I'm still confused :(
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Salaam,
No matter true or false hadith, people are creating rules because of them, which sometimes even contradict the Quran.
It does not mean that you cannot find righteous ideas in the hadith, but you can sometimes wonder if it is really the word of Muhammad in the hadith and also since the Quran tells that Muhammad only uttered the teachings of it.
The praise of Muhammad in both Sunni and Shia islam is clearly idol worship, it is twisted to deny it. I have myself witnessed this in Iran where I have been located for a while and it is undeniable idolatry. The system of Sunni is basically the same, over interpretation of the Quran and interpretation due to wishful thinking and added military rules because of hadith.
I cannot see how it can be misleading to ignore man-made hadith, if one so desires. If it was so important God could have put it in His revelation of the Quran.
Now I do not say that the hadith is utterly useless if it talks about righteous things, such as tips on how to be peaceful and similar things, but it is not a divine revelation. Perhaps tips inspired by God at best.
It is not like I spend much time with hadith though, but I would possibly read some more at times. Unfortunately, most righteous things are simply common sense though.
I spend my time on reading the Quran and getting a new understanding of it instead.
It is much talk about the prayer and I believe that it is because there is not uniform prayer prescribed, the worship is individual. Prostration is simply an ancient form of courteous greeting, which is not only associated with religion.
If one chooses to follow hadith it is up to them, but then they have to be careful not letting this lead them astray.
Anything can lead one astray, even their ego and arrogance.
God bless you
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Solomon,
You say you NEED Hadith for prayer. Please show me which Hadith explains prayer start to finish, step by step. Which Hadith did you learn how to pray from? When I was a kid, no one handed me a Hadith book and said "Read this son and when you're finished, come join us for Salat". That's just not how it happens on planet Earth. My uncle taught me. I taught my kids Alhamdulillah.I think you're confusing Sunnah and Hadith. Not the same thing!
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Peace Dee
I think this will depend on the context in which the prayer is given. For example, I may mention my mom in prayer but not necessarily setting her up as God's equal.
Salam TheNabi,
I just thought it might be bad to associate any other names next to God, since the point of prayer is for the remembrance and worship of God and God alone. I'm only reminded of the following verse
39.45
And when Allah is mentioned alone, the hearts of those who do not believe in the Hereafter shrink with aversion, but when those other than Him are mentioned, immediately they rejoice.And then to make to no distinction between the Prophets
2136
Say ?We believe in God and in what was sent down to us and what was sent down to Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac, and Jacob, and the Patriarchs, and what was given to Moses and Jesus, and what was given to the prophets from their Lord; we do not make a distinction between any of them and to Him (God) we submit.?Although I do recognize the Qu'ran tells us to greet and send blessings to Prophet Mohammad (PBUH), I'm not sure if this means include him in our prayers. I can see how you can send blessings unto him and his family, after prayer is finished though. Thank you for your input.
God Bless peace
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Salaam,
Greet someone who can neither hear you nor help you?
Save your thanks until you, God willing, can meet him in person and thank him. Though even then it is God you have to thank for the most, He is worthy of all praise.
If you want to remember him, follow his example and live in the way of God.
The prophet Muhammad has already finished his trial, and is, God willing, already as blessed as one can be. Pray that God bless someone in need for it instead.
Praying for your mother or someone else alive is not idolatry, since you implore God about them, not associating them with any authoritarian role which God has exclusively. It is the intention that counts. This kind of concern for your contemporaries is just righteousness and a bonus for you.
Pray even for your enemies, like those you have got in quarrels with, it shows you can see righteously even through obstacles.
God bless you
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According to Quran, Allah collected the Quran.
Move not thy tongue concerning the (Qur'an) to make haste therewith. It is for Us to collect it and to promulgate it But when We have promulgated it, follow thou its recital (as promulgated)Then upon Us is its clarification . 7516-19
The status of Hadith
Then woe to those who write the Book with their own hands, and then say"This is from Allah," to traffic with it for miserable price!- Woe to them for what their hands do write, and for the gain they make thereby. 279
Absolutely agree on this )
Indeed, Allah confers blessing upon the Prophet, and His angels . O you who have believed, ask blessing upon him and ask peace. 3356
This is Allah's command to send blessing and peace on Prophet.
