If Allah wants things to be easy for us, why so much confusion about salat?
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I recommend googling how a compass works.
Thanks Wakas, I am pretty sure how a REGULAR Compass works.
however, I am not sure how a Mecca Compass Works.
Because I suppose according to Most Free-minders....It is IMPOSSIBLE to Navigate your body towards the Direction of Mecca (or any place for that matter).
Apparently, It is Physically IMPOSSIBLE to turn towards Mecca.So, I am a bit confused. If I was sailing on a Boat in the Atlantic Ocean, I wonder if I could Sail towards Mecca with my Ipod MeccaLocator App.
If So, Then I suppose We can then say I can also Pray Towards Mecca using my MeccaLocator App.Correct or Incorrect?
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It depends on what you mean. Technically, you will be facing or turning towards a random point in space, however if you were to travel in that direction on the surface of the spherical earth then eventually you'd reach Mecca, assuming you had accurate info, e.g. in the USA if one were even a degree off, then they can end up miles off Mecca, let alone the black cuboid.
Basically, even in practice we can glimpse the real reason behind facing a certain direction, because since it is near impossible to be exactly facing the black cuboid (unless one is very close to it) thus 99% of people will be off, so if exact physical direction was important, why is it so difficult to actually do? Thus, the point more likely lies in terms of unity/purpose/goal, not physicality. Of course, this is not even mentioning the problem of AQ itself putting a huge dent in this practice to begin with.
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I am not sure how its calculated.. but i think it should be the direction with the shortest distance between any place and the Mecca.
suppose if we are in the direct opposite point of Mecca, which will be somewhere around the pacific, any direction will point to Mecca, all with the same distance so we can pray in any direction we wish.but
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Bismillaah
Assalaamo alaykom all!I am new to this forum, but have been reading here regularly for months now, and this is my first post here.
Somehow I can understand TS confusion about the whole salah-issue here. Obviously salah is one of the important aspects in our deen, and none of us who read al-Quran denies that of course. The confusion sets in when everyone seems to have different ideas of what it means. Pray 2, 3, 4 or 5 times a day. Some even say there is no ritual/physical prayer at all. To each their own.
And it is this confusion that is causing me distress in my faith. Because I find myself unable to perform any salah. When I believed that there was one fixed way of doing it, I had no problems focusing and connecting in earnest with God. But now I'm unconvinced that my method is correct, and this inner dilemma is hindering me from performing prayer with the purity that I had before...
At the moment I am in a phase where I am not doing ritualistic prayer 3 times a day regularly. I feel confused in understanding what i am suppose to do in a prayer. I have tried to to do 2 sujood while saying some quranic verses but then the next day I become lazy due to confusion about timings and if Salah is also studying the quraan and "thanking" Allah and doing good deeds etc.
If you feel comfortable in praying the ?traditional way?, then why don?t you do that? Is there anything in al-Qur?aan that says you can?t pray that way? The only thing I can think of that might be akward ? some of you would probably say it?s completely wrong and shirk ? is some parts of the tashahud. But if that?s so, you can be quiet in that part, or praise God, ot make any du?aa you like.
I don?t understand what?s the big deal with praying the ?traditional way? if you belive salah = physical prayer. Well even if you think salah is something else, what?s wrong woth physical prayer as well? Is it so important to be different from ?the traditionalists? so we feel we must make up our own rituals when a person might feel comfortable with their way of praying? If you don?t feel comfortable with it, that that?s another question.
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Salam Waqia,
you wrote about a Two very important issues
1- what's Wrong with traditional Salat ??? ( if real salat had to be physical, of course)
2 - is it so important to be " COMPLETLY " different from the traditionalists ??
i am sailing across this forum quite long ago, and still confused '(
Peace,
P.S Welcome to the forum welcome
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Salam, all,
My way to perform SALAT is by reciting/reading the Great Reading.
What is the diffrence between my way and the "ritual prayer"
In the ritual prayer
- you start with Iqama--> non quranic
- when bowing or standing you pronounce the takbir--> non quranic
- at the end of fatiha you pronounce Amin--> non quranic
- during the ritual prayer you recite Quran--> this is quranic
Remember Allah gave words to Adam, The Great Reading are the Allah's words!
In my way all are quranic facts
- I start with "I seek protection in God against Satan the banished" before reciting the Great Reading as per 1698
- I start reading the Fatiha, the often repeated verses as per 1587
- then I start reading a chapter or more depending on the lenght, salat lenght is based on the following
Salat's duration is given in 1778 and 2187, this duration can vary depending on your geographical location, more you go to the north longer it is, in equator it is about 20 min.
For Nafila can be 1/3, 1/2, 2/3 of the night or what you can of it. - when making an "invocation/prayer" I finnish by "al hamdullilahi rabbi al alameen as per 1010
So what is common in the 2 ways --> reciting the Great Reading is the common denominator!
What does bowing, prostrating etc bring to the Salat?Peace
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For those who Say That the Physical Traditional Salat/Prostration Ritual is Purely Physical and Mechanical, and therefore Meaningless.....
