Surah 2:106
-
...then I think no because the Bible, Torah and New Testament have not been forgotten. LOL!! We would not remember what was forgotten!!
Salam,
Absolutely. bravo
Salam,
Arnab -
Peace
My understanding is novel to my knowlegde. The word "ayat" means signs. In the Quran many countless objects, places, and things are hailed as signs or "ayat". Night and day, annilated citys, camels, humans being created out of sperm, love between husband and wife, and occasionaly Quranic verses all have been honored as "ayat". Many verses speak of animals as "ayat". If you consider the word sign or "ayat" in this verse as animals the implications are uniqe. Here is Ahmed Ali's translation with my parenthesis and a change in translation from "message" to the more accurate "sign".
- When we cancel a sign (creature or animal) or throw it into obilvion,
We replace it with one better or one similar.
Do you not know that God has power over all things? - Do you not know that
God's is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth,
and that there is none to save and protect you apart from God? (Al Qur'an A Contemporary Translation by Ahmed Ali Pg 24).
Since now we know signs refered to means animal we can understand the meaning of this verse. Evolution and animal extinction. "When we cancel our signs or throw them into obilvion" referes to animal extinction. The next sentence about God replacing his sign (animal or creature) with one better or similar is stating evolution. Note the words "better", and "similar". The last sentence reminds the reader of God is powerful enough to start evolution and animal extinction. The second verse states "God's is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth" meaning God is lord of all creatures. To my knowledge my intrepetion is new. My understanding is not perfect so maybe I am wrong. I am open minded so if you dont agree and have a valid reason please state it so I can grow in knowlegde. Also this is my understanding today I might beleive something else tomorrow. Please give me your thoughts.
God bless
sun
peace
- When we cancel a sign (creature or animal) or throw it into obilvion,
-
Salam farida. There is absolutely no authority in the verse that you cite to reject the Torah or the Injeel.
The issue is the correct understanding of 2106. 2106 reads Ma nansakh min aayatin aw nunsiha nat bikhair minha aw mathlaha alam talam in Allah ali kul shi qadeer.
First, of all this refers to ayat. Second, the word nansakh comes from the root nasakh, to copy. Third the word khair means good. Fourth the word mathlaha means similar.
Do not add words to the Quran. Do you see the word Torah or Injeel in there? Claiming that this refers to Torah and Injeel is your addition to the Quran. Addition is prohibited. nansakh comes from nasakh or copy, it is not mansakh/abrogate, there is no meem in there. This error is well known.
The verse is better translated as 2106 We dont copy an ayat or cause its forgetting, we bring good between them or similar, know and known that Allah over everything has power.
In fact this verse can be considered to state that Allah does not abrogate verses or cause their forgetting. This is entirely reasonable, Allah does not have a weak mind that he needs repetition nor does he forget anything. That is entirely consistent with his power. this verse actually rejects the abrogation or forgetting canard.
Allah is the light and the way.
-
2106 Whatever communications We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring one better than it or like it. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things?
Salaam,
Does this apply to previous scriptures?
Salaam Farida
The translation of "nasakha" is not to abrogate. The verb, or its derivative, is used three times in the qur'aan (2252; 4529 and 7154), plus this verse, and it means (to copy).
If you read the verses before this one and the following verses, you will have a better picture of what is meant by this verse. -
Salam farida. There is absolutely no authority in the verse that you cite to reject the Torah or the Injeel.
Allah is the light and the way.
Salaam,
Did I say there is?
Claiming that this refers to Torah and Injeel.
Can you please tell me when I said it refers to the Torah or Injeel?
Do you see the word Torah or Injeel in there?
No! but may be you do as you are saying its cited there.
is your addition to the Quran.
Re-read my question and please tell me where I added words to the Quran?
Addition is prohibited.
Is it my so called addition or your frame of mind where any question asked by a woman has some sort of ulterior motive. Or do you find it difficult that a woman should question anything.
In another thread about Divorce you have shown this kind of approach where without knowing full facts you considered a man's conduct of a momin, Simply because he took three wives - the one who tricked his wife to sign divorce papers ...Yes TRICKED And yes Allah exposes the truth. The situation arose that the first wife and the third wife met and it turned out that ?the momin? used the divorce papers to convince third woman that he was single.When I gave a short account of this you were very quick to call me mentally ill and without having full facts you were slandering a woman who is the victim of deceit. Here is that passage you wrote
The whole story is riddled with completely implausible scenarios, most likely the construction of a person who is mentally ill. My take on the story is, we have a woman who has taken off on her own after 19 years of marriage, has concocted this story of being tricked to elicit sympathy, and is looking for someone to be taken in by her fanciful story.