I hope it clarifies much of your confusion.
Salaam
It definitely does clarify a few things. The only versus that I felt conflicted a bit with me were the verses I mentioned above 39.45 and 2136. Thank you for taking the time to place your input, greatly appreciated.
Peace and Blessings )
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I can still not forget the three basic fundamental criteria to be forgiven by God
- Believe in God alone
- Believe in the Hereafter
- Be a righteous person
I understand what you mean here, I'm reminded of the verse 2.62 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Nazarenes (Christians), and the Sabians, whoever of them believes in God and the Last Day and does good works; they will have their recompense with their Lord, and there is no fear upon them, nor will they grieve.
I was also beginning to call myself Muslim, but now since I feel it is just a label for an invented religion I simply call myself Believer, especially since I am absolutely certain in my heart. I belong to God's religion without any by humans assigned name.
God is not limited by religion, but people seem limited by religion, they cannot see beyond their own one.
God bless you
I agree with you here, but only for cultural and unauthorized religious practices that people have taken as absolute rule. Though, in the Qur'an God does tell us that he has perfected our religion in verse 5.3 This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion.
Then God tells us to call ourselves Muslims in verse 41.33 Who is better in speech than one who calls to God and does good, righteous deeds, and says "Surely I am of the Muslims (wholly submitted to Him)?". This is what I have gathered so far, and also thank you for your time.
Peace and Blessings peace
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This is a common fallacy of hadith-rejectors and quranists. Just because you find a few Hadiths wrong, you deem the whole hadith literature as corrupt.
I completely agree here, and I was not planning to dismiss them altogether, my Sunni friend just assumed this because I was questioning them, but I am currently reading them now. I find some are very inspirational, adding great commentary to the Qu'ran, but others that definitely need to be reevaluated or discussed.
- You NEED the hadiths for prayer. You can pretend you don't, you can pretend Quran describes 100% of prayer, but the reality is that the details are so fragmented and open to hundreds of interpretations. Trust me, I read Edip, Rashad (who admits you need hadith), Quranists and other fringe groups and tried to emulate their ideas. And was not satisfied with myself at all.
I have to believe God has included how to pray in the Qu'ran, I have actually found a site that pin points where exactly. I have to believe this because, otherwise, I am admitting the Qu'ran is incomplete and that God is forgetful.
Try this Go to Sunnah.Com and try any hadith, any chapters. 90% of hadiths are all about making peace and piety, make perfect sense in the proper context. You will have to look REALLY hard to find controversial hadiths, the kind which Quranists use to mislead muslims into rejecting ALL hadiths.
I was not planning to reject all Hadiths, and I am actually currently searching this site, but thanks for posting anyways )
Look, following Quran or Hadith doesn't mean you blindly follow whatever the Sunni ulemas are saying and don't analyse yourself. My personal conclusion is that Prophet Muhammad, being the humble person he was, couldn't have uttered praise for himself, his family in his prayer, as he would appear abnormal and narcissistic to his followers if he did so. It was probably invented by later Muslims, who wanted to keep memory of the Prophet alive.
No, it is not any form of idol worship. You could genuinely admire a person. Does praying for your parents, family in Salat make you an idol worshipper? No it doesn't. Praying for peace upon Muhammad is a similar thing. Plus, there is a verse in the quran which says you have to ask for blessings on the Prophet. How you interpret the verse is your matter, but all I see is Quranists desperately trying to twist the meaning of that verse so that they don't have to do something they don't like. I like to be more straightforward and admit that I may not understand the meaning of that verse at all.
I would not include my parents names during Salat, but I would ask God to send them blessings after my prayer is completed, but this is my personal take on this. I feel I could send the same blessings to the servants, prophets, messengers, and angels of Allah. But only after my prayer to God is completed. I don't think the other ways are incorrect, as only God knows, but this is how I feel comfortable praying, and may God forgive me if I am wrong. Thank you for your input.
