new article - Quranic terms defined

Mazhar

Quote
Allah sent blessings, help, approval, to him .

You mean sends? Because you previously said it is imperfect verb

Those are two different verbs, one is imperfect and the other singular is perfect. The perfect verb is the one which I use when quoting the Name of the Last Messenger and as other Muslims orally state.

san

Peace,

The above observation could not convey anything to me. To say it is neither a fact and nor a conjecture reflects empty frame of mind. One has to decide either way.

Why think black & white? I stand by what i said i think you are not lying, nor that you are trying to make a conjecture. And i also think, that what you have presented is of your opinion, not necessarily the fact. The only fact here is that that is/was/has been your opinion/exposition. Can one not see it? Or is this someone's mind already too "full" to see it? In that case, "emptying" it might be a good exercise for him.

Those are two different verbs, one is imperfect and the other singular is perfect. The perfect verb is the one which I use when quoting the Name of the Last Messenger and as other Muslims orally state.

Understood. So that expression is precisely a statement--or a predicate, as you said. It is not related to any act of "Sallu" by anyone who orally state it.

Mind to respond to the rest of my previous post? Thanks

From 3341-43, do you agree that Allah also yuSalli upon the believers? In other words, is it not true that Allah also "sends blessings, help, approval" to the believers"? Or do you have any other specific, different explanation for that verse?

And as reminder, you have not responded to this question

Or in other words, how do we "send blessings, help, approval" upon him (The Prophet/Nabi), according to your understanding? Or do you have any other specific, different explanation for this part of the verse?

Thanks & Peace

Mazhar

Understood. So that expression is precisely a statement--or a predicate, as you said. It is not related to any act of "Sallu" by anyone who orally state it.

A predicate is a statement about the subject. "Sallu" it is not "u" but "a". The subject of the verb is Allah, noun in nominative case.

san

A predicate is a statement about the subject. "Sallu" it is not "u" but "a". The subject of the verb is Allah, noun in nominative case.

thanks--corrected

So that expression is precisely a statement--or a predicate, as you said. It is not related to any act of "Salla" by any human person who orally states it.

So i have to requote myself, but no prob

From 3341-43, do you agree that Allah also yuSalli upon the believers? In other words, is it not true that Allah also "sends blessings, help, approval" to the believers"? Or do you have any other specific, different explanation for that verse?

And as reminder, you have not responded to this question

Or in other words, how do we "send blessings, help, approval" upon him (The Prophet/Nabi), according to your understanding? Or do you have any other specific, different explanation for this part of the verse?

Thanks & Peace

Mazhar

Quote from Mazhar on Today at 090108 PM

The above observation could not convey anything to me. To say it is neither a fact and nor a conjecture reflects empty frame of mind. One has to decide either way.

Why think black & white? I stand by what i said i think you are not lying, nor that you are trying to make a conjecture. And i also think, that what you have presented is of your opinion, not necessarily the fact. The only fact here is that that is/was/has been your opinion/exposition. Can one not see it? Or is this someone's mind already too "full" to see it? In that case, "emptying" it might be a good exercise for him.

It seems that without having given a single thought to what I said, you have put in a whole paragraph. What is an opinion? An opinion is about present and future. The sentence we are discussing is a statment narrating something about past. So either it is a fact or conjecture/hearsay/false/lie; you can't take it to the category of "opinion". Therefore decide either way.
An opinion expressed is based on some information a person has at a given point in time and that its authenticity is verified in the future when more knowledge/data/information comes into light.

Mazhar

So that expression is precisely a statement--or a predicate, as you said. It is not related to any act of "Salla" by any human person who orally states it.

Again read, the subject of perfect verb is Allah not any human person. Person is only stating it. What you understand by a "statement" and is it different from "predicate" of a sentence.

san

It seems that without having given a single thought to what I said, you have put in a whole paragraph. What is an opinion? An opinion is about present and future. The sentence we are discussing is a statment narrating something about past. So either it is a fact or conjecture/hearsay/false/lie; you can't take it to the category of "opinion". Therefore decide either way.
An opinion expressed is based on some information a person has at a given point in time and that its authenticity is verified in the future when more knowledge/data/information comes into light.

It seems that you have missed what i have referred to as your opinion, without having given a second thought to what i said. I have no objection to your translated English statement, i am sure that "Allah sends (not only that i think that Allah "has sent", but that Allah continues to send) His blessings, help, approval upon the Prophet". There is nothing wrong with that statement. Clear?

What i refer to as your opinion is the meaning of the word "yuSalluna", the meaning of "Salla" in "s.a.w.", according to you. That is your opinion, not necessarily the fact or the true meaning of the word.

And yes, opinion can also be about the past (ever heard of history?), especially when the fact is unknown to the observer. but let's not digress any further.

Again read, the subject of perfect verb is Allah not any human person. Person is only stating it. What you understand by a "statement" and is it different from "predicate" of a sentence.

Don't you get what i'm saying? I understood perfectly that in the "predicate" "s.a.w.", the subject is Allah. Not the human person. The person is only stating it.

