Yea I have some questions
-
I am 20 years old. My family is muslim, but they are not too strict about religion. They are sunni. I know how to read arabic and I spoke a little bit since I grew up in Saudi Arabia. I took an Arabic language class last year and that's about it.
I do not believe the hadith should be used to interpret the Quran. the gap between the time the quran was compiled and the hadith were compiled is too large.
I'd explain my beliefs about the quran and hadith but in the end I now just choose to disregard even the Quran because I can never know what it's REALLY saying and anyone can make it say whatever he/she wants. I am just going to find God the hard way like Ibrahim did.What did Ibrahim do? ???
-
Ibrahim didn't have a book or a religion. He arrived at the truth through observation and reasoning.
p.s. I didn't realize this thread was so old. I probably wouldn't have bothered replying if I knew.
All prophets and messengers were given books. Hazrat Ibrahim AH is no exception.
Regards
-
All prophets and messengers were given books. Hazrat Ibrahim AH is no exception.
Regards
Are you sure? I am referring to these verses. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
674 (Asad) AND, LO, spoke abraham unto his father Azar "Takest thou idols for gods? Verily, I see that thou and thy people have obviously gone astray!"
675 (Asad) And thus We gave abraham insight into mighty dominion over the heavens and the earth - and to the end that he might become one of those who are inwardly sure.
676 (Asad) Then, when the night overshadowed him with its darkness, he beheld a star;., he exclaimed, "This is my Sustainer!" -but when it went down, he said, "I love not the things that go down."
677 (Asad) Then, when he beheld the moon rising, he said, "This is my Sustainer!"-but when it went down, he said, "Indeed, if my Sustainer guide me not. I will most certainly become one of the people who go astray!"
678 (Asad) Then, when he beheld the sun rising, he said, "This is my Sustainer! This one is the greatest !" - but when it went down, he exclaimed "O my people! Behold, far be it from me to ascribe divinity, as you do, to aught beside God!
679 (Asad) Behold, unto Him who brought into being the heavens and the earth have I turned my face, having turned away from all that is false; and I am not of those who ascribe divinity to aught beside Him."
and this
365 (Asad) O FOLLOWERS of earlier revelation! Why do you argue about abraham, seeing that the Torah and the Gospel were not revealed till after him? Will you not, then, use your reason?
2135 (Asad) AND THEY say, "Be Jews" - or, "Christians" - "and you shall be on the right path." Say "Nay, but the creed of abraham, who turned away from all that is false, and was not of those who ascribe divinity to aught beside God."
-
none of those verses mention Ibrahim not having a book.
P.S
'Lobster! enough living in Cold waters, may be you should change your name to sea turtle and start a new journey.' -
So? Ibrahim looked at the heavens to 'find' God and realized what he is NOT.
Ibrahim was the messenger of God. That was how he knew what God is and what He isn't.
-
Ibrahim was the messenger of God. That was how he knew what God is and what He isn't.
If he already had knowledge of God, why was he searching for him up in the heavens and mistaking the sun and the moon and the stars for God?
I believe he is an example for all of us. Unlike other people who just followed whatever religion they were born into, Ibrahim was a free thinker (he was neither christian nor jewish) and he found god by himself through reasoning and observation. He was a wrong a few times but in the end he arrived at the truth.
He also serves to remind us that it's alright to be wrong because as long as our focus is on the truth we'll find it eventually. -
If he already had knowledge of God, why was he searching for him up in the heavens and mistaking the sun and the moon and the stars for God?
I believe he is an example for all of us. Unlike other people who just followed whatever religion they were born into, Ibrahim was a free thinker (he was neither christian nor jewish) and he found god by himself through reasoning and observation. He was a wrong a few times but in the end he arrived at the truth.
He also serves to remind us that it's alright to be wrong because as long as our focus is on the truth we'll find it eventually.salaam brother;
I think Ibrahim making a point for his nation, its the way of his argumentation. Or is it the first time he noticed rising and setting of planets, moon and sun?
674-80
And when Ibrahim said to his sire, Azar Do you take idols for gods? Surely I see you and your people in manifest error.
And thus did We show Ibrahim the kingdom of the heavens and the earth and that he might be of those who are sure.
the above two verses show he was already on the straight path by his Lord.
So when the night over-shadowed him, he saw a star; said he this is my Lord; So when it set, he said I do not love the setting ones.
Then when he saw the moon rising, he said this is my Lord; So when it set, he said If my Lord had not guided me I should certainly be of the erring people.
read the above verse carefully, especially when he said "If my Lord had not guided me" that make it more certain that he was a messenger already. the next verse shows he is making all these point for his nation and not taking those objects as his God.
Then when he saw the sun rising, he said this my Lord; Is this the greatest? So when it set, he said O my people! surely I am clear of what you set up (with Allah).
after making all those points he announced the truth, his beliefs
Surely I have turned myself, being upright, wholly to Him Who originated the heavens and the earth, and I am not of the polytheists.and after hearing all that see how his nation reacted
And his people disputed with him. He said Do you dispute with me respecting Allah? And He has guided me indeed; and I do not fear in any way those that you set up with Him, unless my Lord pleases; my Lord comprehends all things in His knowledge; will you not then mind?
-
If he already had knowledge of God, why was he searching for him up in the heavens and mistaking the sun and the moon and the stars for God?
I believe he is an example for all of us. Unlike other people who just followed whatever religion they were born into, Ibrahim was a free thinker (he was neither christian nor jewish) and he found god by himself through reasoning and observation. He was a wrong a few times but in the end he arrived at the truth.
He also serves to remind us that it's alright to be wrong because as long as our focus is on the truth we'll find it eventually.Was he not informed of the teachings in the scripture of Moses?
And Abraham who fulfilled?
-
Rasulhamsa,
This is how I understand those verses.
It says God shows him the heavens and the earth so that he WILL become one of those who are "sure."
And so when he looks up at the sky and sees the star rising and setting, he uses his reason to understand that that is not his creator.So god shows him his creation, he doesn't just give Abraham the truth. The issue for me here is whether God merely shows Ibrahim his creation or gives him divine knowledge. I think it is the former.
I don't think it is just him making an argument because the quran tells us the events as they are happening to him, not him just talking about it.