Use of 2nd person masculine singular in Arabic: can it be a generic reference?
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As to whether or not the 2nd pers. sing. masc. pronoun refers specifically to Muhammad or to anyone who might read it, then this does not fall under the scope of the rules of grammar; this is an exegetical issue.
If i understanding you correctly, your position is that the use of the 2nd Per M/S in The Reading does not refer to grammatical usage but how a person "interprets" the ayat? If this is your position, I respectfully disagree. The God is clear (bayan) in the usage of words. We have a tendancy to "mis-interpret" its meaning if we are not careful in our study. We should approach The Reading free from all sorts of "baggage" and absorb its meaning with the help of "tasrif" and not "interpret" what The God is saying.
In 1689 we read that The God is telling the messenger..."And We have revealed the Book on YOU (alaika) explaining all things..." The God did not "reveal" His Message to us. This Message was "revealed" to the messenger and the messenger relayed (hadithina) this message to his people verbally. This is why The God calls The Message, the best hadith (see 3923).
Lets suppose this was written for the reader. Suppose the reader is female? Would this be the correct grammar for either a male or female reader?]
Be careful of "supposition." I am a female reader and student of The Reading. Given this premise, is that "supposed" to change the instructions from The God? This Message is clear, global and timeless. We are the ones who sometimes mis-interpret this Message and we need to "step up our game" and do some serious critical thinking when it comes to This Message. This is serious business...your soul depends on it!
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Thanks for sharing your knowledge and wisdom with me.
Maybe it will be easier to get the answer I seek if I pose my question this way
Let's say a piece of paper were handed to you and you did NOT know its author.
On the paper were the words
My question is might a competent female Arabic grammarian read this and say something like "why did you give this to me? This is not relevant to me because it is addressing only males"
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TheBookALone,
I agree that 1689 refers to Muhammad for the following reason the context forces that interpretation.
However, we also read in the Quran "sabbih bi hamdi rabbika..." and "'aqim al-salaata...", these 2 phrases also use the 2nd pers. sing. masc. (as a pronoun and imperative respectively). Surely, these commands are not exclusive to Muhammad.
Which takes me back to my initial point, determining the addressee of the 2nd pers. sing. masc. in any given statement is not a grammatical issue, but an interpretative one.
SAbboushi,
I believe a competent female Arab grammarian will read the statement and she will say "Why did you give this to me?"
Then you might ask "So how can the 2nd pers. sing. masc., when used in certain contexts in the Quran, refer to both genders?"
I would say that this is possible because the Quran is a universal document for all people of any gender; the following verse demonstrates this "man 3amila saalihan min dhakarin aw unthaa wa huwa mu'minun fa lanuhyiyannahu hayaatan tayyibatan...". In English "He who does good from males or females and he is a believer then we will revive him a pleasant life...". (1697)
Note how the masculine pronoun is used to refer to both sexes. This is not a linguistic feature which is exclusive to Arabic, it's a generic use of masculine constructs which is employed for the sake of brevity.
In English Law, we read statutes such as
(3) Where a person is entitled to the grant of a licence of right by reason that subsection (5) of section 16 of this Act has effect in relation to him, he shall be entitled to the grant of a wholesale dealer?s licence. (Medicines Act 1968; Part II, Subsection 6)
Note how the "person" is referred to using the masculine pronoun "he", even though it includes both sexes.
I believe the same holds true in Quranic usage.
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I agree that 1689 refers to Muhammad for the following reason the context forces that interpretation.
However, we also read in the Quran "sabbih bi hamdi rabbika..." and "'aqim al-salaata...", these 2 phrases also use the 2nd pers. sing. masc. (as a pronoun and imperative respectively). Surely, these commands are not exclusive to Muhammad.
Subject Pronoun is visible and is exclusively for second person masculine singular. Similarly the addresse is made known in the sentence "sabbih bi hamdi rabbika..." exclusively for second person masculine singular.
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I will try to convey my understanding as simply as I possibly can.
@SAbboushi
On the paper were the wordsIf you are referring to Q.2145 where it says ?And even if thou shouldst bring to those who have been given the Book?? you need to first read the context in order to get a sense of what is being conveyed.
In Q.2144 the subject of the discourse is ?ka? (2nd Per/M/Sing). Therefore, in 2145 the verb used there (ataita) must agree with the subject, be conjugated accordingly and must stay in the same tense. (See Dictionary of the Holy Quran, p..
As you read further in Q. 2145, the discourse reverts back to the initial subject of the discourse using the ?ka? (2nd Per/M/Sing). In reading the ayats in context, you are able to discern who is speaking and who is being spoken to.
Looking at these two ayats in context, alot can be discussed in these two ayats, however, simply put, The God is the addressor and the messenger is the addressee.
It is not necessary to be a "competent Arabic grammarian" to understand this Message. The God said "And certainly We have made the Quran easy to remember, but is there any one who will mind?" Q.5417
As a female with English as my first language, reading Q.2145, (if that is the ayat you are referring to when you made reference to regarding giving a female a piece of paper) I would say that this particular situation expressed in that ayat has nothing to do with me.
This particular situation was germane to the messenger during his time and whatever was going on. The God has made us privy to this information. Everything in The Reading does not pertain to us today. We are given glimpses of situations that occurred during the time of the messenger that have no bearing on us today except for the fact that we might derive some benefit and/or lesson from reading it.
