Who built the kaaba that is in Mecca?
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Left and bottom.
Found this to be fitting as to where I am in life
The truth is consistent with reality...but is reality what you perceive?
Yes of course thats why you know its consistent with truth..........
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Nuh-uh!
Where reality does not meet "truth", we find that "reality" is not so!
Take this thread as a prime example.
Let me rephrase - we must break this idiotic notion that what we see is gospel truth and that all else are wrong, and commence a truly objective and unbiased study of "reality", and of course, the Quran. Oh, and the hadith. The last has been done. But that was "the easy bit".
Edit Damn, highly off-topic, apologies, people...
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Nuh-uh!
Where reality does not meet "truth", we find that "reality" is not so!
Take this thread as a prime example.
Let me rephrase - we must break this idiotic notion that what we see is gospel truth and that all else are wrong, and commence a truly objective and unbiased study of "reality", and of course, the Quran. Oh, and the hadith.
no, reality always meet the truth..............when we are unable to understand reality and truth we become confuse........confusion is the result of inability to unerstand truth or reality...........
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no, reality always meet the truth..............when we are unable to understand reality and truth we become confuse........confusion is the result of inability to unerstand truth or reality...........
we find that "reality" is not so!
Catch some sleep, it seems that you, like me, have "late-night blindness syndrome" p
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The truth is consistent with reality
Where reality does not meet "truth"
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In my 400AM stint, I forgot
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AgentXXX
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For pilgrimage? none of his close family member/decedents i.e. LUT, ISHAQ, YAQOOB, YOUSAF came to Mecca for pilgrimage?Rajah-If it is not in Quran then you are relying on history or am I wrong?
If on history then what makes your history more reliable then main stream? Give us proofs for it!The above mentioned verses are my proofs.
None of the verse above say that LUT, ISHAQ, YAQOOB, or Yousaf did not travelled to MEcca!
Agent XXX
Now according to my understanding?.it is clear that the people to whom Mohammed is addressing did not receive any Warner/messenger before him?.neither did their forefathers received any warning before Mohammad.
Yes! So where is the problem?, I too am saying the same, Meccans did not recieved any Warner/Messanger before
Muhammad as Abraham was not assigned for Meccans, he only visited and with help of his Son purified/rebuilt the KAABA that is in Mecca and returned to his assinged land.
In the particular verse which we were discussing it was regarding story of Moses.Agent XXX
This grave is acknowledged by Muslims to be under the Mosque of Abraham in Hebron. since Ishmail was not living with Ibrahim when Ibrahim died, so Ishaq had to send a messenger to Ishmail (in Paran) to inform him.
If Ishmael was living in Mecca How many days it would have taken for a messenger from Hebron to Mecca and for Ishmael to make it to Hebron? The body of Abraham will be rotting very badly by then.
Unless Ishaq had a cell phone to inform Ismail about the death of their father and Ismail had a chopper service or a land cruiser ready to take him to Hebron?.I don?t think he would have made it to Hebron from Mecca in time to attend his father?s funeral either on foot or on a horse.
So it is more probable that Paran was just at the southern boundary of Canaan, from where Ishmail could make it within a day or two?Stop making fun out of yourself.
When I visited some of the Mummies of Pharoah's, they were not rotting badly even after thousands of year. And what do you know? There is no Paran in southeren boundary of Canaan.
Further acting funny Agent XXx
Mount paran is the chain of mountains in kharian, Punjab. Which the local Punjabi call Pubbian
The Arabs can call it what ever they like?.it serves their purpose .
There are people who say ?Murree? the hill station near Islamabad is named after Mary ?mother of Jesus? and she is buried there?.there is a Kadam gah of Ali in haiderabad, sind??.there is a foot print of Mohammed in ?Pakpattan??.there is a place kohkaf near ?Chitral? where they say the fairies live?am I to believe all this without any solid evidence?
Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present city of Jerusalem, because she is in slavery with her children. (From the NIV Bible, Galatians 425)"
Larry Williams a prominenet scholar has written a book arguing that the biblical Mt.Sinai is not in the Sinai Peninsula but rather in Saudi Arabia. We know of no serious scholar that has argued this.
Another prominenet Scholar, Frank Moore Cross, a very prominent scholar indeed, sees Mount Sinai
as located in Arabia.If we can rely on the Bible for its geography here, then Sinai/Horeb is associated with
Midian, Paran, and Seir. These areas all appear to be east of the Rift Valley in what is
today modern Jordan and Saudi ArabiaMount Paran is the chain of mountains in that same region which the Arabs call the "Sarawat Mountains". Muhammad (pbuh) received his first revelation in the cave of "Hira'a" located in these mountains.
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Quote from agentxxx on Yesterday at 025842 PM
Wonder why? Jesus, Zikria or Yahya were least interested in this house of Allah
very very significant evidenceHow do you know they were least interested in house of Allah??
If you have any credible proof, then present it and the discussion might have ended long ago, what are you waiting for??
We will discuss it in detail.
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After I told the truth to bro agentxxx, he seemed quite satisfied Alhamdulillah....
Wonder why? Jesus, Zikria or Yahya were least interested in this house of Allah Wink
This is another misconception that they never visited. We should only say Allah never told us if they visited! But alhamdulillah as a Muslim we all believe that they all definitely visited it for sure with great passion. MashaAllah.
bro agentxxx please consider the following as well.....As I mentioned earlier as a Muslim we all believe that they all visited that place, the last prophet before prophet Mohammed was Jesus and when he visited there wasn't any idol inside the Kaaba, so meccans were not worshipping any idol. Some of the prophet tried to warn the meccans but they clearly said to them "you are not warners to us dudes, so perform your hajj thing and go back from where you have come". It was only after the last visit of Jesus that meccans started idol worshipping because they were sure then that no prophet was going to come now to perform hajj. But it was only their bad luck that this time the prophet was born among themselves to destroy their idols. Alhamdulillah.....
I hope it helps...
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the last prophet before prophet Mohammed was Jesus and when he visited there wasn't any idol inside the Kaaba, so meccans were not worshipping any idol. Some of the prophet tried to warn the meccans but they clearly said to them "you are not warners to us dudes, so perform your hajj thing and go back from where you have come".
If meccans were not worshipping idols, and prophets came to mecca for hajj, I presume meccans, too, performed hajj to God, and thus believed in Him. So, why would any prophet want to warn them?
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If meccans were not worshipping idols, and prophets came to mecca for hajj, I presume meccans, too, performed hajj to God, and thus believed in Him. So, why would any prophet want to warn them?
Ok no problem, because hajj is a part of Deen not the all Deen itself. So those meccans didn't know anything else and thus needed a Warner and also they started idol worshiping after the last visit of Jesus so surely they needed the prophet. Now they couldn't say to God that previous prophets came and went after performing the hajj and didn't warn us......no excuses for them after the prophet mohammed. Alhamdulillah
I hope it helps...
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After a few centuries Ismail and Abraham these people forgot all the teachings and the way of their elders and gradually adopted all those wrong practices which were rampant among the other ignorant communities. Hundreds of idols were installed in that very Ka'ba which was built as a centre of preaching and exhortation for the worship of one God, and, ironically enough, idols were made of Abraham and Isma'il themselves whose whole lives were spent in exterminating the practice of idol-worship. The descendants of Abraham, the upright, made idols called Lat, Manat, Hubal, Nasr, Yaghus, Uzza, Isaaf, Naela and God knows what others, and worshipped them. They also worshipped Moon, Neptune, Venus, Saturn and so many other stars. They further worshipped jinns, ghosts, angels as well as the spirits of their dead ancestors.