May Peace and Blessings Be Unto You peace
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I cannot see how it can be misleading to ignore man-made hadith, if one so desires. If it was so important God could have put it in His revelation of the Quran.
Now I do not say that the hadith is utterly useless if it talks about righteous things, such as tips on how to be peaceful and similar things, but it is not a divine revelation. Perhaps tips inspired by God at best.
My thoughts exactly. Some of them do add a bit to the Qu'ran though, but they should always be kept open for discussion, and not accepted as complete truth. Since God never promised to protect the Hadith books, as he did with our Holy Qu'ran. Thank you for your input
Peace and Blessings peace
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Praying for your mother or someone else alive is not idolatry, since you implore God about them, not associating them with any authoritarian role which God has exclusively. It is the intention that counts. This kind of concern for your contemporaries is just righteousness and a bonus for you.
Pray even for your enemies, like those you have got in quarrels with, it shows you can see righteously even through obstacles.
God bless you
I understand praying for my mother is not idol worship, I'm saying if I include my mothers name during Salat, when it is to be offered for God alone, I would feel a bit bad. I want to ask God to bless and help people after my prayer is complete. I feel comfortable this way, and I hope I have not erred, God forgive me if I have.
Peace and Blessings peace
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Miss Dee, my advice is... If he is a hardcore Sunni... and you're unwilling to spend your life wearing a veil and listening to Hadith to justify your oppression... You should turn the other way and RUN. I understand human psychology and Sunni culture. He definitely wants you as his wife but he's thinking he will change you over time. If you are not wanting to change. Get out regardless of the chemistry you may have with him. Big problems lay ahead sister. I grew up traditional Muslim.. Kinda. God gave me the courage to leave my families religion and follow Quran alone. My girlfriend (who I intend to marry Insha Allah) as luck would have it is also a 24 year old Mexican girl. Raised Catholic but never bought into it. She genuinely had a desire for the truth and it was a progression but after reading Quran and seeing the proof behind it, she whole heartedly accepted Quranist Islam. If she had not (and I didn't want to influence her decision), I would not have stayed with her. I don't want our kids going to church, celebrating pagan rituals, etc in the future. I had already made my decision but wanted to see if she would see the truth and accept it because we have great chemistry and she's my best Friend. But Practically, to raise a family and commit for life, that's not enough. It seems like you're in a similar dilemma. Perhaps your boyfriend does have the strength to accept the truth. But you won't find out until you test him. Make it clear what your standards are and what you expect from a husband. Make every logical argument as to why you believe what you believe. If he is sincere and sees the truth... Alhamdulillah. If he's attached to his childhood beliefs and can't see logic... You will be living life as a Sunni woman. Either be willing to accept it or RUN! May God bless you with the best decision for your future and hereafter. Peace!
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Salaam missdee,
It is true God perfected His religion, it is the Quran and some minor adjustments which He means by this. But Islam is a few thousand years old and existed even in the age of Abraham. And Islam is the only religion accepted by God, but that is because the term/name means a way of living. "Deen" as you hear others say.
As I wrote in other threads, anyone who submits to God alone (monotheist), believe in eternal life and live a righteous life is a Muslim, even if it would be that he was calling himself Christian, due to lack of knowledge, or simply say he honestly believes in God and that the world does not end upon death and lives as a righteous man or woman.
Muslim is the description of the "behavior" or "mindset" of the Believer, not a category of names to refer to. You are Muslim because of your struggle to learn the Truth, and I sometimes translate/paraphrase the word to Truthseeker.
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Salaam missdee,
It is true God perfected His religion, it is the Quran and some minor adjustments which He means by this. But Islam is a few thousand years old and existed even in the age of Abraham. And Islam is the only religion accepted by God, but that is because the term/name means a way of living. "Deen" as you hear others say.
As I wrote in other threads, anyone who submits to God alone (monotheist), believe in eternal life and live a righteous life is a Muslim, even if it would be that he was calling himself Christian, due to lack of knowledge, or simply say he honestly believes in God and that the world does not end upon death and lives as a righteous man or woman.
