women/ females/ orphans in Surah Nisa, 4:3

sarah2505

and this one.
http//ucatlas.ucsc.edu/gender/gender_india.html

India Large Differences between North and South

India has one of the worst female mortality rates in the world, with a gender ratio of 0.97. That is, there are only 97 women alive for every 100 men, well below the 105 women in North America and Europe. But these aggregate numbers hide the inequality within India. For example, the southern state of Kerala has a ratio of 1.04. The northern states have extremely low numbers Utter Pradesh has 0.89 and Punjab?s is 0.87.

Amartya Sen studied this regional inequality and found a distinct split based on geography. States in the Northern and Western region of India have higher ratios of female mortality than states in the South and East. In fact, he asserted that with only a couple minor exceptions, every state in the North and East has lower female ratios than every state in the South and West. Sen noted ?a social and cultural divide across India, splitting the country? in half, with respect to female mortality and gender bias before birth (Sen 2001).

The map (above) shows this geographical split. It measures the ratio of girls to boys, reflecting not only the mortality rates of early childhood, but also the sex bias before birth which can result in sex-selective abortions.

Kerala Success due to Progressive Social Programs

The southern state of Kerala has had the greatest success. Its demographics are more typical of a middle-income country, with a female-male ratio of 1.05, similar to Europe and North America. Kerala is notable in India for its progressive social programs, such as accessible health care, educational opportunities, land reform and many others. This has resulted in increased opportunities for women. The female literacy rate is higher than the rest of India. Women have more opportunism to work outside the home. Property ownership and inheritance among women is higher too; in some areas of Kerala, property ownership is usually passed through women. The factors increase women?s agency, which improves female mortality.

Economic Growth No automatic key to success

By economics measurements, some states in the north and west of India could be considered the most successful. Punjab and Harayana are among the richest in the country; Gujarat and Maharashtra are among those with the fastest economic growth. However, their gender ratios were as low as states in the region with no or slow economic growth. Therefore, economic resources, prosperity and GNP growth do not appear to be major factors in reducing female mortality. Higher income appears to improve overall mortality, but does not improve the female ratio. In other words, overall mortality decreases, but boys benefit more than girls.

The north and western states are varied in terms of economic conditions and growth. However, Sen found that one common characteristic among the states in this region is that they have ?given much more room to religion-based sectarian politics than have the east or the south, where religion-center parties have had very little success? (Sen 2001).

Some Factors Hard to Predict

With some factors, it is hard to predict whether they will improve female mortality. For example, Murthi studied access to health care to see if scarcity exacerbates the gender bias, due to boys receiving preferential access to resources over girls. Conversely, when opportunities increase (through increase parental literacy or high per-capita income) it is not always clear whether these advantages are shared evenly throughout families, or if the benefits are distributed mainly to the boy children.

However, Murthi found that increased female literary, education and labor force participation increased women?s empowerment and reduced gender mortality bias. He found that increased literacy can have the most powerful influence and can affect change more quickly than other social factors.

Case Study Lessons in Development

As a case study, India shows that economic growth is not a predicator of improved female mortality. Female literacy and education can help empower women not only in their lives, but in their opportunity to live. Female labor force participation and property ownership can be key contributors, too. There is some debate about the degree to which each factor contributes to the issue of gender bias in mortality. However, there is agreement among scholars that empowerment of women improves their agency and reduces gender biased mortality.

References

Chasin, Barbara, Franke, Richard W., (1991) ?The Kerala Difference,? New York Review of Books, October 24, 1991.

Murthi, Mamta, et al, Mortality, (1995) ?Fertility and Gender Bias in India A District Level Analysis?, June 1995.

Sen, A. (2001), ?Many Faces of Gender Inequality?, The Frontline, October 27, 2001.

Sen, A. (1990). "More Than 100 Million Women Are Missing" New York Review of Books (12/20/90) 61-66.

Fawzia

PS, in mentioning about global sex ratios, I don't mean to hurt Muslim sentiments.

I also said that this happens in non Muslim India, China etc as well.

However, I do think all these societies, Muslim or non Muslim, need to introspect & make women's lives better, so that their total populations have more women than men.

After all, if Sri Lanka can have more women than men in their total population, & women outliving men, why shouldn't Bangladesh as well?

