Quranic laws for war

Lena

Al Qaeda attacked USA because of their support for and their propping up of the authoritarian and oppressive regimes in Saudi, Egypt, Jordan,Gulf States & Israel where dissident citizens are murdered, tortured, raped etc. The USA supports these regimes because of their own economic and political interests - they helped to install them in power and they help them to maintain their power,to the extent that the USA even set up military bases in Saudi Arabia. They supply them with weapons. The USA is therefore colluding in the oppression and murder of the freedom seeking people of these countries.

Britain invaded Afghanistan to support the USA in response to the 9/11 Al Qaeda attack on USA. Those responsible for planning the attack were using Afghanistan as their base and for their training camps. The Taliban rulers of Afghanistan gave support to those who planned the attack.

Al Qaeda and the Taliban call themselves Muslim but do not follow God's Quranic laws and engage in oppression and murder.

So we have two parties at war and both are guilty of colluding in the oppression and murder of people who want freedom. Neither party follows God's Quranic laws.

Two people who call themselves Muslims attack and kill an off duty soldier on a London street. This soldier had previously been with the British forces in Afghanistan and Iraq. Their reasoning for killing him seems to be that Muslims are at war with Britain because Britain has invaded Muslim countries (including Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq).

Do God's Quranic rules of war apply to this situation and if so how do they apply?

Is there any verse in Quran that says a Muslim must go to war with the attackers if other Muslims are attacked?

Do the Quranic rules of war consider an off duty soldier to still be an "enemy combatant" (according to the Pentagons rules of war - yes they are.)

The two guys who killed the soldier are from Britain of Nigerian ancestry. Do Quranic rules of war require all Muslims to fight those who wage war against other Muslims or is it localised to the specific communities/people who are attacked eg British Nigerians were not being physically attacked or prevented from practising their religion in Britain so they had no right to fight back.

Does the "you" in the following Quranic verses refer to you personally, or you as a specific local/national community, or you as Muslims throughout the world?
You may fight in the cause of GOD against those who attack you, but do not aggress. GOD does not love the aggressors.

You may kill those who wage war against you, and you may evict them whence they evicted you. Oppression is worse than murder. Do not fight them at the Sacred Masjid, unless they attack you therein. If they attack you, you may kill them. This is the just retribution for those disbelievers.

If they refrain, then GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.

You may also fight them to eliminate oppression, and to worship GOD freely. If they refrain, you shall not aggress; aggression is permitted only against the aggressors.

Also 22.30 states war is permitted for self defense. Permission to fight is given to those upon whom war is made because they are oppressed.

608-9. Fighting is allowed strictly in self-defense, while aggression and oppression are strongly condemned throughout the Quran.

Islam means peace and Quran promotes peace and mercy, so it would seem that as long as disputes can be settled through conciliatory means and rights and claims can be peacefully attained and imposed, Muslims are required to refrain from fighting. Only, when there is no other option, must Muslims then fight and induce the enemy to live in peaceful and equitable co-existence with the believers.

An agreement for withdrawal of forces has been negotiated with all forces to be withdrawn by 2014. If these 2 guys are Muslims who follow the Quranic laws of war, and Muslims are required to support other Muslims worldwide if they are attacked, and they were fighting to defend innocent Muslims (the collateral damage civilians) in Afghanistan against British attacks, then can they go after an off duty soldier walking in a street in London given he may have participated in such attacks that killed innocent Afghan citizens? Quranically speaking would this need to be confirmed - that he actually participated in an attack that killed innocent Muslim civilians. What if the civilians killed were not Muslims?

Does Quran rules of war require these two guys to refrain from any kind of fighting once the agreement was signed? Does this apply to the intervening period before the troops are withdrawn or are the troops considered to still be at at war right up until their withdrawal?

Jafar

Al Qaeda attacked USA because of their support for and their propping up of the authoritarian and oppressive regimes in Saudi, Egypt, Jordan,Gulf States & Israel where dissident citizens are murdered, tortured, raped etc.

