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  4. Is Surah 111 actually a part of the Quran?

Is Surah 111 actually a part of the Quran?

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Questions/Comments on the Quran
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  • thsT Offline
    thsT Offline
    ths
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    Salaam all, excuse the overly dramatic title.

    I've been reading Rosalind Ward Gwynne's "Logic, Rhetoric, and Legal Reasoning in the Quran".
    In it there is an interesting passage regarding Surah 111

    Hubert Grimme chose sura 111 , according to Watt and Bell, on the basis of "doctrinal characteristics."
    The sura is a curse upon "Abu Lahab," usually identified as an uncle of the Prophet, and upon his wife. A curse may be construed as a command or request to a superior power, but here that power is not identified, nor its relation to the one uttering the curse, nor the transgression that has earned the curse.
    Aside from the (presumably later) basmala, God is not mentioned at all. The only thing vaguely doctrinal about the sura is the wish in verse 2 that Abu Lahab's wealth not profit him in the face of the curse, an implication that earthly wealth is not a sign of virtue. By this theory, the virtual absence of doctrine makes sura 111 the most "primitive" sura, beyond which others could only "evolve."
    Such a curse coming unheralded into his consciousness might well have fueled Muhammad's reported fears that he was insane or afflicted by jinn. On the basis of content alone, however, and in the absence of precedent, context, or any other frame of reference, it is difficult to see how Sura 111 could have been construed as a revelation from God.

    Once the power, authority, and authenticity of the Source of revelation have been established, all subsequent commands from that Source, however laconic, are logically valid. "O you who believe, fulfill your obligations" (Q 51). But even so, there are very few imperatives without either implicit contextual justification or explicit textual justification. It would seem that God does not order his creatures to do something in a way that ignores their desire to know why the must do it. Only occasionally is there an anomalous command whose relation to Divine Power is not clear without exegesis.

    This surah has always bothered me slightly for several of the reasons mentioned in this passage.
    I asked myself,
    Why does God take the time to curse a random person known as Abu Lahab?
    Why would God print such a curse in a book intended to be for all ages and for all people?
    What is the purpose of this curse after the death of Abu Lahab?

    To my mind, the problem may stem from the fact that we are accepting that Abu Lahab was the uncle of the Prophet. We accept this because of hadiths that state so.
    So if we dismiss the hadiths are unnecessary, then who is this person Abu Lahab?

    And if we accept that Abu Lahab is the uncle of the Prophet, then we are also accepting extra-Quranic sources for knowledge, which is a problem for the people on this site who have declared hadiths to be unnecessary for the investigation of the Quran. After all, why would a timeless book for all people take the time to curse one person and his wife that have nothing to do with any of our lives, and then require us to search for their identity outside of the Quran??

    Thus I posit that Abu Lahab was not the uncle of the Prophet, but some other figure.
    So who was he?
    And what is the point of this surah? What should we learn from it?

    My own interpretation

    Perish the hands of the Father of Flame! Perish he!
    No profit to him from all his wealth, and all his gains!
    Burnt soon will he be in a Fire of Blazing Flame!
    and his wife, the carrier of the firewood,
    upon her neck a rope of palm-fibre.

    From Project Quran List

    650 Lam-ha-Ba

    To blaze fiercely/intensely, inflame, burn with anger, Ardour of fire, flame, fiery tempered person, abu lahab - father of flame. A gap/space between two mountains, a cleft/fissure in a mountain. Nickname of the Holy Prophet's uncle, whose real name was Abdul Uzza.

    ]

    My only interpretation of Abu Lahab is that it must be a personality archetype.
    Abu Lahab sounds like "Father of the flame", or "Father of Hell," as hell is referred to as a "lahab" in 7731 and 1113

    Then we must notice the mention of the wife of Abu Lahab.

    Thus the only interpretation I can draw from this is that Abu Lahab is a sustainer of Hell, probably the father of sinful children. He focuses on wealth and power during his lifetime, neglecting his children, and neglecting his duty of fatherhood, thus becoming an accomplice and a cause of their eventual sins.

    The wife of this rich power-seeking man helps him not, and instead colludes with him in their lifestyle and poor parenting, and thus she is described as 'bringing the firewood' to the fire that burns them - ie. an accomplice also, hurting instead of helping.

    "upon her neck a rope of palm-fibre."

    The only thing this brings to mind is the connection between her "necklace" of tinder, and the necklaces she undoubtedly wears around her neck during her lifetime thanks to the riches of her husband. I see this verse as making it obvious that she is also responsible for not shirking the greedy lifestyle.

