The FICTIONAL ANT of the Qur'an
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Peace again "jibbo",
If the Quran did not make correct and useful predictions, be it in the fields of astronomy, archaeology, geology, biology, human behaviour or any other field of science then it wldnt be useful and wouldnt serve as a guide but rather as a hindrance. GOD Bless! -
peace JK
If you agree on using the limited set of available meanings and the grammatical rules of classical arabic to interpret the Quran then i agree with tht too. One point id like to add is the cross referencing with other Quranic verses to see whether the applied meaning gives sense in all those verses sepaking about a similar topic/event. GOD Bless!
cross referencing is good, also one should know that many words have multiply meaning.
yes some verses explains others.Also the Quran has predictive power in its statements. Consider the verse with talks abt GOD creating a "daaba" in 2782 to inform us tht wer not certain abt his revelations. Daaba is either a moving or creeping creature made of water as per other verses of the Quran. This predicts the volution of a creature evolving sometime in a future and indeed scientists came together and int he documentary "the future is wild" predict that the cephalopods(octopus family) would one day be amongst the intelligent beings. Another is "seven heavens". The best and consistent with opther verses prediction im making is tht it refers to seven clearly observable in the future boundaries inside this universe or it being divided into 7 parts each with its own distinct fields and perhaps even distinct laws. Yet another is in 759 where the "sun and moon" crash into one another. this is yet another prediction which cld be very true since the moon is moving away few millimeters from earth every and sun as center has strongest firld so it cld be going there. GOD Bless!
yes the qur'an makes 100% right predictions of the future, but can we ?
what if this daaba means aliens? from earth, yes, but there is many earth's in the universe.
or it could be that cephalopods that you are talking about, some argue that it's the internet, let's say it's the internet, the internet exists know yet, we are not sure if we are right.7 heavens, are we sure what that means ?
7 in classical arabic could also mean several. so it could be talking about the universe as very big.
or is it talking about Multiverses?
are we sure we are right?in other words we can be wrong, but the qur'an can't because it's gods words, the creator of all the exist.
not odd he says he knows the seen and the unseen. -
Peace "jibbo",
yes the qur'an makes 100% right predictions of the future, but can we ?
what if this daaba means aliens? from earth, yes, but there is many earth's in the universe.
or it could be that cephalopods that you are talking about, some argue that it's the internet, let's say it's the internet, the internet exists know yet, we are not sure if we are right.JK- As i said it is necessary that WE AS HUMANS can use the Quran to make useful predictions ofcourse. IF thts not the case whatz use is the Quran then? The Quran is meant to guide us humans. If it doesnt allow US to make significant and useful predictions, MORE THAN OTHER RELIGIOUS SCRIPTURES, in any of the areas mentioned above, then how is it a guide? Did you understand this now?
7 heavens, are we sure what that means ?
7 in classical arabic could also mean several. so it could be talking about the universe as very big.
or is it talking about Multiverses?
are we sure we are right?in other words we can be wrong, but the qur'an can't because it's gods words, the creator of all the exist.
not odd he says he knows the seen and the unseen.JK- The Quran DOES NOT STAND ON ITS OWN. It is there because WE THE OBSERVERS ARE THERE. It is important to understand this. WE interpret the Quran and derive useful precitions from it in accordance with GOD's law. Yes it is possible that we have not interpreted something correct and wed correct ourselves but a SIGNIFIANT no of predictions shldve been right to prove the quran in the 1st place and make it the criterian. Get it? GOD Bless!
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salam JK
yes i undertand what you mean.
we need the qur'an to make useful prediction for it to be useful.
but that is no the issue, the issue is how do we know what it is predicting.some are clear to understand, some are not as i have demonstrated earlier.
if we follow the majority on earth we will be mislead, this is a fact, and easy to understand.
but some are not as easy, that is my point, how do we know the right thing before we can understand it?
i totally understand you, and you are right.
after all it does talk about the universe, we have not mastered the universe, and some verses have multiply meanings.
we can only understand things to the best of our knowledge, and what is right know, could be wrong in the future.
that doesn't mean we where wrong, because this was our understanding at that time.so science and qur'an have to go hand in hand for them to work
qur'an explains science, science explains qur'an
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salam JK
541 The moment drew near, and the moon
was split.
