More salat and ra'kat discussion
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I do three salatFajr(morning), wustha (middle) and Esya (dusk).
My other salatTahhajud (1/3 night), Janazah salat (funeral prayer) and Jumu'ah prayer (I don't see it as obligatory).For Jumu'ah prayer, I agree with @Bender, if word jumu'ah cannot be translated to Roman friday, but translated to gathering salat and the gathering can be implemented in another day, not only friday.
I simply standing with recite Al Fatehah then another recitation for glorifying Him.
Then bowing then prostating then sit with saying"Ya Allah, Ar Rahmaan" and another Allah's name.This is based from chapter 17110.After sit, I prostating again with recite sentences from chapter 17111.
How long I salat, is depending on my mouth's strength to saying Allah's name, if my mouth is tired, so I will end my salat.
I didn't recognize raka'at, sice it's not exist in Quran, I simply do salat in one rakaat.You can do 4,3,6 rakaat whatever you want. -
Peace,
I will have to look it up about salaam to God. I could not imagine that greeting God with salaam would be as bad as "blasphemous". God says "Peace!" is our greeting, so why not allowed to greet Himself with it? I use Salam plus His powerful attributes. But since you so nicely warned me I will look it up and research on it in Quran.
Regarding the prayer "Our Lord in Heaven" with 7 verses; this prayer does not imply that God is limited to Heaven. However, even Quran tells God resides somewhere else. I believe this prayer to actually have been coming down with Jesus and that is why I use it. I see nothing blasphemous in it and it actually suits the Muslim ways. Have you even read the prayer once?
I changed Father to Lord because I think the word Father is a poor translation of the original word Jesus uttered. I am sure Jesus called for the Lord when it says Father in the New Testament. I will continue to use this prayer in my worship of God, it is a nice supplication.
God bless you
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Peace again,
If you have a better translation than this on 3344 I may change my mind about salam to God "Their greeting the day they meet Him is "Salaam" and He has prepared for them a generous recompense".
Of course you can say salaam to God as He is as-salaam himself, it would be as uttering His name. In this case I greet him with it and Quran does not seem to dislike the behavior. I love God, can I not wish my Master peace as He wished me peace?
Hope you understand me and if you do not want to wish God peace then that is up to you. I have my ways and you may have yours.
God bless you
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Peace,
I will have to look it up about salaam to God. I could not imagine that greeting God with salaam would be as bad as "blasphemous". God says "Peace!" is our greeting, so why not allowed to greet Himself with it? I use Salam plus His powerful attributes. But since you so nicely warned me I will look it up and research on it in Quran.
Salaamun alayka,
imo it's not blasphemous for you because you have different understanding on the words with your best intentions.
Regarding the prayer "Our Lord in Heaven" with 7 verses; this prayer does not imply that God is limited to Heaven. However, even Quran tells God resides somewhere else. I believe this prayer to actually have been coming down with Jesus and that is why I use it. I see nothing blasphemous in it and it actually suits the Muslim ways. Have you even read the prayer once?
RED God does not have a residence &
The verse kgwithnob mentioned (4384) does not say that Allah resides in the heaven and the earth nope
It says He is in the heaven God and in the earth God, it does not mean that he lives there nopeSalaam,
Bender -
Peace again,
If you have a better translation than this on 3344 I may change my mind about salam to God "Their greeting the day they meet Him is "Salaam" and He has prepared for them a generous recompense".
Of course you can say salaam to God as He is as-salaam himself, it would be as uttering His name. In this case I greet him with it and Quran does not seem to dislike the behavior. I love God, can I not wish my Master peace as He wished me peace?
Hope you understand me and if you do not want to wish God peace then that is up to you. I have my ways and you may have yours.
God bless you
Salaamun alayka,
RED it does not say "Their greeting TO HIM the day they meet Him is "Salaam" ", But THEIR GREETING.
Besides this, I think "greeting" is not the best translation, check for example 2575
2575 These will be rewarded with a dwelling for what they have been patient for, and they will find in it tahiyyatan AND salaman.Salaam,
Bender -
Peace Bender,
Anyway, the meaning with Lord in Heaven is not to mean he is confined there and has no might over Earth, it is just a saying. I usually see Heaven as the whole Universe, including Earth. I am sure Jesus never had any polytheistic mindset.
I am still certain that God is present here through the Holy Spirit mainly and reside in His own place. In some verse in Quran it says something like "Do they wait until God comes with His angels?". I see the Holy Spirit as the energy of God, so He sure is present here in ways and can control everything.
Even if the verse I posted did not mean to specifically say salam to God I doubt it is blasphemous to say hello to my maker while I mention his powerful attributes.
Ah well, I do as I can to serve my Lord.
