Three or Five Daily Prayers?
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Salam
I think this is a forum where everyone is allowed to present his conclusions. My conclusions may seem 'traditionalist', but I do not lend support from secondary sources. (ahadith) but i read the AT and NT and found there this aspect from five time prayers. Question now, if its allowed to take knowledge from the bible? i'm not a theologian and well versed in the bible.
The stated LInks I studied before. I read the book and like it and find it logical. However, my Arabic is not sufficient and therefore i am careful. Personally, I believe, that prayer involves both aspects. Prayer is NOT a meaningless ritual for me, but a time of contemplation with God, which gives me strength- which maybe you don't need...The ambiguity of the word 'salat' (sulla), is probably another aspect of the greatness and mercy of God, by giving each person the exact form of worship, or a different form of 'Sulla' ... A good word may be the better 'prayer' as a ritual, five times a day without reflecting. I agree with you completely . Salam
Prayer is a meaningless ritual, whatever your view is it doesn't change that fact. Prayer doesn't give you strength, it's a delusion you planted in your own mind. A fake impression
And yes these are traditionalist. You think that just because you don't believe in hadith you're free of them? Haha
Where does Allah ask us to worship Him? Please tell me, I'd love to know
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peace be upon you guys as well
http//www.quran-islam.org/main_topics/islam/pillars/al-salat_(P1192).html
http//www.yuksel.org/e/religion/salaat.htm
https//www.facebook.com/groups/310518545650653/doc/361261267243047/videos
Part 1 Positions & how many rak'a
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzoaS43fOew
Part 2 Prerequisites, Manners, and what to say)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOzex4NRl_s
Part 3 3 salat theory
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MX7Diab4Tg -
peace be upon you guys as well
http//www.quran-islam.org/main_topics/islam/pillars/al-salat_(P1192).html
http//www.yuksel.org/e/religion/salaat.htm
https//www.facebook.com/groups/310518545650653/doc/361261267243047/videos
Part 1 Positions & how many rak'a
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzoaS43fOew
Part 2 Prerequisites, Manners, and what to say)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOzex4NRl_s
Part 3 3 salat theory
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MX7Diab4TgDear Youseff,
why do you think salat is contact prayer? -
Dear Youseff,
why do you think salat is contact prayer?Muhammad is the Messenger of God. Those who are with him are hard against the unbelievers merciful one to another. You see them bowing, prostrating, seeking blessing, bounty and good pleasure (of God). Their mark is on their faces, the trace of prostration. That is their likeness in the Torah, and their likeness in the Gospel as a seed that puts forth its shoot, and strengthens it, and it grows strong and rises straight upon its stalk, pleasing the sowers, that through them it may enrage the unbelievers. God has promised those of them who believe and do deeds of righteousness forgiveness and a mighty wage(4829)
Genesis 171-4 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the Lord appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly. 3 And Abram fell on his face and God talked with him, saying, 4 As for Me, behold, My covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations.
Deuteronomy 56-9 I am the Lord thy God, which brought thee out of Egypt, from the house of bondage. 7 Thou shalt have none other gods before Me. 8 Thou shalt not make thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the waters beneath the earth 9 Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them nor serve them...
Psalm 956 O come, let us worship and bow down let us kneel before the Lord our Maker.
Revelations 711-12 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, 12 Saying, Amen Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.
Joshua 76-7 And Joshua rent his clothes, and fell to the earth upon his face before the ark of the Lord until eventide, he and the elders of Israel, and put dust upon their heads. 7 And Joshua said, Alas, O Lord God, wherefore hast Thou at all brought this people over Jordan, to deliver us into the hand of the Amorites, to destroy us? Would to God we had been content, and dwelt on the other side of the Jordan!
Numbers 1620-22 And the Lord spake unto Moses and Aaron, saying, 21 Separate yourselves from among this congregation, that I may consume them in a moment. 22 And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt Thou be wroth with the all of the congregation?
Numbers 206 And Moses and Aaron went from the presence of the assembly unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and they fell upon their faces and the glory of the Lord appeared unto them.
Matthew 2636-39 Then cometh Jesus with them unto a place called Gesthemane, and saith unto his disciples, Sit ye here, while I go and pray yonder. 37 And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be very sorrowful and heavy. 38 Then saith he unto them, my soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death; tarry ye here, and watch with me. 39 And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me nevertheless not as I will, but as Thou Wilt.