Would it be Incorrect for me to Bring up Sex as a Proper Analogy?
Is Sex just a Physical Ritual in which two people just Mechanically/Physically do repetitive Motions that mean absolutely Nothing In regards to Mentally, Emotionally and Spiritually?
For those of you who have had sex, is it Just Purely Physical? No emotions, No Mental Aspects, or Spiritual involvement?
If so I believe that would be very bland and not doing any justice. )
There is a Common Goal in Sex and a Mindset. The Person and Goal is constantly in your mind as you go through the Physical Motions. Chemicals Endorphins get released often intensifying the feeling of Passion and even Spirituality when Making love.
This is well documented as many feel that their "Souls Literally were in-tuned and vibrating together". There is much Energy in Making Love and From Observing the Dark Religions, It seems there is much Spirituality. This could be a Possible reason why Sex on Menstruation and Anal sex is forbidden. Not only for the Obvious Physical Medical hazards but for the Spiritual Repercussions that may arise from this.
Menstrual blood contains Dead Blood cells and Dead Eggs while Seaman contains rich/pure/living cells (sperm). Both Seaman, Menstrual blood, Urine, and fecal matter are often all used in the Dark Rituals such as Witchcraft for various reasons.
Now I know that these Dark Rituals are Non-Quranic and therefor categorized as Hearsay, But, it could very well be another reason why Menstrual Sex and Anal Sex is forbidden, along with Eating The Flesh of the Pig, (which also is refrained in Spiritual Religions due to its Spiritual Properties and Vibration levels).
So, The Point I am trying to make is This I think Obviously Sex is more than just a Physical Ritual, in the same way I think Prostration/Traditional-Salaat is more than just meaningless Physical gestures. I assume there is more to this then what the Eyes can see.
I am Not here to Refute Whether or not Ayman and Wakas is right or if THS is right. I am rather holding the belief that You should do what you feel is right and correct based on personal Experience and Interpretation of Quran.
The only thing I wish to Accomplish by this Post is to Reply to those who feel hole heartedly that Prostration/Traditional Salaat is purely Physical and therefore contains NO VALUE what so ever. I dont think this assertion is fair. Actually, I wouldn't say Anything is Purely Physical as all things contain various aspects to them.
Perhaps it is just the vale that the individual places towards it that makes it an efficient method.I cant speak for everyone, as we all have different methods, but for me...I personally feel the Symbolic Physical Prostration is the most efficient for me in achieving my goals of "Awareness, Shedding of the Ego, and Remembrance/Appreciation-gratitude/Adoration."
For you is yours and for me is mine, you will be questioned on yours and for me Mine.
Peace/Salaam
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Salam Waqia,
you wrote about a Two very important issues
1- what's Wrong with traditional Salat ??? ( if real salat had to be physical, of course)
2 - is it so important to be " COMPLETLY " different from the traditionalists ??
i am sailing across this forum quite long ago, and still confused '(
Peace,
P.S Welcome to the forum welcome
Bismillaah,
Thank you for the welcoming!
Would you mind sharing your thoughts about these things?
Assalaamo alaykom
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salam,
i pretty much agree with Brother Herbman's View of the subject. in fact, up to now, his understanding meets mine, but still there are some points to discuss ie. does "sujud" literally means prostration ? does "ruku3" literally means bowing ?
i'll never stop searching until i am very satisfied with what i'd find .
Salam ... -
salam,
i pretty much agree with Brother Herbman's View of the subject. in fact, up to now, his understanding meets mine, but still there are some points to discuss ie. does "sujud" literally means prostration ? does "ruku3" literally means bowing ?
i'll never stop searching until i am very satisfied with what i'd find .
Salam ...Salam,
for the sujud, please read
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598240.0 and try the search engine, you will inchallah make your own conclusion on the subject.for "ruku3", I would like to ask you your thought, in arabic "ruku3" would mean "kneeling" and not "bowing" if I am not wrong?
Peace
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I want to pray salat as prescribed. And I usually succeed. But in my line of work, healthcare, I need to be mobile all the time. I cannot perform wudu as prescribed. Within this setting, it is inappropriate to stick my feet, one at a time, into a bathroom sink!
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I want to pray salat as prescribed. And I usually succeed. But in my line of work, healthcare, I need to be mobile all the time. I cannot perform wudu as prescribed. Within this setting, it is inappropriate to stick my feet, one at a time, into a bathroom sink!
Salaam brother Thomas,
I agree. It sure is inappropriate to stick your feet in a sink in which everyone else uses. They even may look at it as a health hazard and offensive on your part.
In this kind of situations you don?t have to wash your feet; just RUB/wipe your wet hands over them (right foot with your right hand, left foot with your left hand) up to your ankles. You don?t even have to take your socks off if you are wearing one.
Remember, GOD, is KIND and MERCIFUL. He informs us all over the Qur?aan that He wants easiness for us, not hardship, especially when we encounter abnormality regarding our environment.