USA government (CIA) trained Osama Bin Laden and his cohort on the 'basic' of military and intelligent operation (a.k.a 'terrorism' if it's being applied to USA) during Afghan - Soviet war. Not only that; the USA Government also supply them with weaponry ranging from small arms up to anti-tank rockets to 'kick the russian's arse', and most of it are also through the service of Osama Bin Laden and his cohorts.
Osama Bin Laden enjoy the 'power and respect' that he got from the Arabs and the Afghani due to his 'brokering' role of supplying money, arms and weapons to Afghanistan.
The Soviet finally lost the war in Afghanistan.
Osama Bin Laden found himself 'jobless' and powerless, given he's not an Afghani in the first place and he now ain't got any other skills except

Waging 'military and intelligent operation'.
Spreading hatred and enmity towards the "kuffar"

And he think, hey why not wage a 'jihad' against 'our previous mentor'?
Who are supporting the people which he hates the most, the jews..
Osama Bin Laden once again found a job, fame, power and respect he desired.

The USA supports these regimes because of their own economic and political interests - they helped to install them in power

USA government did not install them to power, it was the British and the French..

and they help them to maintain their power,to the extent that the USA even set up military bases in Saudi Arabia. They supply them with weapons. The USA is therefore colluding in the oppression and murder of the freedom seeking people of these countries.

The USA Govt set up a military base in Saudi Arabia, due to the 'request' of the Al-Saud family who feared Saddam Hussein's invasion from Kuwait and not from any 'revolution' and/or internal insurgent within Saudi Arabia.

It was considered as a 'return favor' of Saudi Arabia's help on dismantling Soviet Union's economy through crashing the world oil price.

Al Qaeda and the Taliban call themselves Muslim but do not follow God's Quranic laws and engage in oppression and murder.

To be truly honest most of those who label themselves Muslim do not follow God's recommendation as written in the Quran and/or learn to derive wisdom from it.

So we have two parties at war and both are guilty of colluding in the oppression and murder of people who want freedom. Neither party follows God's Quranic laws.

It's much more complicated than that.. as in any other 'political conflict'..

Two people who call themselves Muslims attack and kill an off duty soldier on a London street. This soldier had previously been with the British forces in Afghanistan and Iraq. Their reasoning for killing him seems to be that Muslims are at war with Britain because Britain has invaded Muslim countries (including Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq).

It's a criminal case, with religious hatred as motive..
And Britain did not invade Pakistan and/or declare war against Pakistan, infact London now is packed with Pakis..

Do God's Quranic rules of war apply to this situation and if so how do they apply?

Nope.. this is a murder case..

Is there any verse in Quran that says a Muslim must go to war with the attackers if other Muslims are attacked?

There are verses on waging war to establish order and ending an oppression.

The two guys who killed the soldier are from Britain of Nigerian ancestry. Do Quranic rules of war require all Muslims to fight those who wage war against other Muslims or is it localised to the specific communities/people who are attacked eg British Nigerians were not being physically attacked or prevented from practising their religion in Britain so they had no right to fight back.

Like I said the case is strictly a murder case with religious hatred as motive..

And in the Quran it's clear that 'defending people just merely because they are sharing your social identity' is not a justified action.

Read the story of a mistake made by Moses who (presumed to be accidentally) murdered an Egyptian just because he saw a fight/quarrel between an Egyptian and a Jew (which share the same social identity as Moses) and he (foolishly) defend the Jew without knowing the full context of the fight/quarrel. Later on he found out that the Jew is actually the trouble-maker.

"What is the true objective of war? The true objective of war is to conquer the enemy's heart, if the enemy's heart is not yet being conquered then the war is far from over"
-- Sun Tzu

Salam / Peace

unknownuser

Al Qaeda attacked USA because of their support for and their propping up of the authoritarian and oppressive regimes in Saudi, Egypt, Jordan,Gulf States & Israel where dissident citizens are murdered, tortured, raped etc.

Back in the Gulf war, Osama ever offering his men in Afghanistan to Saudi family help against Iraqi forces in Kuwait, but the Saudi refused instead Saudi accept the offering by Coalition especially from America cause it will bring more profits.Maybe this incident to be condisered as one of the cause of rivalry between Qaeda and USA in the term of influence especially in Jazirah Arab.

he's not an Afghani in the first place and he now ain't got any other skills

Yes he atually is Saudis.According to my book, he ever get nationality from Yemen and protected by it's goverment, but later he expelled.

USA government did not install them to power, it was the British and the French..

Really??Can you explain more?

You may fight in the cause of GOD against those who attack you, but do not aggress. GOD does not love the aggressors.

You may kill those who wage war against you, and you may evict them whence they evicted you. Oppression is worse than murder. Do not fight them at the Sacred Masjid, unless they attack you therein. If they attack you, you may kill them. This is the just retribution for those disbelievers.

