Jesus the messenger of Allah
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Peace Kyle,
Peace be upon you Marie,
The quran is a clear message and I have never said the opposite.
You have never said it was not clear, but do you realize that when you say ONLY the God knows the interpretation of some verses, that it means that there are parts which we can NEVER know, and the EQUALS it being unclear.
I think Brother Ayman was right when He said that "Ta/weel" means the 100% true meaning of something is also the realization of something.
Let us be humble, our understanding is partial and not absolute. The science proves it everyday.
This is why I believe the God gives the correct interpretation to those with knowledge.
Agree, this is why we should not stop us to study it until our death.
So, let us be patient.
"He threw it away to Mary.../alqaha ila maryam...." is an incomplete sentence in arabic and doesn't make sence without "wakalimatuhu / His word" which refers to the God's word.
How is that an incomplete sentence? Please elaborate.
We should not decompose this sentence "... wakalimatuhu alqaha ila maryam..." in two sentences "... wakalimatuhu." and "alqaha ila maryam..."
The second sentence doesn't make sence without "wakalimatuhu"
"wakalimatuhu/and His word" refers to the word of Allah announced to Mary in 345.
If "His word" refers to Jesus, we shouls read "....and His word which he threw/delivered it away to Mary..."
What do you think the "IT" refers to?
"Tt" refers to His word; the word of Allah.
There is a big differnce between "..and His word he threw it..." and "..and His word. He threw it....."
There is no full stop between "..and His word" and "he threw it..."
What evidence are you bringing foward to prove there is no full stop?
Because if you put a full stop the second sentence doesn't make sence.
word for word
"...and His words He delivered it to Mary..." and it is a complete sentece and makes full sence.Allah knows best
Marie
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Salaams marie,all,
wama yaAAlamu ta/weelahu illa Allahu waalrrasikhoona fee alAAilmi yaqooloona amannabihi kullun min AAindi rabbina (37)
But none know its interpretation except God and those who are well founded in knowledge say ?We believe in it, all is from our Lord.? (37)
As you are saying it is the well founded in knowledge who are saying
?We believe in it, all is from our Lord.?
So how about the rest of us who arn't well founded in knowledge ,don't we say this too.So arn't you making a mockery,and i know for a fact there are a lot of people with knowledge who say this the quran is written by a clever man,in that case even those with knowledge arn't saying them special words.
Briefly , i think Allah is telling the prophet along with everybody else to say them words-its an order for all of us.
This i think is how it aught to be.
But none know its interpretation except God and those who are well founded in knowledge. Say ?We believe in it, all is from our Lord.? (37)
I hope you won't be offended with my lingoAnd Salaam.
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Salam MZ,
But none know its interpretation except God and those who are well founded in knowledge. Say ?We believe in it, all is from our Lord.? (37)
There is no offense, if you know a little better the structure and grammar of the above sentence in arabic, you will not put any full stop between (But none know its interpretation except God and those who are well founded in knowledge" and "Say ?We believe in it, all is from our Lord"". As I already explained it to Kyle and to Joe several times, the second sentence (Say ?We believe in it, all is from our Lord") doesn't make sence, the subject is missing and which is those who are well founded in knowledge.
37 But none know its interpretation except God and those who are well founded in knowledge say ?We believe in it, all is from our Lord.?
Idem for 4171, there is no full stop between (You The Book's people, do not exaggerate/exceed the limit in your system/obligation, and do not say on (about) the God except the truth , but the Messiah, Jesus, Mary's son (is) The God's messenger AND His word) and (He delivered it away to Mary, and an energy (ruh) from Him...)
Peace
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Salaams marie,
Rather then teaching people your own views ,i think we can do better by looking at the quran with an open mind-try doing that.You say
the subject is missing and which is those who are well founded in knowledge ,TO THE CONTRARY - LOOK AGAIN AT THE AYAT.
Any person going to even i think a secondary school can see that the subject isn't what you have proposed but ,somthing other - but i will let you ponder on that,and here is the full ayat rather than only a portion which you are using and misquoting - as far as i am aware.
003.007
YUSUFALI He it is Who has sent down to thee THE BOOK IN IT are verses basic or fundamental (of established meaning); they are the foundation of THE BOOK others are allegorical. But those in whose hearts is perversity follow the PART thereof that is allegorical, seeking discord, and searching for ITS hidden meanings, but no one knows ITS hidden meanings except Allah And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say "We believe in THE BOOK; the whole of IT is from our Lord" and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.
