Nail Polish in prayer
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See, I said in my post that most women are less concerned about what men think, than what makes them happy and what other WOMEN think. Thanks Jankren.
I don't believe that entirely, generally speaking most women dress to impress, be it a guy or a girl.
Also I agree with pheonix1"We like immortality because that gives us the power to do whatever we want."
Anyway about nail polish, do you think its necessary I mean forget about wudu what's the whole purpose of nailpolish? "to look pretty" is nail polish considered modest? do you think you should be modest?Also Honor you said "if the nail is able to breathe under the polish, which it is, then although some solutions of the polish may be insoluable to H2O, they nail itself is still exposed to aqua ions"
I'm not to sure about nail polish, I'm not sure if the nail can breath under nail polish, according to you some solutions of the polish isn't insoluble to h2o so wouldn't that mean wudu wouldn't be entirely complete?
I know it's being picking I am doing this purposely.. Also how do you know the type of nail polish doesn't have all the ingredients of insolubility to water... -
See, I said in my post that most women are less concerned about what men think, than what makes them happy and what other WOMEN think. Thanks Jankren.
I don't believe that entirely, generally speaking most women dress to impress, be it a guy or a girl.
Also I agree with pheonix1"We like immortality because that gives us the power to do whatever we want."
Anyway about nail polish, do you think its necessary I mean forget about wudu what's the whole purpose of nailpolish? "to look pretty" is nail polish considered modest? do you think you should be modest?Also Honor you said "if the nail is able to breathe under the polish, which it is, then although some solutions of the polish may be insoluable to H2O, they nail itself is still exposed to aqua ions"
I'm not to sure about nail polish, I'm not sure if the nail can breath under nail polish, according to you some solutions of the polish isn't insoluble to h2o so wouldn't that mean wudu wouldn't be entirely complete?
I know it's being picking I am doing this purposely.. Also how do you know the type of nail polish doesn't have all the ingredients of insolubility to water...Peace BOOST,
Below is a short article I found on the subject. Remember, I didn't say that there aren't some women who make themselves up for the sake of men. I said "most" women. I happen to work in the fashion industry and so find myself surrounded by women on the regular. And so, although I don't speak from a scientific stand-point, I do speak from experience.
"Hey ladies, who do you put on make up for?
Blogher conference made me look deep inside myself. Being around a few hundred smart and pretty women for a couple of days inspires one to ask questions about one?s own feminine nature, one?s identity and sexuality. I was looking at all the pretty women around me, checking out their fashionable handbags, looking at their colorful outfits and cute little shoes when it occurred to me. Women dress up for each other far more than they do for the men.
I asked Ponzi, my fashion and beauty muse the next day as we were walking to lunch who do you put on make up for? She laughed at me as if to hint I was asking her the obvious ?other women, of course,? she said. ?Men take me as I am and won?t even notice the color of the nail polish, or the new trendy hand bag or the expensive custom jewelry that I am wearing. Women always take notice though and complement or criticize.?
I had to agree with her. Women, even the geeky ones, care far more about fashion and shopping than men. Robert never noticed the butterflies I had painted on my toes or the Coach backpack I was wearing at the conference. None of the men did. Nicole Simon, however, took pictures of my toes and many others commented on them, and Beth even took a picture of my backpack. Let?s face it ladies, we dress up and put on make up to impress each other not the men. So who do you put on make up for?"
FROM http//maryamie.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!9592F3DEF41537A3!1959.entryAdditionally, I found the next article that attempts to prove that women dress up more during "certain" (e.g. fertile) times of the month in order to attract men. It's important to note the message by a woman who brings up a good point. Rather than women dressing "up" while most fertile to impress men, perhaps they just dress"down" during times of PMS, etc..
http//www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/technology/technology.html?in_article_id=427961&in_page_id=1965As for my take on whether or not wearing nail polish is being "modest". At this point in my journey, I am so put off by women who judge other women's outer appearance. Believe me when I tell you that there are a lot of very sinful women in the world who have never, and would never, "oh my" wear nail polish. Be careful not to assume that someone's outer appearance indicates who they are in the inside. Since we're unable to look into someone's heart, we must remember to leave the judging to God. As a side note, I very, very rarely wear "finger" nail polish, however, occassionally I do wear "toe" nail polish. And since I don't read Arabic, I can't get into a specific debate with you on the word "modest". If I knew for sure that we were debating the word in the American/English dictionary context, I'd be happy to get into it, but for now I'll leave it be.
