Women dancing, excercising and swimming?
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peace,
Firstly, I am not sure which translation you are using, but it is recommended to use the many available tools online to check and verify a translation, e.g. see www.StudyQuran.org
If you do not already use such tools in your studies, I can guarantee that if you do, you will see a significant leap in the quality and accuracy of your studies.Secondly, I strongly recommend the following article
http//misconceptions-about-islam.com/dress-code-women-veil.htm
It contains some often overlooked points, which you may find interesting.Can a woman swim in a public pool?
Let us know your thoughts once you have read the above article.
I wanted to know what Islam's take is on this?
Strictly speaking, the actual word "islam" (small "i" has no take on anything, and can never have a take on anything, as it is a common descriptive word, a mindset, a way to approach life. It is like any other common descriptive word in the Arabic language, and actually has a meaning, not as a title/noun, which is now the common usage.
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Okay, I see that an anti-traditionalist view is being taken by Qur'an alone followers on the issue of Women, dressing and her modesty. I love the arguments given and I really think they're very liberating but here's a question I still have after reading the following verse
2431;
"And tell the believing women to subdue their eyes, and maintain their chastity. They shall not reveal any parts of their bodies, except that which is necessary. They shall cover their chests, (with their Khimar) and shall not relax this code in the presence of other than their husbands, their fathers, the fathers of their husbands, their sons, the sons of their husbands, their brothers, the sons of their brothers, the sons of their sisters, other women, the male servants or employees whose sexual drive has been nullified, or the children who have not reached puberty. They shall not strike their feet when they walk in order to shake and reveal certain details of their bodies. All of you shall repent to GOD, O you believers, that you may succeed." 2431
Okay so my question is, does this mean that it's not permissible for women to dance (in a mixed crowd), run, exercise, ramp walk (because all of these do emphasize a woman's body, one way or the other) I mean...since these activities aren't considered slutty or seductive these days (Well for certain kinds of ramp walking and dancing anyway...). And what about swimming? Can a woman swim in a public pool? I wanted to know what Islam's take is on this?
And please don't just give me your opinions. I'd like to see proper reasoning and evidences for answers. Thanks a lot )
CG
Peace,
Respectfully.I've noticed that when women, not all but some of them, wear and walk in high heels, i tend to turn around to see who she is. It's interesting that high heels are cauisng this. I mean, just because she walks in high heels, i looked to see.
Gotta give some heavy thought to this...
Peace. -
Secondly, I strongly recommend the following article
http//misconceptions-about-islam.com/dress-code-women-veil.htm
It contains some often overlooked points, which you may find interesting.Yes, indeed, very good article. Concise and complete. I commend your work, it makes things much easier when trying to set apart the "noise" that has clung to coranic injuctions through time from the actual injunction.
Salaam
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I'm sorry I couldn't access the link
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CG, why could you not access the link, as in what was the specific error?
Here is a cut and paste
Misconception Muslim women must fully cover up in Islam
Background Some think that Muslim women must cover their whole body, including face when in public. Women's dress code in Islam is one of the most focussed upon subjects not only in the Western media but also in Muslim countries, yet it remains one of the most distorted and misunderstood.
Firstly, according to The Quran, the most important rule of the dress code for both men and women is as follows
O children of Adam, we have provided you with garments to cover your bodies, as well as to adorn you. But the best garment is the garment of piety/righteousness. These are some of God's signs, so that they may be mindful.
The garment of righteousness/piety could either refer to choosing a garment that reflects this quality or enveloping oneself in righteous/pious conduct is best, or both.
The following verses tells women to guard their private parts (i.e. genitalia) and cover their chests
Tell the believing men to lower their gaze and guard their private parts, for that is purer for them. God is fully aware of what you do.
And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and guard their private parts, and that they should not reveal their beauty except what is apparent of it, and let them draw with their covers over their chests. And let them not reveal their beauty except to their husbands, or their fathers, or fathers of their husbands, or their sons, or the sons of their husbands, or their brothers, or the sons of their brothers, or the sons of their sisters, or their women, or those committed to them by oath, or the male servants who are without need, or the child who has not yet understood the composition of women. And let them not strike with their feet that reveals what they are keeping hidden of their beauty. And repent to God, all of you believers, that you may succeed.From the above verse it can be deduced that for the purposes of women's dress code two types of beauty are described
- What is apparent (this can be revealed in public)
- What is hidden (this type must be covered in public, but could be revealed by a striking of feet or walk/stride which is revealing)
Such a striking of feet or walk could only reveal a limited number of parts of the body, e.g. the private parts, buttocks, thighs, breasts, hips, thus any part not revealed by such an action should not be considered part of hidden beauty and therefore part of apparent beauty. Of course, this means such things as face, hair, hands, feet etc would not clearly fall into the category of beauty that is meant to be hidden. Furthermore, the verse clearly brackets what beauty it is referring to by saying "...the child who has not yet understood the composition of women" implying it is relating to what is specific to a woman (i.e. what is different between man and woman) nothing else.
