History
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to much arabs have to much pride in themselves all because they're arab and believe their elite because the prophet was arab,
997 The Arabs (al-arabu) are the worst in rejection and hypocrisy, and more likely not to know the limits of what God has sent upon His messenger
BTW, Who said the prophet (Muhammad Ibnu Abdullah) was an Arab?
Can you point out a reference / evidence of this in the Quran? -
997 The Arabs (al-arabu) are the worst in rejection and hypocrisy, and more likely not to know the limits of what God has sent upon His messenger
BTW, Who said the prophet (Muhammad Ibnu Abdullah) was an Arab?
Can you point out a reference / evidence of this in the Quran?Peace Jafar,
I don't think that verse is talking about arabs today. If it were talking about all arabs that would be a racist statement. And if I recall correctly that chapter talks about a specific situation to Muhammad's Time. -
I don't think that verse is talking about arabs today. If it were talking about all arabs that would be a racist statement. And if I recall correctly that chapter talks about a specific situation to Muhammad's Time.
Two points are clear
- That verse is talking about AL-ARABU or THE ARABS.
- There is no verse in the Quran stating that The Prophet / Muhammad Ibnu Abdullah is an ARAB.
The truthfulness of the verse is self-evident and even valid in today's world.
You can many verses with similar theme about THE ARABS in THE QURAN.
You can also find verses that NOT ALL ARABS are like that there are SOME ARABS which are trully a mukmineen.
You can many verses with similar theme about THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK in THE QURAN.
You can also find verses that NOT ALL PEOPLE OF THE BOOK are like that there are SOME PEOPLE OF THE BOOK which are trully a mukmineen.The word ARAB by itself is derived from the Hebrew word ARAV which means DESERT. And ARAVAH means DESERT PLAIN.
Thus AL-ARABU actually means "DESERT PEOPLE".Egyptians doesn't call themselves ARABS at that time.
Syrians doesn't call themselves ARABS at that time.
Mesopotamians (Iraqis) doesn't call themselves ARABS at that time.
Canaanites (Palestines/Israelites) doesn't call themselves ARABS at that time. -
Doesn't it stand for Bedouins Jafar?
Anyway there is good and bad of all sorts. Doesn't matter if their arab or not.
also wouldn't it make sense that the prophet knows arabic to spread the word in arabic. not everything in the quran is black and white.
20113 AND THUS have We bestowed from on high this as a discourse in the arabic tongue, and have given therein many facets to all manner of warnings, so that men might remain conscious of Us, or that it give rise to a new awareness in them
427 and so We have revealed unto thee a discourse in the arabic tongue in order that thou mayest warn the foremost of all cities and all who dwell around it to wit, warn of the Day of the Gathering, which is beyond all doubt some shall find themselves in paradise, and some in the blazing flame.
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Peace all,
There is a positive reference for The desert folk (999).
Also, Al madeena is a COMMON noun in Al Quran.
See 7123, 1230, 1567, 1882, 2748, 2815, 2818, 2820 and lots more.
I agree that Al arabu = The desert folk.
4816 Say to those Nomads/Al arabs who lagged behind "You will be called on to fight a people who are very powerful in warfare, unless they surrender. Then if you obey, God will grant you a good reward, but if you turn away as you turned away before, He will punish you with a painful retribution."
"As you turned away before," interesting.
Also, Al arabu is/can be temporary. If they joined Muhammad they became part of 'ahul al madeenah' (i.e. literally people of the city, whatever city he lived in).
Let's also recall that most of the references to nazerenes and jews are NEGATIVE.
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Peace all,
There is a positive reference for The desert folk (999).
Also, Al madeena is a COMMON noun in Al Quran.
See 7123, 1230, 1567, 1882, 2748, 2815, 2818, 2820 and lots more.
I agree that Al arabu = The desert folk.
4816 Say to those Nomads/Al arabs who lagged behind "You will be called on to fight a people who are very powerful in warfare, unless they surrender. Then if you obey, God will grant you a good reward, but if you turn away as you turned away before, He will punish you with a painful retribution."
"As you turned away before," interesting.
Also, Al arabu is/can be temporary. If they joined Muhammad they became part of 'ahul al madeenah' (i.e. literally people of the city, whatever city he lived in).
Let's also recall that most of the references to nazerenes and jews are NEGATIVE.
