setting up partners with god / shirk
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Quran talks about shirk and mushrikeens at various occassions.
What does "setting up partners" actually means?
Few definitions I have came accross are
- idolators
- those who worship more than one gods
- those who think god has a son
- those who worship another human
- those who ask for help from entitires other than god (including other men).
I am interest in the true/real meaning. Has Quran defined this term?
Thanks in advance.
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For example, here is a story of a garden owner. Quran said he setup partners. He simply rejected the hereafter saying "i dont think that the hour is coming". How did he setup partner? Wasn't he a rejected rather than a mushrik? What does "Setting up partner" actually means in absolute terms and in the light of this example?
Thanks in advance
1832 And give them the example of two men We made for one of them two gardens of grapes, and We surrounded them with palm trees, and We made between them a green field.
1833 Both gardens brought forth their fruit, and none failed in the least. And We caused a river to pass through them.
1834 And he had abundant fruit, so he said to his friend while discussing with him "I am better off than you financially, and of great influence."
1835 And he went back into his garden while he had wronged himself. He said "I do not think that this will ever perish."
1836 "And I do not think that the Hour is coming. And if I am indeed returned to my Lord, then I will surely find even better things for me."
1837 His friend said to him while discussing with him "Have you disbelieved in the One who created you from dirt, then from a seed, then He evolved you into a man?"
1838 "But He is God, my Lord, and I do not place any partners at all with my Lord."
1839 "And if you enter your garden, you should have said "This is what God has given, there is no power except by God." You see me as being less than you in wealth and in children?"
1840 "Perhaps my Lord will give me better than your garden, and He should send upon it a violent storm from the sky, so it becomes completely barren."
1841 "Or that its water becomes deep under-ground, so you will not be able to seek it."
1842 So his fruits were ruined, and he began turning his hands at that which he has spent on it while it remained destroyed upon its foundations. And he said "I wish I did not make any partner with my Lord!"
1843 And he had no group which could help against God, and he would not have had victory.
1844 Such is the true authority of God. He is best to reward, and best to punish. -
For example, here is a story of a garden owner. Quran said he setup partners. He simply rejected the hereafter saying "i dont think that the hour is coming". How did he setup partner? Wasn't he a rejected rather than a mushrik? What does "Setting up partner" actually means in absolute terms and in the light of this example?
base on my understanding, within this story the person set up himself as a partner/rival to GOD. One's ego can indeed be a god (254, 530, 287
). Because of the things he possess (1834), he believe that he was great/better that his friend. He had a great ego about himself making his ego a god/rival to GOD. How? He thought himself self suffient and that GOD had no hand in his possesions. He disbelieve that GOD provide those things to him and disbelieve that GOD will hold him accountable. His friend advise him against this saying "This is what God has given" (1839 ) trying to remind him that GOD posses everything and that you should not be egotistical considering yourself self sufficient.does that make sense?
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base on my understanding, within this story the person set up himself as a partner/rival to GOD. One's ego can indeed be a god (254, 530, 287
). Because of the things he possess (1834), he believe that he was great/better that his friend. He had a great ego about himself making his ego a god/rival to GOD. How? He thought himself self suffient and that GOD had no hand in his possesions. He disbelieve that GOD provide those things to him and disbelieve that GOD will hold him accountable. His friend advise him against this saying "This is what God has given" (1839 ) trying to remind him that GOD posses everything and that you should not be egotistical considering yourself self sufficient.does that make sense?
Thanks SatanHatesMe.
So are you saying that setting up partners with God means associating power with an entity other than God? be it our ego or be it another human or be it prophet.
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Thanks SatanHatesMe.
So are you saying that setting up partners with God means associating power with an entity other than God? be it our ego or be it another human or be it prophet.
yes. the surah we say in our daily salat explains it best "You alone we worship. You alone we ask for help." (15). shirk is associating authority with any entity beside GOD. Meaning that the entity have power or authority that rivals/equal to GOD's. Many can fall into this trap in many ways. For example, if you believe that a seat belt will save your life and not GOD, than that can be shirk in my opinion. I'm not saying that seal belts aren't extremely beneficial (and you shouldn't wear it), but i am saying that the concept of believing that the seal belt have more authority over your life than GOD is shirk.
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Peace,
One sets up partners with god when one approaches reality through other means than those approved by god. When one forsakes the god given reason and intellect, and instead go on submitting to fear and greed, that is when one is a mushrik.
Nadeem
Nadeem, can you elaborate on the statement i bold? because to me, god given reason is very subjective and can vary to great extremes.
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Peace Bro,
Reason, like anything else god gave us, grows. Your job is to nurture it right, and then leave it up to god.
Many believers seem to think that they can avoid their subjectivity by submitting to what they perceive as divine. They don't realize that it is their subjectivity that made the object seem divine to them in the first place.
Nadeem
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Nadeem, can you elaborate on the statement i bold? because to me, god given reason is very subjective and can vary to great extremes.
