Greetings from Morocco
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peace,
Welcome to the forum.
...but I didn't think about reading the Qur'an again and following it on my own. It simply didn't cross my mind!
It is amazing how such a small thing, e.g. reading about islam from it's source (rather than from other sources), can have such a profound effect. I found this too.
A helpful site is http//www.StudyQuran.org
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Wa'alaikum Salam ukhti Mayaas.
I don't know, but by reading your post looks like Islam in Morocco not too influencing like in Turkey or my country.And I mistook from the start if Morocco is a country with high Islamic autharity, but looks like it's not.
In the last welcome to this forum.
mean that the strict ritualistic way of doing things in my experience in Sunni Islam for example, reminds me a bit of my experience in Wicca and Paganism.
Supportpeacenotwar, I know you ever practice a Paganism, but I don't know if you practice a Wicca.
http//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/22/Baphosimb.gif/220px-Baphosimb.gif
Is this Wicca which you mean? I'm very honorable if you can share your experience to me ).
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Peace Earthdom,
That symbol appears to be the Baphomet symbol has doesn't have anything to do with Wicca. The most well known symbol associated with Wicca is probably the pentacle which is the 5 pointed star that faced upward that is within a circle. The different points on the pentacle represent an element such as Earth, Fire, Water and Air with the top point representing spirit.
I was interested in and tried to follow eclectic Wicca then I moved onto the term 'Pagan' but it still didn't work as a spirituality and the concept of God was focused on creation/pantheons/male and female which didn't really work for me. I think I've mentioned this before here, I'm not sure I ever truly believed in it especially the part about God, I was always trying to make it fit together but it didn't really fit together for me, hence why I came to Islam, by Allah's swt leave. Although some concepts in Wicca could be true for all spirituality like celebrating the Earth, although not quite in the way Wiccans may view it. Eclectic Wicca a type of Pagan religion, which is the most common and well known wicca probably. Eclectic Wicca draws can actually incorporate different spiritualities as well. It can be hard to define Wicca because there are different variants, but the type of Wicca I tried to practice and make fit together was non-traditional. The core beliefs tend to be that nature is celebrated in the form of eight Sabbats - Samhain - also known as Halloween a time of death and reflection, Yule - the Winter Solstice, Imbolc - the very early signs of spring, Ostara - Spring Equinox, Beltane - May Day, maypoles and things like that are also said to have Pagan origin, Litha - Summer Solstice, Lammas - a harvest time and then back round. It's known as the Wheel of the Year.
Actually, anyone can enjoy and celebrate the seasons and considering what the Quran says about how the whole of nature, plants, Earth, animals, universe etc is in praise of Allah swt in a way we don't perceive and submitted to Allah swt, then nature is important.
The other beliefs about God can vary. Some eclectic Wiccans/Pagans as well even may believe in many different separate gods - such as Hecate, Isis, Ra, Zeus, Artemis and so on. Other Wiccans will believe that all these gods make up one Deity that is both male and female together - but all of these gods are still separate representations and unique and worshipped in their own right. So for example, if you saw some people's altars setup - where Wiccans/Pagans worship - you'd see idols of Goddesses and Gods depending on which one the Wiccan 'works' with or feels drawn to and these representations are seem as human or animal or sometimes they are inanimate things like rocks as representations. The type of representation will depend upon the size of the altar. The other thing is in traditional Wicca, they believe in the Triple Goddess and the Horned God, which are much more modern concepts of God. Wicca is actually a very new religion that incorporates old and new and was developed by people such as Gerald Gardner. Although people practice Wicca quite differently.
Wiccans usually believe in a God and a Goddess - even if they only worship a Goddess, like some Dianic wiccans, they still believe in a God I think but they worship the Goddess, although I'm not sure about that. Then when it comes to the Sabbats, the God and Goddess are though to unite at Beltane - so there's fertility and then the God dies at Samhain and is reborn at Yule, the Winter Solstice and grows during the year to an adult. The God is often associated with the Sun, and the Goddess with the Moon and Earth. But some Goddesses like Brigid are also gods of the Sun sometimes the symbolism that is usually masculine becomes feminine as well. That's one the things I also wondered about back then - do these things really mean masculine and feminine, can we really separate it like this and do we need to? There's more I can say on that but it might get more complicated.
This post is quite long so I'll leave it there, I think I've covered most of the central ideas in Wicca but it does vary from each person as well.
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Thanks for knowledge sis, but is your former cult is a Satanic Church like Anton Lavey's?Are you felt some magical atmostphere during your rites?