In arabic there are three terms
-Proper noun
-Definite noun
-Common noun
Al-madina = Definite noun not a common noun
What is your source of information ? Thanks in advance -
Peace jafar/all.
BTW, Who said the prophet (Muhammad Ibnu Abdullah) was an Arab?
Can you point out a reference / evidence of this in the Quran?I am a little confused, although I can read Arabic, I don't understand the language at all and for my understanding of Quran I totally depend upon the translations. So please ignore any absurdity in my post.
The word ARAB by itself is derived from the Hebrew word ARAV which means DESERT. And ARAVAH means DESERT PLAIN.
Thus AL-ARABU actually means "DESERT PEOPLE".Ok brother, but these desert people spoke a language known as Arabic, quran was revealed in Arabic through a messenger who spoke the same language.
The land they dwelled in was known as Arabia long before the Christian era. The Arabic language was the main symbol of cultural unity among these people and Arabs was the name given to these ancient inhabitants of the Arabian Peninsula and often applied to the peoples closely allied to them in ancestry, language, and culture.
Therefore it is confusing as to why the prophet wasn?t an Arab?
A Book of which the verses are made plain, AN ARABIC QURAN for a people who know 41 3.
And if We had sent this as a Qur'?n in a foreign language other than Arabic, they would have said "Why are not its Verses explained in detail (in our language)? What! (A Book) not in Arabic and (the Messenger) AN ARAB?" Say "It is for those who believe, a guide and a healing. And as for those who disbelieve, there is heaviness (deafness) in their ears, and it (the Qur'?n) is blindness for them. They are those who are called from a place far away (so they neither listen nor understand). 41 44.
And We did not send any messenger BUT WITH THE LANGUAGE OF HIS PEOPLE, so that he might explain to them clearly; then Allah makes whom He pleases err and He guides whom He pleases and He is the Mighty, the Wise. 14 4.
peace
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Peace jafar/all.
I am a little confused, although I can read Arabic, I don't understand the language at all and for my understanding of Quran I totally depend upon the translations. So please ignore any absurdity in my post.Ok brother, but these desert people spoke a language known as Arabic, quran was revealed in Arabic through a messenger who spoke the same language.
The land they dwelled in was known as Arabia long before the Christian era. The Arabic language was the main symbol of cultural unity among these people and Arabs was the name given to these ancient inhabitants of the Arabian Peninsula and often applied to the peoples closely allied to them in ancestry, language, and culture.
Therefore it is confusing as to why the prophet wasn?t an Arab?
A Book of which the verses are made plain, AN ARABIC QURAN for a people who know 41 3.
And if We had sent this as a Qur'?n in a foreign language other than Arabic, they would have said "Why are not its Verses explained in detail (in our language)? What! (A Book) not in Arabic and (the Messenger) AN ARAB?" Say "It is for those who believe, a guide and a healing. And as for those who disbelieve, there is heaviness (deafness) in their ears, and it (the Qur'?n) is blindness for them. They are those who are called from a place far away (so they neither listen nor understand). 41 44.
And We did not send any messenger BUT WITH THE LANGUAGE OF HIS PEOPLE, so that he might explain to them clearly; then Allah makes whom He pleases err and He guides whom He pleases and He is the Mighty, the Wise. 14 4.
peace
Peace agentxxx,
Thanks for the verses. Another verse that implies no superior or inferior race is3528 And from the people, and the animals, and the livestock, are various colors. As such, only the knowledgeable among God's servants reverence Him. God is Noble, Forgiving.
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Another verse that implies no superior or inferior race is
Peace aalmakato, yes no race is superior or inferior and God will not judge us on the bases of color/caste/nationality, it will be our conduct that will matter in the end.
O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise (each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things). 4913.
peace
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997 The Arabs (al-arabu) are the worst in rejection and hypocrisy, and more likely not to know the limits of what God has sent upon His messenger
BTW, Who said the prophet (Muhammad Ibnu Abdullah) was an Arab?
Can you point out a reference / evidence of this in the Quran?It's a lot like in the bible, where the writers refer to "The Jews" as a group opposing Jesus, despite the fact that Jesus and all his disciples were Jewish, and Jesus was executed with a sign saying "King of the Jews". Hence the Prophet Muhammad castigates his fellow Arabs for their 'rejection and hypocrisy'. Obviously, he's in Arabia, who else is going to reject him or be hypocritical but other Arabs?