God bless you
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Peace Bender,
Anyway, the meaning with Lord in Heaven is not to mean he is confined there and has no might over Earth, it is just a saying. I usually see Heaven as the whole Universe, including Earth. I am sure Jesus never had any polytheistic mindset.
I am still certain that God is present here through the Holy Spirit mainly and reside in His own place. In some verse in Quran it says something like "Do they wait until God comes with His angels?". I see the Holy Spirit as the energy of God, so He sure is present here in ways and can control everything.
Even if the verse I posted did not mean to specifically say salam to God I doubt it is blasphemous to say hello to my maker while I mention his powerful attributes.
Ah well, I do as I can to serve my Lord.
God bless you
Salaamun alayka MoF,
I already understood that you meant something like "hi" with "salaam".
But in Quranic arabic it has different meaning. for example "salaamun alayka" means something like "peace be upon you".
It is kind of weird to say something like that to Allah.REDs
If ones reads them then it reads like a personification of God.
Remember verses like this
2559 The One who has created the heavens and the earth and what is between them in six days, then He settled upon the Throne. The Almighty; so ask Him for He is Expert.
Before He created the heavens and the earth and what is between them where was He?
I think it is better to say something like "Lord of Heaven" instead of "Lord in Heaven"Salaam,
Bender -
Please share to me @Man of Faith, how you can salat for long time?What kind of your salat?meditation or something?what do you recite during that minutes?
It' nothing.But your action remind me when I still follow a shirk martial arts 5 years ago.The senior gave me a paper with some du'as (which quoted from Quran n Hadith) written on it.Then after salat, I must recite that du'as in thousand time and must finished it in one day, of course, my salat can be done in one hour, two hours.I must do this for three days, then the senior claimed that I will get new "power".
rotfl
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...I could not imagine that greeting God with salaam would be as bad as "blasphemous". God says "Peace!" is our greeting, so why not allowed to greet Himself with it?...
The highlight above is from me.
Dear Man of Faith,
I am NOT questioning your faith or your intentions at all. I'm just expressing my opinion when deemed necessary, as the following also intended to mean just the same.
Regarding the SALAAM issue; we use it to whish each other PEACE and tranquility when we meet, and the reason is that we as weak and vulnerable earthly creatures are always prone to calamities and disturbances of this short worldly life. On the other hand GOD, the Almighty, is the Supreme, the Eternal, and Supernatural, away from all disturbances and calamities. He is the absolute and infinite PEACE/SALAAM. We are the ones in need of His peace at all times, and we better always beg of him to bestow on us from His Peace if He wills.
...Regarding the prayer "Our Lord in Heaven" with 7 verses; this prayer does not imply that God is limited to Heaven. However, even Quran tells God resides somewhere else....
Please let us know where in The Qur'aan GOD, swt, says He resides "somewhere else", as you claimed above.
Allaah, swt, is INFINITE in size. He does not fit in anything or anywhere. He is the container for ALL things. The Old testament, in Isaiah 661 we read Thus saith the Lord, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool where is the house that ye build unto me, and where is the place of my rest? The Qur?aan in 2255 puts it in a better and more correct context ? His Kursi/FOOTSTOOL extends over the heavens and the earth, and their preservation tires Him not. And He is the Most High, the Most Great. This verse informs us that, the whole creation which consists of the HEAVENS and the Earth is hardly as big as His footstool which is very tiny compared to His THRONE/?ARSH/KINGDOM. In other words, we cannot limit the existence of GOD, the Almighty, to any particular or certain place or time. He is the Omnipresent, meaning, He is present everywhere, be subatomic or intergalactic, at all times.
If you have a better translation than this on 3344 I may change my mind about salam to God
About 3344;
Their saying of ?Hi?/TAHIYAH/GREETINGS is going to be ?SALAAM?/PEACE the day they?ll meet Him and He has prepared for them a noble reward.
The word ?TAHIYAH? in Arabic language in a literal sense means ?to live on?/continue living, but in the Hereafter we are not going to be mortal, so instead of saying ?Hi/TAHIYA? we will greet each other by saying ?PEACE?.
Peace,
Khalil -
Peace Bender, Kgwithnob
I agree that salam to God was not so thought through, I should have not rushed into a change in words. I only did it during two days after I had revised my own individual prayer. I am choosing something else now to say which does not seem weird, like the first thing they say in 3344 about glorifying God.
However, I will keep thinking about the salam to God issue because it felt interesting. I have read about blessings to the Lord, but I will read up on it more in depth before I make any more utterances.
But I will keep reciting the Jesus prayer because I think it was a true prayer and not an invention. Lord of Heaven might be better though, I think the original translation might be flawed. It is like a supplication (dua) for me. If you have read these 7 verses you will realize there is nothing wrong with it.