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Peace Phoenix,
You said "Should I focus on the fact that my life will rush by me, and do everything in a hurry (haste is waste!!), or do I not focus on that and do everything like life lasts an eternity."
-Neither, "life is short" is a phrase that means that when you get older, you will look back and be astonished at how much time has passed in what seems like a "short" amount of time.
"We like immortality because that gives us the power to do whatever we want. We can live out all of our fantasies because we would have an infinite amount of time. Well, why don't we just live like we are immortal?"
-Who is "we"? What Muslim believes in immortality? Did I say something that gave you the impression that I believe myself to be immortal? I think you're missing my point altogether. Perhaps one day you will understand, perhaps not. For now however, I think we should consider "letting it go".Peace
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Salam,
After moments of reflection, I would like to aplogize, in witness to god, that i am sorry for any arrogance, I commited in claiming to be a medical guru, and of scientific knowledge in my previous response to nail polish vs wadu...regardless of any education I have had, I should be more humble. And I apologize, to any offense made to any hadith believers, I only pray for them guidance and mercy from Allah.
Honor
Peace honor,
You seem like an absolutely precious person. I'm glad you enjoyed my response.
Take good care of yourself,
lilyfleur -
Peace Sis Honor
I'd have to agree with Sis Sarah here. I don't think nail polish is breathable at all. Hence the yellow nails you get if you put it on too much. From what i understand, that happens due to lack of "allowing your nails to breathe", or at least that's what my manicurist told me. maybe you have a different explanation?
i think it has nothing to do with whether water can permeate nail polish (which i don't think so or else we'd have color running all over the place)
i think we're reading too much into the wudu verse. i think the purpose of wudu is to clean yourself. so the issue would be (if any) under your nails not the nail surface.as for women dressing up, i'll admit it since nobody else will. when i "dress up" i want men and women to think i look good. i want attention. it doesn't mean i'll grant any back to them but i still want it. lol
very unislamic and i'm dead wrong, but at least its the truth
peace sis )
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Salaam all
Sis Boost I do not think the purpose of "wadu" is to clean ourselves, because even if you are very clean, just came out of the shower, you will have to do wadu. Moreover, how about "tayammum"?.
Also, God mentions "hands"; no nails, not even fingers. Wear polish if you want.
Bro Jarken Why nail polish? Because it draws the attention away from ugly hands ;D
Sis Lilyfleur I gree with you 100% that women dress up to impress ( and also to tease) other women
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See, I said in my post that most women are less concerned about what men think, than what makes them happy and what other WOMEN think. Thanks Jankren.
I don't believe that entirely, generally speaking most women dress to impress, be it a guy or a girl.
Also I agree with pheonix1"We like immortality because that gives us the power to do whatever we want."
Anyway about nail polish, do you think its necessary I mean forget about wudu what's the whole purpose of nailpolish? "to look pretty" is nail polish considered modest? do you think you should be modest?Also Honor you said "if the nail is able to breathe under the polish, which it is, then although some solutions of the polish may be insoluable to H2O, they nail itself is still exposed to aqua ions"
I'm not to sure about nail polish, I'm not sure if the nail can breath under nail polish, according to you some solutions of the polish isn't insoluble to h2o so wouldn't that mean wudu wouldn't be entirely complete?
I know it's being picking I am doing this purposely.. Also how do you know the type of nail polish doesn't have all the ingredients of insolubility to water...Salam Sarah,
As far as I know these are the major ingredients in nail polish
ethyl acetate
butyl acetate
nitrocellulose
isopropyl alcohol
polyester resin
dibutyl phthalate
styrene/acrylates copolymer
stearalkonium hectorite
stearalkonium bentonite
benzophenone-1
calcium pantothenate =This is a water soluable vitamin which is found in the cells.
formaldehyde=Formaldehyde is a formic aldehyde or methanol, HCHO, a powerful disinfectant gas obtained by the oxidation of methyl alcohol. The aqueous solution is a colorless, volatile fluid, used as a surgical and general antiseptic and as a preservativeThe reason why nails turn yellow is not because they cannot breathe but as a side effect to the chemical or polymer in the polish, i.e. In order to make the polish bright and durable, nitrocellulose is added. This substance is extracted from the cotton or wood fiber. Its main disadvantage is that nitrocellulose may produce a yellowing effect, if the nail polish is worn over a long time period.The base coat will also protect your nail surface from harmful substances that can spoil the natural nail color, making it yellow.
