Do Quranists Eat Haram Meat?
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Peace supportpeacenotwar,
Well, regarding the blood, it is still some blood trapped within the body of the animal even if you do the so-called halal slaughtering. It is just nonsense that it helps any more than the conventional "Western" slaughtering. I live in a country with halal slaughtering and it is no different regarding this to my mother country.
The only Quranic problem, which we discussed here, is that the name of God has to be pronounced when sacrificing (killing) the animal to be eaten. In an atheist butchery this is of course not done. But now the question is if it is okay as long as you dedicate the animal by God's name before you eat it in your home.
God bless you
I was just raising a discussion point. The point of the thread can shift from different things at different times covering the general topic under discussion. In fact, it's a natural part of conversation. I don't think there is any need to start calling draining blood nonsense and shutting down the discussion as some may consider it valid if the Quran mentions not eating blood - like PixelAngelBaby said even if some blood is left - as the point is you are eating as little blood as possible or barely any at all. Let God be the Judge of everyone. Sometimes I wish I could feel the peace and blessing from some of these posts, I really do.
It's amazing that we don't like the 'hadith followers' (for shorthand) because when we disagree with some of them, there's a big issue with regards to it from their perspective. I find the exact same thing among some Quran only. What's more amazing is how the Quran has already explained this issue of human nature and labelling.
Interestingly, I just did a quick search and even in red meat like beef the red juice is not blood, apparently it's caused by muscle protein.
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Peace Israfel.
I only accept haram category based on verse 2173
-Carcass
-Blood
-Pig
-Animal slaughtered with other name beside AllahIf you pointing haram categories from hadith, I will never accepted.
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Peace supportpeacenotwar,
I think you misunderstood my post. Nonsense was those who claim that halal slaughtering leaves no blood inside the animal.
My old dad is more or less a butcher and I know the work pretty much. And I know the procedure when it is drained of blood. There is not more blood in it than in halal slaughtering. The only real difference is in a religious slaughtering you sacrifice the animal in God's name.
Sorry if you feel I argue with you, well I was just replying to the issues you raised. It was nothing personal and I should perhaps not have written in addressed to you specifically.
You should know you cannot escape that a small amount of blood never leaves the body of the animal. If you read God's word too literally then you shall never eat meat either in the case of blood.
Of course the ayat means not to drink blood or make food based on purely blood like black pudding.
I did not try to be cold or harsh or blunt or anything in my previous post. I am sorry if I came about that way.
God bless you
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Peace supportpeacenotwar,
Of course the ayat means not to drink blood or make food based on purely blood like black pudding.
I did not try to be cold or harsh or blunt or anything in my previous post. I am sorry if I came about that way.
God bless you
Peace Man of Faith,
That was the other thing I was thinking. Some translations say flowing blood in some of the related verse as well. Of course we need to be careful not to say that this is from Allah swt if it isn't from Allah or if we aren't sure. I think that is what I was also referring to earlier in part.
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Aoa
Aoa
Quote
Wow if it was really that simple why would Allah Tabbarak wa Taala say not to eat meat which has been slaughtered in the name of anyone besides Him, then in Surah 6119, 6120, 6121 (Bismillah included) He specifically commands you to eat meat which has been slaughtered in His Name.Can you please explain, above, where it mentions "slaughtered in His name"
Sorry but still awaiting response to the simple query above.
Regards
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Yes, I do eat meat from western restaurants and buy meat from western butcher is as they are more HALAL (humane) than how Jews and Muslims slaughter the animals.
I have vivid memories of going to the market with my dad as a child, watching the chicken thrash inside the cage after its throat has been slashed and watching it die which took several minutes. The local butcher here puts the chicken in a killing cone (with the neck down) and then severes the jugular AND carotid arteries which renders the bird unconscious and the blood is let to drain. And what is so haram about this method?
With animals, the butcher first renders the animal unconscious and seconds later the animal is hoisted upside down and then slaughtered and the blood is drained. I find this much more humane and at least the people care about the humane treatment of an animal being slaughtered than following some man made ritual laws.
Yes, i am aware of the Israel study but there are strong opposing evidence showing how slashing the throat is not so humane.
God's message is that we treat humanely. So any method that is as humane as possible and safe is the most halal way.
i try to buy my meat from local small farmers or kids who raise these animals with love and care. i buy only organic eggs by free ranging chickens. these days, I have become mostly vegetarian.
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Peace,
The cutting of the throat of the animal was thought of as the best "humane" method in the past, many years ago, but some people still live in the Middle Ages due to their religious belief. Although I am unsure whether there is any consciousness remaining after you cut off the head or not, even if signals are still being sent out to the muscles which may cause you to believe it still lives. But if the brain is severed from the body.
Edit Well. There is probably pain the seconds when it is beheaded. If the animal is rendered unconscious first it is best.