This post is quite long so I'll leave it there
Dont worry about it again, as I said in the past if three years ago I ever joining an english club in my country.In that club I ever met British, Canadian, Australian and American and I got chit chat, laughing and joking with them
In the school, I ever learn about difference of British and American english, so I know well your dialect. -
Wiccans don't believe in Satan if that's what you mean - it's an 'earth based' kind of spirituality. And no, wiccans don't believe in the writings of Anton Lavay. Wicca is very different form Satanism! Magic is believed in, but there is a rule that is called the Wiccan Rede And if it harms none, do as you will. A lot of Wiccans also believe in karma - that what you give out will come back to you.
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Peace Sajda,
Tetouan, how lovely. I was going to take a job there last year. It is very beautiful.
I've spent every summer in Morocco during my childhood (i.e. until I turned 21). Every summer; three weeks Tetouan, two weeks Midar and three more weeks Tetouan. Miss those days. I haven't been back since 2004. I've been told it has changed a lot.
Two round-trip tickets Leeds Bradford - Tetouan. What do you say?
sun
Abdelilah -
Peace Sajda,
I've spent every summer in Morocco during my childhood (i.e. until I turned 21). Every summer; three weeks Tetouan, two weeks Midar and three more weeks Tetouan. Miss those days. I haven't been back since 2004. I've been told it has changed a lot.
Two round-trip tickets Leeds Bradford - Tetouan. What do you say?
sun
AbdelilahSo sajda, what do you say? My vote yes. )
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welcome
Good to have you join. We are an interesting bunch which if you have not discovered already. Just letting you know that here you will find messengers, crusaders, saviors, their followers. Still waiting for a prophet to come.....
All in all, we are a typical family here dysfunctional at best ;D
group
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Salaam Abdelilah,
Peace Sajda,
I've spent every summer in Morocco during my childhood (i.e. until I turned 21). Every summer; three weeks Tetouan, two weeks Midar and three more weeks Tetouan. Miss those days. I haven't been back since 2004. I've been told it has changed a lot.
Wow, every Summer in Tetouan. How lucky you are! I don't know Midar. I've never heard of it. I also got offered a job in Beni Mellal, but it just wasn't anywhere near as beautiful as Tetouan. Plus I love the sea. Living in the middle of the Atlas Mountains wouldn't quite have been the same! Ah, I can just imagine it, walking along the beautiful corniche of Tetouan, enjoying the warm sun and the sound of the sea whilst eating ice-cream!
Two round-trip tickets Leeds Bradford - Tetouan. What do you say?
sun
AbdelilahSo sajda, what do you say? My vote yes. )
(Salaam "justamuslim"!)
Sounds perfect! I don't know about getting a return ticket though. Who wants the Yorkshire Dales when you have the Tetouan corniche whilst enjoying a paper bag full of yummy sfenj and zlebia!
Salaam. peace
Sajda.
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Peace Sajda,
I've spent every summer in Morocco during my childhood (i.e. until I turned 21). Every summer; three weeks Tetouan, two weeks Midar and three more weeks Tetouan. Miss those days. I haven't been back since 2004. I've been told it has changed a lot.
Two round-trip tickets Leeds Bradford - Tetouan. What do you say?
sun
AbdelilahJust "googled" 'Midar'. That doesn't look too bad either. Reminds me of a little of Pakistan and parts of Spain. Oh, how I miss Pakistan!
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Hello all!
Thank you for your replies and for the lovely welcome. Looking forward to interacting with you guys. Glad to see some Moroccans in here!
PS Morocco, for those of you who want to know a bit more about it from a native's perspective, is a country where you can walk in niqab or in a short skirt, but overall our society is very superstitious and sunni islam following maliki madhab is deeply anchored all along, as well as sufism (in its cult of dead and alive saints alike). It's been some years now more and more people are attracted by jamaat al ikhwan al mouslimin or salafi ideologies, so it's getting quite "bearded" and pretty intolerant here. I'm mostly talking about urban Morocco. I don't mean to give an accurate sociological profile of the country, this is only my perception.
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Hello all!
Thank you for your replies and for the lovely welcome. Looking forward to interacting with you guys. Glad to see some Moroccans in here!