One things what we must know before study Quran is "all verses in the Quran was correlated each other"

Example

2191 "And kill them wherever you encounter them......"

This verse is in the state of war.If we look in all verses in the Quran,what people who we must killied is our enemy in that war or the hypocrites who oppresing Muslims.

551 "O you who believe, do not take the Jews and the Nazarenes as auliya' (leader,allies,helper,best friend)......"

This means we musn't take Christians or Jews as our friend??It's poor.
If we look in surrounding or all verses in the Quran is that Jews-Christians who cannot be taken as auliya' is the Jews-Christian who oppressed or mocking the Muslims.

Lena

It's a criminal case, with religious hatred as motive..

And in the Quran it's clear that 'defending people just merely because they are sharing your social identity' is not a justified action.

Peace and thanks Jafar for your comments and adding to my political knowledge of those events.

How did you distingish that these 2 guys were not sharing a religious identity with Muslims who were coming under attack in Afghanistan and were instead motivated by religious hatred - I assume you mean they hated the religion of the soldier.

I see your point about knowing the full context of the quarrel.

Yes, I agree, most people who call themselves Muslims are not Muslims but do they engage in oppression and murder?

I am also thinking about the use of drones to attack "enemy combatants" and the deaths of civilian Muslims during drone strikes. The soldier is not on the battlefield but initiates the attack from their own country. Can an attack on the military institutions (including soldiers/barracks etc) of the home country of the drone operator be justified using Quranic laws of war given your point about the context of the quarrel, which seems to be two oppressive parties fighting each other for power, influence and control of the resources in the Middle East / Afghanistan region?

Lena

One things what we must know before study Quran is "all verses in the Quran was correlated each other"

Example

2191 "And kill them wherever you encounter them......"

This verse is in the state of war.If we look in all verses in the Quran,what people who we must killied is our enemy in that war or the hypocrites who oppresing Muslims.

551 "O you who believe, do not take the Jews and the Nazarenes as auliya' (leader,allies,helper,best friend)......"

This means we musn't take Christians or Jews as our friend??It's poor.
If we look in surrounding or all verses in the Quran is that Jews-Christians who cannot be taken as auliya' is the Jews-Christian who oppressed or mocking the Muslims.

Peace Earthdom
Yes I totally agree that Quranic verses must be read in context and state that for Muslims war can only be in self defense in response to oppression and physical attack when they are not able to negotiate a peaceful way out of the situation. Then the questions I have are

Was the USA / British & allies attack on Taliban in Afghanistan a physical one on a Muslim community?
Who did they attack? They attacked the Taliban who by their oppressive actions cannot be considered Muslims.

However, innocent civilians were also caught up in their attacks and killed. What is the Quranic rule of law about the death of innocent Muslims during war?

Were the USA/British & allies oppressing innocent Muslims in Afghanistan and Iraq? Yes, those who were mistakenly arrested, those whose houses were invaded in the middle of the night etc Does that give other Muslims the right to attack soldiers involved in these wars? What does Quran say about the rights and recompense for innocent Muslims who suffer during a war between 2 non Muslim parties?

Sonny

Al Qaeda attacked USA because of their support for and their propping up of the authoritarian and oppressive regimes in Saudi, Egypt, Jordan,Gulf States & Israel where dissident citizens are murdered, tortured, raped etc. The USA supports these regimes because of their own economic and political interests - they helped to install them in power and they help them to maintain their power,to the extent that the USA even set up military bases in Saudi Arabia. They supply them with weapons. The USA is therefore colluding in the oppression and murder of the freedom seeking people of these countries.

First of all 9/11 was inside job, there is tons of proof for this but we can't see it because media is controled by Israeli zionist lobby which controls US government and their puppets in arab world like Qatar and Saudis, wahhabi regimes which is everything but islamic regime. Wahhabism is death cult.
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0xzsbSbVUE
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ins0So67Yc

Second, as Quran prophecied childern of israel will cause corruption on earth twice, second time after coming back to their land which is NOW. Israeli zionist regime started middle east war and I believe 9/11 was an mossad operation. Just for example there were 5 israelis arrested after somebody noticed they were actually dancing after planes crashed in WTC, 150 mossad agents were arrested and than released after 9/11, Bin Laden said he has nothing to do with 9/11 in his letter, he died in 2001 just after that. Everything you hear on CNN and FOX is bunch of crap and lies, they were caught hundreds of time faking news.
Watch these videos

http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=90Pm2Zpbq_4
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=clGJzywgtqc

Third, Osama Bin Laden was trained by CIA to fight russians in Afghanistan in 90's, I heard his father was also a cia agent.
War on terror is bunch of lies.