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9596857.msg175129;boardseen#newIn the next post when you came to know that the man took three wives, you ignored the fact that the man left two women without a divorce, or due rights . Without knowing "three sides of a story" you passed judgement as if you are God, that he is within hudood that ...If the gentleman had married one woman, went on to marry another woman, then married a third woman, all three without giving any one of them a talaq, this gentleman is well within the hudood ....his conduct is that of a momin.
It was no concern of yours that the man disappeared since you do not believe that a man can disappear in this small world and if I was to tell you that he left his wife with huge debts, you will not believe it as how can a man do such a thing, its wicked woman and her her fanciful story to elicit sympathy. No wonder you want to go back to the orthodox Jewish way of life.Sadly its man like you who make woman like me to question logic behind lots of misinterpretations.
I do not believe in judging anyone I believe Allah is the judge and we can only give our views about what is right or wrong fair or unfair. So initially I had good impression about you and said this
Please read contribution by Arnab, Al Araf and others learned contributors on this subject and I am confident that you won?t be disappointed
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9596925.0But what a disappointment...Allah is mighty wise and knows the secret of the hearts.
Shall I remind you what Shu?aib said in 785 .... Give just MEASURE and weight, nor withhold from the people the things that are their due; and do no mischief on the earth after it has been set in order that will be best for you, if ye have Faith.
1185 "And O my people! give just MEASURE and weight, nor withhold from the people the things that are their due commit not evil in the land with intent to do mischief.
1184 ........And give not short MEASURE or weight I see you in prosperity, but I fear for you the penalty of a day that will compass (you) all round.
AND
1735 Give full MEASURE when ye MEASURE, and weigh with a balance that is straight that is the most fitting and the most advantageous in the final determination.
26181 "Give just MEASURE, and cause no loss (to others by fraud).
AND
832 Those who, when they have to receive by MEASURE from men, exact full MEASURE,
833 But when they have to give by MEASURE or weight to men, give less than due.Surely Allah is the light and the way
-
Salaam Farida
The translation of "nasakha" is not to abrogate. The verb, or its derivative, is used three times in the qur'aan (2252; 4529 and 7154), plus this verse, and it means (to copy).
If you read the verses before this one and the following verses, you will have a better picture of what is meant by this verse.In addition to the above, please see
http//www.studyquran.co.uk/PRLonline.htmNun-Siin-Kha = to abolish, destroy, abrogate, nullify, obliterate, conceal, transfer, substitute, copy, transcribe, rule out.
nasakha vb. (1) impf. act. 2106, 2252
nuskhah n.f. 7154
istansakha vb. (10) impf. act. 4529
Lane's Lexicon, Volume 8, pages 42, 43 -
Salaam Wakas
I am aware of this "meaning" in classical arabic dictionaries. It seems that it is added according to the invented "abrogation" theory. The said dictionaries do not have evidence to prove this meaning, except that "..and the arabs say the sun tansakhu the shadow; meaning it deletes it!!". (Does the sun delete the shadow, or copies the shadow in the shape of the object??), and of course this verse. But the other words of the same root in the qur'aan do not give this fabricated meaning.
-
peace Samia,
The purpose of PRL is to give info to the reader to conduct high quality study, hence meanings are sometimes given that may not necessarily be strong, but are given because they are cited in Classical Arabic dictionaries.
Also, giving all the occurrences of the root and words allows cross-referencing to check meaning.
-
I am aware of this "meaning" in classical arabic dictionaries. It seems that it is added according to the invented "abrogation" theory. The said dictionaries do not have evidence to prove this meaning, except that "..and the arabs say the sun tansakhu the shadow; meaning it deletes it!!". (Does the sun delete the shadow, or copies the shadow in the shape of the object??), and of course this verse. But the other words of the same root in the qur'aan do not give this fabricated meaning.{Samia}
I understand that even stretching the meaning and perception infolded in this particular root too far will not yield "abbrogation/cancellation". The concept infolded in the root is to change the place of stationing of a thing, bring a thing on the place of another thing. A deed is performed, and the copy of the act is ready if the same is recorded in a book, and the written act can be seen by the performer of the act when he reads it. Recalling the memory is nothing but again seeing the past event; and thus the basic perception of the root is also there. After reading one's record everyone will "see" smallest act done by him during his life time.
Quran was revealed/read/taught to the Messenger over a period of time in small bits and he kept reciting it to people immediately after receiving some Ayat. On every fresh revelation, the order of the sum total of the Book revealed upto that point of time was bound to get changed. Everytime, placement of Ayat perforce needed to be changed to make the flow and continuity of reading.
