The Monotheist Translation is NOT faithful to the original Arabic text!

hafeez_kazi

peace brother man of faith

By going to the extreme, and illegally too (these days), a 13-14 year old female must be the minimum age a man can feel the urge to go to bed with them. Guard your private parts from sin. But even then it is just pleasure and you get nothing experience-wise and they are not ready to be mothers or even mentally stable for the flush of hormones intercourse means. It is a sensitive age where they have a transition from childhood to adolescence. It still takes some years in most cases until they are mentally stable and found their identity. Would you make your teenager pregnant who barely even knows herself? No life experience, nothing. It suits a society where the women are confined to the kitchen but not where women are allowed to know things outside the kitchen.

I agree with your views.

There are people who support the Hadith of the messenger marrying Aisha at the age of 6 and the consummation of the marriage at 9 and when I asked them "WILL YOU MARRY OFF YOUR DAUGHTER WHO IS 6 OR 9" there was no reply and they presented many excuses. They do no practice what they believe and preach.

Thanks

Mazhar

Peace Mazhar

Subject is MATURITY. THE SUBJECT IS NOT AL NISSA. I DO NOT KNOW THE MEANING OF AL NISSA, COULD YOU PLEASE TEACH ME?

Peace,

We are not discussing on this forum the marriage laws and practices of Americans or Egyptions. We are discussing with reference to Qur'aan. It uses the word "AnNisa" for marriage. And AnNisa signifies only fully adult women. And fully adult is defined in Qur'aan as one who has reached to fully mature state, physically and mentally.

hafeez_kazi

PEACE

And fully adult is defined in Qur'aan as one who has reached to fully mature state, physically and mentally.

QUOTE ME THE VERSED WHEREIN IT SAYS THAT AN ADULT IS HE WHO HAS REACHED TO FULLY MATURE STATE, PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY

HOW YOU KNOW WHETHER THE FULLY ADULT IS MENTALLY MATURED OR NOT? BY HIS AGE? BY HIS PHYSIQUES?

And We have enjoined upon man, to his parents, good treatment. His mother carried him with hardship and gave birth to him with hardship, and his gestation and weaning is thirty months. until, when he reaches HIS maturity and reaches forty years, he says, "My Lord, enable me to be grateful for Your favor which You have bestowed upon me and upon my parents and to work righteousness of which You will approve and make righteous for me my offspring. Indeed, I have repented to You, and indeed, I am of the Muslims." 4615

And test the orphans until they reach marriageable age. Then if you perceive in them sound judgement, release their property to them. .......46

THERE ARE THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF ADULT MEN AND WOMEN WHO ARE NOT YET MENTALLY MATURED

Man_of_Faith

Salaam,

Can you please avoid writing so much with uppercase letters. It can be considered offensive and that someone has burst into anger and run amok.

God bless you

hafeez_kazi

QURAN SAYS 40 YEARS IS THE AGE OF MATURITY. WHAT IS YOUR PREDICTED AGE FOR MATURITY

Examples of MATURE

She's very mature for her age.
He has a mature outlook on life.
His parents didn't think he was mature enough to live on his own.
Their bodies were mature, but they still behaved like children.
After mature reflection, he concluded that he had been mistaken.
(FROM MERRIAM - WEBSTER)

WHATEVER BE THE AGE OF MEN/ WOMEN UNLESS THEY ARE "TESTED" YOU DO NOT KNOW WHETHER THEY ARE MENTALLY MATURED OR NOT

IN CASE OF MARRIAGE A MAN / WOMAN SHOULD REACH THAT AGE OF MENTAL MATURITY WHERE THEY UNDERSTAND perfectly what is AND WITHOUT TESTING THEM THIS IS NOT POSSIBLE

AGE AND ADULTHOOD IS IRRELEVANT TO MARRIAGE AND THE UNDERSTANDING OF IS APPLICABLE TO BOTH MEN AND WOMEN

THANKS

hafeez_kazi

Peace Man of Faith

Can you please avoid writing so much with uppercase letters. It can be considered offensive and that someone has burst into anger and run amok.

I ask forgiveness to anyone who has been offended by my writing in uppercase, henceforth I will take care not to respond in BOLD LETTERS.

Thanks

Man_of_Faith

Salaam,

Thanks. No hard feelings brother.