Earthdom The actual prayer sequence is over after about 10 minutes. After that I have free speech and meditation which sums up to 30 to 60 minutes, but I may have been exaggerating the duration. It seldom is more than 20 to 40 minutes although it occasionally reaches an hour.
God bless the three of you
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Peace Bender, Kgwithnob
But I will keep reciting the Jesus prayer because I think it was a true prayer and not an invention. Lord of Heaven might be better though, I think the original translation might be flawed. It is like a supplication (dua) for me. If you have read these 7 verses you will realize there is nothing wrong with it.
God bless the three of you
Salaamun alayka,
I went to a Christian elementary school when I was young. We did the prayer every morning and afternoon. From what I remember, it looks like a translation of the first chapter of The Quran which evolved by time (I mean the translation).
Salaam and may Allah bless you 2,
Bender -
Peace Bender,
I do not agree. The contents of this prayer is different from chapter 1 of Quran, but it sounds more like a supplication than the backbone of a prayer. I like that it has seven verses though since I admire this number
It talks mainly about forgiving others that the Lord may forgive us and other islamic main points which is not strange since Jesus was a muslim.
I find it suiting my muslim life and that is why I use the verses and it is not because I still live a Christian life. Also, I never believed in Jesus divinity or the trinity. You have to excuse me, brother, I use the Bible for inspiration sometimes.
God bless you
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peace all,
In my view, with regard to number of salat or even rakat, there is no issue if
- one is to the best of their knowledge/effort/research doing what they think is right
- they are sincere in this
- they continue to seek knowledge etc
Personally, I don't see how anyone can reasonably conclude from reading Quran that a salat has "rakat" units and there is a salat called "wusta" but that's just me.
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I should point out that fulfilling the three criteria above is perhaps not as easy as one might think, for example in my view being "sincere" I think it is common for Muslims to have/do a certain act/belief/practice as part of their religion but if one were to ask them how much time/effort have you spent determining that to be a true/evidenced/accurate act/belief/practice very few would actually say they have spent significant time on it or given this their best effort.
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Peace,
There appears to be five salats
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9605189.msg324894#msg324894
I consider that post to be poor. It simply repeats the same errors as repeated many times before. By far the best discussions on salat can be found here
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598319.0To be honest I am surprised anyone reads that post you linked to and considers it good UNLESS they believe in code 19, as they seem to readily take numerology as "good" evidence.
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Peace Wakas,
Trust me. I am trying to find ways of validating or invalidating my current practice as often as I can. Much of my time goes to try to think if I actually do the right thing. I am not extremely conservative, but since I still have no overwhelming proof that invalidates the rakah system I continue with it. I know, there is no proof validating the practice either, but I find it not to be blasphemous to my Lord.
My modification with stretched up hands is relatively new and I found some texts in the Bible talking about it and I know Zoroastrians pray like that.
Between all these unreliable sources, I actually think salat is not a uniform prayer but an individual one. The personal connection to God is more important than doing some robot-like movements several times daily.
With the above in mind I try to liven up my prayers even if I still condone to the traditional movement. The ending with free talk and meditation is a way to make a more flexible relationship to God (if you read about my prayer).
God bless you
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I consider that post to be poor. It simply repeats the same errors as repeated many times before. By far the best discussions on salat can be found here
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598319.0To be honest I am surprised anyone reads that post you linked to and considers it good UNLESS they believe in code 19, as they seem to readily take numerology as "good" evidence.
Peace Wakas,
The 19 reference is incidental and irrevelant, the point is, are there three or five salat,
and navidfa makes a valid point that there are five. Having said that, now look at the
ayats and make your dispute directed at the ayats and not 19.peace
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Peace Wakas,
The 19 reference is incidental and irrevelant, the point is, are there three or five salat,
and navidfa makes a valid point that there are five. Having said that, now look at the
ayats and make your dispute directed at the ayats and not 19.peace
The highlight above is from me.
Verse 2238 determines the number of SALAATs/prayers, per day. The verse commands us to safeguard over our SALAWAAT/prayers and the SALAATULWUSTA. The Arabic word SALAWAAT is plural and must be at least 3. The word SALAATULWUSTA means the MIDDLE prayer. From this we conclude that the total number of daily SALAATs must be at least 5. The proof is that, SALAWAAT cannot be 3, because 3 is an odd number and has no middle. It should be 4 in order for the SALAATULWUSTA to sit right in the middle of it. 4=2+2. So, the total number of daily SALAATs/prayers=2+SALAATULWUSTA+2=5.
Verse 2238,
Safeguard over your prayers and the middle prayer and stand before Allaah with devotion.
Peace,
Khalil -
Peace @Wakas.
I already reading your posts and your website (studyquran.com)
You may translate sujud as not physiccal prostating.Then I want to know is how do you perform salat?
Salaam
