2 Ramadans - 1 for NH 1 for SH?
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Peace all,
I have read Ayman's articles on Ramadan and Laylat Al-Qadr and have questions that I hope can be answered.
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/science/timing.htm
Ayman you seem to say that Ramadan is around the time of the summer solstice (first full moon after it until the next full moon) and that the restrictions on game hunting associated with Hajj in the following months have much to do with the seasons and animal behavior within these months. I quote below.."The timing of the restriction is significant, especially given that the restriction is on hunting wild-life. Interestingly, the restriction doesn't cover domesticated livestock animals (see 51). Why is that? The answer may be because summer is the time when most wild animals and even wild birds give birth. By killing a wild female animal, you are not only killing it but you would also be inadvertently killing all its new-born off-spring who cannot feed and fend for themselves...."
"...Of course, our analysis indicates that the restriction period would be different between the southern and the northern hemisphere. This is fine. There is nothing in the great reading that indicates that they should be the same for people all over the world. We should orient our direction to the truth from our Lord wherever we are, whether in the Southern or Northern hemisphere (see 2149). "
I understand that Ayman means that in the Southern Hemisphere Ramadan will take place after the first full moon after the summer solstice here (I am in Australia) ie after 22 December. Consequently I also take Ayman to mean that we will also have our own 'sacred/restricted months' in which we in the Southern Hemisphere will observe our own Hajj in the months after our Ramadan and hunting restrictions which are appropriate in those months?
If there are 2 Ramadans does it not follow that there are also two sets of sacred months/hajj? Will the location of Hajj cater to pilgrims over a period of 6 months in the year or are there two different locations? surely not?
It also follows that there would be two laylat al-qadr per year? Will there not also be two calendars with two different new years day as the count of full moon months is to begin in the period between one summer solstice to the next?
Thanks for your clarification
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Peace,
I have consistently proposed that Quranists fast during the hot seasons (summers) in their respective locations. So there are naturally two separate ramadans (hot seasons/summers) for the NH and the SH. i also have consistently promoted that pilrimages are to sanctuaries that we build and designate as houses for God as Abraham did. That means that there is only a need for regional mosques where people visit to perform pilgrimage, not neighborhood ones. And people in the vicinity of these places keep them neat and tidy and make pilrimages whenver they want, but especially during the months of Pilgrimage. Which I believe to be 3 and not 4. The fourth sacred month is the month we chose to fast in during summer.
Check out www.quranists.org
And go to the pilgrimage link.
Godbless,
Anwar -
Peace all,
I have read Ayman's articles on Ramadan and Laylat Al-Qadr and have questions that I hope can be answered.
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/science/timing.htm
Ayman you seem to say that Ramadan is around the time of the summer solstice (first full moon after it until the next full moon) and that the restrictions on game hunting associated with Hajj in the following months have much to do with the seasons and animal behavior within these months. I quote below.."The timing of the restriction is significant, especially given that the restriction is on hunting wild-life. Interestingly, the restriction doesn't cover domesticated livestock animals (see 51). Why is that? The answer may be because summer is the time when most wild animals and even wild birds give birth. By killing a wild female animal, you are not only killing it but you would also be inadvertently killing all its new-born off-spring who cannot feed and fend for themselves...."
"...Of course, our analysis indicates that the restriction period would be different between the southern and the northern hemisphere. This is fine. There is nothing in the great reading that indicates that they should be the same for people all over the world. We should orient our direction to the truth from our Lord wherever we are, whether in the Southern or Northern hemisphere (see 2149). "
I understand that Ayman means that in the Southern Hemisphere Ramadan will take place after the first full moon after the summer solstice here (I am in Australia) ie after 22 December. Consequently I also take Ayman to mean that we will also have our own 'sacred/restricted months' in which we in the Southern Hemisphere will observe our own Hajj in the months after our Ramadan and hunting restrictions which are appropriate in those months?
If there are 2 Ramadans does it not follow that there are also two sets of sacred months/hajj? Will the location of Hajj cater to pilgrims over a period of 6 months in the year or are there two different locations? surely not?
It also follows that there would be two laylat al-qadr per year? Will there not also be two calendars with two different new years day as the count of full moon months is to begin in the period between one summer solstice to the next?
Thanks for your clarification
Peace,
Does any body knows why Ayman is not answering your request for clarification?
