Who is "Abu Lahab" in this Aya
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Nun de plume,
Could you please explain what you mean by this statement;
then we also have all 19 tables containing those verse numbers.
These same numeric ploys (cherry picking INPUT) are used by modern day pollsters/tacticians.
Basically, tell what result (i.e. OUTPUT) you want to see and INPUTS are tweaked accordingly.As I said I did not use this method, but if you are so sure then can you give an example from the Quran and using your calculations..
It?s not a question of your honesty rather a question of the method ? do you understand now?
No I don't can you clarify what you mean because as I have told you I have not used your prescribed method, therefore I do not know what you are ranting about..
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Peace Ijaz,
Could you please explain what you mean by this statement;
As I said I did not use this method, but if you are so sure then can you give an example from the Quran and using your calculations..Why don't you use the same exact method for determining who the blind man in Chapter 80 is? I know you can't. You know why. Because in the case of the blind man, you have no preconception of who it is. Thus, you can't work backwards to get to your preconceived result.
No I don't can you clarify what you mean because as I have told you I have not used your prescribed method, therefore I do not know what you are ranting about..
You used a certain method that gives you your preconceived result. You obviously tried different methods and combinations until you got the 19 divisible result that you wanted (this is what Code-19 numerologists call "study".
For example, here is what you said
when one says Muhammad?s Uncle it would be gv Muhammad and gv Aumam. we get;
111 15 92 150 = 58504850 x 19Actually, in Arabic saying "Muhammad 'Amm" means "Muhammad is the uncle" rotfl
In Arabic "Muhammad's uncle" should be "'Amm Muhammad". So 'Amm should be first. But probably you tried 111 15 150 92 (and several other combinations) and it didn't give you a 19 divisible. So you conveniently disregard the proper order in Arabic and use the irrelevant English order instead.
This haphazard shifting of the method to reach your preconceived result can be said about every step in your supposed "method". For example, why not add 111 and 15, why not use 111 1 111 2 111 3 111 4 111 5, why not multiply instead of add, etc. etc. etc..... There is a very large number of methods and combinations and guess what, 1 out of every 19 trials of this very large number of trials would naturally give you a 19 divisible result. So the trick is to shift and tweak the method until you get your preconceived result.
This same haphazard shifting of the method to reach your preconceived result can be said not only about your antics on this thread but about every single Code-19 miracle that only mathematical idiots believe in.
Peace,
Ayman
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Dear Friends;
Who was "abu Lahab" in this Aya??1111
Is it a factitious character also (as Per Quranist) ??
I have sometimes wondered the same -
Using Quranic Dictionary.
Perish the hands of fiery tempered and perish he.
Not will benefit him his wealth and what he earned.
He will be burnt in a fire of blazing flames.
And his commands to frequent ill speech.
In his neck a snare of twisted palm fiber.Salaams.
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Ayman,
Why don't you use the same exact method for determining who the blind man in Chapter 80 is? I know you can't.
The blind man was just a blind man there is no name attached to him, otherwise we would have heard about it.
You know why. Because in the case of the blind man, you have no preconception of who it is. Thus, you can't work backwards to get to your preconceived result.
What's wrong with preconceived idea, I refer to history and confirm it in the Quran, still you do not accept it, if I had brought a name out of the blue for the blind man, WOULD YOU HAVE BELIEVED I do'nt think so. You are just making excuses so that you don't have to believe in the codes, your ego is stopping you..
Actually, in Arabic saying "Muhammad 'Amm" means "Muhammad is the uncle" rotfl
In Arabic "Muhammad's uncle" should be "'Amm Muhammad". So 'Amm should be first. But probably you tried 111 15 150 92 (and several other combinations) and it didn't give you a 19 divisible. So you conveniently disregard the proper
order in Arabic and use the irrelevant English order instead.In fact the code is perfectly fine so there, my codes with the Grace of God start from left to right in cronological order. The Quran was earliest, then Muhammad and then his Uncle who was older then Muhammad..
why not add 111 and 15, why not use 111 1 111 2 111 3 111 4 111 5, why not
No the code cannot be done any way you like, because there is a reason, Dr Rashad Khalifa the messenger of the covenant introduced this code, I am using the same method's like him with few steps forward, because God tells us that the history of the messengers sets precedence for us;
Messengers before you have been rejected, and they steadfastly persevered in the face of rejection. They were persecuted until our victory came to them. Such is GOD's system that will never change. The history of My messengers thus sets the precedents for you.
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Peace Izaj,
The blind man was just a blind man there is no name attached to him, otherwise we would have heard about it.
What's wrong with preconceived idea, I refer to history and confirm it in the Quran, still you do not accept it, if I had brought a name out of the blue for the blind man, WOULD YOU HAVE BELIEVED I do'nt think so. You are just making excuses so that you don't have to believe in the codes, your ego is stopping you..It is not my problem that you are ignorant of logic and can't see what is wrong with a preconceived idea (which leads you to a circular argument fallacy).
Naturally your code is completly useless without a preconceived idea. This is for the simple reason that you are always working BACKWARDS to self-fulfill your idea. Therefore, it would never provide any information beyond the false Hadiths that you are basing your preconceptions ENTIRELY on.