We decreed in the Book for the tribe of Israel "You will twice cause corruption on Earth and you will reach great haughtiness. When the promised first time came, We sent against you servants of Ours possessing great force, and they ransacked your houses, rampaging right through them. It was a promise that was fulfilled. Then once again We gave you the upper hand over them, supplied you with more wealth and children, and made you the most numerous group." (Qur'an, 174-6)

Jafar

Back in the Gulf war, Osama ever offering his men in Afghanistan to Saudi family help against Iraqi forces in Kuwait, but the Saudi refused instead Saudi accept the offering by Coalition especially from America cause it will bring more profits.Maybe this incident to be condisered as one of the cause of rivalry between Qaeda and USA in the term of influence especially in Jazirah Arab.

It was Al Saud's request for 'US military base'. So it was not USA begging for permit on military base..
And the decision make sense isn't it?
What will you choose if you're Fahd bin Al Saud? US modern troops or Osama's suicide bombers?

He's just following the footstep of 'smart decision' made by his great grandpa.

http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Sabilla
The Battle of Sabilla (March 29, 1929) was the main battle of the Ikhwan Revolt in northern Arabia between the rebellious Ikhwan forces and the army of Ibn Saud. It was the last major battle in which one side rode camels, as the Ikhwan emphasized radical conservatism and shunned technological modernization. The rebellious, but technologically mediocre, Ikhwan were decisively defeated by the Saudi forces, which included machine-guns and cavalry. Faisal al-Dawish, one of the three leaders of the rebellious Ikhwan tribes, was wounded in the battle. According to Ibn Saud Information Resource, his injury was "serious". Sultan bin Bajad, allegedly fled the battle scene

Really??Can you explain more?

http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibn_Saud_of_Saudi_Arabia
During World War I, the British government established diplomatic relations with Ibn Saud. The British agent, Captain William Shakespear, was well received by the Bedouin. Similar diplomatic missions were established with any Arabian power who might have been able to unify and stabilize the region. The British entered into a treaty in December 1915 (the "Treaty of Darin&quot which made the lands of the House of Saud a British protectorate and attempted to define the boundaries of the developing Saudi state. In exchange, Ibn Saud pledged to again make war against Ibn Rashid, who was an ally of the Ottoman Turks.

On 20 May 1927, the British government signed the Treaty of Jeddah, which abolished the Darin protection agreement and recognized the independence of the Hejaz and Najd with Ibn Saud as its ruler.

This means we musn't take Christians or Jews as our friend??It's poor.
If we look in surrounding or all verses in the Quran is that Jews-Christians who cannot be taken as auliya' is the Jews-Christian who oppressed or mocking the Muslims.

It means don't trust the sectarians, the Judaist (Hadu) and Christians is a great example of sectarian people during Muhammad's time. Since during Muhammad's time the Sunnis, Shiites and other sectarian groups were not yet in existence..

The common characteristic of sectarians is that they always have the tendency of 'defending their own member of their own sect/religion' and when they have the power they will oppress other people, especially those who are outside of their own religion/sect/group. (The sunnis oppressing the Shiites, The Sunnis oppressing the Ahmadis, The Catholics oppressing the Jews, The Catholics oppressing the Orthodox, The Communist killing the Orthodox etc)

Salam / Peace

unknownuser

Was the USA / British & allies attack on Taliban in Afghanistan a physical one on a Muslim community?
Who did they attack? They attacked the Taliban who by their oppressive actions cannot be considered Muslims.

However, innocent civilians were also caught up in their attacks and killed. What is the Quranic rule of law about the death of innocent Muslims during war?

Yes all is changed after 9/11 incident.Some US n allied country politicians turned their view from leftist (Cold war) to Islam n even Islamophobia spreading in the whole world.
Look, after 9/11 incident, US and its allies declaring war against terror, exampleInvasion of Iraq 2003, and toppling Taleban's government in Afganistan.
The reason the NATO attacking Taliban is the Taliban proven to helping hiding Osama and Taliban accused to have contact with Qaeda.Unlike Qaeda, Taliban is just political movement with conservative ideology.