Both are South Asian, so its nothing against South Asians, if one South Asian naton can have more women, another can too. peace

Also, if Portugal can have more women than men in their population, then Turkey should too.

Both are slightly poorer nations by European standards & still have illiteracy.

Surely its not European bashing to mention Turkey or South Asian bashing to mention Sri Lanka? peace

Iran has more men than women, the Iran, Iraq war killed many men, still it has more men.

I would like my birthplace Iran to have more women too, to stop all the hideous ill treatment of women.

I think constructive criticism always runs the risk of being blocked by terma like racist or South Asian bashing.

Sri Lanka is in South Asia too, it has more women & women are reasonably well off in Buddhist Sri Lanka.

sarah2505

http//books.google.com/books?id=XRudk_NcA7cC&pg=PA24&lpg=PA24&dq=sex+ratio+in+Europe%3F&source=bl&ots=ybeyiITTbD&sig=H1hnn9uv5FS9zLOH0GoUPh2RvTU&hl=en&ei=Zzb1Srn7Loyf8AaRpoT0CQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9&ved=0CCsQ6AEwCA#v=onepage&q=sex%20ratio%20in%20Europe%3F&f=false

a sex ratio of 1.2-1.3 in Europe in the Middle Ages?

san

I know I know, first you didn't understand demographics, then you will ridicule me & then give up.

All I spoke of were facts.

Why such huge sizes? I too want to help women, I don't think the Quran does enough on that front.

I would like Muslims to be more like nations like Sweden or Norway, which promote women's rights,NOT from the Bible, but from modern ethics.

I think the best help for Muslims, like other people everywhere, isn't to turn back to what God says, but try to find their own meaningful lives, thinking out of the book.

How else can i get your attention?

Thank you for the open words, now we know what your intention is. You wanted to help women. That's noble.

That is your right to think out of the book. And we can do as you do, while at another time also think inside the book--for maybe it is the other 'muslims' interpretation that are wrong?

You already feel that the modern ethics is better than their interpretation, than why don't you work with us?

Without all the not-so-useful speech.

Why don't we compete in presenting our views, in a more systematic manner? Academical is good.

So let's show what is it in our minds in a positive manner.

You can see that we are not on their side, so why keep it on us?

You want some more appropriate place for you to express your anger on the injustice? I'll find some other forums for you. There are a lot of 'muslims' forum still justifying their misinterpretations. And from Clerics too. You could give them some hard blows, definitely. That would be funny for us too.

But why here? When we are trying to deal with the very same subjects as you are?

Can you be more fair to us?

Can you be more fair to yourself?

Please answer, i know you're an intelligent person.

Fawzia

and this one.
......

Read my posts Sarah, I CLEARLY mentioned India & China as well.

I mentioned India too, however, not being Indian, it didn't perturb you.

I'm not Indian too.

However, if I DARE mention Pakistan or Bangladesh, I'm termed racist?

Isn't it racist if you mention Indian witches or ratios?

Or is it all right to mention India as its Hindu majority, but not Muslim nations? ???

I'm not an ex Hindu, if I was I'd be turning my attention to that one, I'm ex Muslim.

I know my ex religion & culture.

Now tell me Sarah, having indulged in India bashing, why do millions of Bangladeshi illegal immigrants go to settle there?

Bangladesh too is a poor nation like India, both were colonized by the British, so you can't use the colony excuse?

If Hindu India is such a baaad, baaaad, place, why do Bangladeshi illegal immigrants go to settle there in millions?

Why flee their Muslim homeland for such a bad nation?

Having indulged in the bashing of one South Asian nation, surely you can answer about the millions of Bangladeshi illegal immigrants in India? Why this attraction for a non Muslim neighbouring, fellow colonized country? ???

I have nothing against South Asia, I did praise Buddhist Sri Lanka,

Why would I do this?

In any case, blaming India is like tu quoque logical fallacy.

Instead of blaming other nations, try to learn from the better ones, for example try to learn from Sri Lanka. peace

sarah2505

http//www.demogr.mpg.de/Papers/Books/Monograph1/sexratio.htm

This is a particularly interesting article.

