I challenge all Quranists.
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a non-Married zani might have an excuse for his crime, but a married zani absolutely has no excuse.
let me ask you something, you know what happened to the people of Lut, but Liwat has no punishment in the Qur'an is it even logical that Allah want to punish zina but won't punish the worst Liwat? Allah says "his day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion." how can he complete our religion without telling us about things like Liwat? or because his messenger already did.
Peace,
So, Are you disbeliever of 24-2?
Are you saying that the stoning to death is God's commandment that Prophet Mohamed refused to write in the Quran? And if so, Do you mean that the Prophet disobeyed God by not writing this commandment? Or, are you following the rummers of others instead of following the Well-established Commandment of 24-2242 The adulteress and the adulterer, you shall lash each of them with one hundred lashes, and do not let any pity overtake you regarding the system of God if you believe in God and the Last Day. And let a group of the believers witness their punishment.
242If this is Sunisem, then Thanks to God that I'm a Moslem who submits to God Alone BY following His Commandments that are in the Quran.
We said Descend from it all of you, so when the guidance comes from Me, then whoever follows My guidance, they will have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve.
238And those who disbelieve and deny Our revelations, they are the dwellers of Hell, in it they will abide.
239 -
You should look it up anyway and not trust anyone's translation.
Sorry, no proof at all from Quran. Not once is tauraat mentioned at all with Musa in any process whatosever.
Actually, the Quran says in 41/43
Nothing is said to thee that was not said to the messengers before thee that thy lord has at his Command (all) forgiveness as well as a most Grievous Penalty
So according to Quran, its saying are known to all the messengers.
And as I showed you, 6/84-89 above. Musa and Isa recieved exactly the same teachings as Quran.
There is no way Quran refers to your OT and NT. It is fully detailed and does not need any other supplementary scripture.
Lol, this is what I mean by patchwork attempts. 48/29 says
Muhammad is the messenger of Allah; and those who are with him are strong against Unbelievers, (but) compassionate amongst each other. Thou wilt see them bow and prostrate themselves (in prayer), seeking Grace from Allah and (His) Good Pleasure. On their faces are their marks, (being) the traces of their prostration. This is their similitude in the Taurat
Look at the half-quotes you're supplying us in the other thread! Are those referring to 'those with Muhammad'? Not at all! Sorry mate, you're welcome to your views but those who study the Quran seriously would never accept half-verses from your OT to meet Quran's description. Quran stands on its own, it doesn't need any other text but stands as a criteria above all texts.
I am not sure what you are saying. But I never said the Quran is not sufficient on its own. I said that the Quran also sees the OT and NT as sufficient on their own. Why else would the Quran order Jews and Christians to follow its teachings and not to divert away from it. As I have said the Talmud and trinity are not based on OT or NT.
You also did not understand what I said about Torah and Moses. I said the Torah was written by eye witness accounts and some prophetic accounts. Its written by humans. There is no "original version", it was always like that. If something was accounted wrongly, it remained there till now. Nobody knows who were its authors, most Biblical scholars believe four or five people were involved in the initial writing. However there is no scriptures that came to Moses the way the Quran came to Muhammad. Jesus in the Quran did not need revelations to recite to poeple as the words of God was genetically coded on him from birth. The Quran makes that very clear and tells us Jesus spoke when in the cradle and preached as a child. Many Christian accounts says that also although they do not form the official canons of Catholicism or Protestanism, but these early scriptures are there.
We know that God communicatd with Moses as the Quran tells us but I see no evidence that it came in a spoken and continous form as the Quran. No scriptures was revealed to Jesus like the Quran as Jesus had a different form of communication. Many Muslims believe a Quran like scriptures came down and this scriptures has been lost. There is no evidence whether in the Quran or history of that.
I am not an expert on this and I am sure in the future more expertise about this will come about.
However the Quran makes it clear that it sees the OT and NT and the Quran as equal in authority. Each is sufficient as a guidance and each is a guidance and a law and a spiritual path. They have different formats, but they all lead to the same. Each has its challenges and diificulties and mysteries but each is sufficient.