542 If they see a sign, they turn away and
say, "Continuous magic!"the moon was split when when human's traveled to the moon and took a piece of it.
this was the splitting of the moon.before the moon was split, how on earth could we understand that verse?
maybe if you have a very open mind you could understand it as thus, but that is very difficult.
so this was more like a sign,telling us," look the moon is split and the hour is near, it's a sign and a warning to humankind, warning us the matter is not over the qur'an is valid to you to this is a sign to you who ever you are, living at that time"get my point ?
peace
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why? how do you know that only the verses that has mathal are the allegorical verses?
Allegoric = metaphoric / non-literal.
Mathal is an Arabic word to portray what is being said as an expression/example/ and not in a literal sence.
The Quran, revealed in Arabic, uses this word on numerous occasions to portray a metephric meaning to a verse or sentence at hand. e.g.
kamthaal al lulul almaknoon(they are like sheltered pearls)37 He is the One who sent down to you the
book, from which there are definite
signs; they are the essence of the book;
and others, which are multiple-meaning.
As for those who have disease in their
hearts, eager to cause confusion and
eager to derive their interpretation, they
will follow what is multiple-meaning
from it. But none knows their meaning
except God and those who are well
founded in knowledge; they say, "We
acknowledge it, all is from our Lord."
None will remember except the people
of intellect.
But none knows their meaning
except God and those who are well
founded in knowledgeif you noticed, mutashabih verses requires deep knowledge.
not just believing in every word as traditionally known.
nowhere does it say that the verses that has mathal attached to it are ellegoric.
besides, how many verses do have mathal attached to it ?
please show me how you came around it.Now, are you saying that the
namlin sura 27 are made as an allegoric reference? because from your earlier posts, I see that you claim it to be literal with a change in the meaning of the word to get the desired results.Please decide which way you want to go with this.
yes 2123 is talking about judgment day, what is wrong with it?
if i have misunderstood then please clarify more.2123 says God is not to be questioned about what He does while we are questioned. Please use the Quran search engine available on this site for easy reference.
where does he say that?
why would he intervene?
there is no change in gods law, that includes himself, he won't change his laws, first he creates the universe and then he would change it, only means he is not all-powerfull.I love the fact that you argue with passion about what the Quran is supposed to mean yet it is obvious from your posts that you don`t even read or research it!
Here is what God says about His own behaviour
8515 Possessor of the throne, the Glorious.
8516 Doer of what He wills.347 She said ?My Lord, how can I have a son when no human has
touched me?? He said ?It is thus that God creates what He
wills, when He decrees a command, He merely says to it ?Be,?
and it is.?3516 If He wishes, He could do away with you and He would bring
a new creation.So please, spare me the baseless statements about God not interfering with the physical laws He has laid down simply because that is what you feel should be the case...
but even Lane's Lexicon mentions that namlah is a tribe
Nun-Miim-Lam = to slander, disclose a thing maliciously, climb. Ant. namil - clever man. Name of a valley situated between Jibrin and Asqalaan a town on the seacost 12 miles to the north of Gaza, in Sinai and namlah is the name of a tribe living in this valley. anaamil - fingers.What you have said is not correct. The only way you can force a tribe name in the verses is to do what Shabir did (insert a lot of extra words/phrases and then state this is what God meant to say!).
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peace layth
Allegoric = metaphoric / non-literal.
Mathal is an Arabic word to portray what is being said as an expression/example/ and not in a literal sence.
The Quran, revealed in Arabic, uses this word on numerous occasions to portray a metephric meaning to a verse or sentence at hand. e.g.
kamthaal al lulul almaknoon(they are like sheltered pearls)yes still that doesn't mean that every verse that has mathal is allegoric.
please don't add from your self
there can be verses that are allegoric and don't have mathal added to it.
if you believe only the verses that had mathal are metaphors, then i believe you have added information from your own self, nowhere does it say such.
the same way as we talk today
you don't say "i would rather have one bird in my hand than 10 on the tree, allegoricly.Now, are you saying that the
namlin sura 27 are made as an allegoric reference? because from your earlier posts, I see that you claim it to be literal with a change in the meaning of the word to get the desired results.Please decide which way you want to go with this.
you must have misunderstood nowhere have i said that the ants are allegoric.