God bless you

Mazhar

Quote
And fully adult is defined in Qur'aan as one who has reached to fully mature state, physically and mentally.
QUOTE ME THE VERSED WHEREIN IT SAYS THAT AN ADULT IS HE WHO HAS REACHED TO FULLY MATURE STATE, PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY

HOW YOU KNOW WHETHER THE FULLY ADULT IS MENTALLY MATURED OR NOT? BY HIS AGE? BY HIS PHYSIQUES?

And you the guardians keep testing-educating-evaluating the father-Orphans until the point in time they crossed over to the Age of Nikah Marriage-Matrimonial Bond;
Thereat, subject to having observed intellect, sound judgment, rectitude of action and good management of affairs in them, you thereby release their inherited property-wealth to them.

A retarded man is physically fit to have relationship with a woman and produce a child. But he is mentally not mature, he does not have "Rushdan".

hafeez_kazi

Peace

keep testing-educating-evaluating the father-Orphans

Thereat, subject to having observed intellect, sound judgment, rectitude of action and good management of affairs in them, you thereby release their inherited property-wealth to them.

The red highlight is what I was emphasizing in my earlier post.

my point unless the man / woman does not understand what is he / she has not reached the age of NIKAH.

A test has to be taken of his / her in respect of the solemn covenant and when it is established that he / she really understands what is solemn covenant then he / she is fit for marriage.

Thanks

anGel_OnE

Peace,

We are not discussing on this forum the marriage laws and practices of Americans or Egyptions. We are discussing with reference to Qur'aan. It uses the word "AnNisa" for marriage. And AnNisa signifies only fully adult women. And fully adult is defined in Qur'aan as one who has reached to fully mature state, physically and mentally.

Once a girl reaches puberty, adulthood and maturity, she becomes a woman.

The Quran does not state a specific age as the age of marriage, Surat An-Nisa' (The Women) requires that when orphans reach the 'age of marriage' or a 'marriageable age', they can be tested for 'sound judgment' or 'maturity of mind'.

Umm Muhammad (Sahih International)
And test the orphans until they reach marriageable age. Then if you perceive in them sound judgement, release their property to them. And do not consume it excessively and quickly, that they will grow up. And whoever, , is self-sufficient should refrain ; and whoever is poor - let him take according to what is acceptable. Then when you release their property to them, bring witnesses upon them. And sufficient is Allah as Accountant.

Muhammad Taqi-ud-Din Al-Hilali & Muhammad Muhsin Khan
And try orphans (as regards their intelligence) until they reach the age of marriage; if then you find sound judgement in them, release their property to them, but consume it not wastefully, and hastily fearing that they should grow up, and whoever amongst guardians is rich, he should take no wages, but if he is poor, let him have for himself what is just and reasonable (according to his work). And when you release their property to them, take witness in their presence; and Allah is All-Sufficient in taking account.

Ali ?nal
(Care for and) test the orphans well until they reach the age of marriage. Then, if you find them to be mature of mind, hand over to them their property; and do not consume it by wasteful spending, nor do so in haste, fearing that they will come of age (and so take it over). If the guardian is rich (enough to support himself and his family), let him abstain (from his ward's property); but if he is poor, let him consume thereof in a just and reasonable manner. When you hand (their property) over to them, let there be witnesses on their behalf. God suffices as One Who reckons and settles the accounts (of His servants).

The marriageable age is linked to soundness of judgement and maturity.

Mazhar

Once a girl reaches puberty, adulthood and maturity, she becomes a woman.

The Quran does not state a specific age as the age of marriage, Surat An-Nisa' (The Women) requires that when orphans reach the 'age of marriage' or a 'marriageable age', they can be tested for 'sound judgment' or 'maturity of mind'.

Umm Muhammad (Sahih International)
And test the orphans until they reach marriageable age. Then if you perceive in them sound judgement, release their property to them. And do not consume it excessively and quickly, that they will grow up. And whoever, , is self-sufficient should refrain ; and whoever is poor - let him take according to what is acceptable. Then when you release their property to them, bring witnesses upon them. And sufficient is Allah as Accountant.

Muhammad Taqi-ud-Din Al-Hilali & Muhammad Muhsin Khan
And try orphans (as regards their intelligence) until they reach the age of marriage; if then you find sound judgement in them, release their property to them, but consume it not wastefully, and hastily fearing that they should grow up, and whoever amongst guardians is rich, he should take no wages, but if he is poor, let him have for himself what is just and reasonable (according to his work). And when you release their property to them, take witness in their presence; and Allah is All-Sufficient in taking account.