The highest levels of excess male mortality in old age are now found in Northwestern Europe and Australia as shown in Table 15

http//www.demogr.mpg.de/Papers/Books/Monograph1/table15.htm

sarah2505

Sex ratio and sex differential of mortality

The greater longevity of the human female is most clearly manifest in the life of the elderly and translates virtually without exception into a sex ratio of mortality (male rate per female rate) higher than unity. With increasing age, however, this ratio likewise almost universally -declines and this has often led to the mistaken conclusion that at high ages death rates for the two sexes tend to converge and may eventually intersect.

Actually, the declining ratio is nothing more than an inevitable result of arithmetic at young ages the ratio may reach, and often does, values of 2 or 3 but such ratios become increasingly unlikely and finally impossible as mortality reaches higher levels in old age. If, instead of the ratio, we look at the differential of the rates, the picture changes completely instead of converging, the rates maintain their distance.

These two structural features of old age mortality - sex ratio declining but sex differential fairly constant with advancing age - have persisted through the recent momentous development which has been much more beneficial to women than men.

An examination of the sex ratio based on age-standardized death rates at ages 80-99 in the 28 countries with acceptable data (Annex Table 10) confirms, first of all, that the males are subject to considerably higher mortality than the females and that this difference has lately been increasing. The male excess mortality which at these ages in 1960-64 varied between countries from 10 to 33 percent, had by 1985-89 grown to an excess of 24 to 48 percent while the mean had grown from 20 to 36 percent.

The highest levels of excess male mortality in old age are now found in Northwestern Europe and Australia as shown in Table 15 and the lowest generally in Eastern and Central Europe. The very low ratio for Spain is probably due to age overstatement by males whose death rate therefore has a downward bias.

The increase in the sex ratio during this last quarter century, also shown in Table 15, has been remarkably sharp in the Low Countries and Scandinavia where improvement in the mortality of old men has been slight. Although this has not been the case in Switzerland and Finland, the gains were in these countries much larger for women. At the other extreme, the sex ratio has increased only moderately in the former East bloc. The apparent decline in Spain is most likely an artifact. The development is illustrated by age group in Figure 9 which is composed of only the most reliable data. In it an aggregate of eleven Western European countries is compared with a group of three Eastern European countries and with Japan. The actual ratios are given in Annex Table 11.

In both European groups the decline of the sex ratio of mortality with advancing age was very moderate in the 1950s, after which the gradually increasing female advantage has translated into ever steeper slopes as the upper end of the life span has not kept pace with the rapid changes among octogenarians. In Japan the slope was very straight and stable for three decades and approached the European pattern only in the 1980s when it also confirmed the existence of a mortality difference between male and female centenarians.

When, instead of sex ratio, we look at the sex differential in Figure 10, we note its nearly constant size by age. In the European curves there is a tendency for a slow increase of the differential over age which belies the assumption of convergence. As the female advantage has grown over time, the curves have been moving to higher levels while roughly maintaining their slowly ascending form.

sarah2505

Some things never change, sigh...

http//news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7123753.stm

UK Indian women 'aborting girls'
Indian girls in at slum in Bangalore
Female infanticide is highest in some of India's wealthiest districts
A study suggests Indian women in the UK are aborting unborn daughters so they can have more boys, the BBC's Asian Network has learned.

The Oxford University study suggests 1,500 girls are "missing" from the birth statistics in England and Wales from 1990 to 2005.

It shows the proportion of boys compared with girls born to Indian-born mothers has increased since the 1970s.

Dr Sylvie Dubuc said this could be due to "sex selective abortion".

See sex-ratio of births to Indian born women

Dr Dubuc, who studied birth rates of different ethnic groups in England and Wales, found that in the 1970s 103 boys were born for every 100 girls.

Between 2000 and 2005, the proportion of boys over girls had increased abnormally to 114 boys for every 100 girls, she said.

Unfortunately it was another girl - my husband and I thought the burden would probably be too much
Unnamed British woman

Britain's unwanted girls

Figures showed 26,662 babies were born to Indian-born women in England and Wales from 1990 to 2005, excluding the first or second child.

"According to my calculation around 1,500 girls are missing... it's significant compared to the total number of births," Dr Dubuc said.

She said the most probable explanation seemed to be sex selective abortion by a minority of mothers born in India.