Then the man bowed down and worshipped the Lord. (Genesis, 2426)
...So they sang praises with gladness and bowed their heads and worshipped. (2 Chronicles, 2930)
and I bowed down and worshiped the Lord. I praised the Lord?(Genesis, 244
.... Then the people bowed down and worshipped...did just what the Lord commanded Moses and Aaron. (Exodus, 1227-2
and they believed. And when they heard that the Lord was concerned about them and had seen their misery, they bowed down and worshipped. (Exodus, 431)
and bowed down...three times, with his face to the ground. (1 Samuel, 2041)
Ezra praised the Lord, the great God; and all the people lifted their hands and responded, "Amen! Amen!" Then they bowed down and worshipped the Lord with their faces to the ground. (Nehemiah, 86)
Abram bowed with his face touching the ground...(Genesis, 173)
When Abraham's servant heard what they said, he bowed down to the ground before the Lord. (Genesis, 2452)
Moses bowed to the ground at once and worshipped. (Exodus, 34
When Moses heard this, he fell facedown. (Numbers, 164)
the oracle of one who hears the words of God, who sees a vision from the Almighty, who falls prostrate, and whose eyes are opened. (Numbers, 244)
Then Joshua bowed to the ground in reverence...(Joshua, 514)
When all the people saw this, they fell prostrate and cried, "The Lord?He is God! The Lord?He is God!"(1 Kings, 1839)
when I bow down in the temple...may the Lord forgive your servant for this. (2 Kings, 51
they bowed low and fell prostrate before the Lord. (1 Chronicles, 2920)
they knelt on the pavement with their faces to the ground, and they worshipped and gave thanks to the Lord...(2 Chronicles, 73)
... the king and everyone present with him knelt down and worshipped... ordered... to praise the Lord. So they sang praises with gladness and bowed their heads and worshipped. (2 Chronicles, 2929-30)
Then he fell to the ground in worship and said ?Naked I came from my mother's womb, and naked I will depart. The Lord gave and the Lord has taken away; may the name of the Lord be praised.? (Job, 120-21)
Seems pretty clear to me.
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Muhammad is the Messenger of God. Those who are with him are hard against the unbelievers merciful one to another. You see them bowing, prostrating, seeking blessing, bounty and good pleasure (of God). Their mark is on their faces, the trace of prostration. That is their likeness in the Torah, and their likeness in the Gospel as a seed that puts forth its shoot, and strengthens it, and it grows strong and rises straight upon its stalk, pleasing the sowers, that through them it may enrage the unbelievers. God has promised those of them who believe and do deeds of righteousness forgiveness and a mighty wage(4829)
Genesis 171-4 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the Lord appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly. 3 And Abram fell on his face and God talked with him, saying, 4 As for Me, behold, My covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations.
Deuteronomy 56-9 I am the Lord thy God, which brought thee out of Egypt, from the house of bondage. 7 Thou shalt have none other gods before Me. 8 Thou shalt not make thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the waters beneath the earth 9 Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them nor serve them...
Psalm 956 O come, let us worship and bow down let us kneel before the Lord our Maker.
Revelations 711-12 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, 12 Saying, Amen Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.
Joshua 76-7 And Joshua rent his clothes, and fell to the earth upon his face before the ark of the Lord until eventide, he and the elders of Israel, and put dust upon their heads. 7 And Joshua said, Alas, O Lord God, wherefore hast Thou at all brought this people over Jordan, to deliver us into the hand of the Amorites, to destroy us? Would to God we had been content, and dwelt on the other side of the Jordan!
Numbers 1620-22 And the Lord spake unto Moses and Aaron, saying, 21 Separate yourselves from among this congregation, that I may consume them in a moment. 22 And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt Thou be wroth with the all of the congregation?
Numbers 206 And Moses and Aaron went from the presence of the assembly unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and they fell upon their faces and the glory of the Lord appeared unto them.
Matthew 2636-39 Then cometh Jesus with them unto a place called Gesthemane, and saith unto his disciples, Sit ye here, while I go and pray yonder. 37 And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be very sorrowful and heavy. 38 Then saith he unto them, my soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death; tarry ye here, and watch with me. 39 And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me nevertheless not as I will, but as Thou Wilt.