Ali ?nal
(Care for and) test the orphans well until they reach the age of marriage. Then, if you find them to be mature of mind, hand over to them their property; and do not consume it by wasteful spending, nor do so in haste, fearing that they will come of age (and so take it over). If the guardian is rich (enough to support himself and his family), let him abstain (from his ward's property); but if he is poor, let him consume thereof in a just and reasonable manner. When you hand (their property) over to them, let there be witnesses on their behalf. God suffices as One Who reckons and settles the accounts (of His servants).

The marriageable age is linked to soundness of judgement and maturity.

Thanks, red part itself negates ridiculous hadith literature, gossips of story mongers.

Arabic and Qur'aan are specific, no vagueness.

Qur'aan gives phases of life
A Phases of Life, their physical and mental characteristics.

Childhood
1.1. Discharge from wombs of mothers. Knowledge-less and physically feeble. Needs two year breast feed-nursing
1.2. Playing and protection needing child Mentally knowledgeable having perception of many worldly realities but physically weak to individually cope with threatening challenges.
1.3 Individuality acquired child Shares practical endeavour with father, mentally and psychologically strong to be consulted in matters relating to his personality.
Adolescence Semi-Half Adult-Termination of childhood with experience in dream of copulation and ejaculation.
Strengthen Maturity Manhood-Fully Adult
3.1 Adult, Manhood Bodily Marriage Age.
3.2 Sophisticated development of Mind after adolescence Myth or Fact

I will soon upload this article, InshaAllah.

hafeez_kazi

Peace Mazhar

Qur'aan gives phases of life
A Phases of Life, their physical and mental characteristics.

Childhood
1.1. Discharge from wombs of mothers. Knowledge-less and physically feeble. Needs two year breast feed-nursing
1.2. Playing and protection needing child Mentally knowledgeable having perception of many worldly realities but physically weak to individually cope with threatening challenges.
1.3 Individuality acquired child Shares practical endeavour with father, mentally and psychologically strong to be consulted in matters relating to his personality.
Adolescence Semi-Half Adult-Termination of childhood with experience in dream of copulation and ejaculation.
Strengthen Maturity Manhood-Fully Adult
3.1 Adult, Manhood Bodily Marriage Age.
3.2 Sophisticated development of Mind after adolescence Myth or Fact

I totally agree with your views on phases of life especially 3.1 Adult, Manhood Bodily Marriage Age.

Thanks for uploading the knowledge. May Allah bless you.

anGel_OnE

Thanks, red part itself negates ridiculous hadith literature, gossips of story mongers.

Arabic and Qur'aan are specific, no vagueness.

Qur'aan gives phases of life
A Phases of Life, their physical and mental characteristics.

Childhood
1.1. Discharge from wombs of mothers. Knowledge-less and physically feeble. Needs two year breast feed-nursing
1.2. Playing and protection needing child Mentally knowledgeable having perception of many worldly realities but physically weak to individually cope with threatening challenges.
1.3 Individuality acquired child Shares practical endeavour with father, mentally and psychologically strong to be consulted in matters relating to his personality.
Adolescence Semi-Half Adult-Termination of childhood with experience in dream of copulation and ejaculation.
Strengthen Maturity Manhood-Fully Adult
3.1 Adult, Manhood Bodily Marriage Age.
3.2 Sophisticated development of Mind after adolescence Myth or Fact

I will soon upload this article, InshaAllah.

Excuse me, did you watch the videos I posted? The biggest communication problem is WE DO NOT LISTEN TO UNDERSTAND, WE LISTEN TO REPLY! yeah

There is NO discrepancy/contradiction between the Hadith and the Quran! God does not specify the age of marriage in the Quran, because the standards varies/changes from time to time and from place to place. Morality is relative not absolute, it varies from culture to culture and society to society. What is perceived to be moral in USA may not hold to be true in other parts of the world, such as Africa and Asia. Morality is also relative to time, fornication/dating little time ago was regarded as taboo and a matter of shame for the family. However, now this is a common habit, dating could start as early as at the age of 10. Another example would be dress code, which was very modest in history but not so now.