Allah has described a principle that He follows. And change in the placement of Ayat was objected even in the days of revelation and people alleged the Messenger as "Muftar". The point has been made quite vivid in 16101.
None of the 'ayat' of the universe get abbrogated. It only changes the place. Knowledge is only of "ayat" and "ayat" of the Quran is the knowledge. Can "Knowledge" be treated as something liable to abbrogation?
-
Assalaam Alaikum
Perhaps this ayah may bring some clarity to the topic.....
and WE did not show them from the ayats/signs except that was bigger than its sister (Ayah) and WE held them with the punishment, so that they return.
Wama nureehim min ayatin illa hiya akbaru min okhtiha waakhathnahum bialAAathabi laAAallahum yarjiAAoona
Allah is indicating that one ayah confirms the previous and so on.....
Soon will We show them our / Sanureehim Signs in the furthest regions of the earth / al-afaqi, and in their own souls, until it becomes manifest to them that this is the Truth. Is it not enough that thy Lord doth witness all things?
nureehim (1st person, verb form IV, imperfect) Allah is showing, we show
-
Allah is indicating that one ayah confirms the previous and so on.....
Soon will We show them our / Sanureehim Signs in the furthest regions of the earth / al-afaqi, and in their own souls, until it becomes manifest to them that this is the Truth. Is it not enough that thy Lord doth witness all things?
nureehim (1st person, verb form IV, imperfect) Allah is showing, we show
This is regarding the happenings in Egypt. It does not say "confirms the previous" but the successive happening was stronger in effect than the earlier one.
Sanureehim We will keep showing to their eyes
New facts/knowledge about universe and human body keeps revealing to human eye/perception in time and space. Why on disclosing of a fact about the universe and oneself one would it become evident that Quran is a statement of proven fact? The only reason is that the information is already incorporated in the Book but it has come within the reach of human eye at later stage.
The only -
This is regarding the happenings in Egypt. It does not say "confirms the previous" but the successive happening was stronger in effect than the earlier one.
Sanureehim We will keep showing to their eyes
New facts/knowledge about universe and human body keeps revealing to human eye/perception in time and space. Why on disclosing of a fact about the universe and oneself one would it become evident that Quran is a statement of proven fact? The only reason is that the information is already incorporated in the Book but it has come within the reach of human eye at later stage.
The onlyAssalaam Alaikum
The Quran is NOT a history or philosophy book. Its guidance, instruction and admonition.
Im not sure how you relegate Sura Ha Mim Sajdah 41.53 to some historical period in the PAST when 'nureehim (1st person, verb form IV, imperfect) means Allah is showing NOW, we show NOW
Imperfect tense indicates present or future tense meaning ?Is?, occurring NOW and in the Future
Secondly, Allah,swt has stated that ALL things have been pre-ordained or 'written' BEFORE human recognition!
No misfortune can happen on earth or in your souls but is recorded in a decree BEFORE We bring it into existence. That is truly easy for Allah.
Thus how are you able to ascertain whether the Signs of Allah exist or dont exist to 'confirm', successively?
By the way the word 'successive' implies that something 'previously' existed
-
The Quran is NOT a history or philosophy book. Its guidance, instruction and admonition.
This is how majority of the people perceive. But the fact is that the Quran is the only Book which narrates important events of history {Al Qasas} in perfect and accurate manner. The history reported in the Quran is by the One Who personally witnessed those events. Therefore the history described in the Quran is the only infinitly reliable history and none of the rest of the books of history are so.
This is regarding the happenings in Egypt. It does not say "confirms the previous" but the successive happening was stronger in effect than the earlier one. Please see the Ayat to know the perspective of this statement of Quran.
Im not sure how you relegate Sura Ha Mim Sajdah 41.53 to some historical period in the PAST when 'nureehim (1st person, verb form IV, imperfect) means Allah is showing NOW, we show NOW
Imperfect tense indicates present or future tense meaning ?Is?, occurring NOW and in the Future
There is "Sa" before it. Why that particle is being considered superfluous?
-
There is "Sa" before it. Why that particle is being considered superfluous?
Sanureehim ayatina fee alafaqi wafee anfusihim hatta yatabayyana lahum annahu alhaqqu awalam yakfi birabbika annahu AAala kulli shayin shaheedun
?Sa? is an adverb that is prefixed to the imperfect verb to denote the meaning of future, as the Imperfect Verb consists both of present and future tense. (NOT past tense)
Dictionary of the Holy Quran page 241nureehim (1st person, verb form IV, imperfect) means Allah is showing NOW, we show NOW