Then the man bowed down and worshipped the Lord. (Genesis, 2426)
...So they sang praises with gladness and bowed their heads and worshipped. (2 Chronicles, 2930)
and I bowed down and worshiped the Lord. I praised the Lord?(Genesis, 244
.... Then the people bowed down and worshipped...did just what the Lord commanded Moses and Aaron. (Exodus, 1227-2
and they believed. And when they heard that the Lord was concerned about them and had seen their misery, they bowed down and worshipped. (Exodus, 431)
and bowed down...three times, with his face to the ground. (1 Samuel, 2041)
Ezra praised the Lord, the great God; and all the people lifted their hands and responded, "Amen! Amen!" Then they bowed down and worshipped the Lord with their faces to the ground. (Nehemiah, 86)
Abram bowed with his face touching the ground...(Genesis, 173)
When Abraham's servant heard what they said, he bowed down to the ground before the Lord. (Genesis, 2452)
Moses bowed to the ground at once and worshipped. (Exodus, 34
When Moses heard this, he fell facedown. (Numbers, 164)
the oracle of one who hears the words of God, who sees a vision from the Almighty, who falls prostrate, and whose eyes are opened. (Numbers, 244)
Then Joshua bowed to the ground in reverence...(Joshua, 514)
When all the people saw this, they fell prostrate and cried, "The Lord?He is God! The Lord?He is God!"(1 Kings, 1839)
when I bow down in the temple...may the Lord forgive your servant for this. (2 Kings, 51
they bowed low and fell prostrate before the Lord. (1 Chronicles, 2920)
they knelt on the pavement with their faces to the ground, and they worshipped and gave thanks to the Lord...(2 Chronicles, 73)
... the king and everyone present with him knelt down and worshipped... ordered... to praise the Lord. So they sang praises with gladness and bowed their heads and worshipped. (2 Chronicles, 2929-30)
Then he fell to the ground in worship and said ?Naked I came from my mother's womb, and naked I will depart. The Lord gave and the Lord has taken away; may the name of the Lord be praised.? (Job, 120-21)
Seems pretty clear to me.
All that's clear here is that you're using corrupted scriptures and verses from Quran that aren't translated correctly, not even close.
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Kaiokenred
then why don't you translate them then? and provide the alternative translation and understanding...nurmuhammed
I don't believe in a blind ritual, i don't believe in 2,4,4,3,4 cycles of salat.
i would believe in contacting and remembering God through salat. I would believe in the 3 daily salat.
This should not take a long period of your time, currently it takes me around <20 min to do my salat... -
Kaiokenred
then why don't you translate them then? and provide the alternative translation and understanding...nurmuhammed
I don't believe in a blind ritual, i don't believe in 2,4,4,3,4 cycles of salat.
i would believe in contacting and remembering God through salat. I would believe in the 3 daily salat.
This should not take a long period of your time, currently it takes me around <20 min to do my salat...I don't know arabic at all, how do you expect me to translate it?
What I do is read many translations and take the one that seems most reasonable to me, and even better if other people who know arabic (and examined Lane Lexicon ) can agree that that translation can be right
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Kaiokenred
then why don't you translate them then? and provide the alternative translation and understanding...He can't and wont, so don't bother. He is only 14 and follows Abdun Nur theologies and his "creative" (mis)translation isn't even done so he can't provide any alternatives.
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Well you need to provide an alternative understanding as a counter argument.
you're 14, God willing you still have time to mature and learn. -
Well you need to provide an alternative understanding as a counter argument.
you're 14, God willing you still have time to mature and learn.I have matured and learned, thanks to Allah, not god.
I was similar to Mr.Q a year ago. Thanks Allah for puberty -
Kaiokenred
then why don't you translate them then? and provide the alternative translation and understanding...nurmuhammed
I don't believe in a blind ritual, i don't believe in 2,4,4,3,4 cycles of salat.
i would believe in contacting and remembering God through salat. I would believe in the 3 daily salat.
This should not take a long period of your time, currently it takes me around <20 min to do my salat...I understand you,
but it is not about time, it is just about truth. As you know majority agree with contact prayers, but not with another option like it could be not contact prayer. while both parts has own proof.
As you say u would believe, when the belief is no more in need. It is just right and wrong issue.I invite you to study the word salat, if you want so.
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From Project Root List (They use Lanes Lexicon)
= Sad-Lam-Waw = prayer, supplication, petition, oration, eulogy, benediction, commendation, blessing, honour, magnify, bring forth, follow closely, walk/follow behind closely, to remain attached.
In a horse race when the second horse follows the first one so closely that its head always overlaps the first horse?s body that horse is called AL-MUSSALLI (i.e. the one who follows closely / remains attached).