Yes you're true, the modern type of war is you even didn't know the face of people you're kill because we kill the enemy mostly from long range like gun, artilery, dreone attck etc.So killing innocent can be considered as inadvertence, but if it deliberate or purposeful, this means it's war crimes and Geneva convention is the answer.

I don't know regarding fatwa in Quran about killing innocent, but this verse can help you (492-93, 532, etc).

First of all 9/11 was inside job, there is tons of proof for this but we can't see it because media is controled by Israeli zionist lobby which controls US government and their puppets in arab world like Qatar and Saudis, wahhabi regimes which is everything but islamic regime. Wahhabism is death cult.

Yes I know more about 9/11 conspiracy since when I'm still in high school, like how all hundred jews survived, Muhammat Atta (one of the9/11 pilot) is still alive etc.This is one of the biggest conspiration theory ever known.

Second, as Quran prophecied childern of israel will cause corruption on earth twice, second time after coming back to their land which is NOW.

We decreed in the Book for the tribe of Israel "You will twice cause corruption on Earth and you will reach great haughtiness. When the promised first time came, We sent against you servants of Ours possessing great force, and they ransacked your houses, rampaging right through them. It was a promise that was fulfilled. Then once again We gave you the upper hand over them, supplied you with more wealth and children, and made you the most numerous group." (Qur'an, 174-6)

rotfl So you still believe with this dog-matic theory.

In the past when I still a teenager, I'm very interested in stories like this, but I know it's just baseless anti-semitism theory.
Sonny, that you must know is the current Israel and Bani Israel is DIFFERENT, so that verse you posted has nothing to do with Zionism.Bani Israel is already dissapear for long time and its pedigree is unknown.While the current nation of Israel was composed mostly from Jews immigrant from around the world and some of them is Hollocaust survivors, beside that not all Israelis follow ultrazionism ideology, some of them even pro-Palestina.

Bro Sonny I recommed you to avoid such kind of stories, cause this stories not only make you not smart but also to became anti-semitism.

4913 O people, We created you from a male and female, and We made you into nations and tribes, that you may know one another. Surely, the most honorable among you in the sight of God is the most righteous. God is Knowledgeable, Expert.

This is article by Prof Aisha Musa about the meaning of Jews
http//www.askmusa.org/site/c.ehLKKZPJLuF/b.2794331/k.E6A4/Who_Are_The_Jews_A_Brief_History_of_the_Jewish_People.htm

supportpeacenotwar

In the past when I still a teenager, I'm very interested in stories like this, but I know it's just baseless anti-semitism theory.
Sonny, that you must know is the current Israel and Bani Israel is DIFFERENT, so that verse you posted has nothing to do with Zionism.Bani Israel is already dissapear for long time and its pedigree is unknown.While the current nation of Israel was composed mostly from Jews immigrant from around the world and some of them is Hollocaust survivors, beside that not all Israelis follow ultrazionism ideology, some of them even pro-Palestina.

Bro Sonny I recommed you to avoid such kind of stories, cause this stories not only make you not smart but also to became anti-semitism.

4913 O people, We created you from a male and female, and We made you into nations and tribes, that you may know one another. Surely, the most honorable among you in the sight of God is the most righteous. God is Knowledgeable, Expert.

This is article by Prof Aisha Musa about the meaning of Jews
http//www.askmusa.org/site/c.ehLKKZPJLuF/b.2794331/k.E6A4/Who_Are_The_Jews_A_Brief_History_of_the_Jewish_People.htm

I would also urge caution on applying verses of the Quran like this. It can easily be referring to past events that are now finished with. I am not sure if this is relevant, but right now, the Israelis are not the most numerous group. Zionist lobbies have a lot of influence but the actual Israelis themselves are not greatest in number. Aren't there some concerns over Palestinian population growth in this regard from the Zionist point of view? As you point out, this does not appear to be the Bani Israel as referred to in the Quran. May Allah swt guide us in how best to understand and apply these verses with caution and not with haste.

unknownuser

What will you choose if you're Fahd bin Al Saud? US modern troops or Osama's suicide bombers?

On 20 May 1927, the British government signed the Treaty of Jeddah, which abolished the Darin protection agreement and recognized the independence of the Hejaz and Najd with Ibn Saud as its ruler.

Peace Jafar.Looks like your main interest is middle east political studies.
Thank you for giving me some good points.But I will responded some.