Therefore, the human person who is stating "Sallallahu alaihi wasallam" is not doing anything related to "Salla" upon the Prophet. The stating of the predicate does not correlate to the actual doing of "Salla".

Is this still not clear enough?

Mazhar

Instead of doing that much of what we call in Urdu "chikh chikh", why dont you translate to disagree with what you call opinion; "That is your opinion, not necessarily the fact or the true meaning of the word".

san

Peace,

Instead of doing that much of what we call in Urdu "chikh chikh", why dont you translate to disagree with what you call opinion; "That is your opinion, not necessarily the fact or the true meaning of the word".

"chikh chikh" (whatever that means) or unable to respond? I requested you with a set of questions to help make me (and who knows other readers might as well) understand. And you managed to avoid some of the questions. You offered the translation "send blessing, help, approval"--despite of what i had argued about "meaning", you chose only four words to relate the word "yuSalluna" to.

OK, it's all right, if that's the best thing you can come up with, then i thank you for your effort. So i applied that translation to 3343, you did not comment on that. Then i also applied that translation to the rest of 3356--i found it not quite fitting How do we "send blessing, help, approval" upon the Prophet? You did not respond to this simple question.

Has it ever occurred to you that if the true meaning of "Salla" upon the Prophet includes, for example, to conduct a communication/a counseling with the Prophet, to learn some truth from the Prophet, to follow the examples of the Prophet, and because of the translation like the one you have given above, people think that stating the predicate "s.a.w" is enough as a substitute for "Salla", then this whole thing would be a case of "covering" the true meaning of a (very important) word in the Book of Allah?

Ayisha

As for the verses you quoted, my verbace wont do images, can you please type and tell me the verse so I can look it up, thanks

Please indicate the number like 203 first Surat Number and then Ayat No, I will, InshaAllah put the typed version of it. Please remember verbace will only give you matching translation of a word, not of the structure of the sentence, however an idea can emerge of thought contained therein.

If I knew the sura and verse number I wouldnt be asking you for it Mazhar and I could look it up myself. Its the image in your 3rd post from the bottom on page 4

Mazhar

Please indicate the number like 203 first Surat Number and then Ayat No, I will, InshaAllah put the typed version of it. Please remember verbace will only give you matching translation of a word, not of the structure of the sentence, however an idea can emerge of thought contained therein.

If I knew the sura and verse number I wouldnt be asking you for it Mazhar and I could look it up myself. Its the image in your 3rd post from the bottom on page 4

http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/033.%20Al%20Ahzaab/33.56.gif
It is certain that Allah and His Angels send blessings upon the Distinctly Elevated and Chosen One

Verb-Like Particle This is one of the six Particles called since in some features they resemble with verbs. They are sentential modifiers. What was earlier known as subject in a nominal sentence, because of its presence at the outset, that will now be called "-Noun of ", which is rendered in accusative case; and the predicate will be called its which will be in nominative case or state.

Allah Proper Noun-accusative.

Prefixed conjunction

Possessive Phrase Noun definite; plural; masculine; accusative + Possessive Pronoun Second person; singular; masculine; in genitive state.

Verb Imperfect; third person; masculine; plural + Subject pronoun in nominative case + Mood Indicative by ; Verbal noun -- Predicate of .

Prepositional phrase Separable preposition+ Noun Definite; singular; masculine; in genitive state; relating to verb.

It is 3356

Ayisha

It is certain that Allah and His Angels send blessings upon the Distinctly Elevated and Chosen One

How come Allah only says 'nabiy' as in 'prophet' yet you have chosen what I have made bold above? Do you use 'the Distinctly Elevated and Chosen One' each time 'prophet' is mentioned or just for Muhammed?

Mazhar

How come Allah only says 'nabiy' as in 'prophet' yet you have chosen what I have made bold above? Do you use 'the Distinctly Elevated and Chosen One' each time 'prophet' is mentioned or just for Muhammed?

http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%2002%20%202.213b.gif
For reason Allah appointed Revivalists/His Chosen and Elevated Servants as Pronouncer of glad tidings and Awakener, http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%20Rijalan%20.gif they were sent as Messengers-648;1856]

Surat-2 Ayat 213

http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/003.%20Aale%20Imran/3.81a.gif
And when Allah obtained a pledge/oath of the Chosen/Elevated/Selected Persons,

Surat Ale Imran-381

It suffices or I may give all ocurrences of the word? However you may like to check on my site.

I never use the word "prophet" since it is not the translation of word Nabi- from whatever Root it might be considered to have been derived/made.

somebody who interprets divine will somebody who claims to interpret or transmit the commands of a deity
somebody predicting the future somebody who predicts the future
prophets of economic doom
advocate of something somebody who advocates a cause or idea
inspired leader somebody considered to be an inspired leader or teacher

And when you cross check the synonyms for one who predicts the future you will find prognosticator. And it has categorically been told that by the Grace of Allah Muhammad is not a prognosticator, and none of the Nabi was so. They gave news not prophecies; the word prophecy has a built in element of doubt.