The Sunnah, the Talmud and the Trinity is something else.
But what I am saying is that IF YOU WANT TO BE A QURANIST ACTIVIST, you will have to have knowledge of the previous scriptures and previous traditions. The Quran itself tells the prophet to seek knowledge of the previous scriptures and to ask the Rabbis and Preists if he has doubts.
And if thou (Muhammad) art in doubt concerning that which We reveal unto thee, then question those who read the Scripture (that) was before thee... (Surah 10, Jonah, verse 94)
But why do they come to thee for decision, when they have the Torah before them?- Therein is the (plain) command of God; yet even after that, they would turn away. For they are not (really) people of faith. (Surah 5, Maida, verse 43)
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Salam and Peace on you respected brother!
1)---Please, can you show me the word or terminology "Sunnatur Rasool" in Allah's Quran???
Take it as a challenge.---A brotherly challenge.
And if you can not show this terminology "Sunnatur Rasool" in Allah's Quran, then fear Allah, and don't invite people to what is not Approved and Authorized by Allah as Deen.
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Salam,
Just had to share my thought
Must comment on a quoteSince Qur'an alone is a new sect
lol, no brothers, its not new at all. What do you think Muhammad followed for religious guidance ? Qur'an alone
Is it that hard to get ? brickwall You understand this logic when you debate a christian, you dont have faith in St. Paul but ask me to have faith in St. Bukhari. You ask the Christain to provide the Injeel not the words of historians, but you yourself follow the words of historians for religious teaching. May Allah guide us.
---------------- Student of Allah
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Hello, I'm a Sunni I challenge all of you to prove one or 2 things to me
1- your sect is the only true one
2- Ahlu Alsunnah Waljammah are false
you can use any time of history, any hadith, anything you want but no mocking, I won't answer anyone mocking.
I hope you accept my challenge and have a nice day.
Let us turn to the Quran, and the teachings of the People of the Book to see who is on the right path, and who is led astray.
Those who uphold hadith reject the Quran. Allah has not given authority to follow anything but what He revealed.
?Follow what has been revealed to you from your Lord and do not follow guardians besides Him, how little do you mind.? Surah 73
Take a test and see if you obey Allah and the Messenger, or if you obey the way of the ancients.
This is ?pass or fail?, just as it will be on the Day of Judgment. Let us see who truly rejects the Quran.Muhammad (pbuh) was revealed the Quran by Allah, and it was the Prophet (pbuh) who taught us the Quran. Only in the Quran, the pure, protected revelation, do we have proof of the Messenger?s words
"Say 'I do not find, in what is revealed to me, aught forbidden to him who eats thereof except it be carrion, or blood outpoured, or the flesh of swine -- that is unclean -- or an ungodly thing that has been blessed to other than Allah; yet whoso is constrained, not desiring nor transgressing, surely thy Lord is All-forgiving, All-compassionate.'" Surah 6145
That is the Prophet Muhammad speaking (pbuh). He states nothing is forbidden EXCEPT four specific foods. Carrion, blood, flesh of swine, and food blessed to another god.Now turn to hadith, and count how many foods are forbidden within.
Then look to the additions in the Torah and find the same forbidden foods as the Jews ? Orthodox Yahduians who follow the Talmud, also known as the Oral Law.Beasts with fangs Sahih Bukhari #5527, Sahih Muslim # 2721
Donkey Meat Sahih Bukhari #5521
Birds with talons Sahih Muslim # 4752
Amphibians Saheeh Jaami #6970Beasts with fangs Lev. 113; Deut. 146
Donkey Meat Lev. 113-4, Deut. 147
Birds with talons Lev. 1113-20, Deut. 1412
Amphibians Lev. 1129-30, 42-43, Deut. 1410Halal/kosher food Lev. 111-46, Deut. 143-21
A follower of hadith cannot say these were revealed to Muhammad and passed on in hadith, because Allah is verifies what the Jews were forbidden
"And to those of Jewry We have forbidden every beast with claws; and of oxen and sheep We have forbidden them the fat of them, save what their backs carry, or their entrails, or what is mingled with bone; that We recompensed them for their insolence; surely We speak truly." Surah 6146
Allah revealed to the Messenger that all foods not forbidden in the Quran were permitted to the People of the Book, abrogating the previous Messages The Torah and Injeel.