Therefore, we need to analyse the age of marriage in history and judge Prophet's marriage from there. Historically, the age at which a girl was considered ready to be married was puberty; this also was the case in biblical times. In an article called "Ancient Israelite Marriage Customs", by Jim West, ThD - a Baptist minister writes

"The wife was to be taken from within the larger family circle (usually at the outset of puberty or around the age of 13) in order to maintain the purity of the family line;"

While discussing the meaning of the word 'almah, which is the Hebrew word for "young woman" or "adolescent female"

Gerald Segal, in his book "The Jew and the Christian Missionary", Ktav Publishing House,1981, page 28 says

"It should be noted, however, that in biblical times females married at an early age."

The Campaign To Raise The Age Of Consent, 1885-1994 states
"American reformers were shocked to discover that the laws of most states set the age of consent at the age of ten or twelve, and in one state, Delaware, the age of consent was only seven."

Thus it was a norm to be married at a young age. This is why the people of Quraish and other Arabian tribes at Prophet's time found absolutely no fault in their marriage. On the contrary it is evident from countless narrations that the marriage was successful. They detested Islam, they did everything to belittle the Prophet, tried to prevent Islam from spreading and even attempted to kill the Prophet! However, they raised no objection to the marriage of the prophet to aisha since at those times such a thing was not considered 'immoral'.

Even in our times in certain parts of the world the age of marriage is still relatively low. According to a chart on (http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_consent#Ages_of_consent_in_various_countries) the age of consent in Mexico and Philippines is only 12. In Guyana, Japan, South Korea, Spain and Swaziland the age of consent is 13. Hence even in ?Today's Times' a young marriage is not abnormal, as some in the west think.

Should the people of United Kingdom, where the age limit is higher, be correct in slandering the people of Philippines/Mexico where the age limit is much lower and thus married at young age? Of course not! Or if within few centuries the age of marriage rises up to 20, then should those people have a right to slander those who lived at our times and married before 20? By the same token, we should not criticize the marriage of the prophet based on the norm of our time.

It ought also be noted that aisha ( RA) was engaged to Jubayr son of Mut'im before prophet Muhammed. This indicates the age of marriage and engagement in Prophet's time. However, the engagement was later nullified by Jubayr's parents due to Abu Bakr (RA) embracing Islam.

Thus the history demonstrates that the age of the marriage was lower and relative to olden times, the marriage of the prophet was not abnormal and there was nothing immoral about it. It was a norm at biblical times to be wedded at puberty or earlier, the age of consent one century ago in a 'modern country' was as low as 10 or 12, even 7 in Delaware! Even in our times, in certain societies, the age of consent is as low as 12 or 13. In the light of historical evidences, the marriage cannot be criticized.

Age of Puberty, can a 9 year old be mature enough?

Indeed, there have been many cases of early puberty. For instance, Lina Medina gave birth at the age of 5 years, 7 months and 21 days. Encyclopaedia Wikipedia (http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lina_Medina ) says

"Lina Medina (born September 27, 1933 in Paurange, Peru) gave birth at the age of 5 years, 7 months and 21 days and is the youngest confirmed mother in medical history. This world record is closely followed by a similar case in Russia."

When aisha had reached puberty the marriage was consummated, as Karen Armstrong writes in her book Muhammad A Biography of the Prophet, Harper San Francisco, 1992, page 157

"Tabari says that she was so young that she stayed in her parents' home and the marriage was consummated there later when she had reached puberty."

Therefore it is not surprising if aisha (RA) reached puberty at an early age. The marriage was consummated when aisha (RA) reached puberty. Her maturity from ahadiths certainly dictates this. In addition, let us not forget that in olden times, marriage at puberty was nothing strange.

Vital Benefits of the Marriage

In addition, aisha (RA) was exceedingly intelligent and had a formidable memory. She had profound knowledge of Quran and Sunnah She narrated over 2,000 hadith (at least 2,210). Abdul-Hamid Siddiqui writes in a book entitled Sahih muslim (English-translation of Sahih Muslim, Volume 2, International Islamic Publishing House, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, page 715.)

"She developed into a spiritual teacher and scholar, since she was remarkably intelligent and wise. Her qualities help support the Prophet's work and further the cause of Islam. Aishah, the Mother of the Believers, was not only a model for wives and mothers, but she was also a commentator on the Qur'?n, an authority on had?th and knowledgeable in Islamic Law. She narrated at least 2,210 ah?d?th that give Muslims valuable insights into the Final Prophet's daily life and behaviour, thus preserving the Sunnah of Muhammad(P)."