This condition lasted for more or less than two and a half thousand years as i have pointed out before No Arab prophet was born during this long period nor did any prophet's genuine teaching reach the people of Arabia. Ultimately the time arrived for granting the 'Dua' of Abraham which he had invoked while raising the walls of Ka'ba, i.e. " O Lord ! raise up in their midst a messenger from among them who shall recite unto them Thy revelations, and shall instruct them in the Scripture and in wisdom and shall reform their morals". (Al-Qur'an 2129)
The root of Isaac had many Prophets and they prospered and they were not assigned for Meccans or Arabia, but from root of Ismail Muhammad was assigned for Meccans and Arabia and for all of Mankind.
Therefore, along with the renewal of Hajj, all the customs of the time of ignorance which, had become rampant during the last two and a half thousand years, were completely exterminated.
The names you mentioned of prophets are from the line of Isaac and you may know where they lived and what were their duties further more they were not bounded to visit Mecca by Allah.
Hamsa you try to make fun of word "Alhamdulillah" without even knowing the meaning of it? Well who you are trying to impress with your non sense any way?
If you have any thing positive to contribute we are waiting but with solid evidence?Quote from agentxxx on Yesterday at 025842 PM
Wonder why? Jesus, Zikria or Yahya were least interested in this house of Allah
very very significant evidenceHow do you know they were least interested in house of Allah??
If you have any credible proof, then present it and the discussion might have ended long ago, what are you waiting for??
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How do you know they were least interested in house of Allah??
If you have any credible proof, then present it and the discussion might have ended long ago, what are you waiting for??
The names you mentioned of prophets are from the line of Isaac and you may know where they lived and what were their duties further more they were not bounded to visit Mecca by Allah.
Ok, they were very much interested actually, but they were not bounded to visit mecca so they prefered not to visit it.....subhan Allah
People please forget the previous nonsense and accept the newly formed...shown in red
I hope it helps...
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peace Rajah,
Rajah- If you have any credible proof, then present it and the discussion might have ended long ago,
The discussion should have ended when I posted the other two verses to prove that ?being the first Warner for the Meccans? has nothing to do with the story of Moses WHICH WAS YOUR ORIGINAL STANCE.
You haven?t answered most of my Questions from the previous post and have yet to present any evidence from Quran to prove Ibrahim and Ismail were in Mecca. But instead you keep on asking others for credible evidence?.what about your credible answers buddy?
Can you show from the Quran where Ishmael settled?
Can you produce one single verse from the Quran stating that he settled in Mecca?
Can you even find a single verse where Becca/puran is said to be an alternate name for Mecca?
In what direction was the original Qiblah pointing?
What is the location of the sacred mosque i.e. masjid al-haram?
If you claim that it is Mecca, can you produce a single verse stating that the sacred mosque is located there?Rajah- What are you waiting for??
I was waiting for a logical explanation from you. But it seems to me that you don?t have any?
Rajah- After a few centuries Ismail and Abraham these people forgot all the teachings and the way of their elders and gradually adopted all those wrong practices which were rampant among the other ignorant communities.
why can?t these people forget the teachings centuries after Mohammad?
Rajah- This condition lasted for more or less than two and a half thousand years as i have pointed out before No Arab prophet was born during this long period nor did any prophet's genuine teaching reach the people of Arabia. Ultimately the time arrived for granting the 'Dua' of Abraham which he had invoked while raising the walls of Ka'ba, i.e. " O Lord ! RAISE UP IN THEIR MIDST A MESSENGER FROM AMONG THEM who shall recite unto them Thy revelations, and shall instruct them in the Scripture and in wisdom and shall reform their morals". (Al-Qur'an 2129)
Now we are classifying prophets as Arabs and non Arabs.......after the construction of Kaaba, for 2400 years it was even ignored by the almighty confused. And it took almost 2400 years for the ?Dua? of Ibrahim to take effect and for the lord to raise a messenger from among them?
Rajah- The names you mentioned of prophets are from the line of Isaac and you may know where they lived and what were their duties further more THEY WERE NOT BOUNDED TO VISIT MECCA BY ALLAH.