God bless you
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Aoa
The verses 6118,119,121 do not talk about meat or slaughtering. They only mention anything/everything/whatever we eat, name of GOD must be mentioned on it before eating
Thank you for your response. However I was waiting for the guy who used the above verses to state that Gods name must be mentioned before slaughter. Where did he get slaughtering from in the above verses.
Regards
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Peace everyone,
This talk of treat animals humanely is one I definitely agree with and has raised some questions. I also agree with care of the Earth and environment as well. I may come across a bit of a hippy with that and my username - so be it. Although, I don't really fit that stereotype.
Anyway, do you think as Muslims that we should be certain we know the living conditions of the animals? A lot of chickens for example in the UK are kept in a very non-humane environment even if they are killed humanely.
Another thing is - and I'm not 100% certain on this one but I think it is true - that in the UK now with halal slaughtering they stun the animal so it complies with certain UK laws.
I've put this question here because the discussions has turned to this question. I didn't think there was any need for me to make my own thread.
In terms of treating animals humanely what about fish and other sea life? This is something that I came across a while back. When they put fish or other sea life that is caught on the fishing boat in crates, those fish are still alive, all piled on top of one another while they are in the boat.
I don't know if this is the case for the majority of fish or not - its just I've seen it quite a few times. Or if they aren't actually fully alive, they are still moving around a bit. I haven't looked into this area a huge amount, so if anyone wants to give some input then feel free.
Also things like crabs and lobsters, I couldn't eat because they usually boil them alive, which I find so cruel.
I don't know if all boats do this with the crates but I understand it might be for practicality - do we see this as inhumane with regards to the Quran or is this acceptable if its considered practical?
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The cutting of the throat of the animal was thought of as the best "humane" method in the past, many years ago, but some people still live in the Middle Ages due to their religious belief. Although I am unsure whether there is any consciousness remaining after you cut off the head or not, even if signals are still being sent out to the muscles which may cause you to believe it still lives. But if the brain is severed from the body.
Yeah I also have some think like this, even I'm not a historian.It's a takdir, if slaughtering animal="inhumane.
Anyway, do you think as Muslims then we should be certain we know where the animal was raised? A lot of chickens for example in the UK are kept in a very non-humane environment even if they are killed humanely.
Spc, then it's dangerous for you to eating that chicken meat.
My family also running a chicken farm, the good quality of the chicken mean is delivered from young healthy chicken, plus you must be careful if that chicken which treated in inhumane ways was sick especeally suffering bird flue (H25N1)
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Yeah I also have some think like this, even I'm not a historian.It's a takdir, if slaughtering animal="inhumane.
Spc, then it's dangerous for you to eating that chicken meat.
My family also running a chicken farm, the good quality of the chicken mean is delivered from young healthy chicken, plus you must be careful if that chicken which treated in inhumane ways was sick especeally suffering bird flue (H25N1)
Peace,
They're called factory farmed chickens and its not just the UK either. Might be across the West and beyond now. The factory part is the inhumane aspect but its one of those things that been gaining interest in the media etc although still largely ignored - apparently they pass all laws with regards to health and they would be available in most supermarkets. In fact, smaller local butchers including halal butchers may source from elsewhere rather than factory farmed. I need to look into this topic further, I think.
I would say the first priority is the health of the animal, as well as our own health.
What would you say about the fish issue I mentioned - do you have an opinion on it?
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What would you say about the fish issue I mentioned - do you have an opinion on it?
Sorry sis, unfortunately my village is not in the coast, so I can't speak to you about fish.
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Peace everyone,
This talk of treat animals humanely is one I definitely agree with and has raised some questions. I also agree with care of the Earth and environment as well. I may come across a bit of a hippy with that and my username - so be it. Although, I don't really fit that stereotype.
Anyway, do you think as Muslims that we should be certain we know the living conditions of the animals? A lot of chickens for example in the UK are kept in a very non-humane environment even if they are killed humanely.
Another thing is - and I'm not 100% certain on this one but I think it is true - that in the UK now with halal slaughtering they stun the animal so it complies with certain UK laws.
I've put this question here because the discussions has turned to this question. I didn't think there was any need for me to make my own thread.
In terms of treating animals humanely what about fish and other sea life? This is something that I came across a while back. When they put fish or other sea life that is caught on the fishing boat in crates, those fish are still alive, all piled on top of one another while they are in the boat.
I don't know if this is the case for the majority of fish or not - its just I've seen it quite a few times. Or if they aren't actually fully alive, they are still moving around a bit. I haven't looked into this area a huge amount, so if anyone wants to give some input then feel free.
Also things like crabs and lobsters, I couldn't eat because they usually boil them alive, which I find so cruel.