I am sorry but I don't believe in your crappy fallacious and useless Code and Hadiths.
In fact the code is perfectly fine so there, my codes with the Grace of God start from left to right in cronological order. The Quran was earliest, then Muhammad and then his Uncle who was older then Muhammad..
So now you change the method yet again and introduce a new twist to make it fit. This is pathetic.
By the way, Arabic is written from right to left so in this case you would have 92 150 15 111. But of course nothing matters as long as you delude yourself into believing that you got your preconceived result.
No the code cannot be done any way you like, because there is a reason, Dr Rashad Khalifa the messenger of the covenant introduced this code, I am using the same method's like him with few steps forward, because God tells us that the history of the messengers sets precedence for us;
I am sorry but Dr. Khalifa was a proven hypocrite and propagator of lies so he cannot be a messenger. You are using the same deceptive principals but not the same method as him. He didn't have a method. He had a slew of inconsistent methods. But even those inconsistent methods he himself routinely violated to get to his preconceived ideas. You are not making any steps forward, you are haphazardly making up methods until you get the result that you want. Did the god tell you to start with a preconceived idea and work backwards to justify it? Is this what a messenger does? Is this the example of Abraham? No, this is what ignorants such as Dr. Khalifa and you do.
Peace,
Ayman
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I have sometimes wondered the same -
Using Quranic Dictionary.
Perish the hands of fiery tempered and perish he.
Not will benefit him his wealth and what he earned.
He will be burnt in a fire of blazing flames.
And his commands to frequent ill speech.
In his neck a snare of twisted palm fiber.Salaams.
Peace mz,
Very interesting translation! It eliminates 'Abu Lahab' as a character altogether.
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Ayman,
It is not my problem that you are ignorant of logic and can't see what is wrong with a preconceived idea (which leads you to a circular argument fallacy).
What logic?? If there is logic in your argument then lets here it, and what do you mean by "circular argument fallacy", why are big words used to confuse people when they do not mean anything!!
Naturally your code is completly useless without a preconceived idea
That is your opinion, nothing more or less, you do not prove anything in your posts just come up with big words to confuse people.
I am sorry but Dr. Khalifa was a proven hypocrite and propagator of lies so he cannot
Once again this is just your opnion, no more no less and that you have not proven this point at all.
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I have sometimes wondered the same -
Using Quranic Dictionary.
Perish the hands of fiery tempered and perish he.
Not will benefit him his wealth and what he earned.
He will be burnt in a fire of blazing flames.
And his commands to frequent ill speech.
In his neck a snare of twisted palm fiber.Salaams.
Which is this Quranic Dictionary which is using "male pronouns" for "female " (Imaraatun)
Subhanallah Another PEARL FROM A QURANIST
BTW
Which verse has been translated asAnd his commands to frequent ill speech
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Abu Lahab may well have been the Prophet's uncle and may well have been an evil person who deserved to be mentioned in that chapter.
But how does this necessitate Hadith as a compulsory addition to understanding the Qur'an? Beats me.
Even if we did not know that he was the Prophet's uncle, the Qur'anic message is not lost. -
Abu Lahab may well have been the Prophet's uncle and may well have been an evil person who deserved to be mentioned in that chapter.
But how does this necessitate Hadith as a compulsory addition to understanding the Qur'an? Beats me.
Even if we did not know that he was the Prophet's uncle, the Qur'anic message is not lost.
Analyzing and properly scrutinizing any historical event or even an artefact is crucial to evaluating its purpose. Just stating that Abee Lahab and his wife were condemned to hell without any explanation or reason is dangerously, unknowingly and incompetently judgmental. There were worst enemies of Muhammad than Abee Lahab (nick named "inflammatory father" or "father of flames", shockingly not even mentioned, and it could possibly be the other way around. Besides, if we had no idea what the words meant, then sky would be the limit to blaspheme, as intentionally taken out of Arabic dictionaries without knowning whether the meanings of a specific Quranic word is classical, later addition, modern or simply cluttered. -
Peace Bro,
When the Quran uses a 'nick name', which is given as a description of the name-holder, that comments on the persons hot temper, then it is enough information for the wise, and for the rest like me, to understand what the condemnation is all about.
Nadeem
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When the Quran uses a 'nick name', which is given as a description of the name-holder, that comments on the persons hot temper, then it is enough information for the wise, and for the rest like me, to understand what the condemnation is all about.
