Refuting Sheikh Fawzan of Saudi Arabia
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Refuting Sheikh Fawzan of Saudi Arabia
Peace.
https//youtube.com/watch?v=1-2PUM2w_9g
Sheikh Fawzan is the 2nd highest ranking cleric among the clerics of Saudi Arabia, he's second in charge over the "global Sunni ummah".
His refutation is above, of "Quranists/Quraniyoon" unauthorised names "Muslims" DO NOT use for themselves.
He quotes Surah 597, of course, he's refuted by the "whole text" of 597, not good using a snippet, in justifying an entire expanse of Sunnah. This Ayah is clearly in context of "war booty", any sincere reader sees this.
This "Wa" in Arabic, is gathering, unrestrictedly, not 2 separate rulers or authorities, as the Sunnis have done in their polytheistic "Shahadatain", making the Seal of the Prophets a parter with THE GOD.
Sunnis have another favourite they like to cling to, "obey Allah and his Messenger".
Sunnis and of course all other sectarians, would only have a position if the Ayah was read, "atiu Allaha THUMMA Rasul". This could then be Sunnah, but of course, the Quran is from Allah Ta Ala, perfectly preserved.
Any person grounded in Quranic Arabic, knows that "obey Allah & his Messenger" is one obedience to THE GOD.
Surah 91 is a perfect example, it's dissociation of "THE GOD & his Messenger", it's not 2 separate dissociations.
The sheikh then, presented Surah 1644 in the famous "litubayyina" argument they love, about the prophet teaching the Quran. I think when this sheikh reads Surah 3187, he must "black out" when reading "Latubayyinunnahu" in that portion of the text.
Sheikh, in 3187, who are those people, where is there Sunnah?
Sheikh, what is "bilbayyinati wal zuburi" at the beginning of Surah 1644?
Sheikh, in 1644, if the prophet explained the Quran, then why do we need to "yatafakkaruna" reflect, if he explained it?
Of course, as I once rightly heard before "the Arab shuffle".
The Quran is in Arabic, not "Saudi Arabic", and meanings they wish to stick by.He goes on with "how will you pray"? It's unfortunate, no one informed this man, there is NO ritual praying in Islam, let alone towards a "cubic" temple.
To be continued/modified.
Your welcome to post better refutations to these two Ayahs quoted in the video.
Please only stick to Sheikh Fawzan and the Ayahs he quoted.
Please only use Ayahs to refute.
Peace.
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Salaam,
It is always good to take a look at lexicons such as Lane's while checking Quran's traditional interpretation. The root used tay-waw-ayn for the word translated as 'obey' have other less dogmatic connotations as well.
Alternative definitions for To do voluntarily, do an act with effort.
I am of the mind that Arabic words do not carry more than just one meaning, so either have to be true.Personally, an alternative English variant would be "follow", i.e. follow Allah and the 'Rasuul'. We can also argue about the word for messenger with the root (ra-siin-lam) which can connote bestow, let go.
However, the person being a rasuul is likely to give something, but it is not merely a plain message but they are a face of GOD and they teach spirituality. I used to metaphorize it as 'beacon' for the word providing "light" and salvation for those who choose to follow.
It is not exactly obedience GOD expects but spiritual ascension for those who take heed and can see the truth about the world's nature. The prophets came saying "follow my example/guidance/teachings and you shall be sound" etc. Not bursting out "OBEY GOD and me". ALLAH, the word, means the image people should tread in. Allah = The image Rasuul = The representative/The bestower. I suppose you can see how the Quranic passage is supposed to talk. Rasuul means more than a mere mailman, because the person is supposed to bring the grace ( huda) of The Rabb upon people.
To follow the Rasuul is totally voluntary and its teachings are for those who appreciate them. A prophet would never force the teaching upon people and if they reject then he or she would move on to another who may listen. Jesus venture in the Biblical Gospels is an ancient display of a prophetic mission with wandering around preaching to those who care to listen and simply walk away if they see they are being rejected.
Today, a prophet would likely use the Internet which is an effective platform which was not available a millennium ago, and the same as then if people do not seem to like what they hear they can just ignore them or perhaps challenge them with tricky questions if it is worth it as an exposure or demonstration.
Challenging them is often in itself futile, because they are too blinded, but it may be good to provide a demonstration for those who are not but only deluded by those who are blinded with no better alternative.
Prophets do not use the essence of their time here for compilation of worldly books but they preach and assist people who care to listen and are willing to forsake the illusion they live in and take a step towards Transition ( al-akhar in Arabic).