Where is your evidence for such a claim?? is this the reason why the other prophets were least interested in the house of Allah in Mecca?
Rajah- Therefore, along with the renewal of Hajj, all the customs of the time of ignorance which, had become rampant during the last two and a half thousand years, were completely exterminated.
PILGRIMAGE AND CIRCLING KABA 7X
Pagan Origin - Each local tribe of Arab pagans walked 7 times around their own kaba that housed their own black stone.
Pilgrims circle the Kaba, claiming Abraham did such.KISSING BLACK STONE.
Pagan Origin - Each local tribe of Arab Pagans kissed their own tribal black stones.
Pilgrims today kiss black stone but say it was a divine meteorite that fell at Adam?s feet and was rediscovered by Abraham."THE STONE THROW" AT MINA
Pagan Origin - Wide spread custom among Pagan Arabs.
Pilgrims today do it claiming the custom was started by Abraham when he threw stones at the devil."THE RUN" SAFA AND MARWA
Pagan Origin - Pagans ran between two idols, Isaf and Na?ila
Pilgrims today perform the same running but redefine the meaning to be Hagar running between hills, looking for water for Ishmael.None of these rituals were exterminated, only the reasons were redefined.
http//i73.photobucket.com/albums/i231/nabpeace/hajj-2.jpg
http//i73.photobucket.com/albums/i231/nabpeace/hajj-3.jpg
Which part of the structure in the above two images was built by Ibrahim and Ismael?http//i73.photobucket.com/albums/i231/nabpeace/xin_1001022212317402756816-1.jpg
was this wall built by Ibrahim and Ismail?http//i73.photobucket.com/albums/i231/nabpeace/touch.jpg
was the black stone placed here by Ibrahim/Ismael/Mohammad?http//i73.photobucket.com/albums/i231/nabpeace/roman_senate.jpg
is ihram an inspiration from what romans wore in senate?I hope instead of an emotional answer, your answer will be based on logic.
peace
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Agent XXX
peace Rajah,
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Rajah- If you have any credible proof, then present it and the discussion might have ended long ago,You haven?t answered most of my Questions from the previous post and have yet to present any evidence from Quran to prove Ibrahim and Ismail were in Mecca. But instead you keep on asking others for credible evidence?.what about your credible answers buddy?
Can you show from the Quran where Ishmael settled?
Can you produce one single verse from the Quran stating that he settled in Mecca?
Can you even find a single verse where Becca/puran is said to be an alternate name for Mecca?
In what direction was the original Qiblah pointing?
What is the location of the sacred mosque i.e. masjid al-haram?
If you claim that it is Mecca, can you produce a single verse stating that the sacred mosque is located there?Instead of providing any proof/evidence that goes in your favor You again started asking me questions? ignoring all the Historical evidences I provided.
I don't think so any reasonable question of yours has been un answered, i even answered your funny ones for example Isaac using mobile phone and Mount Paran being in Kharian, with evidences provided by some well known researchers.I have also mentioned Quranic verses in support but if one wants not to read or listen?
But let me summarize it for you and for all of us, before i do remember the basic of debate is "One who presents defends" meaning to say you have to provide the evidence and not me or the opposing party.Can you show from the Quran where Ishmael settled?
YeS! but will you believe then? or like Jews will start asking what should be the color of calf, how old shoud be it or how many hair should it have?
Al-Quran
Our Lord! Lo! I have settled some of my posterity in an uncultivable valley near unto Thy holy House, our Lord! that they may establish proper worship; so incline some hearts of men that they may yearn toward them, and provide Thou them with fruits in order that they may be thankful.this is supported by the Verse I quoted from Bible
2121 And he dwelt in the wilderness of Paran and his mother took him a wife out of the land of Egypt.
"Paran = 'two who migrated'"
Where is Paran located??
Mount Paran is the chain of mountains in that same region which the Arabs call the "Sarawat Mountains". Muhammad (pbuh) received his first revelation in the cave of "Hira'a" located in these mountains.