As far as the nail breathing it does...nail is hard keratin (protien), its dead, it can 'breathe', one has to only look after the cuticle area, thats where the slightly less harder keratin still exist underneath. And where your nail absorbs oxygen.
Considering that most of the majority of ingredients are non soluable in water, does not neccessarily mean that they cannot absorb water, this is why I said that mainly the ingredients are hydrophilic in the sense, that they will share or accept water ions.
The ions from which the salts of strong acids and strong bases are constituted do not react with water, and so do not disturb the neutrality of their aqueous solutions. The ions are nearly accepted bonds, by these acids and bases, which actually help to serve their purpose in making them polymers and hard resins,..its like this,....you have a bunch of wool (the nail polish ingredients)..you knit this wool(creation of polish), you cover yourself in the wool, when water is applied, it is absorbed and tightens the wool against you. wool may be a bad example, but my point is the ion bonds..some of these ingredients have them,..but in the subject of your argument scientifically, if lets say their is 5 ingredients and 3 accept water ions, and 2 dont,...wadu is still complete, because as a whole the ingredients as a soultion were permeated and allowed these ion bonds.
But to really get to the point, and I will use Samia's opinion on this subject, regardless of scientific argument and value, the wadu does mention hands...and did not specify nails, now..the nails belong to the fingers and the fingers to the hand, but I believe that for sake of intention, god did not mean water must soak the nail, and besides, I have already have proven that the nail is accepting water ions even while in the midst of polish.
I much appreciate your pickiness as it reminds me to be humble, and to really have the right intentions when observing the Quran and Islam. Its been great to get to a deeper level of understanding!!
group
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Cool. In my personal opinion wearing nail polish isn't modest. If people want to wear it to show off to other women by all means go for it, because everyone will be accountable for their own deeds. So if you want to be accountable for showing off accept the consequences.
) Asalamu alaikum
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Peace All
Yes i agree with sis Sarah. It's not really modest, in my opinion.
When i imagine a modest woman, i don't imagine her with shiny nailpolish on -
Cool. In my personal opinion wearing nail polish isn't modest. If people want to wear it to show off to other women by all means go for it, because everyone will be accountable for their own deeds. So if you want to be accountable for showing off accept the consequences.
) Asalamu alaikum
Salam Sarah,
Well you are definitely entitled to your own opinion. I never mentioned that I wear it for anyone, but I understand your referring to another discussion. I personally wear clear nail polish and only sometimes, because i have a vitamin deficiency, that makes my nails peel and split, so I wear the clear coat to make them look healthy and prevent them from cracking. But I personally don't see anything wrong with color, even that I don't like to draw attention to my own hands.
To each his own opinion, and to God we must answer.
Asalam Aleikum
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The example I'll present is illustrative of the idea of nail polish or any other 'barrier' preventing 'wudu' or any other action.
If a female instead of putting on nail polish, puts a glove on her hand and puts her finger in her anus has she performed that act, or has the presence of the glove barrier nullified it?
If you believe the glove has nullified it, then you are going with the hadithist view.
If you believe the glove has not nullified the act then you are on the right path.
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LOL that was kind of funky
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Peace
Hey bro that was a wee bit too much info for the creatively advanced loooool
anyways if you dont think the finger nail is getting clean why cant you make wudu then put the nail polish on then that nail was "clean" before you put the nail polish on why would it get "dirty" again......??????
just curious
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The example I'll present is illustrative of the idea of nail polish or any other 'barrier' preventing 'wudu' or any other action.
If a female instead of putting on nail polish, puts a glove on her hand and puts her finger in her anus has she performed that act, or has the presence of the glove barrier nullified it?
