Oral Debate between Ayman and Edip...
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Peace all;
peace sun
Thank you
the words are very specifec, most compassionate most merciful most gracious,altawaab lra7eem, shadeed l3iqab, alsami3o l3aleem, these are all titles for god alone, they cannot be used for any human.if you can find me in the quran "ghafooron ra7eem" those words as such to mohamad or anyone else then god, please bring them forward.
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And Abraham prayed for his father's forgiveness only because of a promise he had made to him. But when it became clear to him that he was an enemy to Allah, he dissociated himself from him for Abraham was most tender-hearted forbearing. (9-114)Can you note that Abraham was called 7aleem.
A fast lesson in Arabic translation
(raheem) merciful/compassionate; plural (ruhamaa'
(arhamur rahimeen) The most compassionate/merciful of all (does not have a plural ;D)Can I say, in arabic, That Samia is Raoofa and Raheema with Cats?
Peace
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Peace all;
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And Abraham prayed for his father's forgiveness only because of a promise he had made to him. But when it became clear to him that he was an enemy to Allah, he dissociated himself from him for Abraham was most tender-hearted forbearing. (9-114)Can you note that Abraham was called 7aleem.
Can I say, in arabic, That Samia is Raoofa and Raheema with Cats?Peace
salam
i am really sorry, but i am still not understand what your point is, so what if ibrahim prayed for forgiveness, we all as humans pray for such things, but can ibrahim assure him forgiveness, the answer is no because only the ghafooron ra7eem can do that , being god.
and im sorry no you cant say she is ghafoura ra7eema becasue she is not god either, in my 39 years of being on this earth i have NEVER heard anyone ever say that about someone and my father was a shiekh so the speech in my household and around us was mostly religious.
another thing ppl on earth can say they are gods for all i care, as god says " they will write with there own hands and say this is from god and sell it for cheap. so ppl will say and do many things, that the whole purpose of this life to test us. BUT when it comes to QURAN we can not play with words ghafooron ra7eem is gods and gods alone period.
by the way you still have not brought me any aya or verse that has those words specific for mohamad. -
Peace all;
Thank you
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And Abraham prayed for his father's forgiveness only because of a promise he had made to him. But when it became clear to him that he was an enemy to Allah, he dissociated himself from him for Abraham was most tender-hearted forbearing. (9-114)Can you note that Abraham was called 7aleem.
Can I say, in arabic, That Samia is Raoofa and Raheema with Cats?Peace
How do you know I am a member of "jam3eetur ra'fi bil 7ayawaan "
and that one of my nicknames is "Raheema"... -
How do you know I am a member of "jam3eetur ra'fi bil 7ayawaan "
and that one of my nicknames is "Raheema"...I know you are not a memeber; moreover, I know you eat pigions ;D
But, I want your opinion in the use of Raoof and Raheem for any person.
salam
i am really sorry, but i am still not understand what your point is, so what if ibrahim prayed for forgiveness, we all as humans pray for such things, but can ibrahim assure him forgiveness, the answer is no because only the ghafooron ra7eem can do that , being god.I gave you a clear example where God called Abraham 7leem, which is one of God's Names. Please do not ignore the main point, which is, did God use 7leem or Raheem or Raoof to discribe Mohamed or Abraham, in Quran.
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I gave you a clear example where God called Abraham 7leem, which is one of God's Names. Please do not ignore the main point, which is, did God use 7leem or Raheem or Raoof to discribe Mohamed or Abraham, in Quran.
salam,
i am going to post one more time in this thread,it seems we are not gettng anywhere here, all you are bringing me is words discribing actions of ppl, this is very obvious
the verse is saying that he was extremely lenient towards his fathers actions of denying god, that does not make him god and the meaning of that verse is not implying he is god.he also called mohamad and those with him compassionate as you showed me before,again the meaning of that verse does not imply that any of them are god.
the words are arabic words, part of a language therefore they will be used in many ways, it is the way they are used that define them, the way ghafroon ra7eem was used in that specific verse is giving mohamad titleship of a god, now you can accept it or leave it. you did not provide me with any verse that shows mohamad being ghafooron ra7eem other then 9128. therefore i am finished here
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salam,
i am going to post one more time in this thread,it seems we are not gettng anywhere here, all you are bringing me is words discribing actions of ppl, this is very obvious
the verse is saying that he was extremely lenient towards his fathers actions of denying god, that does not make him god and the meaning of that verse is not implying he is god.Okay; but do ot ignore the Fact that God used the word 7aleem, which is one of his names, to discribe Abrahem.