Muslim is the description of the "behavior" or "mindset" of the Believer, not a category of names to refer to. You are Muslim because of your struggle to learn the Truth, and I sometimes translate/paraphrase the word to Truthseeker.
Salam,
I cannot claim I know what God means in this verse, because only he knows the absolute truth, and I'm forbidden to debate anything I don't have knowledge of. So I digress -X
I actually believe in a similar set of views that you do. I believe people are not damned to hell simply for lack of knowledge. Like the Qu'ran states, as long as you believe in God, do righteous deeds, and believe in the Day of Judgement, no matter whether your Jew, Christian, you will have your recompense with God, the Qu'ran clearly states this. I just believe the Qu'ran is the ultimate guide because God has protected his book. This is simply what I believe, to each his own right? P
May Peace and Blessings be Upon You peace
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Salaam,
There is no compulsion in religion, God will judge us where each individual went wrong.
Quran is the mercy and for us a Guide which caused the religion to become perfect. Those before it only had various scrolls scattered here and there.
People have different opinions about this, but I regard the Quranic verses to be recommendations to best worship God. This means you can still read only the Bible and be righteous and come to Heaven.
But to refuse the Quran as a revelation I suppose is a big minus for people. Mostly it is due to prejudices against the Muslim community that make people neglect the Quran and poor translations which promote strange behavior. If they had the better translations and got rid of their preconception of Islam, everyone would embrace Quran.Quran. It is irrational to ignore this perfect scripture.
God bless you
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But to refuse the Quran as a revelation I suppose is a big minus for people. Mostly it is due to prejudices against the Muslim community that make people neglect the Quran and poor translations which promote strange behavior. If they had the better translations and got rid of their preconception of Islam, everyone would embrace Quran.Quran. It is irrational to ignore this perfect scripture.
God bless you
Exactly my thoughts )
May Peace and Blessings be unto You peace -
Peace
So hold fast to all that has been revealed to thee for, behold, thou art on a straight way; (4344)
As you see God never mentions to hold fast to haddits.
ART THOU NOT aware that it is God whose limitless glory all that are in the
heavens and on earth extol, even the birds as they spread out their wings?62 Each
knows indeed how to pray unto Him and to glorify Him; and God has full knowledge of all that
they do (2442) for, God's is the dominion over the heavens and the earth, and with God is all
journeys' end.
2443My belief is that every person(or maybe every community) will have his/her own way regarding prayer. As long as only the Glorious name of our lord is glorified, and no other name is mentioned besides His, I believe the person praying is not sinning. I am not of the idea that is okay to mention prophets, or even your own parents, during a prayer that is meant to glorify and exalt the name of our God the Most Merciful.
I personally like Mohamed Asad translation of the Holy Qur'an is very reasonable, and the Monotheist translation is fair too. But, I don't like those from saudi arabia because they put too much stuff from hadiths and traditions into the translation.
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Peace
So hold fast to all that has been revealed to thee for, behold, thou art on a straight way; (4344)
As you see God never mentions to hold fast to haddits.
ART THOU NOT aware that it is God whose limitless glory all that are in the
heavens and on earth extol, even the birds as they spread out their wings?62 Each
knows indeed how to pray unto Him and to glorify Him; and God has full knowledge of all that
they do (2442) for, God's is the dominion over the heavens and the earth, and with God is all
journeys' end.
2443My belief is that every person(or maybe every community) will have his/her own way regarding prayer. As long as only the Glorious name of our lord is glorified, and no other name is mentioned besides His, I believe the person praying is not sinning. I am not of the idea that is okay to mention prophets, or even your own parents, during a prayer that is meant to glorify and exalt the name of our God the Most Merciful.
I personally like Mohamed Asad translation of the Holy Qur'an is very reasonable, and the Monotheist translation is fair too. But, I don't like those from saudi arabia because they put too much stuff from hadiths and traditions into the translation.
Salam,
This is very true, God will guide us to his path and his path alone, Insh'Allah. I'm also not comfortable adding any other names besides God during my prayers, but this goes from a person to person consensus, I will not judge anybody who does so. I don't think I've read Mohammad Asad's translation, I'll have to check it out, thanks for your input.
May Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon You peace