?Today the good things are permitted you, and the food of those who were given the Book is permitted to you, and permitted to them is your food; Likewise believing women in wedlock, and in wedlock women of them who were given the Book before you if you give them their wages, in wedlock and not in licence, or as taking lovers. Whoso disbelieves in the faith, his work has failed, and in the world to come he shall be among the losers.? Surah 55Who, when proof is given, is shown to reject the Quran and who is shown to uphold it?
"The Truth has come and falsehood vanished. Surely falsehood is ever bound to vanish." Surah 1781, 3447-50
Only believers, Muslims with faith in their heart who uphold the revelation of Allah, the word of an honored Messenger, pass the test.
Followers of hadith follow teachings of the Jews and Christians, rewritten into hadith.
Terrorism, violence and intolerance Deut. 2010-18, Num. 3117, Num. 3132-35, Joshua 621-24, I Sam.l 1827, I Kings 1840
Religious compulsion (kill unbelievers) Lev. 2416, Ph. 210; Deut 172-7, II Chron.1513, Deut. 135-10
Apostasy Deut. 135-10
Suicide Mission Judges 1627-30
Stoning Adulterers Deut. 2223-24, Lev. 210, John 86-8
Sunni ?Al-Aqeedah? Gen. 221-19, James 221, Heb. 117, Rom. 416
Halal/kosher food Lev. 111-46
Genital mutilation Gen. 1713-14, Gen. 1723-25, Exo. 424-26
Cut off hand/feet Deut. 2511-12, Mat. 530, Mark 943-45
Grow a beard Lev. 1927, Lev. 215, II Sam. 105
Cover your head Lev. 106, II Maccabes 4412, Shabbat 156b
?Cover your head in order that the fear of heaven may be upon you.? ~ Talmud
Djjal/All-Seeing Eye/Head Corner-stone Job 384-7, Zech. 1117, Mat. 622, Luke 1134, Eph. 221-22, Rev. 16213, Rev. 1920, Rev. 2010
Slavery Lev. 2544-46, Lev. 2210-11, Exo. 2132
Females are unclean Lev. 122-5, Lev. 1519-25
Proof of virginity Deut. 2215-21
Raped girl should be killed Deut. 2222-29
Hijab I Cor. 113-6
Men dominate women I Cor. 113, I Peter 31-7, Eph. 522-24
Daughters are property Exo. 217
Women have no rights I Tim. 211-15, I Cor. 1434-36
Pedophilia Sanhedrin 52b, 54b, 55b, 69a, Kethuboth 11b, Yebamoth 60bIf you uphold hadith until your appointed term, the Fire will be your reward. The only unforgivable sin is idolatry.
Idolatry nullifies all works Surah 3965, 448, 4116, 12106, 3113, 4066
"And certainly, it has been revealed to you and to those before you Surely if you associate, your work would certainly come to naught and you would certainly be of the losers." Surah 3965"Surely Allah does not forgive that anything should be associated with Him, and He forgives what is besides this to whom He pleases; and whoever associates anything with Allah, he indeed strays off into a remote error." Surah 4116
Peace.
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Salam,
Just had to share my thought )
Must comment on a quotelol, no brothers, its not new at all. What do you think Muhammad followed for religious guidance ? Qur'an alone )
Is it that hard to get ? brickwall You understand this logic when you debate a christian, you dont have faith in St. Paul but ask me to have faith in St. Bukhari. You ask the Christain to provide the Injeel not the words of historians, but you yourself follow the words of historians for religious teaching. May Allah guide us.
---------------- Student of Allah
Salam and Peace!
