Sunni scholar unable to answer a question on live TV infront of millions.
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OK.
And why "islamic call" in the second quote ?
"islamic call" is the name of the website of Gamal Al Banna.
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=11638.0Peace
Islamic call ( ) is a common name, and that's the phrase the broadcaster used, and I translated. I did not put it in capitals (well, except for Islamic). I do not know about Albanna's organization. It seems he chose a common used name for it. I mixed between the names because both relate to known Egyptian Muslim Brothers Hassan Albanna and Sayed Qutb, so I heard Jamal Qutb and put Jamal Albanna.
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Salaaman all,
Thank you Samia for all your hard work... May Allah give you the best reward. pr
How ignorant that Skeikh is? How can he say it is not important to discuss? Is it not important to discuss which is mentioned in AlQuraan? hypno
Allah is really far more greater than the gods they made. Allah Kabeera!
Regards,
mmKhan -
Our understanding is that ?Ma Malakat Aymanukum? are widowed women who may be living under the roof and financial support of a man (her family, or the brother or relative of the deceased) and thus are described by the term ?what your OATHS posses? (i.e. due to the responsibility).
Marriage to such women is allowed in the Quran under slightly different terms & conditions than other women
jedi
I think's it's better to take Occam's razor to this one. Ma Malakat Aymanukum must mean 'Husband', hence 235-6, the believers are blessed "who guard their privates except from their wives or their husbands". It makes so much more sense.
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I think's it's better to take Occam's razor to this one. Ma Malakat Aymanukum must mean 'Husband', hence 235-6, the believers are blessed "who guard their privates except from their wives or their husbands". It makes so much more sense.
interesting, i have never heard or contemplated this being what is meant. it would make sense as a matter of parity. anyone have any reasons why this interpretation doesnt suit? what is "occam's razor" ?
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I think (mulkul yameen) is a kind of marriage where at least one of the couple is unable to have sex. This is the only difference between it and a complete marriage. It's the only marriage where family (of the one who can have sex but is waving their right) is asked for permission (425). This verse is a proof that MMA is neither a slave nor a war captive.
And the MMA is each of them they are both mulku yameen the other.
I hope others scan the word MMA in the qur'aan and see if there's a verse where this understanding does not fit, or another fits better. -
I think's it's better to take Occam's razor to this one. Ma Malakat Aymanukum must mean 'Husband', hence 235-6, the believers are blessed "who guard their privates except from their wives or their husbands". It makes so much more sense.
Peace liquiddharma,
But then it would not make sense in this verse.2458 O you who believe, let those who are committed to you by oath, and those who have not yet attained puberty, request your permission regarding three times before the dawn communion, and when you put off your attire from the noon time, and after the evening communion. These are three private times for you. Other than these times, it is not wrong for you or them to intermingle with one another. God thus clarifies the revelations for you. And God is Knowledgeable, Wise.
Ya ayyuha allatheena amanooliyasta/thinkumu allatheena malakat aymanukumwaallatheena lam yablughoo alhuluma minkumthalatha marratin min qabli salatialfajri waheena tadaAAoona thiyabakum mina alththaheeratiwamin baAAdi salati alAAisha-i thalathuAAawratin lakum laysa AAalaykum wala AAalayhim junahunbaAAdahunna tawwafoona AAalaykum baAAdukumAAala baAAdin kathalika yubayyinu Allahulakumu al-ayati waAllahu AAaleemun hakeemun
what is "occam's razor" ?
Peace dc2,
This is often paraphrased as "All other things being equal, the simplest solution is the best."
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_Razor
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Peace all,
Samia I have collected these verses as well but haven't done a full study on them yet, just preliminary. From verse 436 it seems clear that this phrase represents a group of people. However, how would your definition fit in verse 3355 referring to the wives of the Prophet?
Umm Tariq
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Peace liquiddharma,
But then it would not make sense in this verse.2458 O you who believe, let those who are committed to you by oath, and those who have not yet attained puberty, request your permission regarding three times before the dawn communion, and when you put off your attire from the noon time, and after the evening communion. These are three private times for you. Other than these times, it is not wrong for you or them to intermingle with one another. God thus clarifies the revelations for you. And God is Knowledgeable, Wise.
I don't see a problem - "O you who believe, let your husband and young children request your permission regarding three times .........These are three private times for you." - after all, they aren't private if your husband is bugging you.
However, how would your definition fit in verse 3355 referring to the wives of the Prophet?
3355 There is no sin upon them before their fathers, or their sons, or their brothers, or the sons of their brothers, or the sons of their sisters, or their women, or their husband(s).
Could be refering back to the Prophet himself, or earlier to their (deceased?) husbands before they married the prophet.
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I don't see a problem - "O you who believe, let your husband and young children request your permission regarding three times .........These are three private times for you." - after all, they aren't private if your husband is bugging you.
What about wives?
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Peace all,
Samia I have collected these verses as well but haven't done a full study on them yet, just preliminary. From verse 436 it seems clear that this phrase represents a group of people. However, how would your definition fit in verse 3355 referring to the wives of the Prophet?
Umm Tariq
Salaam Um Tariq
I do not know who the wives of the prophet were, but from sunna, we were told that his second wife, after Khadija, was a widow who accepted to marry him just to look after the children. I would think that maybe one or two of his wives were quite old or were not interested in sex, or that he was so busy they waived their right. God did not tell us much, but I would rather not believe that they were captives of war or slaves he bought or were a gift.