Fahd Ibn Saud of course he will choose the US as his allies, because it will give more profits.In current time what is profit working with illegal groups or terrorist unless you want playing dirty politics.
By choose US as allies it will give the profit of the Saudi Kingdom

Econmoy basically from investation.
Saudi-Iran involved in Cold wars, by alliying with US and its allies, it will supported Saudi for balancing Iran's hegemony in middle east.
Bahrain which now is buffer state between Saudi and Iran, also need help from USA, since Bahraini royal family is Sunni who aware if Iran became serious in claiming Bahrain.

For British installing Saud, I think it's wrong, because First Saudi State already existed in 1700s by help of Wahhabism.

Sonny

Yes I know more about 9/11 conspiracy since I'm still in high school, like how all hundred jews survived, Muhammat Atta (one of the9/11 pilot) is still alive etc.This is one of the biggest conspiration theory ever known.

rotfl So you still believe with this dog-matic theory.

Its a fact not conspiracy theory you idiot. Bin Laden himself said he has nothing to do with 9/11. he died shortly after. Former Pakistani Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto admited this watch this, http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Z96IIQyVe0

unknownuser

Its a fact not conspiracy theory you idiot

Then you must open your eyes widely like your avatar before reading my post.

What I pointing about baseless theory is not that 9/11, but your Bani Israel theory you posting.
I still believe about 9/11 is a conspiracy by Mossad or Pentagon and not Al- Qaeda did.I even read it's sources for multiple times in the past.

Man_of_Faith

Peace,

Very respectful to call someone idiot indeed. I am impressed by Earthdom's calm response.

Please relax a little. Does God like it when you call people idiot?

God bless you

Sonny

Please relax a little. Does God like it when you call people idiot?

It was more like a joke not insult

In the past when I still a teenager, I'm very interested in stories like this, but I know it's just baseless anti-semitism theory.

The biggest anti-semite is Zionism regime. http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RjnvQHWyLE

Jafar

Fahd Ibn Saud of course he will choose the US as his allies, because it will give more profits.In current time what is profit working with illegal groups or terrorist unless you want playing dirty politics.
By choose US as allies it will give the profit of the Saudi Kingdom

Econmoy basically from investation.
Saudi-Iran involved in Cold wars, by alliying with US and its allies, it will supported Saudi for balancing Iran's hegemony in middle east.
Bahrain which now is buffer state between Saudi and Iran, also need help from USA, since Bahraini royal family is Sunni who aware if Iran became serious in claiming Bahrain.

Of course, what are his other choice? Allying with the Soviet?
The (failing) country which he (Fahd and other Sunni's king in the gulf) economically ruined through 'discount sales' of Oil?
Note During the heyday of Soviet Union, 68% of Soviet state income came from oil.

Syria, Libya, Iraq, Egypt choose Soviet as their 'ally', during the cold war and look how they ends up..

For British installing Saud, I think it's wrong, because First Saudi State already existed in 1700s by help of Wahhabism.

There's no absolute right and wrong in politics..

The brits needs allies for their war against the "Central Power" (German, Austria, Ottoman Turkey, Bulgaria) in WWI.
They found Saud to be among those allies.

If the Brits and their allies lost the WWI, then Abdulaziz ibn Saud (a.k.a "Saud&quot will be beheaded or hanged just like his great great grandpa in 18th century by the Ottoman Turks "colonial power" for treason.

Since the Brits won the WWI, thus as a 'payback' the Brits granted authority and power to the Saud.
That's why "Saudi Arabia" is the only country in the world today which named after a specific person.
A piece of Arab land which belong to Saud.

This 'Islam terrorist' + 'Bin Laden' is a political issue thus one need to understand the 'political history' in order to understand the 'problem' more clearly.

Salam / Peace

unknownuser

Of course, what are his other choice? Allying with the Soviet?

What time you pointing out, Jafar? During Gulf war time of course the Great Power is USA n some from NATO.What kind of country who refused join venture with Great Power?

What ideology, what political strucuture a country has, but if the economy is bad, the ideology is nothing.
Whetever the politics, the aims is same ECONOMY.

The brits needs allies for their war against the "Central Power" (German, Austria, Ottoman Turkey, Bulgaria) in WWI.

It's just Great Power useless doing since Napoleon wars and Central Asian Great Game.

Since the Brits won the WWI, thus as a 'payback' he granted authority and power to the Saud.
That's why "Saudi Arabia" is the only country in the world today which named after a specific person.
A piece of Arab land which belong to Saud.