Moses lived for X number of years and only a tiny fraction of that time he spent with some kind of physical testament ('The Commandments' on stone tablets and supplementary information). The rest of the time he spent as a prophet, an insightful person and he was humble and one among the people. Prophets usually do not claim to be leaders as in kings, they do never claim the rank and they are not interested in it (so much for the warlord Muhammad).
Jesus, the son of Mary, did not even write a text in his whole life and hardly owned any physical possessions for that sake either. He lived as he taught, although he gave praise to John The Baptist and even said that concerning abstention (piety) from the world he was amazing while he himself a glutton and a drunkard which is a bit amusing considering how unworldly Jesus actually seems to most people.
Jesus was not really a role model for a cleric, compared to John who was the son of a cleric, and very rebellious when it came to established doctrines because he exposed them. He spoke ill of sectarian prayers and compared them to Pagan mumblings which is not really a lie but very blunt. He knew the sectarians would react negatively to many sayings, but his mission was to be very forthcoming in a very zealous and dogmatic community with an abundance of invented traditions (those same sectarians follow today) and by saying what he did was certainly a death warrant. Clearly inevitable.
Probably why so many rejected him as he did not preach an established sectarian doctrine.For Muslims he is just a puppet among prophets along with Muhammad which teach the Pagan visualized separate god object concept, preferably sitting on a physical throne in Heaven. They reject the Biblical Gospels because they cannot stand "I am in the Father and the Father is in me" (which they do not understand) and the earlier scholars changed the meaning of "La Ilah ila Allah" to mean "no god than Allah" instead of the real "to be Elah is to be Allah" which needs to be put contextually to be understood and it is important to know what the word Elah means. It is an immersion (merging) into an image, the same "Kingdom" (realm) Jesus spoke of that people should join and Al-Akharateh is is the 'Transition' to be made. The phrase "la elah ila allah" means "to be it is to REALLY be it" with the Arabic AL prefix giving that emphasis.
When ALLAH, usually narrated in plural, is used in Quran it is to be taken that the collective is speaking, i.e everyone included in Allah (the "Kingdom", realm). Jesus wisely spoke metaphorically, but you are sophisticated enough to be intelligent enough to be spoken to plainly and I am not immediately threatened of persecution (necessitating parables). GOD GOD's personal address is Rabb in Quran and is included in that collective noun Allah. No righteous/knowledgeable person in Quran will use Ya Allah to address The Rabb, but they say Ya Rabb or simply Rabb implying it is meant as a title just like any other addressing using 'ya'.
That has to do with Allah being too ambiguous to use as an address, understandably, because you do not address one but many "nodes" interlinked.
Sorry I seem to have turned the reply into a lecture. Seems a common habit of mine, but in one way or another it is connected. It is important to know what the ALLAH word means together with the alleged "obey" word. It surely says to 'follow' which is generally perceived to be voluntary. It ought to say attain a similarity with Allah and the rasuul.
Salaam
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"How will you pray?" It is such a confusing question. Just pray, although GOD does not need it because The Rabb already knows what you need before you open your mouth. The reason you pray is as your own reminder that you may realize yourself in it and the reason why you traditionally end a prayer with "amen". It is you in ALLAH (the image/realm/"kingdom" who should realize it.
And how do you bring honor to yourself (within ALLAH)? Not by ritually praying in prostration, but by realizing what you prayed. The Rabb has no worldly needs and so a ritual would seem fairly redundant. You do not prostrate to yourself, do you, seeing the Rabb is in you (ALLAH)? It would seem a bit egotistical, but you can honor yourself (ALLAH) by doing what is seemly.
And no, The Rabb is not separate from yourself. No glorious image to vainly worship. The best you can do is being One with The Rabb, literally. There is no other platform to join. No separation. The other is a violation of 'The Commandment' number two No image to worship from neither Heaven or Earth.
Salaam
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https//youtube.com/watch?v=1-2PUM2w_9g
Sheikh Fawzan is the 2nd highest ranking cleric among the clerics of Saudi Arabia, he's second in charge over the "global Sunni ummah".
His refutation is above, of "Quranists/Quraniyoon" unauthorised names "Muslims" DO NOT use for themselves.
2nd highest ranking cleric in Saudi? We're making progress
https//bobbiblogger.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/gandhi.jpg
Looking forward to the day when they have to roll out the number one cleric to "refute" Quran based islam ;D
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2nd highest ranking cleric in Saudi? We're making progress
https//bobbiblogger.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/gandhi.jpg
Looking forward to the day when they have to roll out the number one cleric to "refute" Quran based islam ;D
Hmmm..... it's true... history repeat itself...
Thus based on the 'historical pattern';
Looking forward to the day when they will torture, kidnap, imprisoned, burn or crucify "the apostate"..
Oh... they did that already right? -
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