Reconstruction 'Meena' is an actress
Reconstruction 'Meena' went to India to abort her daughter

Full interview

One British woman, who spoke to the BBC anonymously, said she had an abortion after a doctor in India found she was to have a fourth daughter.

"Unfortunately it was another girl. My husband and I thought the burden would probably be too much and the pressure when I got back home. So we decided to terminate," she said.

In Indian culture, the preference for boys over girls is well known.

Getting rid of baby girls is a practice that is so widespread in some parts of India that it has skewed dramatically the ratio of males to females.

Female foeticide, as it is known, has been illegal in India since the early 1980s.

It is also illegal to offer scans to find out the sex of a baby - but the law is regularly flouted.

Undercover filming

To see how difficult it is to find a doctor willing to carry out the service, the BBC sent a British couple to one of Delhi's top gynaecologists, Dr Mangala Telang - a doctor recommended by the British High Commission.

Dr Telang, an IVF treatment specialist, has practised in some of Delhi's top hospitals and has actually campaigned against female foeticide calling it an "evil" crime.

The BBC had heard that her clinic would offer ultrasound scans to determine the sex of a baby - even though a sign in the waiting room clearly said it was illegal.

FACTS AND FIGURES
Female infanticide occurs in 80% of Indian states
Worst-affected states include wealthiest areas
927 girls born for every 1,000 boys
Infant mortality rate 60/1,000
Source Unicef

Secret filming shows that within minutes Dr Telang agreed to perform the scan. She warns the couple not to tell anyone about what they were doing as it is illegal.

The couple also ask whether, if the unborn child is a girl and they decide to abort the baby, she could recommend someone to carry out a termination.

Dr Telang says "Yes, I can recommend someone."

In the ultrasound room, another doctor tells the couple the "good" news that it is a boy. Both doctors had broken several laws.

When the BBC told the doctors about the evidence, they denied doing anything wrong.

Dr Telang said she was not in the room when the scan was carried out. But she is clearly seen in the room congratulating the couple.

Cultural pressures

An estimated seven million girls have gone missing from India's population over the last 25 years.

Some of them will have been killed after they were born, or allowed to die within their first few days. But most of them will have been aborted.

Selective abortion is happening all over India as ultrasound machines - which carry out the scan - have become cheaper, but it has always been worst in Punjab and Gujarat.

It is impossible to say how many British women are travelling to India for terminations.

But the UK has a substantial community with strong links to, and often the same pressures as, families in India.

Fawzia

http//books.google.com/books?id=XRudk_NcA7cC&pg=PA24&lpg=PA24&dq=sex+ratio+in+Europe%3F&source=bl&ots=ybeyiITTbD&sig=H1hnn9uv5FS9zLOH0GoUPh2RvTU&hl=en&ei=Zzb1Srn7Loyf8AaRpoT0CQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9&ved=0CCsQ6AEwCA#v=onepage&q=sex%20ratio%20in%20Europe%3F&f=false

a sex ratio of 1.2-1.3 in Europe in the Middle Ages?

Do you have reading & learning difficulty Sarah?

Still having trouble reading?

Didn't I mention maternal mortality reducing numbers of women?

The book portion mentions that there were more men but fails to pin the causal factor.

It mentions that there were more men because in the crucial years of teens & twenties, women died in large numbers in childbirth.

That would ostensibly happen in Muhammad's time as well, so with women dying in childbirth, if the Muslim claim was true, then there surely Muhammad couldn't be polygamous with his daughter in law or with little Ayesha! ;D

Mazhar

http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9597268.msg181548#msg181548
First
The Quran , in the original Arabic text, does NOT use the word "female" . There is no "female" anywhere in the text of verse 4127.

Here is the text in Arabic

The word . (Nisa'a). This word means "WOMEN", not "females". For your info, the Arabic word for "female" is . "Untha".

The opposite of "untha" is "zhakar"

Hence

"untah" = female
"zhakar" = male.

While

"nisa'a" = women
"rijal" = men

Now you will ask of course So what? What is the diference between "untha" and "nisa'a"? Are they not synonymous?

NO, they are NOT synonymous. Anyone who claims they are synonymous is

1- Ignorant in Arabic.
2- Unaware of the Quran's precision
3- Corrupting the message.