PICKTHAL He it is Who hath revealed unto thee (Muhammad) the SCRIPTURE wherein are clear revelations - they are the substance of the BOOK - and others (which are) allegorical. But those in whose hearts is doubt pursue, forsooth, that which is allegorical seeking (to cause) dissension by seeking to explain it. None knoweth its explanation save Allah And those who are of sound instruction Say We believe therein; the whole is from our Lord; but only men of understanding really heed.
SHAKIR He it is Who has revealed THE BOOK to you; some of ITS VERSES are decisive, they are the basis of THE BOOK, and OTHERS ARE allegorical; then as for those in whose hearts there is perversity they follow the PART of IT which is allegorical, seeking to mislead and seeking to give IT (their own) interpretation. but none knows its interpretation except Allah and those who are firmly rooted in knowledge say We believe IN IT, IT IS ALL from our Lord; and none do mind except those having understanding.Salaam.
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Peace MZ,
Salaams marie,
Any person going to even i think a secondary school can see that the subject isn't what you have proposed but ,somthing other - but i will let you ponder on that,and here is the full ayat rather than only a portion which you are using and misquoting - as far as i am aware.
I'm surprised you did not propose your version, the subject who say "We believe in THE BOOK; the whole of IT is from our Lord", this is only one solution those who are firmly grounded in knowledge.
As I already said it to Kyle and Damon, we could understand all the verses in the quran but at different degree. Our understanding is relative and progressive. We should to study and seek the knowledge until the death.
AAaqala/fahama to comprend/understand and "Awwala=100% true meaning and the realization of the book in the light of the quran" are not the same things.
Only Allah holds the absolute truth and knowledge.
Let us be humble and patient.
Peace
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Peace be upon you Marie,
As I already explained it to Kyle and to Joe several times, the second sentence (Say ?We believe in it, all is from our Lord") doesn't make sence, the subject is missing and which is those who are well founded in knowledge.
What is the subject for the following verses?
(1131) Say I seek refuge with the Lord of the Dawn
(1121) Say He is Allah, the One and Only;
(1091) Say O ye that reject Faith!
These are all the first verse of thier respective chapters, so there is no "subject" in front of them, how does your understanding compensate for this contradiction?
I think it is clear that 37 tells us that the God "AND" those with knowledge have the understanding. The next statement is just like the above examples, we know the subject by CONTEXT.
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Salam Kyle,
You refuse or you are not ready to understand.
Sorry, I have not time to give you lessons in arabic.
Maybe I did not be rather clear in my posts, Only Allah will guide you Inshaa Allah.
I am obliged to abandon this thread. I have other projects.I leave you with peace
respectfully
Marie
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Peace be upon you as well.
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Peace be upon you,
Ayman's translation of 37
- He is the one who descended on you the book. From it are judging signs that are the cradle/origin of the book, and others that are similar. So in the case of
(1) Those who have blurriness in their hearts, they follow what is similar from it (the book) desiring a problem and desiring its (the book's) original interpretation.
And none knows its (the book's) original interpretation except The God.
And,
(2) Those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say "We have faith in it (the book), both (types of signs) are from our Lord."
And none remember other than those with intellects.
For "say" in "...Those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say...", in arabic it's conjugated in the plural form (they).
I want also to give an example of a progressive understanding
The newtonian theory about the garvitational field was and still correct if used within it's values limitations. But Einstein in his theory of relativity demonstrated that newton's theory doesn't work if the speed of the studied objects is near to the speed of the light, thus he proposed his new theory that superceed newton's theory in a wider interval.Both theories are right, but only in their limits. Einstein's theory has also it's limitations, and maybe one day, it will be superceeded by a newer theory.
And finaly, all we (humanity) have acquired in knowledge during all the centuries is but a compilation of theories that aim to explain the universe around. No absolute knowledge exist, except with the god.
- He is the one who descended on you the book. From it are judging signs that are the cradle/origin of the book, and others that are similar. So in the case of
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Peace be upon you Someone,
No absolute knowledge exist, except with the god.
I am only looking for the knowledge that allows me to interpret these stories so I can have a clear guide to life, I am not in search of absolute knowledge