Going on further from Bible
Now this verse of (Isaiah 60),
607 All the flocks of Kedar shall be gathered together unto thee, the rams of Nebaioth shall minister unto thee they shall come up with acceptance on mine altar, and I will glorify the house of my glory.Is surely of before Muhammad, and in it Allah tells us clearly about his house and invites for piligrimage, the key word there being with regards to our discussion "Kedar"
What are or is Kedar?
The Arabs are called Kedar?s or Kedarites (Genesis 2513-16 and see Illustrated Dictionary & Concordance of the Bible- G.G. The Jersulem Publishing House Ltd 1986 pages 478 and 589).
This further confirms that the House of Allah existed even before Muhammad and Jesus in the Arab and all the historical evidences lead us to "Paran" MAKKAH" "BAKKAH" located in present day Saudi.
Tanveer replied for the above
After Muhammad's death, the arab pagan hypocrites renamed their pagan temple Kaaba after the common noun "kaaba"/heel/base in al-qur'aan and renamed the insignificant town containing this pagan temple Mecca after the common noun "makka(t)"/destruction/wearing down in al-qur'aan so that they can resume their pagan practices while pretending to be following al-qur'aan.
First of all if i follow your flawed logic I will ask is this written in Quran? this is babyish! My question is where did he got this evidence from, and when did Muhammad travelled to Palestine for Hajj or Why did no one from that time pointed out this biggest blunder. For the Meccans it was OK but what about the other tribes and areas of Arab, were they not Jealous? why they not pointed out anything of kind? It is fact that this is the one of the biggest lie carved in the name of Islam by Muslims themselves in this century. In this paragraph it tells us that Meccans were trying to pretend while following Quran they were actually practicing Pagan practices. So who were they afraid of? why they were pretending? if they were afraid of some one, why that some one did not pointed out since then? Offcourse Arabs are nationalists and they discriminate other nations often, but that is against the teachings of ISlam and Allah choosing the Arab for his house should not be crticized for that.
As Abraham raised the foundations of the shrine, together with Ismail (they prayed) "Our Lord, accept this from us. You are the Hearer, the Omniscient
"Our Lord! make of us Muslims, bowing to Thy, and of our progeny a people Muslim, bowing to Thy (will); and show us our place for the celebration of (due) rites; and turn unto us (in Mercy); for Thou art the Oft-Returning, Most Merciful.Is this Prayer of Abraham and Ismail still unanswered??
If these prayers are been answered then KAABA in MECCA is the Place and Surely Abraham and ISmail have built it.TAnveer's Translation
2127 And as Ibraheem raised the foundations FROM/MIN the house with Ismaeel "Our Lord accept this from us, You are the Hearer, the Knowledgeable."
Ok even if we take your translation still the question remains the same, combining it with second verse
"Our Lord! make of us Muslims, bowing to Thy, and of our progeny a people Muslim, bowing to Thy (will); and show us our place for the celebration of (due) rites; and turn unto us (in Mercy); for Thou art the Oft-Returning, Most Merciful
Further Quran tells us that the
Most surely the first house appointed for men is the one at Bekka, blessed and a guidance for the nations.
Indeed, in Arabic and Hebrew, the word becca/baca also means ?the mastic or the balsam tree.? Another meaning of the word is ?the overflowing tears.? These two meanings fit the description of Mecca as well. Mecca is a place where these evergreen trees are found in abundance (the Meccan balsam is a well known name in pharmacopeia). Furthermore, the commemoration of God?s Name - and God alone - during hajj, truly brings tears to many a pilgrim?s eyes.
Qur?an lays stress on the religion of Ibrahim, presenting Islam as a return to the purity of the religion of Ibrahim which, obscured by Judaism and Christianity, shone forth in its original brightness in the Qur?an. The pilgrimage?s to the Ka?aba and ritual progressions around the building were continued after Muhammad cleaned it from idols but now for the glorification of One God. The Abrahimic vision of the Ka?aba created a means of discerning an orthodox origin buried in the midst of pagan malpractices to which the first muslims pointed the way.
