Does 5:33 applies to those insulting Allah and His Messenger?
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Those wishing to punish others for insulting the blessed Messenger often quote the following from the Qur'an in support of their actions.
533 It is but a just recompense for those who make war on God and His apostle, and endeavour to spread corruption on earth, that they are being slain in great' numbers, or crucified in great numbers, or have, in l' result of their perverseness, their hands and feet cut off in great numbers, or are being banished from the earth such is their ignominy in this world. But in the life to come awesome suffering awaits them-
.........................................This contrasts with numerous verses advising the Messenger to deal with those insulting him with dignified patience.
How best should 533 be interpreted and for what situations it came into effect or comes into effect?
Thanks in advance
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Salaam
Concerning the attitude towards who insult prophet
633 We know that you are saddened by what they say; they are not rejecting you, but it is the revelations of God which the wicked disregard.
634 Messengers before you were denied, but they were patient for what they were denied, and they were harmed until Our victory came to them; there is no changing the words of God. News of the messengers has come to you.
668 And if you encounter those who make fun of Our revelations, then turn away from them until they move on to a different narrative; and if the devil makes you forget, then do not sit after remembering with the wicked people.
6108 And do not insult those who call on other than God, lest they insult God out of ignorance. And We have similarly adorned for every nation their works; then to their Lord is their return and He will inform them of what they had done.
16125 Invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and good advice, and argue with them in that which is better. Your Lord is fully aware of who is misguided from His path, and He is fully aware of the guided ones.
16126 And if you punish, then punish with equivalence to that which you were punished. And if you are patient then it is better for the patient ones.
2563 And the servants of the Almighty who walk on the earth in humility and if the ignorant speak to them, they say "Peace."
2855 And if they come across vain talk, they disregard it and say "To us are our deeds, and to you are your deeds. Peace be upon you. We do not seek the ignorant."
3348 And do not obey the rejecters and the hypocrites, and ignore their insults, and put your trust in God; for God suffices as an advocate.
4134 Not equal are the good and the bad response. You shall resort to the one which is better. Thus, the one who used to be your enemy, may become your best friend.
4135 And none can attain this except those who are patient. And none can attain this except those who are extremely fortunate.Concerning 5-33 which is one of the more difficult verses i faced.
i looked for the expression "min khilaf" and found this533 The recompense of those who fight God and His messenger, and seek to make corruption in the land, is that they will be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off from alternate sides or that they be banished from the land; that is a
7124 "I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, then I will crucify you all."
2071 He said "Have you believed to him before taking my permission? He is surely your great one who has taught you magic. So, I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, and I will crucify you on the trunks of the palm trees, and you will come to know which of us is greater in retribution and more lasting!"
2649 He said "Have you believed unto him before I permitted you? He is surely your great one who has taught you magic. So you shall come to know, I will cut off your hands and feet from alternate sides, and I will crucify you all."The other three occurences are relative two Firaoun.
So, first of all, we have to be careful not be a firaoun when we use this verse.Firaoun Changed the "Or" to an "And".
(Please remember that wife of Firaoun was a believer and one of his minister was a believer. So Firaoun knew what islam of Abraham says and probably knew the law in 5-33)the context of 5-33 is "The recompense of those who fight (haraba) God and His messenger".
Haraba is doing war. Insulting is not war. Fighting muslims for other reason than God and his message is not fighting God and his messengerFiraoun used this verse against his magicians for what they have said and for their belief and not in context of war and physical danger.
Peace
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(Please remember that wife of Firaoun was a believer and one of his minister was a believer. So Firaoun knew what islam of Abraham says and probably knew the law in 5-33)
Yes, in his episode no one used Muslim before him, but he proclaimed that he is a Muslim while about to drown.
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Salaam
Concerning the attitude towards who insult prophet
Concerning 5-33 which is one of the more difficult verses i faced.
i looked for the expression "min khilaf" and found this
The other three occurences are relative two Firaoun.
So, first of all, we have to be careful not be a firaoun when we use this verse.Firaoun Changed the "Or" to an "And".
(Please remember that wife of Firaoun was a believer and one of his minister was a believer. So Firaoun knew what islam of Abraham says and probably knew the law in 5-33)the context of 5-33 is "The recompense of those who fight (haraba) God and His messenger".
Haraba is doing war. Insulting is not war. Fighting muslims for other reason than God and his message is not fighting God and his messengerFiraoun used this verse against his magicians for what they have said and for their belief and not in context of war and physical danger.
Peace
Thanks for the explanation. I often point out that the Bible also gave a commmandment much like this one during the time of Moses (commanded to fight anyone that would not let the Israelites pass peacefully through an area). Of course, they all say "We don't live by that part of the Bible anymore."
Peace,
Amina
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Those wishing to punish others for insulting the blessed Messenger often quote the following from the Qur'an in support of their actions.
533 It is but a just recompense for those who make war on God and His apostle, and endeavour to spread corruption on earth, that they are being slain in great' numbers, or crucified in great numbers, or have, in l' result of their perverseness, their hands and feet cut off in great numbers, or are being banished from the earth such is their ignominy in this world. But in the life to come awesome suffering awaits them-
.........................................This contrasts with numerous verses advising the Messenger to deal with those insulting him with dignified patience.