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What about wives?
No mention... I guess that means husbands aren't allowed private time. Someone's got to look after the kids during the wife's private time.
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Salaaman all,
From the aayat 235-6 it says
235 and who are mindful of their chastity,
Waallatheena hum lifuroojihim hafithoona
236 With any but their spouses - that is, those whom they rightfully possess for then, behold, they are free of all blame,
Illa AAala azwajihim aw ma malakat aymanuhum fainnahum ghayru maloomeena
"Aw" means "Or"
But in 2458 it says
2458 O YOU who have attained to faith! At three times, let those whom you rightfully pos?sess, as well as those from among you who have not yet attained to puberty, ask leave of you before the prayer of daybreak, and whenever you lay aside your garments in the middle of the day, and after the prayer of nightfall the three occasions on which your nakedness is likely to be bared. Beyond these, neither you nor they will incur any sin if they move about you, attending to one another. In this way God makes clear unto you His mes?sages for God is all-knowing, wise!
Ya ayyuha allatheena amanoo liyastathinkumu allatheena malakat aymanukum waallatheena lam yablughoo alhuluma minkum thalatha marratin min qabli salati alfajri waheena tadaAAoona thiyabakum mina alththaheerati wamin baAAdi salati alAAishai thalathu AAawratin lakum laysa AAalaykum wala AAalayhim junahun baAAdahunna tawwafoona AAalaykum baAAdukum AAala baAAdin kathalika yubayyinu Allahu lakumu alayati waAllahu AAaleemun hakeemun
If MMA are taking permission at these three mentioned times... then who are in? Wives? If yes, then when MMA's are in, wives are also has to take permission? But it is not mentioned vise-versa.
What does this mean then?
May Allah open our minds to understand what He meant and keep us away from following Shaitaan.
Regards,
mmKhan -
Salam samia
I was a little confused by your reply. I was referring to in the ayat that it says that there is no sin on them regarding their fathers nor their sons nor their brothers nor the sons of their brothers nor the sons of their sisters nor their women nor 'what their right hands possess' referring to them the wives. I wasn't saying that they are what the right hand possess. Sorry about the confusion. Just initially then, this phrase 'maa malakat aymaanukum' has been applied to men as the possessors and to women in this case.
Your said"God did not tell us much, but I would rather not believe that they were captives of war or slaves he bought or were a gift. "
Were you referring to the wives of the prophet? If not then we have verse 3350 speaking to the prophet and that 'what your right hand has possessed from what the god 'afaa'a' (gave, granted, awarded, bestowed, gave as booty) upon/ to you'. What do you get from this verse?
Umm Tariq
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Or should it be translated -
3350 O prophet, we have made lawful for you the wives to whom you have already given their dowry, as their husband, as granted to you by God...
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Peace all,
That is the first part of the verse but it's followed by 'and' 'maa malakat yameenuk' from what the god granted to/ upon you... Translate the whole verse as you see it because what you wrote is confusing without the rest of it. Thanks.
Umm Tariq
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Peace all,
That is the first part of the verse but it's followed by 'and' 'maa malakat yameenuk' from what the god granted to/ upon you... Translate the whole verse as you see it because what you wrote is confusing without the rest of it. Thanks.
Umm Tariq
O prophet, we made lawful for you your wives to whom you have paid their due dowry, or what you already have, as granted to you by GOD. Also lawful for you in marriage are the daughters of your father's brothers, the daughters of your father's sisters, the daughters of your mother's brothers, the daughters of your mother's sisters, who have emigrated with you. Also, if a believing woman gave herself to the prophet - by forfeiting the dowry - the prophet may marry her without a dowry, if he so wishes. However, her forfeiting of the dowry applies only to the prophet, and not to the other believers. We have already decreed their rights in regard to their spouses or what they already have. This is to spare you any embarrassment. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.
You may gently shun any one of them, and you may bring closer to you any one of them. If you reconcile with any one you had estranged, you commit no error. In this way, they will be pleased, will have no grief, and will be content with what you equitably offer to all of them. GOD knows what is in your hearts. GOD is Omniscient, Clement.
Beyond the categories described to you, you are enjoined from marrying any other women, nor can you substitute a new wife (from the prohibited categories), no matter how much you admire their beauty. You must be content with those already made lawful to you. GOD is watchful over all things.
are you talking about this one hmm -
Peace all,
That is the first part of the verse but it's followed by 'and' 'maa malakat yameenuk' from what the god granted to/ upon you... Translate the whole verse as you see it because what you wrote is confusing without the rest of it. Thanks.
Umm Tariq
The end of verse 3350 - refering to the Prophet - "so that strain/blame/sin not be on you" - matches with verse 3355 - "No offense/guilt/sin (is) on them" - if you translate it as husband (being the Prophet, husband of his wives), not if you translate it as possessed people.
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salam. ma malkat aymanakum.
why does everyone try and shove the meaning of this phrase under the carpet. ask yourselves, are you rightly guided?
clearly there is another category of women lawful to men aside from those with whom there is a nikah.
the only plausible reason why this obvious conclusion is being ignored is western pagan brainwashing.
allah is the law.
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Allah created Adam and Eve as two parts of the same whole. There are no such things as 'categories of women', it is an innovation, the product of a inhumane society.