A headscarf (commonly called "hijab" is often worn by Muslim women, however this word is not used like this in The Quran. In fact, the word "hijab" is not even used to mean an item of clothing and simply means something which intervenes between two things, e.g. barrier, screen, seclusion. All verses where this word occurs are as follows 746, 3353, 3832, 415, 4251, 1745, 1917, 8315. It should also be noted that believing men and women are free to eat in each other's company, whether family or friends , thus a veil covering the face (commonly called "niqab", or the full veil "burqa" would obviously be impractical. Again, such an item of clothing is nowhere to be found in The Quran.
Another common mistake regarding dress code is when the following situation-specific verse is applied to all situations
And those who harm the believing men and the believing women, with no just reason, they have brought upon themselves a slander and a gross sin.
O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the wives of the believers that they shall lengthen (or draw near) their outer-garments. Thus, they will be recognized and avoid being harmed. God is Forgiver, Merciful.
If the hypocrites and those with disease in their hearts and those who spread lies in the city do not refrain*, then We will let you overpower them, then they will not be able to remain as your neighbours except for a short while.
*proving harm is already occurring, and refers back to 3358, which is before the modification in dress is mentioned.The mistake is exposed when the practicalities of applying the above verses are considered. The verses deal with open enmity with significant repercussions for the perpetrators if this behaviour does not stop. The open enmity is direct to the person, hence the need for the women to modify their outer-garment in order to be recognised in public and not harmed. For the suggested solution in these verses to succeed three things must be in place
- The open enmity or harm must be present in the community first and direct to the women
- The modification in outer-garment and the consequence for the perpetrator of not abiding by this identification code must either be made known to the community or this would have to be common knowledge amongst the community
- The authority is in place to fight/expel those persisting in this behaviour
Clearly, this specific criteria has to be fulfilled for these verses to work, thus is not a universal rule. It is situation-specific, e.g. if a section of the community become hostile to believing women or women in general and the believers have some power in the land, then they can utilise this solution, effectively giving an ultimatum with no room for excuse for the perpetrators.
These verses are commonly interpreted to mean that Muslim women must lengthen (or draw near) their outer-garment whenever in public even in times of peace. However, this is easily refuted by considering that if this was the case and open enmity then appeared, the modification suggested in these verses would already exist, thus implementing the modification in these verses could not be done, thus rendering the solution described in these verses as void.
However, from these verses it can be deduced that wearing of an outer-garment by women when in public was the norm.The following verse shows being clothed is the norm but makes it clear that flexibility is allowed in certain situations, as long as we are mindful of modesty. The context is etiquette within the household
And the women who are past child bearing and who do not seek to get married have no sin upon them if they discard their garments*, provided they do not show off with their beauty. If they abstain, then it is better for them. God is Hearer, Knower.
*Arabic word is "thiyab" and refers to ordinary clothes/gowns.It should be noted that all examples of dress in The Quran of the righteous or believing men and women involve wearing garments, e.g. 1831, 2223, 2458, 2460, 3533, 744, 7621. Also, to provide clothing for others is considered a charitable or righteous act .
As can be seen, The Quran gives us a set of simple basic rules with flexible guidance for the rest, which can be applied to different situations/society/function. This flexibility is a mercy but has unfortunately been abused by various schools of thought and religious leaders who have issued their own additional rulings and consequently there is disagreement amongst them on other than the basic rules.
Additional notes for Arabic readers
The word "khumur" is used in 2431 and can be the plural of "khimaar" or "khimirr", and can mean any cover made of cloth or headcover, according to Classical Arabic dictionaries and Traditional Ahadith/Narrations (see Ibn Kathir tafsir). Please note the Arabic preposition "bi" meaning "with" in "bikhumurihinna", which means they are to cover their chests with their "khumur/covers/headcovers". The usage of preposition "bi" is different to the preposition "min" as used in 3359 "min jalabeebihinna" which means to use a part of their "jilbab/outer-garment" in the modification suggested, i.e. not all of it has to be lowered or drawn near, just part of it. In 2431 if God intended that part of it (e.g. headcover) stays on the head and part of it be used to cover the bosom, it would have been more appropriate to use "min khumurhinna". Furthermore, the word "yadribna" as used in 2431 has no connotation of lengthening or lowering in any other occurrence, unlike "yudneena" in 3359 which does, thus would have been more appropriate to use.############################
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I'm sorry, but I guess it's obvious that dancing, running and exercising will expose and emphasize a woman's "hidden beauty" ?
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And thanks for taking the trouble, anyway ;D
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I'm sorry, but I guess it's obvious that dancing, running and exercising will expose and emphasize a woman's "hidden beauty" ?
Why do you say it is "obvious" then phrase your statement like a question as if you are unsure?
Also, can you please answer my question as to why you could not access the link? Since I run the website, this information is important to me.
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Why do you say it is "obvious" then phrase your statement like a question as if you are unsure?
Also, can you please answer my question as to why you could not access the link? Since I run the website, this information is important to me.
There is no prob with the page peace
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What is your concept of hidden beauty? If it says to guard her private parts and also the bossom, those are the hidden beauty. There is no reason why running those would show, or dancing or exercising. Actually apart from the bossom it is very hard for women's private parts to be seen, specially if they are covered. If running could do such a things, why shouldn't the Qur'an have said so straight out? Normaly it doesn't lack words or is shy to pronounce them.
Salaam
