Huuuuge Problem about sexuality!
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Peace,
Angel and Lot. I suggest both of you study the story of Lot in the Quran. If you can't accept the facts there then you should understand then that you guys don't really believe in the book. Maybe you guys beleive in making a reformist, modernized form of Islam and accept the Quran because you see it as more tolerant. However, the Quarn definitely outlines through this story that homosexuality is immoral. Just because it doesn't hurt someone else doesn't mean it is moral.
There are also other parts in the Quran like where it mentions when two believers commit faahishat. There also another part of the Quran that allows for mental abberation as a justification, but in no way says it is okay.
Godbless,
Anwar -
Peace,
Because morality in addition to just dealing with the prevention of physical harm also deals with spiritual harm. There are things that we can do that hurt no-one else but that corrode our spirits, our relationships, our minds and our bond with God. When you go out and have safe sex with alot of guys, or if I do that with girls, the first thing that happens is that I weaken my relationship with God by opposing him thinking that he is wrong and I can do what I want, not hurt anyone and still be righteous. Remember God knows best. So firstly you are actively disobeying God and doubting his wisdom because you can't see any immediate harm for you or others. Secondly the only way you can realize why this is wrong is to do it and be actively analytical and watch what happens in your life or study it second hand. In my opinion it is never worth sinning, you can recover if you repent but it will regress you in a way that you will not realize until you begin to turn around from that sin, and understand the spiritual matrix that is also around you in this world and how by disobeying the true essence, controller and core of that matrix (God almighty) you really put yourself on the losing side.
So you go out and do what you want to do and have to learn the hard way how it is that this negatively affects you spiritually, mentally and/or physically. As I said eating pork won't hurt you either if you do it safely but there is more to eating the meat of this animal than just our physical health, there is something to eating the meat of this animal that damages us in some way that we don't yet realize, however the most grave damage we do to ourselves is doubting the wisdom of God, especially if we have come to know Him with our minds and know that He is real, and also through study have accepted his words. The answer for the true nature of how this could harm us could lie in any corner and it could be physical or spiritual.
Or maybe it is a rule that God puts to us to strengthen our spirit to worship, serve and sacrifice to him even when we have the choice not to. People who have sex with all sorts of partners "safely" and who eat pig meat and consume of many other things that are forbidden in the Quran that might not be harmful if done safely, look at their lives, get to know people like that if you don't know and think on how their lives are and how prepared they might be for the day of judgement.
I believe that much of what we are told not to do in the Quran can be done in a "safe" manner, however it will decrease the quality of our lives in material and spiritual matter. Remember God knows best what is best for us. You could have safe incest as well (using a condom or birth control, etc.) however we do not fully realize the spiritual, mental or even physical harm that could be done by doing these "harmless" sins. They are sins for reasons, folks and we should stay clear of them for our own good in this life and the next.
Godbless,
Anwar -
Peace Anwar,
For me, that verse in Quran meant Lust, not necessarily homosexuality per se. Like when they wanted to have sex with the messengers of God that went to Lot, it was lustful.
But I agree, be it homosexual or not, sex just because is wrong.
Wa Salaam
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peace Anwar,
Because morality in addition to just dealing with the prevention of physical harm also deals with spiritual harm. There are things that we can do that hurt no-one else but that corrode our spirits, our relationships, our minds and our bond with God. When you go out and have safe sex with alot of guys, or if I do that with girls, the first thing that happens is that I weaken my relationship with God by opposing him thinking that he is wrong and I can do what I want, not hurt anyone and still be righteous.
Sorry, I don't believe that god would forbid things which do no harm.
It is harmful to have sex just for the sake of sex and it's wrong.
I don't believe that we are weakening any bonds with god or corroding our spirits if we do harmless things. -
Peace,
amuslim,
Firstly those verses make it clear that it is wrong for men to fulfill their sexual desires with other men. Period. Is it wrong to lust after your wife? Of course not, within the bounds of marriage and/or engagement(the promise of marriage) you can lust after your partner all you want and have sex just to have sex. Sex is not a sin. That is within the bounds of God. Remeber where the Quran says "Come to them (your wives) wherever and however you would like."? So lust is not wrong. What is wrong is to lust after what you have no right to lust after, i.e. women you have no promise of marriage with (for men and the opposite for women), men lusting after men and women after women, and brothers with sisters, children with parents(includes grandparents), nephews and nieces with uncles and aunts is all faahishatun. Those verses about Lot, specifically point out the sin in men taking out their shahwatun (lust) on other men, and then make it clear that we are to have sex with our zawj, our mates, and the Quran makes it clear that man is woman's mate and vice-versa, not the other way around. You cannot justify homosexuality through the Quran. No one says that you should go kill them or punish them if they do not follow the Quran, however again homosexuality is not compatible with the Quran and should be abandoned or totally avoided by those who follow the Quran. And that is according to the Quran. Read and study, I considered this topic before and consulted the Quran on these issues. The Quran is pretty clear about this.
Lobster,
I guess you didn't really understand my point. The first one is
- How do you know what is harmful to you more than GOD knows?
The second is
- God is always working for your betterment, even if you don't always understand how at the moment.
The last is
3. If God puts a rule to you to follow, it can be to give you something to fulfill your faith in Him in which case once that rule is set it is to your disadvantage to disobey God.The overall point is God knows what is better for you more than you do.
If you really doubt the wisdom of God on this, then go out and eat all the pig meat you want, eat animals that fall on their own and die or die from a blow, go drink blood from a healthy cow that you know has no diseases (the Masai do it all the time). Go on, it can be shown that you can do these things and it will not harm you any way. But would you dare to disobey God because you think that you know better than him? Would you dare to rely on what society says is okay but what God says is not okay? You can go hoard up wealth to and give only to make sure that people don't curse you, or do you believe in charity because you grew up with that sweet line that society gives us "It is better to give than recieve." Why do you do what you do? Why do you follow the Quran for your earthly life or for society or for God? Do you not trust that he knows better? In the end it comes down to trust. You can prove the source(with your mind and logic), you know it is from the almighty, the allwise but do you know trust in what he wants you to do because you see no earthly benefit or harm?
part of this issue is also your capacity to trust in God in all things in your life. Do you trust in God or in yourself and the limited knowledge of Man? I hope you realize that your understanding and the understanding of men is limited in many, many ways and that we take the knowledge that God gives us but we also need to trust in him when we have no knowledge and when we have knowledge, as He might prove to us at every stop that where we thought we knew something we didn't even know the most minimal part. Haven't you seen this manifest itself in the physical and social sciences and in your own personal life?
Godbless,
Anwar -
Peace,
I agree that we shall not kill or punish someone who are homosexual but a matter of fact it was exactly what God did to the people of Lot, erased them from the earth and then keep mentioning them over and over again in Quran as some kind of warning and enlightments of what will happen to people who are not clean.
And sometimes people don't know what is best for them o so read Quran and God will guide you.
Majidah
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Peace,
I think they were erased because the whole city was engaged in this sin, and they tried to not only to harm the righteous but also force them into this activity. From what I see this is why God told the righteous to leave so he could punish the town and wipe them out, giving them the final word, as they were not going to change their ways.
However, in the Quran the most consistent aspect that I see of the societies that were destroyed is that they impeded and forcibly tried to oppress or blot out those who called to God. From Pharoah to Lot.
Had they not done this they might have been given themselves more time but their sins would have and will catch up with them on the day of judgement. If you die immersed in sin, it is a done deal for you. Read the Quran, 281
Godbless,
Anwar