Very good answer!------
Masha Allah!
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Salam and Peace!
Very good answer!------
Masha Allah!
As someone raised a hard nosed Catholic who went to study after study and class after class I gotta say I don't quite get where this discussion has gone. Sure there are some similar and even identical ideas between the Qu'ran and the Bible. They however contradict each other too much to take them BOTH as complete books. The Bible has some nice stories in it and some good lessons. But it contradicts with itself and does not meet eye to eye with the Qu'ran either. If someone wants to believe that all of it should be taken then good for them. But I can't quite wrap my head around it. The Hadith to me seemed to serve the purpose of upholding cultural norms and wants by using holy figures and religion to serve it's purposes.
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I love how when people provided evidence from Quran and previous scripture to refute him he vanishes from the argument. LOL peace be unto you all
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Hello, I'm a Sunni I challenge all of you to prove one or 2 things to me
1- your sect is the only true one
2- Ahlu Alsunnah Waljammah are false
you can use any time of history, any hadith, anything you want but no mocking, I won't answer anyone mocking.
I hope you accept my challenge and have a nice day.
A fast question do you believe that the prophet of Islam married a 9 years old girl? and he kissed and made out while fasting in Ramadan and while Aisha was on menstrual period?and he used to sleep with his 9 wives each night, and had the power of 33 men?? and he had enough time to go on the day line to some women and sleep their and wake up laughing and making a prediction while Qur'an said he didn't know the future?If you believe the stories and the paragraphs they did aside of the hadith to make this hadiths right in front of the people, yet, they failed.
Do you believe all the previous or not? If yes then sorry you will not be convinced, nor you are trying to seek the truth, but you want to prove that your ancestors and your parents and yourself right, because you are afraid o being wrong all your life long...good luck bro. -
A fast question do you believe that the prophet of Islam married a 9 years old girl? and he kissed and made out while fasting in Ramadan and while Aisha was on menstrual period?and he used to sleep with his 9 wives each night, and had the power of 33 men?? and he had enough time to go on the day line to some women and sleep their and wake up laughing and making a prediction while Qur'an said he didn't know the future?If you believe the stories and the paragraphs they did aside of the hadith to make this hadiths right in front of the people, yet, they failed.
Do you believe all the previous or not? If yes then sorry you will not be convinced, nor you are trying to seek the truth, but you want to prove that your ancestors and your parents and yourself right, because you are afraid o being wrong all your life long...good luck bro.Salam,
I am aware of the hot tub scene during Aisha's menstrual period, found it in Bukhari 2 days ago. Can you help find the one that I highlighted in red ???
PEACE
----------- Student of Allah
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I'm afraid for you in this sect ...
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Narrated 'Ayesha , The Prophet used to kiss her when he was fasting and he would suck her tongue -
?Aisha reported Allah?s Messenger used to kiss (his wives) while fasting and embraced (them) while fasting; but he had the greatest mastery over his desire among you. -
Narrated Aisha ?The Prophet (PBUH) used to kiss and embrace his wives while he was fasting, and he had more power to control his desires than any of you.? (Bukhari, volume three, Hadith number 149).
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peace,
Islam is not a sect - it is the system that God has revealed through the prophets since the term was first coined during the time of Abraham.
Background
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9597465.msg186755#msg186755
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9600142.msg241101#msg241101 -
I'm afraid for you in this sect ...
The sects are those that follow and practice what ALLAAH, swt, Has not AUTHORIZED in The Qur'aan. Sects are Sunnis, Shi'ahs, Jews, Christians, and... If you belong to one of these SECTS, you are called a SECTARIAN. Muslims as GOD, Almighty Says in The Qur'aan are only those who follow What GOD Has sent down to us for our guidance. The only GUIDANCE for us MUSLIMS is The Qur'aan ALONE, PERIOD, no ifs, buts, or what not. See verses 543-49 below.