Now, I will give you some more examples
Example one shows how people use one of God's name (God's Title) to discribe Human
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Said the Chiefs of the people of Pharaoh "This is indeed a sorcerer well-versed. (7-109)
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And bring up to thee all (our) sorcerers well-versed." (7-112)Example two shows how God used his name (God's Title) to discribe people
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So he began (the search) with their baggage, before (he came to) the baggage of his brother at length He brought it out of his brother's baggage. Thus did We plan for Joseph. He could not take his brother by the law of the king except that Allah willed it (so). We raise to degrees (of wisdom) whom We please but over all endued with knowledge is One more knowledgable. (12-76)
Example Three shows Angels useing God's Name (God's Title) to discribe a Human (Issac)
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They said "Fear not! We give thee glad tidings of a son endowed with wisdom." (15-53)
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(When they did not eat), He conceived a fear of them. They said "Fear not" and they gave him glad tidings of a son endowed with knowledge. (51-2
Example four shows a Messanger of God using two names of God (God's Titles) to discribe himself
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(Joseph) said "Set me over the storehouses of the land I ?m a keeper and Knowledgeable" (12-55)
Thus, 9-128 is not different than any of the above example.
Peace
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I know you eat pigions ;D
This is my way of rahma eat
But, I want your opinion in the use of Raoof and Raheem for any person.
If you ask your sheikh google, he will give you more than 2,000,000 hits most of which are names of people (without Abdul). Moreover, it's very common language to describe kind, charitable people as (as7aab or thwuw qulub raheema owners of merciful hearts); and euthania is translated as "qatl ra7eem م. Those who are native speakers of Arabic, should be truthful and own to the fact that the adjective "raheem" is more than normal, just like "kareem generous; 7aleem wise; raouf kind; or even kabeer big/old..." and is used normally for anything and anyone.
The verse you quoted earlier(48 29 where God describes Muhammad and those with him as "ru7amaa' plural of ra7eem" is enough a proof that this adjective can be used for people, let alone for messengers. Moreover, verses where you find (khairur rahimeen); (ar7amur rahimeen) or even (khairul ghafireen) and (a7sanul khaliqeen) shows that God is telling us that there are among His creation who are themsleves creators, forgivers, merciful..etc, but He is the most, the best.
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salam,
i am going to post one more time in this thread,it seems we are not gettng anywhere here, all you are bringing me is words discribing actions of ppl, this is very obvious
the verse is saying that he was extremely lenient towards his fathers actions of denying god, that does not make him god and the meaning of that verse is not implying he is god.he also called mohamad and those with him compassionate as you showed me before,again the meaning of that verse does not imply that any of them are god.
the words are arabic words, part of a language therefore they will be used in many ways, it is the way they are used that define them, the way ghafroon ra7eem was used in that specific verse is giving mohamad titleship of a god, now you can accept it or leave it. you did not provide me with any verse that shows mohamad being ghafooron ra7eem other then 9128. therefore i am finished here
salam anna,
The count would be same if any "Ram" verse is removed which is applicable to people as in compassionate, clement, soft, humane, kind...
1175 Verily, Ibrah?m (was) clement/patient kind-hearted returning to God/repenting.
If people did not have this capacity of mercy/compassion/kindness to a much lesser degree, God would not command it toward parents...
Waikhfid lahuma janaha alththulli mina alrrahmati...
1724 And be comforting to them the humbleness's wing from the mercy...Also when including 9128-129...
It seems the numbers by Nun is confirmed by 7430 look at this
70301051 40060705 70300200 6555 6236 12791 = 19 x 370005533687405563315895081874926989.0000
And your numbers
70301051 40060705 70300200 6555 6234 12789 = 19 x 370005533687405563315895081874916462.5789
the above may be a coincidence but it serves as eye opener to have a second look "Why you remove 2 verse?"
God bless you.
Hati
Surah... #Verses... S+V... 57 Even... 57 Odd
1............7...............8............8.............