On the original question, of course the early Arabs, those from the prophets lifetime, were going to praise themselves, say they were wonderful and sinless, the true, pure, original muslims. The reason they started fighting and murdering each other so quickly is that it was a lie. They feigned faithfulness to enhance their status so they could boss people around and keep their subordinates in line. The reason things then kept getting worse is that later generations were gullible enough to believe the stories and present the bogus teachings of earlier generations as absolute truth.
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In the past Muslim scholars did not take hadiths for granted. They had something called Ijma or Consensus. Today the game is that if it is in Bukhari books then it is true.
Anyway, if you are into sociology you might wanna try Al Muqaddimah by Ibn Khaldun.
Daniel Brown has a dissertation paper about the iconization of Bukhari. It talks about how Bukhari slowly emerged as the authority and how the Sunni fiqh and the hadiths emerged. Earlier scholars did not consider Bukhari as an authority of hadith even when they were very aware of his works. Its the Shafi's who lobbied hard for Bukhari so as to standardize the hadith criteria. The Hanafis took almost 600 years after the Shafi's to accept Bukhari. Whats interesting is how they accepted Bukhari's standards but did not change their madhabs according to his hadiths. They accepted the Isnad criteria of Bukhari but not necessarily the hadith themselves, at least they thought that the madhabs authority is above it. That dissertation more than any other work, really shows how the process of consensus emerged.
I would love to show you that dissertation. I have it in Pdf in my c-drive but I am not sure how to upload it.
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Peace Sarah/all,
Early historians, such as Tabari, and hadith collectors, such as Bukhari, were led to compile their books on the basis of oral narrations as no original written records existed at that time. The authors did not care if the hadiths they are writing contradict the Quran or the other Hadiths or the common sense. In these books a new religion was written that dominated over the Quran despite the claim for the opposite.
More than 5000 hadiths are narrated by Abu Hurayra who came from Yemen in the seventh year of Hijra and converted to Islam. He stayed in the company of the Prophet less than two years. In contrast very few hadiths are narrated by Ayesha, Abu Baker, Ali or Omar, who were in the company of the prophet for a very long time . Most of abu Hurayra's narrated hadiths are called the "Aahad" hadiths, i.e. hadiths only witnessed by one person, this one person was Abu Hurayra himself. Some of the Prophets companions and Ayesha, the Prophet's wife, accused him of being a liar, telling lies about the prophets just to make up hadiths and gain some status. Omar Ibn Al-Khattab, the second Khalifa threatened Abu Hurayra to send him to exile if he does not stop telling hadiths about Muhammed, he did stop until Omar's assassination then started again. He kept telling hadiths to please the Khalifa of the Muslims then, including the time he lived in the Royal Palace of Mu'aawiyah in Syria. The Quranic constitution which guarantees universal human rights and freedom, was distorted and given an imperial twist.
According to the Muslim writers, the prophet died in 632 AD.
The man who compiled the first book of hadiths was born 178 years after the death of the prophet and the man recognized for the first comprehensive book of Islamic history was born 206 years after the prophet's demise.
MUHAMMAD AL-BUKHARI (810-870)
Bukhari was born in July 20, 810 CE in the city of Bukhara, in what is today Uzbekistan.
It is said by the age of ten, Imam Bukhari had memorised 70,000 hadith by heart with their complete chain of narrations going from him to his teacher, and his teacher's teacher, all the way to the Prophet Muhammad.
He was a famous Sunni Islamic scholar of Persian ancestry, most known for authoring the hadith collection named Sahih Bukhari, a collection which Sunni regard as the most authentic (Arabic Sahih) collection after the Qur'an.
Sunni say that notable hadith scholars of that time, such as Ahmad Ibn Hanbal 855, Ibn Man 847, and Ibn Madni 848, all accepted the authenticity of his bookOther Hadith collectors and historians
MUSLIM IBN AL-HAJJAJ. (821-875)
Born in the town of Nishapur in Persia and traces his origins to the Muhammad ibn al-Hanafiyyah of the Arab tribe of Quraish.
