Dr. Subhi Mansour on the term "muhsanat" in the Koran

A2Z

You are again arguing that the translation is quran. Even free minds have errors, yes. Actually you can take every translation and throw it in the garbage, if you ask me. Its only the quran i am intrested in.

Well many muslims have been some assholes throughout history where they have kidnapped, raped and looted the freedom of many people. Especially the khalifahs, they were experts in these crimes against humanity.

You looks desperate. Without translation how you want to convey Quran messages to other non-Arabic spoken peoples. Please bear in mind that Quran was written in Arabic and it is not the Arab spoke Quran's language. Those translators translated the Quran using the Arabic language's rules and disciplines with years of study.

You need to be thankful to at least one of the caliphs as he was the one who initiate to put Prophet Muhammad's teaching into book.

A2Z

The verse in itself prooves that Ma malakat aymanakum, wrongly translated as what your right hands possess, does not means slaves. Just look at these words in the sentence= IF THEY ARE POOR, GOD WOULD....

Are you translating Quran's words to English? You said,

..... Actually you can take every translation and throw it in the garbage, if you ask me. Its only the quran i am intrested in.

What had happened to you?

Its only their masters who can be poor or rich.

How does poor master(s) possessed slave(s)?

A2Z

I did. I actually studied the American civil war.

As fas as how the Koran uses slaves, you are wrong. look at verse 24.32 and you can see the Koran used the term (abd) for slave

http//quran.com/24/32

In fact I have not see this verse before. The verse after it uses "right hand possess" which may indicate that slaves and MMA are not the same.

Please calibrate with WhereIsTheTruth(WITT) and Noon dhe plume what should be the right translation for verse 2432. Word of the day is 'ibadi'.

http//corpus.quran.com/wordimage?id=45458

Looks like renowned translators having difficulty to choose the right meaning for this particular word.

024.032
Waankihoo al-ayama minkum waalssaliheena min AAibadikum wa-ima-ikum in yakoonoo fuqaraa yughnihimu Allahu min fadlihi waAllahu wasiAAun AAaleemun

YUSUFALI Marry those among you who are single, or the virtuous ones among yourselves, male or female if they are in poverty, Allah will give them means out of His grace for Allah encompasseth all, and he knoweth all things.

PICKTHAL And marry such of you as are solitary and the pious of your slaves and maid-servants. If they be poor, Allah will enrich them of His bounty. Allah is of ample means, Aware.

SHAKIR And marry those among you who are single and those who are fit among your male slaves and your female slaves; if they are needy, Allah will make them free from want out of His grace; and Allah is Ample-giving, Knowing.

KHALIFA You shall encourage those of you who are single to get married. They may marry the righteous among your male and female servants, if they are poor. GOD will enrich them from His grace. GOD is Bounteous,

FREEMINDS And marry off those among you that are single, and the good from among your male and female servants. If they are poor, then God will grant them from His grace. And God is Encompassing, Knowledgeable.

Sahih International And marry the unmarried among you and the righteous among your male slaves and female slaves. If they should be poor, Allah will enrich them from His bounty, and Allah is all-Encompassing and Knowing.

Or to make things simpler, can we come to agreement which English translation to be used in FreeMinds' forum discussions? I have read about our Christian brother looking for right Quran translation(s) to study Islam and by having a standard reference the path to the truth will be brighter.

A2Z

Please calibrate with WhereIsTheTruth(WITT) and Noon dhe plume what should be the right translation for verse 2432. Word of the day is 'ibadi'.

Please also consider below verse in the discussion.

003.079
Ma kana libasharin an yu/tiyahu Allahu alkitaba waalhukma waalnnubuwwata thumma yaqoola lilnnasi koonoo AAibadan lee min dooni Allahi walakin koonoo rabbaniyyeena bima kuntum tuAAallimoona alkitaba wabima kuntum tadrusoona

YUSUFALI It is not (possible) that a man, to whom is given the Book, and Wisdom, and the prophetic office, should say to people "Be ye my worshippers rather than Allah's" on the contrary (He would say) "Be ye worshippers of Him Who is truly the Cherisher of all For ye have taught the Book and ye have studied it earnestly."

PICKTHAL It is not (possible) for any human being unto whom Allah had given the Scripture and wisdom and the prophethood that he should afterwards have said unto mankind Be slaves of me instead of Allah; but (what he said was) Be ye faithful servants of the Lord by virtue of your constant teaching of the Scripture and of your constant study thereof.

SHAKIR It is not meet for a mortal that Allah should give him the Book and the wisdom and prophethood, then he should say to men Be my servants rather than Allah's; but rather (he would say) Be worshippers of the Lord because of your teaching the Book and your reading (it yourselves).

KHALIFA Never would a human being whom GOD blessed with the scripture and prophethood say to the people, "Idolize me beside GOD." Instead, (he would say), "Devote yourselves absolutely to your Lord alone," according to the scripture you preach and the teachings you learn.

FREEMINDS' It is not for any human being that God would give him the Book and the authority and the prophethood, then he would say to the people "Be servants to me rather than God!" Rather "Be Devotees for what you have been taught of the Book, and of what you have studied."

WhereIsTheTruth

You looks desperate. Without translation how you want to convey Quran messages to other non-Arabic spoken peoples. Please bear in mind that Quran was written in Arabic and it is not the Arab spoke Quran's language. Those translators translated the Quran using the Arabic language's rules and disciplines with years of study.

You need to be thankful to at least one of the caliphs as he was the one who initiate to put Prophet Muhammad's teaching into book.

NOPE. Who says it was the caliphs who put the prophets teachings into book? and who says prophets name was muhammad? look, i am not a hadither.

And why do I have to convey \qurans'' message to people who are not arabs? Look, you can find muslims in every community, whether they know quran or not, and you can find disbelievers in every community even if they know quran.

God guides whoever he wants to guide, with or without the quran, and he misguides who ever he wants, with or without the quran. There are billions of revelations from God, quran IN ITS ORIGINAL FORM is just one out of billions. So if I speak with an non-arab I would properly convey another revalation from God, maybe something scintific. Quran is for the arabs, just as you said, but its message is for the whole of humanity and this message is being revealed in several other ways.

WhereIsTheTruth

Are you translating Quran's words to English? You said,

What had happened to you?

How does poor master(s) possessed slave(s)?

No, I was just trying to show how contradicting the translation is.

Excately, that is why I woundered that how could the slave or master be poor.

But maybe there were some RELATIVE poor masters, who were richer before but than got poor afterwards.
It does in any case, not change the fact that a slave cannot be poor or rich since he or she does not possess something.

WhereIsTheTruth