Meteors chase things?
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I said, if it's possible, it's possible, and nothing more.
But the chemical attraction should work all across the board, and not just on the specific jinn who happen to steal a hearing. So this one goes out the window, but I know you have many more in store, as I was sincere when I said you should be a science fiction writer. Nobody is as creative as Muslims when it comes to religion.
Correction. You said "the word "jinn" means entities that have the ability to conceal themselves". What are these "entities"? So much for bona fide, when you can't even post the unadulterated meaning.
Didn't I say the word Jinn means "to conceal"? Isn't that what I said? That IS the unadulterated meaning. I was taught this by Muslims that apparently know more than you do.
So, if it is possible for one human to be struck by lightning repeatedly, it should happen to ALL humans? They wouldn't be attracted to any of them, simply those that used stealth, and those that stole a hearing. Either the stealth or the theft could cause it.
Oh please, that's enough of the reaching, OK? I think you are a bright teenager. Do you know why I think so? Because in my experiences, teenagers have unlimited creativity, but they have a poor sense of plausibility. That sense only comes with age and experience. An adult would know not to reach as far as you are attempting to reach. But you're crazy if you think I'm going to continually entertain any sort of idea you can invent until you've exhausted your imagination, because it would take a very very long time to exhaust your imagination. So sorry, but "possible" is not good enough. I'm looking for "plausible", if you understand the difference between the two.
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But the chemical attraction should work all across the board, and not just on the specific jinn who happen to steal a hearing. So this one goes out the window, but I know you have many more in store, as I was sincere when I said you should be a science fiction writer. Nobody is as creative as Muslims when it comes to religion.
Where did you get that? The process of stealth or the process of theft or both, or whatever, could easily cause it.
Didn't I say the word Jinn means "to conceal"? Isn't that what I said? That IS the unadulterated meaning. I was taught this by Muslims that apparently know more than you do.
You said entities that have the ability to cloak themselves, implying living beings, I want to know what these entities are ;D.
That IS the unadulterated meaning.
Good to see you caught on and are now using unadulterated meanings instead of Arnold's Lexicon and Tafsir Ibn Arnold ;D
I'm looking for "plausible", if you understand the difference between the two.
It's implausible if "jinn" are living beings. Now show me where "jinn" are living beings. By your admission, jinn means "to conceal" or "concealed".
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Where did you get that? The process of stealth or the process of theft or both, or whatever, could easily cause it.
If you hear something, then this sets off a chemical reaction? Oh come on. I told you, I'm not entertaining your imagination forever. Plausible, not possible. Possible is stupid to bring up. Plausible is relevant.
You said entities that have the ability to cloak themselves, implying living beings, I want to know what these entities are ;D.
Ask the Quran and the Hadiths. I don't know why you're asking me. Here, here's a good article all about the Jinn from a very respected Muslim website.
http//thetruereligion.org/modules/wfsection/article.php?articleid=55
Good to see you caught on and are now using unadulterated meanings instead of Arnold's Lexicon and Tafsir Ibn Arnold ;D
Caught on to what? I'm merely trying to play it from your angle. Most other Muslims I've talked to would consider you to be a blithering apostate, so don't go around thinking you have the correct standard and that people should finally catch on. Look, I'll tell you this very simply. You're not particularly bright and the jargon you hide behind does not particularly impress me, and people do not usually speak in the most complex fashion they can unless they want to show people they are smart, and the people that usually do this are actually hiding the fact that they really aren't particularly smart when it come down to it. So I have no idea why you keep thinking you're being clever, when all you are doing is inventing less than plausible "possibilities". Start giving me something plausible, rather than the bounds of your imagination, OK?
It's implausible if "jinn" are living beings. Now show me where "jinn" are living beings. By your admission, jinn means "to conceal" or "concealed".
Sura 72 Al-Jinn. Seems like living beings to me. In fact, some even become Muslims. Dude, you are way off. I don't even think most Muslims would agree with you either. Am I having a conversation with a whack job? I hope not.
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If you hear something, then this sets off a chemical reaction? Oh come on. I told you, I'm not entertaining your imagination forever. Plausible, not possible. Possible is stupid to bring up. Plausible is relevant.