2123 says God is not to be questioned about what He does while we are questioned. Please use the Quran search engine available on this site for easy reference.
yes i have read it, still don't see anything wrong, he does as he pleases, that doesn't mean that one day he makes an unchangable law, then he decided it was weak and that he need to change it by intervening.
please use reason.
as i have said, that means he is weak, he design is perfect, you jump from the window you will fall, the gravity pulls you down, this is fixed, all is bound by this law not some.
he does that he wills and he has already done what ever he willed by this design. we can't say he should have made more animals.
his design is perfect.I love the fact that you argue with passion about what the Quran is supposed to mean yet it is obvious from your posts that you don`t even read or research it!
Here is what God says about His own behaviour
8515 Possessor of the throne, the Glorious.
8516 Doer of what He wills.347 She said ?My Lord, how can I have a son when no human has
touched me?? He said ?It is thus that God creates what He
wills, when He decrees a command, He merely says to it ?Be,?
and it is.?3516 If He wishes, He could do away with you and He would bring
a new creation.So please, spare me the baseless statements about God not interfering with the physical laws He has laid down simply because that is what you feel should be the case...
yes no one has touched here, then when he said to it be it was,then somebody touched here, that doesn't necesary mean in 0.000001 second.
he said to the humans be and we was, trough evolution.you are actualy over complicating.
i really recommend you to read the evolution of thinking by Arnold Yasin
all these questions are explaned in deep details.3516 If He wishes, He could do away with you and He would bring
a new creation.yes in the same way he brought us. he could have made a law for us for destruction, and bring a new creation.
he does what he want no one can say no.What you have said is not correct. The only way you can force a tribe name in the verses is to do what Shabir did (insert a lot of extra words/phrases and then state this is what God meant to say!).
please explain why what i said is not correct ?
as a matter of fact i do research the qur'an and i'am not perfect nor is anybody here, i'am not arguing blindly nor do i believe what i believe because of desires, but following reason, logic.
non of the verses you have put forth does in anyway prove that he intervenes, that is just you interpretation.
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Peace "jibbo",
Can we agree on the following statements
"The possible interpretations of predictions MUST LIE WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES OF THE MEANINGS DERIVED FROM CLASSICAL ARABIC, THE GRAMMATICAL RULES AND CONTEXT"?
"The Quran should over time show signficaant number of predictions coming true eg from the moon splitting verse people could derive that one day it could approach the sun, as mentioned in another verse of the Quran, and split into pieces etc(Im not to sure whether id say tht the moon has already split and the verse be used for tht moon landing incident too since its too vague whilst the other is more specific even within Quran"?
GOD Bless! -
Peace "jibbo",
Can we agree on the following statements
"The possible interpretations of predictions MUST LIE WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES OF THE MEANINGS DERIVED FROM CLASSICAL ARABIC, THE GRAMMATICAL RULES AND CONTEXT"?
"The Quran should over time show signficaant number of predictions coming true eg from the moon splitting verse people could derive that one day it could approach the sun, as mentioned in another verse of the Quran, and split into pieces etc(Im not to sure whether id say tht the moon has already split and the verse be used for tht moon landing incident too since its too vague whilst the other is more specific even within Quran"?
GOD Bless!peace JK
yes we can agree on that the interpretations of the qur'an must lie within the meanings derived from classical arabic, grammatical rules and context.757 So, when the sight is dazzled.
WHEN THE SIGHT IS DAZZLED
what could that mean?
could it be that when the humans has advanced to a time where we could be living in the virtual world?
a couple years ago i once saw a program on national geographic titled "year 3000"
it was talking about how the human could be living in year 3000.
and it mentioned that computers would have been very advanced and could be inside our brain.
the virtual world would have seem real as it would be very advanced.
this is one possible prediction the qur'an is aiming at, but what if when humans have advanced much and there was things not even imagined in our time, and the sight being dazzled could mean something different in the future.
yes sure qur'an has many prediction.
understanding them is the hard part.
