Any Non Believers of a supernatural creator here?
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Iznagen,
The OP did not profess as a 'muslim', he said he's a Qur'aanist. I have spoken to him in the past, and I gather that he is a "Qur'aanist" in a sense that he believes in the wisdom of (most of the) Qur'aan. He is not a "Qur'aanist" muslim, he is someone who agrees with most of Qur'aanic teachings, hence a "Qur'aanist". Basically he takes the Qur'aan as a set of 'guidelines' but not divine revelation.
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Iznagen,
The OP did not profess as a 'muslim', he said he's a Qur'aanist. I have spoken to him in the past, and I gather that he is a "Qur'aanist" in a sense that he believes in the wisdom of (most of the) Qur'aan. He is not a "Qur'aanist" muslim, he is someone who agrees with most of Qur'aanic teachings, hence a "Qur'aanist". Basically he takes the Qur'aan as a set of 'guidelines' but not divine revelation.
But please explain how you can label yourself as a "Quraanist" if you refuse to adhere to its fundamental teachings? Can I label myself a "Biblist" because it teaches that one should give money to the needy, and I also believe it ? Might as well label my self Senegalese because I visited the country.
Munzir, you should simply give yourself the name of the surah and verse of Qu'ran you accept, instead of calling yourself a "Quranist" hence making it seem like you adhere to the whole book. (For example SURAHFIVEVERSEFIFTYSIXist).
Anyway, I will put an end to this discussion, it is not an important matter.
Salam. -
On that last note, Iznagen. Labelling does not matter. It's what you do that matters. Some people can claim they believe in the Qur'aan etc etc, but do not practice some of their commandments (either intentionally, or not). But who am I to tell them they are not believers of the Qur'aan? Anyway, he may 'miss' the bit of believing in God which is prevalent in the Qur'aan, but I am sure all of us have missed at least one of Qur'aanic teachings.
Anyway, you should focus on the bigger thing that someone's labelling, as I'm sure you are doing now ).
Salaam.
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I consider myself an Atheist Quranist. I do not consider that book to be infallible as it is the work of Muhammed. I do not believe in many historical verses and ritualistic verses.
Shalom,
The part highlighted in red sounds like "porn-star nun". Anyways, from my point of view it is at least better than repeating what you hear of calls and cries. Thinking for yourself.
PEACE
------------------- Student of Allah -
http//servantofthelight.com/
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Why do Many Atheists agree with the doctrine of Human rights and call themselves secular humanists?
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Salam,
God says that disregarding His revelations is "disbelief", even just part of them. Failing to uphold ALL of commandments is also considered disbelief. We can't believe only part of what God says and disbelieve in others. Failing to apply them properly or failing to understand them are different than disbelief.
There is no such thing as an atheist Quranist. They are just disbelievers. In fact, the very Quran they claim they agree with says they are Idol Worshippers, whose god is their own Ego, and their "religion" is their own personal opinions. They only come to post on forums with believers to cause doubt and to cause straying from God. They want you to compromise with them so that they too can feel better about their compromising their duties to God.
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I do not mind anything you say. I already refuse to believe that the Quran is divinely inspired. It is the work of Muhammed but there are a lot of good things in it. As well as somethings that I cannot agree with, for example rituals, historical verses, worship and adoration of a deity.
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Salam
Do as you wish and so will I..When we die, it is the end..
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At the end of the day..
Belief doesn't matter... it's your deed that matter the most...If somebody does good deed for the sake of doing good and expect nothing in return.
He/she earn more respect from me than those who does good deeds for the sake of 'heavenly reward' from some deities. -
Whatever
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Actually God says the only deeds that matter are those done for His sake, while believing. All others count for nothing on The Last Day.
Well in that case.. Bin Laden and his thugs, including those suicide bombers who murdered many people.. will certainly get their 72 virgins then.. since they do it for "His sake".. And so does the crusaders, the catholic popes and priest who ordered mass murder since they also do it for "His sake"..