The word Nabi has a built in grandeur, elevation, selection, distinction, and perhaps that is the reason none of them ever introduced themselves as "I am Nabi towards you people". They always used the words "I am the Messenger of Allah and/or your Sustainer Lord".

Ayisha

http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%2002%20%202.213b.gif
For reason Allah appointed Revivalists/His Chosen and Elevated Servants as Pronouncer of glad tidings and Awakener, http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%20Rijalan%20.gif they were sent as Messengers-648;1856]

Surat-2 Ayat 213

http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/003.%20Aale%20Imran/3.81a.gif
And when Allah obtained a pledge/oath of the Chosen/Elevated/Selected Persons,

Surat Ale Imran-381

It suffices or I may give all ocurrences of the word? However you may like to check on my site.

I never use the word "prophet" since it is not the translation of word Nabi- from whatever Root it might be considered to have been derived/made.

somebody who interprets divine will somebody who claims to interpret or transmit the commands of a deity
somebody predicting the future somebody who predicts the future
prophets of economic doom
advocate of something somebody who advocates a cause or idea
inspired leader somebody considered to be an inspired leader or teacher

And when you cross check the synonyms for one who predicts the future you will find prognosticator. And it has categorically been told that by the Grace of Allah Muhammad is not a prognosticator, and none of the Nabi was so. They gave news not prophecies; the word prophecy has a built in element of doubt.

The word Nabi has a built in grandeur, elevation, selection, distinction, and perhaps that is the reason none of them ever introduced themselves as "I am Nabi towards you people". They always used the words "I am the Messenger of Allah and/or your Sustainer Lord".

right, so they were all elevated and chosen ones, not one more elevated and chosen than the others.

Mazhar

right, so they were all elevated and chosen ones, not one more elevated and chosen than the others.

Read 381? All are being made bound for whom? See in time and space; one in first century AD is to believe in the one who has to come after him. And conversely the one coming after in tine will authenticate and affirm the one in first century AD. Does something strikes or not?

Ayisha

Read 381? All are being made bound for whom? See in time and space; one in first century AD is to believe in the one who has to come after him. And conversely the one coming after in tine will authenticate and affirm the one in first century AD. Does something strikes or not?

yes I understand that Mazhar, but none were more 'elevated and chosen' than any other is what I said, I said nothing about who confirms and helps whom.

Also 381 takes a covenant from ALL prophets to believe and help ALL others after him not just the next one, they have an agreement to believe in and help each other. When a prophet comes and confirms what came before him ALL those before him have accepted to help and they have all agreed. In short, they all help and believe in each other, that was not in question. They have ALL taken an oath and none are more 'elevated and chosen' than the next one.

ayman

Peace Mazhar,

http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/033.%20Al%20Ahzaab/33.56.gif
It is certain that Allah and His Angels send blessings upon the Distinctly Elevated and Chosen One

....

...
Allah sent blessings, help, approval, to him .

Is the above statement a narration of a fact or a conjecture, lie?

Sorry to be the first to tell you this but unfortunately the original Arabic is a conjecture, lie. Moreover, your translation "Allah sent blessings, help, approval, to him " is incomplete. What happened to " "? Why did you cut it off and not translate it?

Can you please translate the complete statement so that you and everyone can see for sure if it is a lie as I am 100% sure or not?

Peace and all best wishes,

Ayman

Mazhar

Sorry to be the first to tell you this but unfortunately the original Arabic is a conjecture, lie. Moreover, your translation "Allah sent blessings, help, approval, to him " is incomplete.

Allah's and Angel's and mine curse is upon Aymen, the Munafiq who calls it a conjecture. The Qur'aan is full of statements that Allah blessed him, Allah helped him.

Can you please translate the complete statement so that you and everyone can see for sure if it is a lie as I am 100% sure or not?

Typical style of a Munafiq, Allah says Munafiq is conveniently recognized by his way and style of talking. The grammer and meanings of first part was given to the questioner with comparison to the verse pasted above. Why a Munafiq does not translate the Arabic sentence at his own to show it a lie, since he knows it is truth but talks like this to deceive those who do not know Arabic.

san

Allah's and Angel's and mine curse is upon Aymen, the Munafiq who calls it a conjecture. The Qur'aan is full of statements that Allah blessed him, Allah helped him.

you mean this Aymen?
Name Aymen
Posts 0 (0 per day)
Position Beginner/Inquirer
Date Registered April 16, 2003, 030253 PM
Last Active April 17, 2003, 051247 AM

btw, is it an example of following Qur'aan, cursing?

Ayisha

Allah's and Angel's and mine curse is upon Aymen, the Munafiq who calls it a conjecture. The Qur'aan is full of statements that Allah blessed him, Allah helped him.

Typical style of a Munafiq, Allah says Munafiq is conveniently recognized by his way and style of talking. The grammer and meanings of first part was given to the questioner with comparison to the verse pasted above. Why a Munafiq does not translate the Arabic sentence at his own to show it a lie, since he knows it is truth but talks like this to deceive those who do not know Arabic.

I assume that was not the translation?

Ayman, welcome to the exclusive Munafiq club, I was feeling a bit lonely but i'm sure as this goes on there will be others cast in here with us welcome