Ask the Quran and the Hadiths. I don't know why you're asking me. Here, here's a good article all about the Jinn from a very respected Muslim website.
http//thetruereligion.org/modules/wfsection/article.php?articleid=55
Caught on to what? I'm merely trying to play it from your angle. Most other Muslims I've talked to would consider you to be a blithering apostate, so don't go around thinking you have the correct standard and that people should finally catch on. Look, I'll tell you this very simply. You're not particularly bright and the jargon you hide behind does not particularly impress me, and people do not usually speak in the most complex fashion they can unless they want to show people they are smart, and the people that usually do this are actually hiding the fact that they really aren't particularly smart when it come down to it. So I have no idea why you keep thinking you're being clever, when all you are doing is inventing less than plausible "possibilities". Start giving me something plausible, rather than the bounds of your imagination, OK?
Sura 72 Al-Jinn. Seems like living beings to me. In fact, some even become Muslims. Dude, you are way off. I don't even think most Muslims would agree with you either. Am I having a conversation with a whack job? I hope not.
It isn't "if you hear something", it is "if you steal a hearing".
Ask the Quran and the Hadiths. I don't know why you're asking me. Here, here's a good article all about the Jinn from a very respected Muslim website.
But you're the one trying to say "jinn are chased by meteors", not the Quran...
1529, 329, and other verses clearly show humans are special, living entities, where is this for jinn? Nothing in that article.
Caught on to what? I'm merely trying to play it from your angle. Most other Muslims I've talked to would consider you to be a blithering apostate, so don't go around thinking you have the correct standard and that people should finally catch on. Look, I'll tell you this very simply. You're not particularly bright and the jargon you hide behind does not particularly impress me, and people do not usually speak in the most complex fashion they can unless they want to show people they are smart, and the people that usually do this are actually hiding the fact that they really aren't particularly smart when it come down to it. So I have no idea why you keep thinking you're being clever, when all you are doing is inventing less than plausible "possibilities". Start giving me something plausible, rather than the bounds of your imagination, OK?
Blithering apostate, ;D. It isn't "complex language", it's the easiest way to get to the point. Somehow I get the feeling I struck a nerve somewhere. Not my problem if you can't be bothered to think what the word "passive" or whatever means in context.
Sura 72 Al-Jinn. Seems like living beings to me. In fact, some even become Muslims. Dude, you are way off. I don't even think most Muslims would agree with you either. Am I having a conversation with a whack job? I hope not.
That's already been addressed. I don't care whether "most Muslims would agree" either. All you've said is "waah, no fair" and "waah, that's off" and "waaha, you nutjob", show me where jinn are directly said to be alive. Put up, or shut up. As for your conversation with a whack job, it depends, do you talk to yourself?
Regardless, the original topic, that "jinn" are chased by "meteors" is pure horses***. This is just a diversion on your part. The fact of the matter is that the word cannot be tied specifically to "meteor", or even worse, "shooting stars", because it refers to the lowest heaven adorned with planets, last I checked, the sky isn't adorned with planets.
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It isn't "if you hear something", it is "if you steal a hearing".
;D Same thing. If you hear one of heaven's conversations or you steal one, it's pretty much the same thing. Remember, these are conversations that we are talking about, not objects. The moment you hear it, you have stolen a hearing.
But you're the one trying to say "jinn are chased by meteors", not the Quran...
I disagree, and I explained precisely why. And, if you would like, I can show you multiple Muslim websites that concur that these verses were talking about meteorites. It's pretty obvious.
1529, 329, and other verses clearly show humans are special, living entities, where is this for jinn? Nothing in that article. That's already been addressed. I don't care whether "most Muslims would agree" either. All you've said is "waah, no fair" and "waah, that's off" and "waaha, you nutjob", show me where jinn are directly said to be alive. Put up, or shut up.
Did you even read it? The entire article was entirely about the jinn. See why I start to question your coherence? OK, but you'll just deny that as something that other Muslims think, so to the Quran it is. I'm amazed you don't know this. Jinn a living thing? Of course it is, and it's all over the Quran.