How best should 533 be interpreted and for what situations it came into effect or comes into effect?
Thanks in advance
Without caring for the original Arabic words of the text of Qur'aan, translation yields nothing but distortions. Verbs are Passive and in subjunctive mood. And that two different types of people are mentioned.
The only appropriate Penal Code for those;
who wage war against Allah the Exalted and His Messenger ;
and those who keep attempting to create disturbance-panic-chaos in the society;
is that they might be fought back-killed in the war or prosecuted to capital punishment.
Or their feet and their hands are chained in the state oppositely linked;
or they might be exiled from the country-land.
The disgrace is for them in the worldly life.
And a great punishment is in wait-prepared for them in the Hereafter. -
Without caring for the original Arabic words of the text of Qur'aan, translation yields nothing but distortions. Verbs are Passive and in subjunctive mood. And that two different types of people are mentioned.
The only appropriate Penal Code for those;
who wage war against Allah the Exalted and His Messenger ;
and those who keep attempting to create disturbance-panic-chaos in the society;
is that they might be fought back-killed in the war or prosecuted to capital punishment.
Or their feet and their hands are chained in the state oppositely linked;
or they might be exiled from the country-land.
The disgrace is for them in the worldly life.
And a great punishment is in wait-prepared for them in the Hereafter.Salaam Mazhar
i noticed that you traduced youqtaou by chained and yoslabou by prosecuted to capital punished.
i am interested in seeing your argumentsPeace
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Salam noshirk
Salaam
Concerning the attitude towards who insult prophet
Concerning 5-33 which is one of the more difficult verses i faced.
i looked for the expression "min khilaf" and found this
The other three occurences are relative two Firaoun.
So, first of all, we have to be careful not be a firaoun when we use this verse.Firaoun Changed the "Or" to an "And".
(Please remember that wife of Firaoun was a believer and one of his minister was a believer. So Firaoun knew what islam of Abraham says and probably knew the law in 5-33)the context of 5-33 is "The recompense of those who fight (haraba) God and His messenger".
Haraba is doing war. Insulting is not war. Fighting muslims for other reason than God and his message is not fighting God and his messengerFiraoun used this verse against his magicians for what they have said and for their belief and not in context of war and physical danger.
Peace
thank you for your explanation! The first time that I am aware, that Pharaoh could have known the law! And because he saw himself as a god, he threatened the people with that exact punishment (and even more), for the active war against God, was exactly what he was doing, and he's accused the magician, when they not longer obey him... Thank you! You help me a lot.
Salam )Mazhar i like your deep knowledge in arabic- just explain it in a easy way that also i (not good english and arabic) can follow. thanks! )
Salam ) -
5.33 does not establish a legal punishment for anybody, it is stateing that whagt may await those who do such things is that they may end up being killed, crucified or their extremities cut. It doesn't order anybody or dictate anybody to do so or say that it would be right to do so for anybody. As far as I can judge is the equivalent of the evangelical
Thos who kill will the sword will die by the sword. Or thos who do wrong end up wronged.
It doesn't impose any particular behaviour on believers, except of course not to do those things mentionned at the beginning of the aya.
Salaam
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5.33 does not establish a legal punishment for anybody, it is stateing that whagt may await those who do such things is that they may end up being killed, crucified or their extremities cut. It doesn't order anybody or dictate anybody to do so or say that it would be right to do so for anybody. As far as I can judge is the equivalent of the evangelical
Thos who kill will the sword will die by the sword. Or thos who do wrong end up wronged.
It doesn't impose any particular behaviour on believers, except of course not to do those things mentionned at the beginning of the aya.
Salaam
Peace Huruf,
Where did you get the term "legal" from? I didn't see it implied or written anywhere.
-Amina
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Salaam Mazhar
i noticed that you traduced youqtaou by chained and yoslabou by prosecuted to capital punished.
i am interested in seeing your argumentsPeace
Salamun alika,
One are those who imposed war on Believing society, they are to be fought back; some might get killed while there could be others who need to be tried for war crime---
who wage war against Allah the Exalted and His Messenger ;
is that they might be fought back-killed in the war
Verbs are subjunctive---not necessarily it needs be done. Enemy can be killed in the war but outside war field no one can be killed without a fair court trial,
Second category is not invaders or outsiders, they are within the society who create panic and chaos in the society.
or prosecuted to capital punishment; if it is not executed they might be sentenced to imprisonment with their feet and their hands chained in the state oppositely linked;
It is a common scene in our-Pakistan jails where terrorists and dangerous prisoners are chained like this. -
Peace Huruf,
Where did you get the term "legal" from? I didn't see it implied or written anywhere.
-Amina
Exactly. It is not stating a punishment that the community, the believers, or whoever should apply, it is stating what may happen to those people, what they earn with their behaviour.
Salaam
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Oh...okay.
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Exactly. It is not stating a punishment that the community, the believers, or whoever should apply, it is stating what may happen to those people, what they earn with their behaviour.
Salaam
oh...okay
For me too.i thank also Mazhar for his response.
Peace