2..........286..........288..........288..........
3..........200..........203.....................2039..........129..........138..........138...........
110..........3..........113.....................113
111..........5..........116..........116..........
112..........4..........116..........116..........
113..........5..........118..........118..........
114..........6..........120..........120..........6555.......6236....12791.......6236.....6555
6236 6555 12791 = 19 x 328245026989
Peace
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Peace Nun,
The count would be same if any "Ram" verse is removed which is applicable to people as in compassionate, clement, soft, humane, kind...
1175 Verily, Ibrah?m (was) clement/patient kind-hearted returning to God/repenting.Ib-rahim has nothing to do with "rahim" apart from sharing some letters in the English spelling. Instead of counting verses and stuff, you should spend more time learning that the "h" in Ibrahim is an entirely different Arabic letter to the English "h" in rahim.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace Ayman,
Have excel to count verses and you should spend less time looking for head bubba of full moons although halloween is approaching and I'm thinking Head Bubba Elvis, Pompous Sheik, and we convince Edip to be Nixon 1974. lol
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Instead of counting verses and stuff, you should spend more time learning that the "h" in Ibrahim is an entirely different Arabic letter to the English "h" in rahim.
Why do you have to be so rude when correcting somebody?
If you want to speak for God Religion, you have to be nice and humble, otherwise you are misrepresenting God's religion; and trust me, God does not like who speak and represent his religion to be Rude or Arrogant.(
It is part of the Mercy of Allah that thou dost deal gently with them. Wert thou severe or harsh-hearted they would have broken away from about thee; so pass over (their faults), and ask for (Allah's) forgiveness for them; and consult them in affairs (of moment). Then when thou hast taken a decision, put thy trust in Allah. For Allah loves those who put their trust (in Him). (3-159))
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Peace Belal,
Why do you have to be so rude when correcting somebody?
If you want to speak for God Religion, you have to be nice and humble, otherwise you are misrepresenting God's religion; and trust me, God does not like who speak and represent his religion to be Rude or Arrogant.(
It is part of the Mercy of Allah that thou dost deal gently with them. Wert thou severe or harsh-hearted they would have broken away from about thee; so pass over (their faults), and ask for (Allah's) forgiveness for them; and consult them in affairs (of moment). Then when thou hast taken a decision, put thy trust in Allah. For Allah loves those who put their trust (in Him). (3-159)
)How was I rude for simply and objectively correcting him and giving him good advice that I follow myself? I didn't I call him Rude or Arrogant while giving him advice about how he should be nice. )
Peace,
Ayman
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Ibrahim (rahim 5 Arabic letters; plus the letter "h " is as in "he"
Rahim (Rahim 4 Arabic letters; the letter "h " has no equivalent in the English language)
Ssy what??? In your first rendition, you infer that "h" is as in "he" but in your second etymology you state that "h" has no equivalent in English language. Am I misunderstanding you here or are you confusing the two? Perhaps I am confused between one "h" and another "h"? -
Ssy what??? In your first rendition, you infer that "h" is as in "he" but in your second etymology you state that "h" has no equivalent in English language. Am I misunderstanding you here or are you confusing the two? Perhaps I am confused between one "h" and another "h"?
Forget about the "written". Concentrate on the two red shapes these are the two different letters I am referring to as "h as in he" and "h without equivalence". How do you want me to write the latter if it has no equivalence?
How can I show you how it is pronounced? hmmm
Do you know the difference between the pronunciation of the "h" in (Ibrahim) and the "h" in (Muhammad)? If you do, then this is the differene between the "h" in Ibrahim and the "h" in Rahim. If you don't....well, sorry I can't help you -
Ibrahim (rahim 5 Arabic letters; plus the letter "h " is as in "he"
Rahim (Rahim 4 Arabic letters; the letter "h " has no equivalent in the English language)Peace Ayman
You are right.
More than half century ago in HS I had no choice unless to learn Arabic Grammar . Farsi is using 28 Arabic letters plus few more .
Yet I remember was called Ha ?Jeemy? and Ha Hota. I can not remember what meant by Hota but I say Ha Allah.
I wonder how these people post so many Arabic text and yet they do not know simple thing like that. ?
Peace.