"Caedite eos! Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius!"
Kill them all! Surely the Lord discerns which ones are his.
-- Arnaud Amaury, 13th century Papal Legate
Upon asked by a Crusader how to distinguish the Infidels (Cathars) from the Believers (Catholics)Salam / Peace
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Well in that case.. Bin Laden and his thugs, including those suicide bombers who murdered many people.. will certainly get their 72 virgins then.. since they do it for "His sake".. And so does the crusaders, the catholic popes and priest who ordered mass murder since they also do it for "His sake"..
"Caedite eos! Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius!"
Kill them all! Surely the Lord discerns which ones are his.
-- Arnaud Amaury, 13th century Papal Legate
Upon asked by a Crusader how to distinguish the Infidels (Cathars) from the Believers (Catholics)Salam / Peace
If a God exists, he would be very much unlike the COMMONLY described abrahamic God..
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Salam,
Doing something, namely committing mass murder or sins or transgressions of His commandments, in His Name is not doing anything for His sake. They are simply sins. You should be smart enough to already understand that.
He only accepts the Righteous works that are in accordance with His Commandments, not evil works commited by disbelievers for misguided idols. Its not very hard to understand.
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If a God exists, he would be very much unlike the COMMONLY described abrahamic God..
If it is "Personified God" that you meant.. I might advice you to 'explore' the easterners view of "The Supreme Reality"..
The notion of "Believe doesn't matter it's your deed that matter the most" is many centuries old concept which resurfaced and regain a lot of momentum nowadays. It's no wonder they're commonly referred as "Dharmic Religion" as Dharma = Deeds in Sanskrits...
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At the end of the day..
Belief doesn't matter... it's your deed that matter the most...If somebody does good deed for the sake of doing good and expect nothing in return.
He/she earn more respect from me than those who does good deeds for the sake of 'heavenly reward' from some deities.Would you kindly explain than why god says in the quran regarding charity that the believers are those who give the poor charity and say ''We feed you for the sake of god. We don't expect anything in return from you, not even thanks''.,
NOT to mention all the times god reminds us that we should do good deeds without selfish intentions since our reward is with our god.
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-Action yields belief. A stated belief on it's own is worthless in the grand scheme of things.
-Belief (on it's own) doesn't necessarily yield action, though it may and does help the sincere folks of the world (which The quran states are but a few).Any fool can say they believe in X,Y,Z, It's our actions that define us.
Belief in God is not a literal thing http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9597179.msg221961#msg221961
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-Action yields belief. A stated belief on it's own is worthless in the grand scheme of things.
-Belief (on it's own) doesn't necessarily yield action, though it may and does help the sincere folks of the world (which The quran states are but a few).Any fool can say they believe in X,Y,Z, It's our actions that define us.
Belief in God is not a literal thing http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9597179.msg221961#msg221961
It is my view that everyone (even the atheist) believe in God.
7172 When your Lord took from the children of Adam from their backs, their progeny; and He made them witness over themselves "Am I not your Lord?" They said, "Yes, we bear witness." Thus you cannot say on the day of Resurrection that you were unaware of this.
Belief in an Almighty God is a subconscious thing. It is imprinted in every human being. For example one of the biggest signs of this is if an atheist ( or any idol worshiper) were near the brink of death even he would call upon God.
1022 He is the One who carries you on land and on the sea. When you are on the ships and We drive them with a good wind which they rejoice with, a strong gust comes to it and the waves come to them from all sides, and they suppose that they are overwhelmed, they implore God devoting the system to Him "If You save us from this, we will be of the thankful."
1023 But when He saves them, they then traverse through the land with injustice. O people, your rebellion is only against yourselves. What you seek out is only the consumption of this worldly life, then to Us is your return and We will inform you of all that you had done.
Everyone believes in God and has the knowledge of an Almighty Creator. The only thing that prevents other people from devoting the true system to him is arrogance.
Peace,
Kevin