This is a basic rule of grammar in any language...the subject must match the verb...for example, "He has" or "They have." You cannot say "He have" or "They has."
@uq same rules of grammar apply to your statement "sabbih bi hamdi rabbika..." and "'aqim al-salaata..." the ?ka? is the subject of the discourse and the subsequent verb must conjugate accordingly.
I do not believe I made the statement that ?ka? was exclusive to the messenger, and if I conveyed that message, I apologize, that was not my intent. I concur with Mazhar on the point that ?Ka? is only exclusive to it being 2nd Per/M/Sing.
You referenced comparing "English Law" and Quranic usage, (how The God uses His Words). There is no comparison with something created such as English Law and The Reading authored by The Creator of All Things. The God said "The Originator of the heavens and the earth. He has made for you pairs from among yourselves, and pairs of the cattle, too, multiplying you thereby. Nothing is like Him; and He is The Hearing, The Seeing." Q.4211
Would you possibly want to re-think that statement?
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@uq Thank you for clearing up my misunderstanding. Also, please excuse my typo, it should have read Dictionary of the Holy Quran, p.8
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Some of us have very busy lives...but not too busy to stop and discuss our Creator. I always have time for that! Your welcome.
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http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Tabweeb%20Part%202/101.Aatu%20Alif%20Ta%20Ya/127.gif
Verb Perfect; Second person; singular; masculine; ; Subject pronoun, nominative state; - Verbal noun. (1)1088(2)3350=2
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http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Tabweeb%20Part%202/101.Aatu%20Alif%20Ta%20Ya/16.gif
Verb Perfect; Second person; singular; masculine; Subject pronoun, in nominative state; - Verbal noun. (1)2145=1
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The Pronoun specifies only an identified and specific person. It never never includes other than one masculine person.
Dictionary-Word Analysis
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"And The God will establish the truth by His Words, though the guilty be averse." (Q.1082)
"For them is good news in this world's life and in the Hereafter. There is no changing the words of The God. That is the
Mighty Achievement." (Q.1064) -
As I ponder this "2nd person masculine singular" grammar in the Reading, I understand it to pose a problem for some muslims who believe that the prophet guides. When I read Q.2272 and 2856-57, the problems I understand they are confronted with is when you look at Q. 2272, The addressor is Allah and the addressee is the messenger. The God says to the messenger, "Their guidance is not your duty, but Allah guides..." and "sufficient is thy Lord as a Guide and a Helper." (Q.2531) and Allah doesn't need an "assistant" or "helper" to convey His Message. Also, in 2856-57, Allah says to the messenger in ayat 56 that he can't guide those whom he loves (who were right there with him), so how is he capable of guiding us today? Also, in ayat 57, Allah gives us a glimpse of what the people at that time said, "...if we follow the guidance with you..." Here we see that the messenger had to follow the guidance that was sent down also, therefore a follower cannot be an innovator and their argument of the validity of their hadith fails.
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A Guide is the one who is in possession of the road map to destination. He guides only with the help of the Road Map-the Book revealed and communicated to him.
...and what exactly are you inferring?
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...and what exactly are you inferring?
...and what exactly are you inferring?
The Book is the guide, in time and space and not other conjectural stories attributed to the Guide.
Mohammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam pronounced "And this Qur'aan has been communicated to me so that I admonish/awaken you the living people with this and to admonish/ awaken the one whom this Qur'aan reached". ;
All time Admonisher
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I agree the Book is the guide. The God told the messenger to say "...and this Quran has been revealed to me that with IT I may warn you and whomever it reaches..." (Q.619)
As far as the messenger "permanently and perpetually" a warner/awakener, The God says, "And Muhammadun is but a messenger - messengers have already passed away before him. If then he dies or is killed, will you turn back upon your heels?..." (Q.3143) Therefore, we dont need the messenger anymore once he has delivered The Message.
Also, The God says, "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)
The Messenger was the last of the prophets, but The God is "...ever sending messengers." "A mercy from thy Lord - truly He is the Hearing, the Knowing." (Q. 445-6)
Who do you understand are the messengers that The God is "ever sending"?
Mohammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam
If the Book is the Guide, where in the Book are we told to say this? In the Book, (Q.383)
"Say We believe in Allah and that which is revealed to us, and that whic was revealed to Abraham and Isshmael and Issac and Jacob and the tribes, and that which was given to Moses and Jesus and to the prophets from their Lord; we make no distinction between any of them, and to Him we submit."
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Also, The God says, "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)
The Messenger was the last of the prophets, but The God is "...ever sending messengers." "A mercy from thy Lord - truly He is the Hearing, the Knowing." (Q. 445-6)
No fault of yours to have the perception that you have mentioned.
The translator seems to have little bothered to first peep into some grammar book to know what does a deficient verb mean. Nor he seems to have bothered to first know the structure of the sentences in three worded last part Ayah. Nor he seems to have remembered or taken care the context and the reference to which the Ayah relates.
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Given your knowledge of "deficient verbs" "sentence structure" and "context and the reference to which the ayat relates"...what is your understanding of what this ayat is saying?
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Given your knowledge of "deficient verbs" "sentence structure" and "context and the reference to which the ayat relates"...what is your understanding of what this ayat is saying?
Deficient verb "kana" denotes a past transanction, act done in the past, not continuous action in the present and future as suggested in the translation quoted by you "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)