And how do they make you a judge and they have the Taurat wherein is Allah's judgment? Yet they turn back after that, and these are not the believers. 43
Surely We revealed the Taurat in which was guidance and light; with it the prophets who submitted themselves (to Allah) judged (matters) for those who were Jews, and the masters of Divine knowledge and the doctors, because they were required to guard (part) of the Book of Allah, and they were witnesses thereof; therefore fear not the people and fear Me, and do not take a small price for My communications; and whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed, those are they that are the unbelievers. 44
And We prescribed to them in it that life is for life, and eye for eye, and nose for nose, and ear for ear, and tooth for tooth, and (that there is) reprisal in wounds; but he who foregoes it, it shall be an expiation for him; and whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed, those are they that are the unjust. 45
And We sent after them in their footsteps Isa, son of Mariam, verifying what was before him of the Taurat and We gave him the Injeel in which was guidance and light, and verifying what was before it of Taurat and a guidance and an admonition for those who guard (against evil). 46
And the followers of the Injeel should have judged by what Allah revealed in it; and whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed, those are they that are the transgressors.47
And We have revealed to you the Book with the truth, verifying what is before it of the Book and a guardian over it, therefore judge between them by what Allah has revealed, and do not follow their low desires (to turn away) from the truth that has come to you; for every one of you did We appoint a law and a way, and if Allah had pleased He would have made you (all) a single people, but that He might try you in what He gave you, therefore strive with one another to hasten to virtuous deeds; to Allah is your return, of all (of you), so He will let you know that in which you differed; 48
And that you should judge between them by what Allah has revealed, and do not follow their low desires, and be cautious of them, lest they seduce you from part of what Allah has revealed to you; but if they turn back, then know that Allah desires to afflict them on account of some of their faults; and most surely many of the people are transgressors. 49
According to the above verses, those who follow other that what GOD Has revealed have a lot to answer to Him.
Peace,
Khalil -
This is a sect, and the true Islam is the Original islam, like sahaba who where learning quran and learning from the prophet. I love Allah, I love prophet muhammad peace be upon him, I love the true muslim people who are following the prophet. As a real muslim, I know that hadiths are true, and I don't call a hadith false just to please my soul, I know that our prophet muhammad is the best creature in this world. And no, prophet muhammad is not death, the prophets are alive (If you have faith and if you are a true muslim you cannot deny that !)! Alhamdulillah I am not in this sect who is trying to confuse muslims. I'm not really into forums, but a friend came to me and said to me Salah I don't pray anymore, I said why ? Because all the hadiths are false ... Stop confusing my people, and be afraid of your god !
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If you look deep in your heart you will find that you are saying that hadith are false just to please your soul !!! As a real muslims I know that hadiths are true and I love prophet muhammad peace be upon him.
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Dear Salah,
The hadiths are satanic and that they will lead those who take them as authority to the wrong side of the fence - but it is your perogative to follow such elements if they please you.
As for love, you should know that we here love God above all else - and that all else (prophets, angels, etc.) are absoluteley nothing in comparison to our Lord, our Master, our Creator - May His name be praised forever.
2165 And from among the people are some who take other than God as equals to Him, they love them as they love God; but those who
believe love God more strongly; and when those who were wicked see the retribution, they will see that all power belongs to God, and that
God is severe in retribution. -
Peace salaheddine,
If you are true to your claim as a Muslim, and a follower of the Quran, heed what Allah is saying in it very carefully. Take a deep breath, open your mind and simply acknowledge.
7185 Do they not look at the dominion of heavens and earth, and all that God has created, and perhaps their time is drawing near? In which hadith after this one will they acknowledge?
316 Among the people, there are those who accept baseless hadiths to mislead from the path of God without knowledge, and they take it as entertainment. These will have a humiliating retribution.
456 These are God's signs that We recite to you with truth. So, in which hadith, after God and His signs, do they acknowledge?
Allah is asking you a question. Think carefully about your answer!
6836-38 What is wrong with you, how do you judge? Or do you have another book which you study? In it, you can find what you wish?
May Allah guide us all to the truth.