Quran
Then we inspired you (Muhammad) to follow the religion of Abraham, the monotheist; he never was an idol worshiper.Those who received the scripture, and know it as it should be known, will believe in this. As for those who disbelieve, they are the losers.
We have rendered the shrine (the Ka`aba) a focal point/model for the people, and a safe sanctuary. You may use Abraham's shrine as a prayer house. We commissioned Abraham and Ismail "You shall purify My house for those who visit, those who live there, and those who bow and prostrate."
It says that Abraham and Ismail were ordered by Allah to purify this house and not to built for the first time but may be rebuilt or rennovate, meaning that this house existed before them.
So my understanding is that this building existed before Abraham and Ismail and they only purified it by removing idols etc.
But regarding the question is this the same building which is in Mecca, YES as the Quran clearly tells us
We appointed Abraham to establish the Shrine "You shall not idolize any other god beside Me, and purify My shrine for those who visit it, those who live near it, and those who bow and prostrate.
Allah appointed Abraham to establish the shrine on basis that we should not idolize any other god besides Allah and not on the basis it existed before.
Another translation
And when We assigned to Ibrahim the place of the House, saying Do not associate with Me aught, and purify My House for those who make the circuit and stand to pray and bow and prostrate themselves.Prophecy
And proclaim that the people shall observe Hajj pilgrimage. They will come to you walking or riding on various exhausted (means of transportation). They will come from the farthest locations."Mecca is the only place where People come for HAJJ from all over the world from farthest places in an organized manner, Mecca is the only place where this practice is carried out for last 1500 years every year without any break.
No other place in the world is there we people go for Hajj or are called for Hajj.Hajj shall be observed in the specified months. Whoever sets out to observe Hajj shall refrain from sexual intercourse, misconduct, and arguments throughout Hajj. Whatever good you do, GOD is fully aware thereof. As you prepare your provisions for the journey, the best provision is righteousness. You shall observe Me, O you who possess intelligence.
Only in Mecca people go for Hajj in specific months, and refrain from Sexual intercourse and misconduct. Where else do people go for Hajj in specified months refraining from Sex etc.?
You shall observe the complete rites of Hajj and
Umrah for GOD. If you are prevented, you shall send an offering, and do not resume cutting your hair until your offering has reached its destination. If you are ill, or suffering a head injury (and you must cut your hair), you shall expiate by fasting, or giving to charity, or some other form of worship. During the normal Hajj, if you break the state of Ihraam (sanctity) betweenUmrah and Hajj, you shall expiate by offering an animal sacrifice. If you cannot afford it, you shall fast three days during Hajj and seven when you return home - this completes ten - provided you do not live at the Sacred Masjid. You shall observe GOD, and know that GOD is strict in enforcing retributionWhere else do people stop cutting their hairs until sacrifice of the animal is done? Where else do people during HAjj offer Kafara in the shape of Fasting during HAjj??
You commit no error by seeking provisions from your Lord (through commerce). When you file from `Arafaat, you shall commemorate GOD at the Sacred Location (of Muzdalifah). You shall commemorate Him for guiding you; before this, you had gone astray.
Where else do in the world we see trading during Hajj season, and the place Arafat?
If all these things mentioned in Quran combined happen some where else other then Mecca, Then is the case of those who impressed by Jewish and Christian missionaries propoganda say that Kaaba is not the place Abraham was assigned to purify.
THIS HAPPENS ONLY IN ARABIA! no matter how bitter it tastes to brother Tanveer or Ayman or any.