Nadeem, the Quran is allegedly claimed to be the Word of God and it seems that this God is using "nick names" (conjecture). Abee lahab may be descriptive but it specifically refers to Abd al Uzza and his wife Umme Jamil. They had two sons who married the daughters of Muhammad/Khadija. Amr ibn Hisham was also nicknamed Abul Jahl (father of ignorance) by Muhammad and his accomplices and not by a fathomless GOD, LOL!. There's no wisdom in surah 111. It is incomplete and deficient of any standards to claim condemnation on husband and wife without an explanation or reason. Just stating "father of flames" as a descriptive form is not by any means an explanation or reason whatsoever, let alone wisdom. One is forced into analyzing the verse's historical event in order to justify the condemnation thwarted upon the husband and wife. It is clear from ahadith that they troubled Muhammad because they refused to submit to Muhammad's harsh commands and severe punishments (as clearly dipicted in the Quran as well). They were part of Muhammad's family (as many others were) and were powerful people. Muhammad could not bring them to his own "corrupted" justice as he did with others, so he condemned them. Few other verses relate the same picture.The Quranists approach exactly in the same manner towards all other Muslim sectarians and non-Muslims as well, as if they were all abu jahl and abu lahab, and as a matter of fact among themselves. ) The question is why and what makes them say this to each other? Is this the trait of a merciful loving GOD towards his own creation who needs his alleged "body guard" (an angel) with wings to command Muhammad secretly in order to command all others and then put everything in a book form so that no can properly understand so that his entire creation can call each other deaf, dumb and blind? o One might as well read Harry Porter fairly tales and be done with? Analyzing the Quran's compilation process along with its external/internal renderings, I can at least evidently confess that this book has a lot of problems which Muslims relentlessly, manipulatively and wishfully disregard any criticisms or objections against it with extreme denial and awe. If its not the Kaba, then its the book (alone) that becomes an idol. Without reason, logic and explanation, there's no wisdom. Religion is truely a farce.
Remember, I am discussing the Quran for what it is and what it states from historical standpoint. Please don't take this as a personal attack.
peace
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Hey! Harry Potter tales are x-cellent.
Certainly, Joe. Its an x-cellent way to amuse the kids and the adult ignorants anecdotally. Movies are similar to fashion industry. They are competitive, pleasing to the eye, keep changing fast and determines the garments of righteousness worn. -
The movies are good, but I'm walking about the books. Those outshine the movies like the sun behind the sun.
The books are written AFTER the sun shines. If one already knows that the sun shines, what good is a book that is dimlit and shadowed. )
peace -
Peace to you Genteel,
Nadeem, the Quran is allegedly claimed to be the Word of God and it seems that this God is using "nick names" (conjecture).
It is not conjecture brother, it is the language of that area. A person was named according to his reputation. A man could have several names. He could be named after his village, after his skills, after his looks, after his attitude, after his thought etc. A man would change name when he had his first born. If my first born was called Ali, then I would be called "Abu Ali", not "Nadeem". At least that is what my textbook says.
Abee lahab may be descriptive but it specifically refers to Abd al Uzza and his wife Umme Jamil. They had two sons who married the daughters of Muhammad/Khadija. Amr ibn Hisham was also nicknamed Abul Jahl (father of ignorance) by Muhammad and his accomplices and not by a fathomless GOD, LOL!. There's no wisdom in surah 111. It is incomplete and deficient of any standards to claim condemnation on husband and wife without an explanation or reason.
Now that is conjecture.
Just stating "father of flames" as a descriptive form is not by any means an explanation or reason whatsoever, let alone wisdom.
Seems so to me. Since "Abu Lahab" is a description, it refers to anyone suitable to carry it. I do not limit "Abu Lahab" to a specific person, and thus I enjoy the privilege of being reminded that those who are angry and harsh with the people will suffer, no matter what their wealth is. (Quran ch. 111 "His money will not avail him"
I agree, the message is very simple and doesn't sound fancy or anything, but it's there.
One is forced into analyzing the verse's historical event in order to justify the condemnation thwarted upon the husband and wife.
Yet here I am as free as a bird.
it is clear from ahadith that they troubled Muhammad because they refused to submit to Muhammad's harsh commands and severe punishments (as clearly dipicted in the Quran as well).
Well I met a guy, who knew a guy, that had this cousin who had a mother that had met a man that said that this just ain't so.
The Quranists approach exactly in the same manner towards all other Muslim sectarians and non-Muslims as well, as if they were all abu jahl and abu lahab, and as a matter of fact among themselves.
Some do, others don't.
The question is why and what makes them say this to each other? Is this the trait of a merciful loving GOD towards his own creation who needs his alleged "body guard" (an angel) with wings to command Muhammad secretly in order to command all others and then put everything in a book form so that no can properly understand so that his entire creation can call each other deaf, dumb and blind?
People will call each other whatever they please, there is no other factor involved here but the people themselves.
And I completely missed how you linked human behavior with the divine trait.
Without reason, logic and explanation, there's no wisdom
.I've always believed that.
Remember, I am discussing the Quran for what it is and what it states from historical standpoint. Please don't take this as a personal attack.
I never do. I, and the Quran itself, invites towards the criticism of Quran. Or are there some that think that the 'pondering' and 'reflection' encouraged by the Quran consist merely of a series of 'WOW!'s and 'So true, so true's ?
Personally, I've got several bones to pick with the Quran, it's not like it makes perfect sense to me either. I've got a heart, and my eyebrows do flinch a little when I hear about for example flogging. But I'm not going to be so small that I'll reject the concept simply because it seems harsh. Where is the logic in that? I think it's better to study these kind of punishments and see if they work. If they don't, I do not see why we are not well within our rights to mend them. I believe we are obliged to.
Peace,
Nadeem