Even in English, FEMALE and WOMAN are not necessarily the same. To rephrase that Every woman is a female. But not every female is a woman. , age of marriage according to Qur'aan, ]

A female could be a dog, sheep, horse, plant, or a three-year old child.
A woman is a grown adult human, passed the age of orphanage

If you can't see this difference, and stubbornly insist on ignoring it, then stop reading further. God is precise in using His words. Your scholars are apparently incapable of grasping this accuracy.

http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/004.%20An%20Nisa/temp%2014%20%204.127c.gif
And they seek confirmation/strengthened verdict about women from you, the Messenger;
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/004.%20An%20Nisa/temp%2014%20%204.127d.gif
You tell them; " Allah gives you the verdict regarding their matter, i.e. what is being narrated to you word by word from the Book,
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/004.%20An%20Nisa/temp%2014%20%204.127e.gif
about orphan lonely women whom you do not give what is written for them and you desire that you may take them into Nikah ;

http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/004.%20An%20Nisa/004.%20An%20Nisa%2002.htm

sarah2505

http//mobile.france24.com/en/20080423-diet-influence-child-sex-britain-maternity-health

This is just plain weird.

Oysters may excite the libido, but there is nothing like a hearty breakfast laced with sugar to boost a woman's chances of conceiving a son, according to a study released Wednesday.

Likewise, a low-energy diet that skimps on calories, minerals and nutrients is more likely to yield a female of the human species, says the study, published in Proceedings of the Royal Society B Biological Sciences, Britain's de facto academy of sciences.

Fiona Mathews of the University of Exeter in Britain and colleagues wanted to find out if a woman's diet has an impact on the sex of her offspring.

So they asked 740 first-time mothers who did not know if their unborn foetuses were male or female to provide detailed records of eating habits before and after they became pregnant. The women were split into three groups according to the number calories they consumed per day around the time of conception.

Fifty-six percent of the women in the group with the highest energy intake had sons, compared to 45 percent in the least-well fed cohort.

Beside racking up a higher calorie count, the group who produced more males were also more likely to have eaten a wider range of nutrients, including potassium, calcium and vitamins C, E and B12.

The odds of an XY, or male outcome to a pregnancy also went up sharply "for women who consumed at least one bowl of breakfast cereal daily compared with those who ate less than or equal to one bowl of week," the study reported.

These surprising findings are consistent with a very gradual shift in favor of girls over the last four decades in the sex ratio of newborns, according to the researchers.

Previous research has shown -- despite the rising epidemic in obesity -- a reduction in the average energy uptake in advanced economies. The number of adults who skip breakfast has also increased substantially.

"This research may help to explain why in developed countries, where many young women choose low calorie diets, the proportion of boys is falling," Mathews said.

The study's findings, she added, could point to a "natural mechanism" for gender selection.

The link between a rich diet and male children may have an evolutionary explanation.

For most species, the number of offspring a male can father exceeds the number a female can give birth to. But only if conditions are favorable -- poor quality male specimens may fail to breed at all, whereas females reproduce more consistently.

"If a mother has plentiful resources, then it can make sense to invest in producing a son because he is likely to produce more grandchildren than would a daughter," thus contributing to the survival of the species, explains Mathews.

"However, in leaner times having a daughter is a safer bet."

While the mechanism is not yet understood, it is known from in vitro fertilisation research that higher levels of glucose, or sugar, encourage the growth and development of male embryos while inhibiting female embryos.

Fawzia

.....

Excellent Sarah! bravo bravo bravo

Thanks for showing your true colors!

I was accused of racism or South Asian bashing if I dared mention Bangladesh or Pakistan, however, you freely mention India!

Isn't that the biggest chunk of South Asia?

So "South Asian bashing" is to be avoided if it hurts Muslim sentiments right?

Or its allright?

I face the same when I dare speak agaainst Palestinians, it becomes Muslim bashing, however then the Muslim person follows with Jew bashing! ;D

Will criticizing India make your Bangladesh perfect?

Nope, so why not learn from Sri Lanka?

AND why migrate in millions from Bangladesh to India, if its so bad? ???

I would've bashed Hindus had I been born that, as it happens, I'm not.

Fawzia

Sex ratio and sex differential of mortality