Author of the second most widely recognized collection of Hadith in Sunni Islam, "Sahih Muslim"
Among the author's teachers were included Harmala ibn Yahya, Sa'id ibn Mansur, Abd-Allah ibn Maslamah al-Qa'nabi, al-Dhuhali, AL-BUKHARI, Ibn Ma'in, Yahya ibn Yahya al-Nishaburi, and others. Among his students were AL-TIRMIDHI, Ibn Abi Hatim al-Razi, and Ibn Khuzaymah, each of which wrote works on hadith too. After many studies throughout Arabia, Egypt, Iraq and Syria, he settled down in his hometown of Nishapur where he first met Bukhari, with whom he would have a friendship until his death.
He died in 875 CE in Nishapur, where he was also buried.His book is considered among Sunni Muslims the most authentic collections of hadith, second only to al-Bukhari's work.
Estimates on how many hadiths are in his books vary widely from 12,000 to 3,033 depending on whether they remove the duplicates, and consider only the text or the isnad as well. The book is said to share about 1900 hadiths with Bukhari's Sahih
Abu Da'ud Sulayman ibn Ash`ath al-Azadi al-Sijistani (817-88
was a noted collector of hadith and wrote the third of the six canonical hadith collections recognized by Sunni Muslims, Sunan Abi Da'ud. He was born in Sijistan (Sistan or Sagestan, Persia) in 817, and died in 888.ABU IBN MUHAMMAD TIRMIZI (824-892)
He wrote the Sunan al-Tirmidhi, one of the six canonical hadith compilations used in Sunni Islam. He was born in Bugh, a suburb of Termez , Persia. Starting at the age of twenty, he traveled widely, to Kufa, Basra and the Hijaz, seeking out knowledge from, among others, Qutaiba ibn Said, Bukhari, Imam Muslim and Abu Da?ud.Muhammad ibn Ishaq , or simply Ibn Ishaq (died 767) was an Arab Muslim historian. He collected oral traditions that formed the basis of first biography of the Islamic prophet Muhammad. This biography usually called Sirat Rasul Allah (Life of Allah's Messenger).
Abi Ja'far Muhammad ibn Jarir al-Tabari (838-923)
He was one of the earliest, most prominent and famous Persian historians, most famous for his Tarikh al-Tabari (History of the Prophets and Kings) and Tafsir al-Tabari.Tarikh al-Tabari is considered to be the first comprehensive book of History of Islam and his history is considered to be the mother of all history confused. It enjoys a unique position among the histories of Islam and it is the main source of all subsequent books on Islamic history.
But we must keep in mind that God repeatedly told us in the Quran that His book, is complete and fully detailed. God also says that the Quran is enough and that those who do not find the Quran to be enough will be committing idol-worship by having people like Bukhary, Muslim, Ahmed and others as partners with God, in setting the law for this great religion.
peace
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Salam all,
hmm well actually hadiths did exist before bukhari compiled them into a book. All he really did is collect hadiths that were written and orally transmitted and organised them into "sahih" he didn't make them up he just categorised them...
No doubt corruption is what made muslims fall, though I doubt it all came from hadiths. I would like to read historical books of the "originals". i believe hadith today has a massive affect on muslims now, when you read of past men, say ibn jubayr and ibn battuta their memory for traditions is minimal, their knowledge of quran is great and i dont meant just memory but also understanding. today no one understands anything very little anyway. when you read of companions of prophets their conduct is portrayed good, their actions are trying to emulate the prophet. nothing wrong with that, their knowledge is also seen as great.
If a hadith doesn?t contradict the Quran I don?t believe it is bad.
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Salam Sarah,
If a hadith doesn?t contradict the Quran I don?t believe it is bad.
Not questions of good or bad rather that most idolize hadith stories and treat them as Qur?an.
Good advice, history, etc., is fine although it needs to be clear there is only one Qur?an? -
Peace,
hmm well actually hadiths did exist before bukhari compiled them into a book. All he really did is collect hadiths that were written and orally transmitted and organised them into "sahih" he didn't make them up he just categorised them...
He also claimed to have gone through 600,000 hadeeth, that would be one every 28 minutes (no rest or sleep). They didn't have cars back then either
The thing is the hadeeth were never authorized by Muhammad and most importantly God. Not unless The messenger had an interest in being KILLED (6940-46).
1015 And when Our clear AYATS are recited to them, those who do not wish to meet Us said "Bring a Quran other than this, or change it!" Say "It is not for me to change it from my own accord, I merely follow what is inspired to me. I fear if I disobey my Lord the retribution of a great day!"
Ask yourself this Why don't these people simply say 'give us a different ruling!' i.e. hadith?
17/73-76 also talks about this...