If you believe the glove has nullified it, then you are going with the hadithist view.
If you believe the glove has not nullified the act then you are on the right path.
Salam Truth,
hehehehe I have to laugh at your analogy, while I at first was slightly offended, later it made me laugh..because while it was grossly descriptive o it made complete and utter relavance, quite brilliant in a perverse twisted way yuck! LOL
Question Why a woman with the glove up her butt and not a man? P confused
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That's the stupidest analogy I've heard in my life.
Ouch! that was harsh, Sarah.
Anyway, I think that the purpose of the wudu is probably not cleanliness. It's more like getting yourself refreshed and ready for the act. or something. I've heard that Buddhist do a kind of "wudu" before they start their meditation ritual.
If it was cleanliness, we'd be better off cleaning our anus then washing our hands and faces.AND, the whole nail polish thing is just stupid. These trivial details don't really matter. Too many details, too many weird rules.
Can we have nail polish on during salat or not?
who cares?
if it wasn't important enough to be written in the book that explained the idea in the first place, then it just isn't important enough for us to waste our precious time over. -
Yeh maybe a little harsh though true in my perspective.
Wudu = Cleanliness; physically and within in the mind. In my opinion that's what wudu reflects.
People like to brag about things people don't know that not everything is black and white and it creates uncertainty and anxiety and fear, so they start asking questions as such. Wth me I look at things like this what benefit do i get out of it?Does it bring me closer to my objective? if there is no benefit it's not worth my time anyway do as you wish, one day you'll all be accountable )
asalamu alaikum
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Peace all,
3 pages on nail polish !!! If it was that important Allah would have surely mentioned it specifically in the Qur'aan in reference to salat and the pre-salat washing; or does anyone think that Allah forgot about it or did not know it was going to be invented in the 20th century ??? It seems that we keep forgetting that the words of Allah are FULLY detailed, detail ALL things, give EVERY kind of example, and NOTHING is neglected from the Book relevant to our guidance.
Judging from the number of replies given by women versus men, this thread is empiric evidence that men do not pay that much attention to women's nail polish !!! Personally, women's nail polish does not do any thing for me. As far as physical attraction goes, I am attracted to other features for example the eyes, hair, other facial features etc. P But spiritual and mental attraction would be more important for me !
I agree with sis Samia's comments that the purpose of pre-salat washing does not seem to be physical cleanliness. I think it might be for mental cleanliness as sis Sarah partially said, to wake up the person completely especially for the dawn salat, to give a sense of freshening up, and to help focus our minds on what we do it for - the salat. Lastly, the word "wudu" is nowhere to be found in the Qur'aan ! I also agree with sis Sarah's comment that nail polish has a lot to do with modesty and thus with ego. Also it would be waste of money which could be spent for better purposes like for example feeding a poor with the same money.
1726 And give the relative his due, and the poor, and the wayfarer; and do not waste excessively.
726 O Children of Adam, We have sent down for you garments to alleviate your sin, as well as feathers; and the garment of righteousness is the best. That is from God's signs, perhaps they will remember.
Having said that, in my opinion, nail polish is a very very minor offence if it is one, and there are far more important things to be done or to be avoided and I do not think Allah will be upset if someone wore nail polish and would probably forgive any "immodesty" or "excessive wastage" caused by it as long as we have done as many good deeds as we can !
5332 They avoid major sins and lewdness, except for minor offences. Your Lord is with vast forgiveness. He has been fully aware of you since He initiated you from the Earth, and while you were embryos in your mothers' wombs. Therefore, do not acclaim yourselves; He is fully aware of the righteous.
I guess it would come down to intention, whether a woman is wearing nail polish for beauty purposes or showing off or for health reasons (like sis honor). If it is for beauty purposes or for showing off, it would fall under the following
2460 And the women who are past child bearing and who do not seek to get married have no sin upon them if they put-off their garments, provided they are not adorned for beauty. And if they remain as they were, then it is better for them. God is Hearer, Knower.
438 And those who spend their money to show-off to the people, and they do not believe in God or the Last Day. And whoever has the devil as his companion, then what a miserable companion!