Peace,
Khalil -
Khalil, thank you for your feedback. May God's peace be upon you. O0
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Dear Thomas,
please see 56 for detailed explanation of how to perform ablution/WUDZOO. The very important point in the verse is that GOD does NOT tell us to WASH our feet in a direct and STRAIGHTFORWARD wording. I personally take it as if GOD Almighty indirectly is telling us that we are allowed to RUB/WIPE our feet just like our head when it comes to situations like the one you are in.
Peace,
Khalil -
A thought just came to me.. dunno if it totally relates but anyway.. I noticed other than arabs, people use the term "namaz" in relation to the ritual salat. I know turks do it, i know paki's/bangla's/iranians not sure about others..
could there be a significant difference? like where did the term namaz originate. Why call it namaz if it's salat? you don't hear people giving ramadan a diff name for example?
just a thought.
BTW lots of people get confused and then this confusion leads them to inertia i.e. a state of being not bothered into anything, a slum state of frustration pretty much. it's so easy to be spoon fed! but will it give you certainty? it certainly didnt for me as a sunni, doesn't remove the frustration of wanting to know, probably just puts it in the back of the thoughts.. spoon feeding left me with "But why" so i guess active research is important, and yes time consuming which will be annoying! but will be well worth it in the end. being certain from yourself is the greatest feeling ever
salam
Here in Kosovo its also called Namaz, but they're all sunni, they take some kind of carpet written Allah on it or a scarf then they say something in Arabic, most likely praising Allah.
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peace, dont worry bout inertia.
there is no confusion about salat at all, the problem is we all have too much information in out head. problem is, if you're going to open the quran with preconcieved notions of what salat is, then you will defenitly gt confused.
you have to erase everything from your mind and forget the traditional way of prayer that you know, when u do this then the information that the quran tells you about salat will be more than sufficient. as far as i kno standing bowing and prostrating must be perfomed during salat, the glorification of god and the reciting of the quran is required as a part of it. think of salat a more of a christian prayer. more personal if u know what i mean -
Dear Thomas,
please see 56 for detailed explanation of how to perform ablution/WUDZOO. The very important point in the verse is that GOD does NOT tell us to WASH our feet in a direct and STRAIGHTFORWARD wording. I personally take it as if GOD Almighty indirectly is telling us that we are allowed to RUB/WIPE our feet just like our head when it comes to situations like the one you are in.
Peace,
KhalilWhere is the Quran does it tell us to wipe our right foot with our right hand? Also You were very correct in your second sentence above, but why do you then go on to somehow imply that we are allowed to wipe our feet when it comes to certain situations? Allah told us ONLY to wipe our feet. We were never told to wash them thoroughly for wudu and to wipe when washing is inappropriate. God makes things easy for us, but we still insist on making up little rules based on nothing real. Wiping over socks seems odd though, but there is no detail otherwise, but it just seems odd. I just stopped wearing socks all together so wudu will be easy, but i really only need to do it once generally at work, and the rest of the time I'm at home without shoes on anyway.
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i thought we have to wash our feet??
something to do with the suffix used in arabic which links the two verbs in the verses even if they are seperated by another verse. i read it ages ago on submission.ws and i confirmed it with the arabic quran i have. seemed quite logical. it had something to do with the linguistics of arabic or something. the laws of language -
Selam
Here is something from a book called 'mental bondage' on the subject
What about 56 where you are supposed to do the ritual ablution (which they call wudu) before Sol-laa? Surely, that proves that ritual prayer is needed.
Surah 5 is to be read from 1 through to 7. Verse 6 is about being hygienic. The first two verses talk about food. People should observe the harmony sanctioned by God in the system. Verse 3 has more details on food, and then it says, ?Today the way of life (or the deen) is perfected? after detailing unhygienic food. The fourth and the fifth verses also talk about food with additional decrees that Muslims can marry the people of the previous Scripture. That in itself should be an eye-opener.
The subsequent verse says that we are upholding our commitments when we make ourselves clean. In verse 7 we are told to be appreciative of God?s blessing upon us and we should uphold the covenants He made with us from the time we say, ?We hear and we obey?.
Hygiene is part of our commitments. And if there is no water to wash ourselves, God has prescribed an alternative i.e. to use clean dry soil to clean our hands. The point is, we are obliged to be as clean as we can ? and here the limits are described with provision for extreme circumstances.
There is no such thing as the word ritual cleansing or wudu (this common term used by the majority of the Muslims is not to be found anywhere in the Reading). There is no ritual ablution. In 56 we are told it is good to wash ourselves up to the elbows, wash the face, and wipe our heads and feet. We must keep ourselves clean. This verse does not say that Sol-laa is a ritual prayer. The verse does not say after we ?ritually? clean up ourselves we must start praying ritually.I am not too sure on the clean soil bit however. Somehow it does not fit, I could not see how we can clean ourselves with clean soil. No matter how clean this soil is its still soil. I guess further research is needed here and I think the soil issue is the key.
May Allah guide us to the truth.
Peace