Central portion of the back, portion from where the tail of an animal comes out, the rump.musalla (ي n. m. - 2125
salat (ة n. f. sing. - 23, 243, 245, 283, 2110, 2153, 2177, 2238, 2277, 443, 477, 4101, 4102, 4103, 4103, 4103, 4142, 4162, 56, 512, 555, 558, 591, 5106, 672, 692, 6162, 7170, 83, 835, 95, 911, 918, 954, 971, 9103, 1087, 1187, 11114, 1322, 1431, 1437, 1440, 1778, 17110, 1931, 1955, 1959, 2014, 20132, 2173, 2235, 2241, 2278, 232, 2437, 2441, 2456, 2458, 2458, 273, 2945, 2945, 3031, 314, 3117, 3333, 3518, 3529, 4238, 5813, 629, 6210, 7023, 7034, 7320, 985, 1075
salawat (ت nom. gen. n. plu. - 2157, 2238, 999, 2240, 239salla (ي vb.II m.
perf. act. 7531, 8715, 9610
impf. act. 339, plu. neg. 4102, plu. 4102, tusalli (ل neg. 984, yusallee (ي sing. 3343, yusalloona (ن plu. 3356
salli (ل impv. 9103, salloo (ا plu. 3356, 1082
musalleena (ن pcple. act. plu. acc. gen. 7022, 7443, 1074LL, V4, p 444, 445
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Slaamm to all sun
We are not here to Worship, only to SErve trught best actions to the ones around and not set Partners with Allah.
how can ibd can be rendered to Slaves and /worshipers ? http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=Ebd#%28152%29 no sense.. its for manipulation and total control porpuses this translation
like SALLA is not ritual prayer, the Corpus coran again fails root dl ayn ww instead of S L L, YEs we can Ask for guidence and benefit of anykind it is the Recitation, meditation, studyponder on the signs of AQ and the verification of the Signs and Signs around us in Earth and Heavens, and apply the sistem to our dailly lifes.. The Furqan against the Amount of Falacyes that are used to interpret AQ , as its the Only book passed trught mankind and to all Prphets..somehow it passes trught a profund and deep inner trevel inside of your own counscience, the stations of enlighment comes to every person if one wants to open eyes to see truth and not eat the ritualistic sheep movements full of fables contradictions and idolworshiping egoworship ...for me no nooo.. We are here to Serve by deeds and actions meditating and ponder, AQURan must be studied carefully and not just parroted ..be Wisee and build yourself with the help of the Deen sun
Slaam to all group
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Could you please restate/ provide links to "how it is evident from the quran and even looking at remains of earlier scriptures from God" ?
Will appreciate very much.highly ecommend reading Hayim H Donin's book To pray as a Jew A guide to the prayer book.
and you will also see the similarities between jewish traditions and hadiths.
I know how some people feel about wikipedia but here it is
Jewish prayer (Hebrew , tefill?h; plural Hebrew , tefillos or tefill?t; Yiddish tf?le, plural tf?lles; Yinglish davening from Yiddish davnen ?to pray?) are the prayer recitations that form part of the observance of Judaism. These prayers, often with instructions and commentary, are found in the siddur, the traditional Jewish prayer book.
Traditionally, three prayer services are recited daily
Shacharit or Shaharit (ת, from the Hebrew shachar or shahar (ר "morning light,"
Mincha or Minha (ה, the afternoon prayers named for the flour offering that accompanied sacrifices at the Temple in Jerusalem,
Arvit (ת or Ma'ariv (ב, from "nightfall."and check out this youtube video http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aHWASyMjwg
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I understand you,
but it is not about time, it is just about truth. As you know majority agree with contact prayers, but not with another option like it could be not contact prayer. while both parts has own proof.
As you say u would believe, when the belief is no more in need. It is just right and wrong issue.I invite you to study the word salat, if you want so.
But its very important that we understand the Koranic persuasion based upon how the community understands it and not how we as individuals understand it or expect it to be. I say this because in the end that is what people will follow. Right now the Koranic persuasion is led by pioneers and self reliant individuals. But soon the masses will flock. When that happens they will simply follow what there is a consensus upon.
The reality is most Koranist have an understanding of what salat is. They differ as to when and how it should be done but there is a general agreement that it should be done daily, consistently in a timely manner, that it requires some form of praise and glorification, that is requires some form of standing, bowing, prostrating and kneeling, that it requires humility and that it requires a verbal communication with not too loud of a sound or absolute silence, and that a person should not be dirty and unhygenic when he or she is performing it and it must be done with sincerity and that he should be conscious and concentrating and that it can be done individually or collectively and that it is an absolute must for a believer and it must be done for God only and to gain His favor and support.
This consensus is based on how the Koran sees it and how the previous scriptures sees it and how mankind saw it throught history and now. Its a consensus among mankind.
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Have you read the Qur'an?
Yes. And that's not a valid answer. Please answer my question.