6128 One day will He gather them all together, (and say) "O ye assembly of jinns! Much (toll) did ye take of men." Their friends amongst men will say "Our Lord! we made profit from each other but (alas!) we reached our term - which thou didst appoint for us." He will say "The Fire be your dwelling-place you will dwell therein for ever, except as Allah willeth." for thy Lord is full of wisdom and knowledge
6130 "O ye assembly of jinns and men! came there not unto you apostles from amongst you, setting forth unto you My signs, and warning you of the meeting of this Day of yours?" They will say "We bear witness against ourselves." It was the life of this world that deceived them. So against themselves will they bear witness that they rejected Faith
7179 Many are the jinns and men we have made for Hell They have hearts wherewith they understand not, eyes wherewith they see not, and ears wherewith they hear not. They are like cattle,- nay more misguided for they are heedless (of warning)
11119 Except those on whom thy Lord hath bestowed His Mercy and for this did He create them and the Word of thy Lord shall be fulfilled "I will fill Hell with jinns and men all together
1527 And the jinn race, We had created before, from the fire of a scorching wind
1788 Say "If the whole of mankind and jinns were to gather together to produce the like of this Qur'an,.........
1850 Behold! We said to the angels, "Bow down to Adam" They bowed down except Iblis. He was one of the jinns, and he broke the Command of his Lord.
2717 And before Solomon were marshalled his hosts,- of jinns and men and birds, and they were all kept in order and ranks
2739 Said an 'Ifrit, of the jinns "I will bring it to thee before thou rise from thy council
3213 If We had so willed, We could certainly have brought every soul its true guidance but the Word from Me will come true, "I will fill Hell with jinns and men all together.
3412 And to Solomon (We made) the Wind (obedient) Its early morning (stride) was a month's (journey), and its evening (stride) was a month's (journey); and We made a Font of molten brass to flow for him; and there were jinns that worked in front of him, by the leave of his Lord, and if any of them turned aside from our command, We made him taste of the Penalty of the Blazing Fire
3414 Then, when We decreed (Solomon's) death, nothing showed them his death except a little worm of the earth, which kept (slowly) gnawing away at his staff so when he fell down, the jinns saw plainly that if they had known the unseen, they would not have tarried in the humiliating Penalty (of their Task)
3441 They will say, "Glory to Thee! our (tie) is with Thee - as Protector - not with them. Nay, but they worshipped the jinns most of them believed in them.
37158 And they have invented a blood-relationship between Him and the jinns but the jinns know (quite well) that they have indeed to appear (before his Judgment- Seat)!
4125 And We have destined for them intimate companions (of like nature), who made alluring to them what was before them and behind them; and the sentence among the previous generations of jinns and men, who have passed away, is proved against them; for they are utterly lost.
4129 And the Unbelievers will say "Our Lord! Show us those, among jinns and men, who misled us We shall crush them beneath our feet, so that they become the vilest (before all).
4618 Such are they against whom is proved the sentence among the previous generations of jinns and men, that have passed away; for they will be (utterly) lost.
4629 Behold, We turned towards thee a company of jinns (quietly) listening to the Qur'an when they stood in the presence thereof, they said, "Listen in silence!" When the (reading) was finished, they returned to their people, to warn (them of their sins)
5156 I have only created jinns and men, that they may serve Me
5533 O ye assembly of jinns and men! If it be ye can pass beyond the zones of the heavens and the earth, pass ye! not without authority shall ye be able to pass
5539 On that Day no question will be asked of man or jinn as to his sin.
5556 In them will be (Maidens), chaste, restraining their glances, whom no man or jinn before them has touched
5574 Whom no man or jinn before them has touched
721 Say It has been revealed to me that a company of jinns listened (to the Qur'an). They said, 'We have really heard a wonderful Recital!
726 'True, there were persons among mankind who took shelter with persons among the jinns, but they increased them in folly
Whew !!! That was a long one. ;D At this point, i would say that the Quran thinks they are living beings. What do you think? I had no idea why you would think the jinn are not referred to as living beings, which is why I start to detect some imbalance or something.
Blithering apostate, ;D. It isn't "complex language", it's the easiest way to get to the point. Somehow I get the feeling I struck a nerve somewhere. Not my problem if you can't be bothered to think what the word "passive" or whatever means in context.