Further proof for Abraham and ISmail rebuilding KAaba
A line in the Book of Jubilees (2013) mentions that the descendants of Abraham's son by Hagar, Ishmael, as well as his descendants by Keturah, became the "Arabians" or "Arabs". The 1st century Jewish historian Josephus similarly described the descendants of Ishmael (i.e. the Ishmaelites) as an "Arabian" people. He also calls Ishmael the "founder" (ς of the "Arabians". Some Biblical scholars also believe that the area outlined in Genesis as the final destination of Ishmael and his descendants ("from Havilah to Assyria" refers to the Arabian peninsula. This has led to a commonplace view that modern Semitic-speaking Arabs are descended from Abraham via Ishmael, in addition to various other tribes who intermixed with the Ishmaelites, such as Joktan, Sheba, Dedan, Broham, etc. Both Judeo-Christian and Islamic traditions speak of earlier inhabitants of Arabia.
Meccans who were known for memorizing and repeating the family tree and praising renknown members of the family tree have provided us with the tree which leads from Muhammad to Ismail.
Regarding black stone etc. I have posted before.
By posting these pictures you have further confirmed that the prayers of ABRAHAM and Muhammad Have been answered and People from all over the world from the farthest places visit this House of Allah by using all means of Transposrt, While the House which is trying to be built by Ayman and followers is yet to be discovered and waiting for people who can visit them. Thanks for your posting of pictures
Allah Ho Akbar.
Next time I hope whenever you post, I doubt if you will, please post some proof for House of Allah that Ayman is trying to built with help of Tanveer and AgentXXX.
Salaam.
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Did Ibrahim Migrate to Mecca?
According to quran Ibrahim and Lut migrated to a blessed place
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According to quran we know that later Lut left Ibrahim and migrated to an other place......but I couldn't find any evidence from quran which shows that Ibrahim also left that blessed place and migrated somewhere else.
Children of Israel also migrated to a blessed place
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Solomon as well
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3418
Is that blessed place Palestine? Ibrahim should have built Ka'aba to that blessed place where he migrated, if we believe for instance that he left that blessed place and migrated to mecca so according to quran he should remain in mecca and should have not left that place, but we are told that Ibrahim left mecca and went back to the blessed place......Why I am saying Ibrahim shouldn't left mecca because of the following verse
2226 <------ God is asking Ibrahim to keep His house clean, but why he left the mecca and ignored the God's commandment? God forbid...
2227 <------ God is asking Ibrahim to proclaim unto alnnasi bialhajji. They will come unto you on foot and on every lean camel; they will come from every deep ravine....
OK, God is commanding Ibrahim what to do next and Ibrahim left that place and went back?
Salam o rahmah
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Peace Sis Samia,
Faran = Paran = Arabia...I do not take comfort in numbers, or spinned interpretations of The Quran via Hadith, and Scholars...
The only way my heart will be convinced either way is if the Saudis will allow forensic studies conducted in the sites and a history time line map be produced from the findings.
Are the Saudis better than other nations who wish to study their past objectively?...
What are they scared of that will be found?
We could even find out the age of The Prophet using carbon dating and more precise times as to the events that took place in Madinah, and supposedly earlier in Makka...
Since they want to destroy tombs that they fear will be taken as pagan shrines, why not let Scientists at least take samples to analyse?
But of course who cares? The status quo satisfies the Saudis very well... And who gives a toss about the Muslims to fund scientific research in Makka, Madinah and other Arabian places... Most non-Muslims look at the Muslims as a nuisance community who they have to contend with because of the rich resources in the countries they inhabit, they also look at us as backward, stuck in the dark ages, unable of scientific progress, and a fodder for extremism.
Plus we are unable to defend ourselves and we keep fighting (Shia / Sunni divides etc)...
So lets keep on spinning around the cube and forget about the world, after all we seem to think that we were only sent to look after our own, and how caring we so very are... -
Peace brother Hamsa,
Is that blessed place Palestine? Ibrahim should have built Ka'aba to that blessed place where he migrated, if we believe for instance that he left that blessed place and migrated to mecca so according to quran he should remain in mecca and should have not left that place, but we are told that Ibrahim left mecca and went back to the blessed place......Why I am saying Ibrahim shouldn't left mecca because of the following verse
The whole earth is blessed. See 4110.
Peace,
Ayman