God created us. God gave. Simple as that. When it comes to things that are not physical, of course, it is completely different. The simple matter is that the way God created us, it can only be said that we have reason and intellect ingrained into us.
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Quran talks about shirk and mushrikeens at various occassions.
What does "setting up partners" actually means?
Few definitions I have came accross are
- idolators
- those who worship more than one gods
- those who think god has a son
- those who worship another human
- those who ask for help from entitires other than god (including other men).
I am interest in the true/real meaning. Has Quran defined this term?
Thanks in advance.
Salaam Explorer,
Include humans in your list, they could be prophets or messengers or so called saint's etc.
The way you can tell if you are idolising is if you love or respect this human (dead or alive) more then God. For example Sunni's go to mosques and listen to sermon full of admiration for Muhammad, they even pray to God through Muhammad, this is idolatory to its extreme..
Some verses for you to ponder on;
The Idols Disown Their Idolizers*
Yet, some people set up idols to rival GOD, and love them as if they are GOD. Those who believe love GOD the most. If only the transgressors could see themselves when they see the retribution! They will realize then that all power belongs to GOD alone, and that GOD's retribution is awesome.
Invitation to All Believers
Say, "O followers of the scripture, let us come to a logical agreement between us and you that we shall not worship except GOD; that we never set up any idols besides Him, nor set up any human beings as lords beside GOD." If they turn away, say, "Bear witness that we are submitters."
Believers Or Hypocrites?
Have you noted those who claim that they believe in what was revealed to you, and in what was revealed before you, then uphold the unjust laws of their idols? They were commanded to reject such laws. Indeed, it is the devil's wish to lead them far astray.
On The Day Of Resurrection
GOD will say, "O Jesus, son of Mary,* did you say to the people, `Make me and my mother idols beside GOD?' " He will say, "Be You glorified. I could not utter what was not right. Had I said it, You already would have known it. You know my thoughts, and I do not know Your thoughts. You know all the secrets.
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The simple matter is that the way God created us, it can only be said that we have reason and intellect ingrained into us.
Many believers seem to think that they can avoid their subjectivity by submitting to what they perceive as divine. They don't realize that it is their subjectivity that made the object seem divine to them in the first place.
I have to disagree due to the subjectivity element of your interpretation. applying subjective logic and reasoning eliminates absolute truth. plus most subjective judgments are made on ones personal desires and not made with the community at mind. PLUS, subjective reason can vary greatly in which one individual can view an act evil and wrong while another considered it wise and just. how can agreement be made on such subjective reasoning? and how can one commit shirk when technically according to your interpretation, his or her personal subjective reason is GOD gave (therefore, if he view it correct, it is correct?)?
im i missing something?
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Peace
Nadeem, can you elaborate on the statement i bold? because to me, god given reason is very subjective and can vary to great extremes.
Just thought Id add my reasoning on that. In the Quran we are all born with fitra, the instinct of Allah, like all the other creatures. However with us, we can CHOOSE to stray from that path, thereby following man made ideas and such. For example, Christians that believe in the Trinity. If they never read the Bible, how would they know about Jesus? They wouldnt even conceive the idea of the Trinity or Jesus or anything else in the Bible. Same with Muslims, we wouldnt know who Muhammad was or even Abraham. However we are all born with the instinct of God, Tawhid, Al-Haneefiyah.
Peace
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Peace SHM,
I have to disagree due to the subjectivity element of your interpretation. applying subjective logic and reasoning eliminates absolute truth. plus most subjective judgments are made on ones personal desires and not made with the community at mind. PLUS, subjective reason can vary greatly in which one individual can view an act evil and wrong while another considered it wise and just. how can agreement be made on such subjective reasoning? and how can one commit shirk when technically according to your interpretation, his or her personal subjective reason is GOD gave (therefore, if he view it correct, it is correct?)?
With subjectivity I'm simply referring to your 'self'. You cannot circumvent this 'self' that you have; so you cannot escape your subjectivity. It's like breathing. Everything, all things, that you experience are through the lenses of your 'self'.
'Subjective logic' is a redundancy (same goes for subjective reason and judgment); all logic is, as all else, subjective. There is no 'true' logic. And there is no 'absolute truth' within the frameworks of human mind. What is beyond this framework, that is beyond our perceived reality, it doesn't exist for us.
So what if we disagree? It is not like we haven't cracked that nut before. Largely, we have come to believe that those who are united in the larger numbers have the most forceful stance. Some use their force violently and operate tyrannically. Those are the mushriks (idolator) and kafirs (denier). Others invite and enlighten others with wisdom and kind words. Those are the hanif (monotheist) and muslims (peacemaker).
Yes, the 'self' - wherein lies subjectivity - is god given, but the path it takes and the meandering it does is its own. Your mouth is god given, your tongue is god given, your sound is too, but neither your words nor your tone can be blamed on god.
SHM therefore, if he view it correct, it is correct
In his mind, yes, and he shall be made to answer why he thought so. Then god is the best judge.
But you have the luxury of subjectivity brother, you don't need to be the subject of his.
Nadeem