I know he does not reply to my requests anymore '(Ayman!!! we miss you ;D
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Peace all,
I have read Ayman's articles on Ramadan and Laylat Al-Qadr and have questions that I hope can be answered.
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/science/timing.htm
Ayman you seem to say that Ramadan is around the time of the summer solstice (first full moon after it until the next full moon) and that the restrictions on game hunting associated with Hajj in the following months have much to do with the seasons and animal behavior within these months. I quote below.."The timing of the restriction is significant, especially given that the restriction is on hunting wild-life. Interestingly, the restriction doesn't cover domesticated livestock animals (see 51). Why is that? The answer may be because summer is the time when most wild animals and even wild birds give birth. By killing a wild female animal, you are not only killing it but you would also be inadvertently killing all its new-born off-spring who cannot feed and fend for themselves...."
"...Of course, our analysis indicates that the restriction period would be different between the southern and the northern hemisphere. This is fine. There is nothing in the great reading that indicates that they should be the same for people all over the world. We should orient our direction to the truth from our Lord wherever we are, whether in the Southern or Northern hemisphere (see 2149). "
I understand that Ayman means that in the Southern Hemisphere Ramadan will take place after the first full moon after the summer solstice here (I am in Australia) ie after 22 December. Consequently I also take Ayman to mean that we will also have our own 'sacred/restricted months' in which we in the Southern Hemisphere will observe our own Hajj in the months after our Ramadan and hunting restrictions which are appropriate in those months?
If there are 2 Ramadans does it not follow that there are also two sets of sacred months/hajj? Will the location of Hajj cater to pilgrims over a period of 6 months in the year or are there two different locations? surely not?
It also follows that there would be two laylat al-qadr per year? Will there not also be two calendars with two different new years day as the count of full moon months is to begin in the period between one summer solstice to the next?
Thanks for your clarification
Salaam
This is an interesting point and shows how an already divided community can fragment into oblivion. Other religions celebrate their special occassions on the same day, but we the followers of the Quran have our various, small pockets of special occassions, several versions of the Qur'an, each with his/her own day to celebrate, the only place of jammah being the free-minds forum, all agreeing only to disagree.
bravo -
Salaam
This is an interesting point and shows how an already divided community can fragment into oblivion. Other religions celebrate their special occassions on the same day, but we the followers of the Quran have our various, small pockets of special occassions, several versions of the Qur'an, each with his/her own day to celebrate, the only place of jammah being the free-minds forum, all agreeing only to disagree.
bravorotfl Very true rotfl
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Salaam
This is an interesting point and shows how an already divided community can fragment into oblivion. Other religions celebrate their special occassions on the same day, but we the followers of the Quran have our various, small pockets of special occassions, several versions of the Qur'an, each with his/her own day to celebrate, the only place of jammah being the free-minds forum, all agreeing only to disagree.
Is there no way to put all this things together and reach a conclusion about ANYTHING?
there were some attempts to do so, but failed at the end (after 8 pages of posts)...This is confusing and depressive...
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This is confusing and depressive...
There is nothing we can do about it unfortunetly. My only friends in real life are Sunnis so if they ever know what I believe then I think I will pretty much just have my family (who don't even share my beliefs except for my brother) and free-minds. I broke of contact will all my high school and University friends due to differences in lifestyle.
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Salam
Re differences in Lifestyle
I think we can all pretty much relate to that.
Re confusing and depressive
that's why many go back to sects or choose a new sect! it's part of the test! alhamdu lillah that some people are stronger than that.
Just do the best you can. Don't accept anything unless you can verify it. and be patient and trust in Allah. There is a time for everything. Allah is not just going to teach you everything at once!
There will be a time for all those working on unity and peace with Allah's triumph and destroying sects and hatred.
Just remember that you are NOT alone and that
If you obey the majority of people on earth, they will divert you from the path of God. They follow only conjecture; they only guess. (6116)
"The majority of people, no matter what you do, are not believers." (12103)
YES the test of being in this life is more difficult and complex than you think
2155 Be sure we shall test you with something of fear and hunger, some loss in goods or lives or the fruits (of your toil), but give glad tidings to those who patiently persevere,
4731 And We shall try you until We test those among you who strive their utmost and persevere in patience; and We shall try your reported (mettle).
Many of us have established their networks with brothers and sisters worldwide on social networks, forums, emails, messengers, etc. so you're never alone.
Hope that helps.
Peace.