Naming Saud for country, it's like doctrination and it's just Saudi's tactic for sthrengthen their position.So generations to generations will called their country "Saudi Arabia" and it's a taboo to change another.

Name & flag is main identity of the nation.

This 'Islam terrorist' + 'Bin Laden' is a political issue thus one need to understand the 'political history' in order to understand the 'problem' more clearly.

Yes I already know about Osama "true motive" for being terrorist.I has a book in Indon language about Osama and say Osama's case just about oil rivalry but in the banner/flag of Islam

Jafar

Whetever the politics, the aims is same ECONOMY.

Whetever the politics, The aims is POWER..
And human invented Religions and Gods as a tool to gain POWER.

It's just Great Power useless doing since Napoleon wars and Central Asian Great Game.

Since Roman vs Persian..

Since human big ape ancestor cracking each other heads for exclusive control over hunting territory..

Yes I already know about Osama "true motive" for being terrorist.I has a book in Indon language about Osama and say Osama's case just about oil rivalry but in the banner/flag of Islam

Oh yes of course.. the banner of Islam...
Anything to appease the audience and gain more recruits for his suicidal bomber..
It has been the same rethoric repeated over and over, since middle ages crusade..

Salam / Peace

unknownuser

Whetever the politics, The aims is POWER..

POWER for ECONOMY.ECONOMY is people needs, POLITIC is just for arrange ECONOMY policy.

Iran-US are enemies in politics, but they still do export-import, Cuba-US claim themself enemies in ideologies, but American now can still smoke Cuban cigarettes.

Since Roman vs Persian..

but the political atmosphere at that time is different with 17-20 centuries

Salam/peace

Jafar

POWER for ECONOMY.ECONOMY is people needs, POLITIC is just for arrange ECONOMY policy.

When I have POWER I don't need any 'ECONOMY'.

Sultan Jafar May Blessed Be His Name You! Yes you! Gimme 50% of your income every month or I cut your head off!! (Also known as Taxation)

Sultan Jafar MBBHN And you! Since my troop has caught you in one of my daring Jihad (read raid), I shall spare your life and you and your son and daughter will be my slave, you must work for me without any salary, or I shall crucify you all! (Also known as War Booty)

Sultan Jafar MBBHN And you priest! Write in your book that I am the "Blessed one by the God", declare the book to be holy, and I shall declare those who dare to desecrate the holy book shall be considered as traitor and shall be put to death by stoning. (Also known as Heresy)

Sultan Jafar MBBHN And declare also in the holy book, that those who serve and died during one of my glorious jihad (read invasion and raid to neighboring state / country) shall earn himself heaven by the LORD, within he shall have 72 virgins to play around with. (as such I can have millions of troops without paying a single dime from my treasury)

Sultan Jafar MBBHN's priest ergghh.. My Lord, that's kind of weak, what if someone say "If that's the case why the Sultan is sitting in the comfort of his palace with his Hareem and doesn't stand in the front line to die in his 'glorious jihad? Thus he shall go to Heaven instantly?"

Sultan Jafar MBBHN Priest! Write also in the holy book those who dare to challenge with such statement is a heretic and shall be put to death plus he'll abide in hell for all eternity.

Iran-US are enemies in politics, but they still do export-import, Cuba-US claim themself enemies in ideologies, but American now can still smoke Cuban cigarettes.

Your statement is actually supporting my statement, Politics is all about POWER which shall bring AUTHORITY and CONTROL and not about ECONOMY or TRADE.

Back to the main topic

To really expose those vile and evil preachers who spread hatred by 'waging a jihad against the infidel'.
Challenge them, if you tell us to do suicidal bombing to kill the infidel and such act shall earn us heaven with 72 virgins. Then why the heck you're still standing here? and not doing it yourselves?? Instead you tell other people to do such 'heaven rewarding' act???

Salam / Peace

unknownuser

Peace Jafar.

Who is Sultan Jafar anyway?

To really expose those vile and evil preachers who spread hatred by 'waging a jihad against the infidel'.
Challenge them, if you tell us to do suicidal bombing to kill the infidel and such act shall earn us heaven with 72 virgins. Then why the heck you're still standing here? and not doing it yourselves?? Instead you tell other people to do such 'heaven rewarding' act???

Sorry, I dont know the meaning and purpose of your questions.