PS Morocco, for those of you who want to know a bit more about it from a native's perspective, is a country where you can walk in niqab or in a short skirt, but overall our society is very superstitious and sunni islam following maliki madhab is deeply anchored all along, as well as sufism (in its cult of dead and alive saints alike). It's been some years now more and more people are attracted by jamaat al ikhwan al mouslimin or salafi ideologies, so it's getting quite "bearded" and pretty intolerant here. I'm mostly talking about urban Morocco. I don't mean to give an accurate sociological profile of the country, this is only my perception.
Salaam Mayass,
Thank you for your perspective.
Just a few miles away from where I live, there is a large town with a huge second and third generation Pakistani and Indian population. There are so many of these men who go to Morocco to find wives each year. There are many South Asian-Moroccan couples in that town. These men tend to be of Salafi persuasion and their wives tend to be quite similar in belief. It's nice to see that we are diversifying.
peace
Sajda.
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Hello all!
Thank you for your replies and for the lovely welcome. Looking forward to interacting with you guys. Glad to see some Moroccans in here!
PS Morocco, for those of you who want to know a bit more about it from a native's perspective, is a country where you can walk in niqab or in a short skirt, but overall our society is very superstitious and sunni islam following maliki madhab is deeply anchored all along, as well as sufism (in its cult of dead and alive saints alike). It's been some years now more and more people are attracted by jamaat al ikhwan al mouslimin or salafi ideologies, so it's getting quite "bearded" and pretty intolerant here. I'm mostly talking about urban Morocco. I don't mean to give an accurate sociological profile of the country, this is only my perception.
Peace Mayass,
Do you reject sufism entirely? Oh and sorry to have put that long post about Paganism here, but Earthdom asked and I'm glad he did really. I should have made my own intro thread but never really did. Modern Pagans are very different to some of those Pagans described in the Quran - some are so open minded, welcoming, not hostile in anyway, not threatened by Islam even though it may challenge what they believe etc. I only have great things to say about some of them and I think they're already following Quranic principles. Allah swt may be guiding them in their own way, it is some hurdle to get over that idea of female and male goddesses and gods and leave that behind, although yes, the Quran does explain it - some of them really don't know about that so they may simply have some steps to steadily take. It's between them and Allah swt. May He guide all those who truly seek Him and love Him.
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Peace supportpeacenotwar,
Was reading your post where you talked about your Pagan cult. You mentioned that they believe in Karma and that what good you do comes back to you one way or another. Well, this should prove true for islam as well where it is God who will see the good deeds and return good back to you. I believe strongly in the immediate presence of the Holy Spirit (God's spirit) in the world and that together with the angels this good 'Force' is coordinated to do good in the world. It may be that a good act from a Believer may also cause the strength of the spirit within ourselves to increase which will lead to other people (unknowingly perhaps?) to treat us differently due to the invisible Force of the Spirit.
In this regard the belief in Karma might not be so far off, while the term itself might be an invented one. We can often see the "Karma effect" for real when we start to become more reverent Believers.
Of course, a person with a good personality logically is better treated differently than one with a bad personality. But I still believe that the Holy Spirit affects the total change of a person, which can be interpreted as 'Karma'.
In my thread I made a while ago 'the Star Wars allegory' or 'the Game Allegory' I mentioned about Light Side points and this can be counted as equal to 'Karma' I think. To be with God is the same as being on the Light Side of the Force while living in the realm of Shaytaan is being on the Dark Side of the Force. Gaining Dark Side points will have adverse effects on the personal development and one will indulge in immoral, unrighteous and evil acts, such as described in Quran. Such ones will never be happy (and it seems those who fall to the Dark Side in Star Wars are not happy either).
God bless you
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Peace Man of Faith,
One thing I should have said earlier is that I do not believe Paganism is a cult. I know some may view things in this way, but it's a religion/a grouping of similar religions. Or we could just call it spirituality, I think cult has too much of a pejorative meaning.
The idea of karma can also differ and some beleve in the threefold law, that whatever one does comes back to them by the power of three. Although, many may not believe in that but just a general idea of karma in Wicca. I would agree, that karma as a concept can relate to the idea of ultimate justice in the Quran. Since karma occurs over lifetimes - at least that's the idea I came across, there could be different ideas out there as well - then it differs in that way from the Quran. In terms of justice in the Quran, as things are not served out in this life total justice will occur in the Hereafter. So some people experience bad in this life - then Messengers and believers did, but I would say it is wrong to say whether this is a punishment, as it can be a lesson in general. All good comes from Allah swt but even those real evil in the world today, serious corruption and so on can appear to have some 'good' but in the Quran it also says for such people who are like that, it can also be a test.
I would agree though, there is an overlap of ideas here.
