Grammatical Arabic Question about 11:114
-
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/011.%20Hud%20alaihissalm/11.114.gif
And you the Messenger organize/make people stand for As'salat at the two ends of the day and at the approach of the night .The first underlined word is dual, in accusative state.
The alif on the other is accusative nunation, it is not added if the last consonant is feminine marker Ta marbuta or hamza .
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/011.%20Hud%20alaihissalm/011.J%20Hud%20alaihissalam.htm
-
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/011.%20Hud%20alaihissalm/11.114.gif
And you the Messenger organize/make people stand for As'salat at the two ends of the day and at the approach of the night .The first underlined word is dual, in accusative state.
The alif on the other is accusative nunation, it is not added if the last consonant is feminine marker Ta marbuta or hamza .
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/011.%20Hud%20alaihissalm/011.J%20Hud%20alaihissalam.htm
Thanks Mazhar,
but what about
is it a plural or a dual?regards
-
herbman,
thanks for drawing attention. Qur'aan is too specific and precise. Night starts from sun set but it darkens progressively and these are moments. So the word "approach" used by me for translating zulfan is perhaps not correct or does not convey the complete perception including its Root's perception. I have tried it like this
And you the Messenger organize/make people stand for As'salat at the two ends of the day and in moments from the progressively approaching night .
-
herbman,
thanks for drawing attention. Qur'aan is too specific and precise. Night starts from sun set but it darkens progressively and these are moments. So the word "approach" used by me for translating zulfan is perhaps not correct or does not convey the complete perception including its Root's perception. I have tried it like this
And you the Messenger organize/make people stand for As'salat at the two ends of the day and in moments from the progressively approaching night .
Salam,
first comment things underlined are not in the original text I don't understand why you add them.
secondly
I am calling your arabic knowledge, these moments close to the night can only be 2, one after sunset and one before sunrise, so my question why a plural for zulafan and not a dual??? -
And you the Messenger organize/make people stand for As'salat at the two ends of the day and in moments from the progressively approaching night .
Salam,
first comment things underlined are not in the original text I don't understand why you add them.
Someone/one male human being is being addressed, he is the Messenger . So it need to be reflected in the translation. Second and third, two ends/time locations of the day, the first having been mentioned as Salat at Fajr whereafter the day begins and in progression the day keeps revolving.
-
I understand it (11114) diffrently than you
"You shall observe the Salat at the 2 extremities of the day, and (moments) near from the night (zulufann min al-layl)."
so you have parts in red are zulufan mina layl
the night----------extremity of the day------------day---------------extremity of the day--------------night
Peace
-
Salam,
first comment things underlined are not in the original text I don't understand why you add them.
secondly
I am calling your arabic knowledge, these moments close to the night can only be 2, one after sunset and one before sunrise, so my question why a plural for zulafan and not a dual???-
It is singular, meaning that the messenger is being adressed.
-
I understand it as "You shall uphold the bond at the two ends of daylight, that is, during the times close to/adjacent parts of the night. . . " (11114)
Traditional translators and commentators consider the last clause "zulfan minal layl" of this verse as a seperate prayer indicating to the "night" prayer. However, we consider that clause not as an addition but as an explanation of the previous ambigious clause; it explains the temporal direction of the ends of the day. The limits of "Nahar" (daylight) is marked by two distinct points sunrise and sunset. In other words, two prayers should be observed not just after sunrise and before senset, but before sunrise and after sunset.
Furthermore, the traditional understanding runs into the problem of contradicting the practice of the very tradition it intend to promote. Traditionally, both morning and evening prayers are observed in a time period that Quranically is considered "LaYL" (night) since Layl starts from sunset and ends at sunrise. The word "Layl" in Arabic is more comprehensive than the word "night" used in English.If the expression "tarafayin nahar" (both ends of the day) refers to morning and evening paryers which are part of "Layl" (night), then, the last clause cannot be describing another prayer time.
The plural usage is not abnormal. In the quran/reading there is another/other place/places where a plural is used to describe a dual. I can't find it now, though.
-
-
You shall observe the Salat at the 2 extremities of the day, and (moments) near from the night (zulufann min al-layl)."
For a circular/revolving thing there are no extremities. The day and night are reflective of relationship of different objects and their location in relation to each other, all revolving simultaneously.
-
Do you mean this command is addressed only to the prophete?
If I read "You shall observe..." I understand it as I shall observe....
peace
1773 They nearly diverted you (the messenger) from what We inspired to you so that you would fabricate something different against Us, and then they would have taken you as a friend!
1774 If We had not made you (the messenger) stand firm, you were about to lean towards them a little bit.
1775 Then, We would have made you (the messenger) taste double the retribution in this life and double the retribution in death. Then you would not find for yourself any helper against Us.
1776 They nearly enticed you (the messenger) to drive you (the messenger) out of the land. But in that case, they would have shortly been destroyed after you (the messenger) were gone.
1777 This is the way of those whom We sent before you (the messenger) of Our messengers. You (the messenger) will not find any change in Our way.
1778 You (the messenger) shall uphold the bond at the setting of the sun, until the darkness of the night; and the dawn reading. Certainly, the dawn reading is being witnessed.
Same goes for 11114
11114 You (singular - the messenger) shall uphold the bond at both ends of daylight at the times close to night. The good deeds take away the bad. This is a reminder for those who remember.
11120 All the news of the messengers that we relate to you (same you as in 11114) is to strengthen your mind. In this has come to you the truth and a lesson and a reminder for those who acknowledge.
11121 Say (singular - the messenger) to those who do not acknowledge "Continue to do what you will, we will also do.
Note how the messenger is ordered to say something to those who acknowledge (mumins).
-
The context for 11114 is 11111, the singular reader.
Salam Jack,
Thanks, I agree with you.
Salam Mazhar,
How can there be "end" for a perpetually revolving thing unless it is interrupted by another force to end its movement?
A day has a begining and an end, don't you agree with this simple fact?
-
How can there be "end" for a perpetually revolving thing unless it is interrupted by another force to end its movement?
A day has a begining and an end, don't you agree with this simple fact?
Day
Beginning End---------------------------------Ending end.Is this two ends of the day---simple fact as you call it?
Then what is this fact
Many/more than two ends of the day.
-
Day
Beginning End---------------------------------Ending end.Is this two ends of the day---simple fact as you call it?
Then what is this fact
Many/more than two ends of the day.
Salam,
from PRO
= Tay-Ra-Fa = attack the extremity of the enemy's lines, chose a thing, extremity, edge, lateral/adjacent/outward part, side, border, end, newly acquired, proximity, fringes.
leaders/thinkers/scholars, best of the fruits.
Look from outer angle of eye, twinkle in eye, putting eyelids in motion, looking, glance, blinking, raise/open eyes, hurt the eye and make it water.
descend from an ancient family, noble man in respect of ancestry.tarafa vb. (1) n.vb. 1443, 2740, 3748, 3852, 4245, 5556
taraf. n.m. (pl. atraf) 3127, 11114, 1341, 20130, 2144
Lane's Lexicon, Volume 5, pages 126, 127, 128, 129, 130, 131
As you see Ta-Ra-Fa means extremity, edge NOT end.
regards
-
Good advances.
Edge has also broad, generalized meanings. With reference to day, revolving thing, perhaps "brinks" may be more appropriate since it has relativity with a marked change or event. Another problem is that edge is generally not perceived for the point of beginning.