I don't know if all boats do this with the crates but I understand it might be for practicality - do we see this as inhumane with regards to the Quran or is this acceptable if its considered practical?
Regarding the bold/red statement above, the HFA ( http//halalfoodauthority.com/ ) allow stunning. HMC on the other hand do not allow it ( http//www.halalhmc.org/IssueOfMSandStunning.htm )
Therefore because of all the negative aspects of stunning, the Halal Monitoring Committee has set a blanket ruling disallowing stunning in any form.
HMC deem stunning as a "inhumane" practice.
If you dislike non-stunned meats then look out for the labels that's only if you eat "halal" labelled food.
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Do Quranists eat Haram meat? I mean the Quranists who live in Western countries where meat is mechanically processed and not hand slaughtered as per Islamic ritual laws. Do Quranists eat meat from western restaurants and buy meat from western butcheries?
Check out the links provided on the first page. Meat in Islamic countries is also industrially produced, the animals are being tortured and killed in abysmal ways. The Bismillah is usually coming from a tape.
Imho only organic meat could be considered "halal". Personally, I don't eat any meat at all.
Are we supposed to know that we should drain blood because of the Quranic commands about blood? Or doesn't it matter if we drain the blood?
All animals get drained of blood when they are being slaughtered. It does not matter whether an animal has been slaughtered "Islamically" or not ? the amount of blood being lost is the same.
Some supporters of religious slaughter methods claim that efficiency of bleed-out is adversely affected by stunning. Our previous study carried out in sheep at an abattoir comparing the Muslim method of slaughter without stunning with pre-slaughter stunning using a captive bolt or by electrical methods concluded that bleed-out is not adversely affected by stunning, nor improved by a neck cut without stunning.
In this paper, a similar study carried out in cattle is reported. In this study, captive bolt stunning followed by neck cutting was compared with the Muslim slaughter method without stunning. The total blood loss, percentage blood loss expressed as a percentage of live weight and percentage loss of estimated total blood were calculated and compared between each group. In addition, the time periods taken to reach 25, 50, 75 and 90% of total blood loss were also calculated. There was no significant difference between the two stunning groups for any of these blood loss variables. The results, subjected to statistical analyses, also showed no apparent difference in the PCV levels and meat quality parameters between treatments. These results confirm the findings with sheep and show that the bleed-out is not adversely affected by captive bolt stunning, nor improved by a neck cut without stunning in cattle. It is anticipated that these findings may help promote the use of stunning methods during Halal slaughter.
http//www.ingentaconnect.com/content/ufaw/aw/2006/00000015/00000004/art00002
Fear of the huge, uncontrollable cattle has led to inconceivably cruel slaughter methods. For example at Bassatin, initially four or five cattle are driven from their pens into a narrow gangway. The exit to this gangway remains bolted and the animals line up behind each other. A slaughterman then approaches from the outside and cuts the Achilles tendon of the right hind-leg of all the animals, some 20 cm above the hoof line. This is done so that the animals do not escape when led across a sand path, via a ramp, to a landing in front of the slaughter room. The landing is surrounded by horizontal bars; the floor is soiled with blood and excrement, and very slippery.
A group of four or five cattle is driven onto the landing, where the slaughter men spread themselves around the huddled animals and begin to cut more tendons on the front and the hind legs. Whenever a slaughterman is able to approach an animal from behind or from the side, he strikes out with his knife at a tendon. The affected animal then attempts to hobble in the opposite direction where another slaughterman waits to strike.
The knee and elbow joints are also targeted for destruction and the eyes knocked or stabbed out. To get the broken animal to drag itself into the main slaughter hall I have seen the and stab them in anus and/or vulva. I have observed a slaughterman, cutting the tongue from an animal and stuffing it into his shirt directly after its throat was cut and while the animal was still conscious and struggling with its head raised above the ground. I was advised that, for some of the assistant labourers, parts of the body are the only reward they get for their work.
http//www.liveexportshame.com/pmsidholm_maysora_june2003.htm
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In terms of treating animals humanely what about fish and other sea life? This is something that I came across a while back. When they put fish or other sea life that is caught on the fishing boat in crates, those fish are still alive, all piled on top of one another while they are in the boat.
I don't know if this is the case for the majority of fish or not - its just I've seen it quite a few times. Or if they aren't actually fully alive, they are still moving around a bit. I haven't looked into this area a huge amount, so if anyone wants to give some input then feel free.
Also things like crabs and lobsters, I couldn't eat because they usually boil them alive, which I find so cruel.
I don't know if all boats do this with the crates but I understand it might be for practicality - do we see this as inhumane with regards to the Quran or is this acceptable if its considered practical?
Peace,
Why do you think Allah used the word "lahaman" in 1614 and also "tariyyan" if you are interested in?
May Allah bless you pr
mmKhan