5720 Know that this worldly life is no more than play and amusement and adornments, and boasting among you, and to increase in wealth and children. It is like plants that are supplied by an abundant rain, which appear pleasing to the disbelievers. But then they dry-up and turn yellow, and become useless hay. And in the Hereafter there is severe retribution, and forgiveness from God and approval. This worldly life is no more than a deceiving enjoyment.
314 It has been adorned for people to love the desire of the most modern things, and buildings, and ornaments made from gold and silver, and trained horses, and the livestock, and fields. These are the enjoyment of the world, and with God are the best goods.
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Peace Tanveer,
May I ask what Qur'an you read/quote from? The wording is very clear. Thank you for sharing. As for there being a lot of posts under this nail polish thread, you're correct. And although it is somewhat silly to discuss something so trivial, it (nail polish) happens to be one of those modern things we women need to think about. Thankfully, we care enough to wonder if it may displease God. Do I feel that there are way more important things happening in the world, YES. In fact, I've posted here regarding several more pressing issues like war, poverty, and mental health just to state a few. There was a time in my life (in fact most of it) when I was a complete naturalist and had no desire to wear makeup and such. I've evolved over time however, into a woman who although most interested in the serious issues our world faces, also one who appreciates the little gifts God has given me that make me feel good about myself. Not to say that eradicating poverty, hunger, war and mental illness wouldn't make me feel a gazillion times happier, but that I find small indulgences balance my head, if you will. Personally, I have a tendency to worry so much about the condition of humanity, that it's in my best interest to sometimes allow myself to experience life's trivial pleasures. And so with the personal intention of making this world a better place and all the hard work that could entail, who's to say I can't kick butt and feel cute doing it? All of this reminds me of one of several funny sayings my Aunt sent me today God made man before woman so as to give him time to think of an answer for her first question. Peace brother. ~~~~~
438 And those who spend their money to show-off to the people, and they do not believe in God or the Last Day. And whoever has the devil as his companion, then what a miserable companion!
TOTALLY
5720 Know that this worldly life is no more than play and amusement and adornments, and boasting among you, and to increase in wealth and children. It is like plants that are supplied by an abundant rain, which appear pleasing to the disbelievers. But then they dry-up and turn yellow, and become useless hay. And in the Hereafter there is severe retribution, and forgiveness from God and approval. This worldly life is no more than a deceiving enjoyment.
THAT'S SO AWESOME
314 It has been adorned for people to love the desire of the most modern things, and buildings, and ornaments made from gold and silver, and trained horses, and the livestock, and fields. These are the enjoyment of the world, and with God are the best goods.
YEA GOD, YOU ROCK
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Peace Lilyfleur,
May I ask what Qur'an you read/quote from? The wording is very clear. Thank you for sharing.
You are welcome and thank you for your comments. I usually quote from the free-minds translation on this website
http//free-minds.org/quran/
I like this translation because of its simplicity and because it is literal without the bracketed personal interpretations/insertions/additions of the translators. This translation, however, is not perfect and there are occasional mistranslations which is true for any translation. I also try to read the actual Arabic and compare other different translations and sometimes when I find a mistranslation in the free-minds translation, I quote a "hybrid" translation which I think is closer to the original Arabic in my understanding. An example is my following recent post where the free-minds translation said "know" but that creates a logical contradiction with God as All knowing as stated in other parts of the Qur'aan, so I researched the possible meanings of the word "ya3lam" and found that in 3140 it can only mean "distinguish" and not "know", hence I corrected the free-minds translation
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=13535.msg115317#msg115317
I also compare the different translations of other translators and the following browser allows me to study 13 different English translations at the same time along with the Arabic and the transliteration
http//yaqb.org/
When I researched 3140 in this browser I found that QXP translation and Rashid Khalifa's translation also says "distinguish" instead of "know" which helped me in finding the correct translation which makes sense in the context without creating contradictions. I have found that whenever a translation does not make sense or creates contradiction with other parts of the Qur'aan, it is invariably a mistranslation.
Another good website to research the Qur'aan is the following which gives a lot of different tools in one place
http//www.studyquran.co.uk/
This website is constructed by brother Wakas and is an outstanding contribution by him, may Allah bless him !