Thus the contribution of aisha was vital, without her perhaps much of the sunnah would have been lost.

Pedophilia and lust for women?

According to Encyclopaedia Britannica, 1998, definition of Paedophile is

"Pedophile also spelled PAEDOPHILIA, psychosexual disorder in which an adult's arousal and sexual gratification occur primarily through sexual contact with prepubescent children. The typical paedophile is unable to find satisfaction in an adult sexual relationship and may have low self-esteem, seeing sexual activity with a child as less threatening than that with an adult." Encyclopaedia Britannica, 1998.

Apart from Aisha, all his wives were more than 16 (The prophet of Islam, the Ideal Husband (Lahore Kazi Publications), pp. 10-12), which at those times was considered as a mature age. Indeed, his first wife was twice widowed before and was older than him by 15 years. All his wives except aisha and Marya were widows. Therefore, it is evident that Prophet's marriage with aisha was not a norm and prophet did indeed find adult relationship. prophet also did not have low self-esteem, as it is evident from his Seerah.

In addition, Harold I. Kaplan et al. (Synopsis of Psychiatry, 5th ed. , p. 360) writes

"In addition to their paedophilia, a significant number of paedophiles are concomitantly or have previously been involved in exhibitionism, voyeurism, or rape". (Voyeurism is the recurrent preoccupation with fantasised or acts that involve seeking out or observing people who are naked, or are engaged in grooming or in sexual activity).

It is commonly accepted by Muslims and non-muslims (un-biased) that prophet in no sense indulged in "exhibitionism, voyeurism, or rape" or even came close to it. There is not a single reference to indicate that prophet was involved in any such act. In addition, prophet waited for aisha to mature and reach Puberty before the marriage was consummated, this obviously is contrary to the characteristics of a paedophile.

Was Prophet Muhammad a pedophile who had sex with children?
www.faithinallah.org/was-prophet-muhammad-a-pedophile-who-had-sex-with-children
http//islamnewsroom.com/news-we-need/23

Is it reasonable/possible that a raped woman loves her rapist?

'A'isha reported
Allah's Messenger (PBUH) used to kiss me while observing fast; and who among you can control his desire as the Messenger of Allah (PBUH) could control his desire.

http//sunnah.com/muslim/13/81

Mazhar

Excuse me, did you watch the videos I posted? The biggest communication problem is WE DO NOT LISTEN TO UNDERSTAND, WE LISTEN TO REPLY!

There is NO discrepancy/contradiction between the Hadith and the Quran! God does not specify the age of marriage in the Quran, because the standards varies/changes from time to time and from place to place. Morality is relative not absolute, it varies from culture to culture and society to society. What is perceived to be moral in USA may not hold to be true in other parts of the world, such as Africa and Asia. Morality is also relative to time, fornication/dating little time ago was regarded as taboo and a matter of shame for the family. However, now this is a common habit, dating could start as early as at the age of 10. Another example would be dress code, which was very modest in history but not so now.

Qur'aan does specify the age of Nikah. Age does not mean certain number of years from the date of birth. Age means a specific period-duration of time. Qur'aan has unimbiguously and specifically specified the period in the life of a man and woman when they can enter into Nikah.

Nikah is a consented contract involving two sane persons of mature body and mind; and the third party is the society-state.

Qur'aan has laid down the standards which will never be altered. Nothing is left as so called relative. Morality of Qur'aan is absolute not relative to time and space..

Three terms are used for those who are destined to Hell-Prison; namely Fasiqoon; Zaalemoon; and Kafroon. Who ever does not decide and adjudge exactly according to that which is revealed in the Book of Allah the Exalted in the entire time line are declared as such by these three titles.

Be mindful; if anyone in timeline decided and commanded not by that the Book which Allah the Exalted communicated
Thereby, they are the people who are in fact the non-believers.

Be mindful; if anyone in timeline decided and commanded not by that the Book which Allah the Exalted communicated
Thereby such people are truly the evil-doers-distorters-creators of imbalances-disorders-over stepping.

Be mindful; if anyone in timeline decided and commanded not by that the Book which Allah the Exalted communicated
Thereat, they are truly the people who are in habit of going out of the prescribed bounds.

Whoever believes and relies on anything other than the revealed words of Allah the Exalted is leading and heading towards the Hell-Prison. This was the advice and lesson given to man while he was seen off to land on the Earth for a certain period.

anGel_OnE