    Peace

    فَاسْتَبِقُوا الْخَيْرَاتِ
    So strive as in a race in all virtues! 5:48

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    • B Offline
      B Offline
      bkanwar2
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      Peace, please consider this linguistic base understanding for a change.

      Badar

      Surah 111 1

      They who separated from this instrument of advise (Qur'an), which is made manifest and evident; will suffer from diminution and be at a loss. Resulting in them living as if dead and perished, suffering an emotive thirst.

      Surah 111 2

      As long as one is away from manifest advise (Qur'an), which is supposed to fulfil ones needs. They shall not benefit from whatever they collect as wealth and property.

      Surah 111 3

      The ones who shall try to outwit, deceive and circumvent, the distinct essence that exists through eternity as an intense illumination, will cause themselves to suffer from emotive thirst.

      Surah 111 4

      As a result the comparison for them is as a land in which no herbage grows, even if it is rained upon. Or just like a person who carries the utmost burden of cut off, dried section of their grapevine, their burden is of no use except as dried fuel for the fire.

      Surah 111 5

      In this state of deception and separation they continue to suffer from a vehement thirst, affected by drowsiness and slumber to the point of death and destruction. Instead of making a covenant to obtain a promise of security and safety, and holding on to it laboriously, and with energy.

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      • thsT Offline
        thsT Offline
        ths
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        Peace, please consider this linguistic base understanding for a change.

        What linguistic base? You've written your own translation that bears no resemblance to the arabic. Did you mean poetic?

        فَاسْتَبِقُوا الْخَيْرَاتِ
        So strive as in a race in all virtues! 5:48

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        • M Offline
          M Offline
          Mazhar
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          "upon her neck a rope of palm-fibre."

          She is "enjoying" the leniency in the Hell-Prison being a lady.

          she is in a state that a rope twisted from palm-fiber has been placed/necklace around her neck. .

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          • thsT Offline
            thsT Offline
            ths
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            Salaam Mazhar, nice observation.

            yet unlike men who will have iron yokes

            I've heard this before but can't remember if it was from hadiths or from the Quran...are there any verses that mention men wearing iron yokes?

            Also, the more I think about it the less I think that Abu Lahab and his wife are parents, although this is still a possibility. They are probably just your generic rich, power-hungry couple.

            فَاسْتَبِقُوا الْخَيْرَاتِ
            So strive as in a race in all virtues! 5:48

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            • J Offline
              J Offline
              Jack
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=13605.0
              http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=8487.0
              http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=7311.0

              http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?action=search

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              • thsT Offline
                thsT Offline
                ths
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                Ah, many thanks Jack

                I find the theory that his 'wife' is the same kind of partner as Adam's partner, and is a representation of his nafs, or subconscious to be interesting...but I'm not entirely satisfied with it.

                'Eve' (for lack of a better word) is called Adam's "zawjah", ie. spouse, wife, partner

                Abu Lahab's partner is called "'amra'ah", ie. woman, or wife. A quick look at other occurrences shows that Imra'ah is translated always as 'wife'.

                That is the first indicator.

                The second is the final verse, with the 'necklace' of tinder. I find that symbolic of the wealth this 'couple' share.

                Therefore I shall stick to my definition of a couple, but correct my previous definition of Abu Lahab as anyone who protects the deviance within himself.

                فَاسْتَبِقُوا الْخَيْرَاتِ
                So strive as in a race in all virtues! 5:48

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                • M Offline
                  M Offline
                  Mazhar
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  Salaam Mazhar, nice observation.

                  I've heard this before but can't remember if it was from hadiths or from the Quran...are there any verses that mention men wearing iron yokes?

                  Also, the more I think about it the less I think that Abu Lahab and his wife are parents, although this is still a possibility. They are probably just your generic rich, power-hungry couple.

                  Thanks. I prefer not to quote and be guilty of spreading conjectural material.
                  .
                  This information is in Grand Qur'aan.

                  http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/040.%20Ghaffir/40.71.gif
                  when the iron collars will be placed in their necks and tied in chains they will be dragged

                  The reason told to them reflects what status and position they people had in worldly life
                  http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/040.%20Ghaffir/40.75.gif
                  "This is because you people kept boisterously rejoicing in the Earth without any justifiable cause and fact,
                  http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/040.%20Ghaffir/40.75a.gif
                  and for that which you people kept behaving insolently.

                  Surat 40 Ghaffir

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