to those who think salat=prayer and nothing else...
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Peace everyone,
This just occurred to me
Salaat al-fajr is to be upheld exactly in the middle of daytime and night at one end, and salaat al-3isha is to be upheld exactly in the middle of daytime and night at the other end so they are both in the middle, hence BOTH ARE MIDDLE SALAATS. They are also to be upheld in a balanced manner, for example "seek a path in between" (17110). This satisfies both possible meanings of al-salaat al-wusta. This proves that all salaats are actually supposed to be al-salaat al-wusta and this interpretation fits 2238.
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Peace,
It does not mention anywhere in the context of 2238 that it refers to one day. If you say that salawaat here refers to salaats only in one day then that is a complete assumption on your part. Assumption about what the god says = ascribing lies to the god. Therefore, because a day is not mentioned in its context, the only interpretation of 2238 could be that it is talking about all the salaats in one's lifetime. Then middle salaat would mean the salaat in exactly the middle of one's life. How will you determine the salaat exactly in the middle of your life?
You are right that the "wa" here clarifies. It clarifies that each salaat of our lifetime should be upheld in a balanced manner. That is the only way it can clarify without being redundant. In every example from the qur'aan where "wa" clarifies, it gives an additional clarifying attribute or description of what is mentioned before, but does not repeat what has already been included in what was mentioned before.
Another one of your pathetic claims that I am "lying about God". How do YOU know what God thinks? Are YOU trying to play GOD? Are YOU assuming that God thinks that way? We saw how people commented about your posts the past discussion we had.
You are the one making assumptions about what God thinks. We are told in the Quran not to be suspicous about someone without proof. So stop being like that, it's very annoying as others have already said.
Start being open-minded and accept/respect other peoples' opinions.
Now back to the topic.
I find this verse interesting2441 Alam tara anna Allaha yusabbihulahu man fee alssamawati waal-ardiwaalttayru saffatin kullun qadAAalima salatahu watasbeehahu waAllahuAAaleemun bima yafAAaloona
Reformist Translation 2441 Do you not see that everything in the heavens and the earth, even the birds in formation, glorifies God? Each knows its contact prayer and its glorification. God is fully aware of everything they do.
Shabbir Ahmed/QXP Translation 2441 Do you not realize that God, He is the One Whom all beings in the heavens and earth glorify, and the birds, with their wings outspread, as they fly in columns. All of them know their Salaat and Tasbeeh (mission and strife). God is Aware of what they do to fulfill His Plan.
So in this verse could "salat" mean commitment/obligation?
Does anybody know the root of "tasbih"?Peace
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Peace everyone,
This just occurred to me
Salaat al-fajr is to be upheld exactly in the middle of daytime and night at one end, and salaat al-3isha is to be upheld exactly in the middle of daytime and night at the other end so they are both in the middle, hence BOTH ARE MIDDLE SALAATS. They are also to be upheld in a balanced manner, for example "seek a path in between" (17110). This satisfies both possible meanings of al-salaat al-wusta. This proves that all salaats are actually supposed to be al-salaat al-wusta and this interpretation fits 2238.
You mean that they are both BETWEEN the day and the night. However, your point is not valid, since you dont acknowledge "wusta" meaning "middle" in 2238. Also, why can it mean "balanced"? Because when you have equal things on either side of something then you can placesoemthing right in between without the weight shifting anywhere and the lever you would have would be pointing towards the (horizontal) middle.
Waw-Siin-Tay = middle, midst, among, best, best part of a thing, mediate/intercede between, most remote from the extremes, equidistant, intermediate, most conforming/equitable/just/balanced, most excellent of them in particular, occupy the middle position.
Now, of course it can mean "balanced", BUT notice the following "most remote from the extremes". What are the extremes? The ends of the day.
Anyways, we could discuss this for days without agreeing, so lets get back to the initial topic.
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Your Lord would not care about you except for your imploring.
If you " keep" the "prayers", that would be better for you.
sun
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Peace everyone,
Scientifically speaking, the dawn and the dusk periods can each be considered as "middle" of a 24 hour day. These two middles of a 24 hour day are the most easily discernible by using cosmological phenomenon.
The above point is actually moot because there is no "day" or "daytime" or "night" mentioned in the context of 2238. If 2238 is translated as middle, then it can refer to either middle of a person's lifetime or middle of the total time humans will be in existence.
Those who claim that it is middle of daytime ascribe lies to the god because "daytime"/"nahaar" is not mentioned in the context. Those who claim that it is the middle of night again ascribe lies to the god because "night"/"layl" is not mentioned in the context either.
Using the same logic, why can't it be the salaat in the middle of the lunar cycle or why can't it be the salaat in the middle of the solar year? If it is the middle of the lunar cycle then is it the middle point from full-moon to full-moon or middle point from one new crescent to another new crescent? If it is the middle of the solar year then is it the middle point from one solstice to the other or the middle point from one equinox to the other? Why not the middle of the lunar year?
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Peace everyone,
Scientifically speaking, the dawn and the dusk periods can each be considered as "middle" of a 24 hour day. These two middles of a 24 hour day are the most easily discernible by using cosmological phenomenon.
The above point is actually moot because there is no "day" or "daytime" or "night" mentioned in the context of 2238. If 2238 is translated as middle, then it can refer to either middle of a person's lifetime or middle of the total time humans will be in existence.
Those who claim that it is middle of daytime ascribe lies to the god because "daytime"/"nahaar" is not mentioned in the context. Those who claim that it is the middle of night again ascribe lies to the god because "night"/"layl" is not mentioned in the context either.
Using the same logic, why can't it be the salaat in the middle of the lunar cycle or why can't it be the salaat in the middle of the solar year? If it is the middle of the lunar cycle then is it the middle point from full-moon to full-moon or middle point from one new crescent to another new crescent? If it is the middle of the solar year then is it the middle point from one solstice to the other or the middle point from one equinox to the other? Why not the middle of the lunar year?
Dear Brother
Is Quran so difficult to understand that you are persistantly jumping from one concept to the other ?
Regards -
You can use the greeting " good evining" during late afternoon, or at nightime. As a general rule you can start using " evening" an hour before the sun sets. Therefore, the evening salat time commences an hour before the sunsets and lasts untill it has become completly dark outside.
With that, since "evening" can be used 1) late afternoon ( before the sun sets) and also 2) at nighttime ( sunset), do you think that the evening salat can be split into two with late afternoon being considered ( middle)?
I caint really explain it right now.....................................What im tryin to say is that when we hold the evening salat we are glorifyin 1) before the setting of the sun/ lateafternoon and 2) at nightime/ sunset....
hmm
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Peace,
Dear Brother
Is Quran so difficult to understand that you are persistantly jumping from one concept to the other ?
RegardsI am not jumping but just trying to illustrate the serious IRRECONCILABLE flaws in the "middle" understanding which make it UNTENABLE.
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Peace,
I am not jumping but just trying to illustrate the serious IRRECONCILABLE flaws in the "middle" understanding which make it UNTENABLE.
Dear Brother
Your constant striking of your mind against this concept indicates that you, yourself is not getting convinced of your own understanding of this term.
Regards -
peace all,
Translating salat as 'prayer' in the following verses does not fit. Translators such as Yusuf Ali recognised this and ammended his translation accordingly.
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To those will be salawat from their Lord and a mercy, they are the guided ones.
Does the Lord pray for people? (salawat = plural of salat)
Isn't salwat more correctly translated as 'greetings' and not 'prayer'?