You didn't strike a neverve, you're merely annoying by constantly referring to active and passive when it really doesn't matter. It's an irrelevant side point. A distraction.
Regardless, the original topic, that "jinn" are chased by "meteors" is pure horses***.
You can call it whatever you want, but I know what those verse say and even most Muslims agree with this, as per the posted article from a respected Muslim website. So you can hiss, poo poo or do any other objecting you want, but those verse don't say what you need them to say, and it's not horse *** in the least. Why don't you tell me what else fits the following qualifications.
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In the sky
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Bright for us to see
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Pursuing or flying across the sky.
So you tell me what else fits that bill, and make it good. My interpretaion works perfectly with the verses. Those verse all match shooting stars perfectly in every way.
This is just a diversion on your part. The fact of the matter is that the word cannot be tied specifically to "meteor", or even worse, "shooting stars", because it refers to the lowest heaven adorned with planets, last I checked, the sky isn't adorned with planets.
;D Well, all the other translators say "stars", but either way, it doesn't really matter. 675 calls them lamps. Do you think lamps are referring to planets? Could you please think these things out a little more before you post them?
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Grin Same thing. If you hear one of heaven's conversations or you steal one, it's pretty much the same thing. Remember, these are conversations that we are talking about, not objects. The moment you hear it, you have stolen a hearing.
Not the same thing. That is eavesdropping, not exactly the same thing.
I disagree, and I explained precisely why. And, if you would like, I can show you multiple Muslim websites that concur that these verses were talking about meteorites. It's pretty obvious.
I don't care if multiple "Muslim websites" concur.
Did you even read it? The entire article was entirely about the jinn. See why I start to question your coherence? OK, but you'll just deny that as something that other Muslims think, so to the Quran it is. I'm amazed you don't know this. Jinn a living thing? Of course it is, and it's all over the Quran.
If you read the references to Quran I posted, they make it clear that humans are living, as in "breathed with Allah's spirit". God has no defined language in the Quran. See 4111, for instance. Inanimate objects don't talk, yet here they are, communicating. Likewise, for Solomon, 2716. As I said, personification. I'm not saying "jinn" aren't alive, but I take a position of caution because the Quran doesn't seem to state it directly as it has for humans. All of those show speech and personification, none show a direct link between life and jinn. I guess, 1850 shows definite self-awareness from a "jinn".
You didn't strike a neverve, you're merely annoying by constantly referring to active and passive when it really doesn't matter. It's an irrelevant side point. A distraction.
This argument revolves around those two terms. It's a distraction because it negates your agenda, and we wouldn't want that, would we?
You can call it whatever you want, but I know what those verse say and even most Muslims agree with this, as per the posted article from a respected Muslim website. So you can hiss, poo poo or do any other objecting you want, but those verse don't say what you need them to say, and it's not horse *** in the least. Why don't you tell me what else fits the following qualifications.
Most Christians tell me Jesus is the Son of God, therefore, Jesus is the Son of God. )
As for what else fits the qualifications, take your pick. I used the example of solar plasma.
In your numbers,
1.) It isn't "sky", it is "samawat".
2.) Where does it say "For us to see"?
3.) It doesn't say that. It doesn't reference their location except close to the lowest heaven.
Now, your interpretation matches "sky" very well, but it doesn't match the original meaning well at all. All the criteria you used are dubious.
Well, all the other translators say "stars", but either way, it doesn't really matter. 675 calls them lamps. Do you think lamps are referring to planets? Could you please think these things out a little more before you post them?
Newsflash More than one type of celestial body exists. Why do you think "lamps" refers to meteors, which emit no light of their own until they actually start burning up?
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Arnold has been suspended. It seems as though it's okay fro all of you guys to fling insuslts and camm me childish, but I can't do the same as well without being suspended. BYW, I can't answer your argument right now, but it was absolutely ridiculous
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Hmm, are you the Salvation Army? ;D
I think you're missing the point.
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Was Arnold suspended?Why does this Iris always pop up close to the departure of some immature-seeming, odd, debater with destructive agendas, like Arnold and Starjade? Are they all members of the same sect or what?
Who is this Iris? The xian fairy god mother of all those who come here to proclaim their anti-quran truths???