Does "Khamr" mean Wine or Intoxicants?
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As Salaam Alaikum,
Could someone please tell me if "khamr" means wine or intoxicants?
I came across someone who said that "khamr" actually only means wine and anything else is just another person's interpertation of trying to find similarities between wine and other things and trying to include it.
Khamr refers to anything "Intoxicant" rather than Wine in particular. Usage of the word comes from "something changing from one state to another". There is a good word in English "to brew" and Khamar corresponds well to that.
Leavening bread/dough is known as Khamr and the process is actually similar for making alcoholic beverages by brewing that is by fermentation.
http//www.tyndalearchive.com/tabs/lane/
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Greetings and Peace, all group
There may be a few things in existing threads related to this subject.
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9602930.msg284559#msg284559
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=10889.msg66813#msg66813
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Greetings and Peace, all group
There may be a few things in existing threads related to this subject.
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9602930.msg284559#msg284559
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=10889.msg66813#msg66813
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
In he second link - the word Khamer is not properly understood. . . it means a "brewed alcoholic beverage" and actually not to "intoxication" as such.
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As Salaam Alaikum,
Could someone please tell me if "khamr" means wine or intoxicants?
I came across someone who said that "khamr" actually only means wine and anything else is just another person's interpertation of trying to find similarities between wine and other things and trying to include it.
Peace -- then someone is suggesting women are told to pour wine over their breasts...
2431 and say to the believers (f/p) should lower from gaze theirs and should guard private parts theirs (f/p) and not display adornment theirs (f/p) except what apparent from it walyarib'na/and to strike they b-kmr-hn/with cover theirs on/over bosoms theirs ...
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Peace -- then someone is suggesting women are told to pour wine over their breasts...
2431 and say to the believers (f/p) should lower from gaze theirs and should guard private parts theirs (f/p) and not display adornment theirs (f/p) except what apparent from it walyarib'na/and to strike they b-kmr-hn/with cover theirs on/over bosoms theirs ...
rotfl
Maybe that could be found in some obscure hadith somewhere.
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http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9605608.msg333418#msg333418
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Peace -- then someone is suggesting women are told to pour wine over their breasts...
2431 and say to the believers (f/p) should lower from gaze theirs and should guard private parts theirs (f/p) and not display adornment theirs (f/p) except what apparent from it walyarib'na/and to strike they b-kmr-hn/with cover theirs on/over bosoms theirs ...
Try not to be flippant.
The words has multiple meanings.
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Try not to be flippant.
The words has multiple meanings.
Try not to be a simian.
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Calm down people....
Words have many meanings and it depends on the context. In this case, the closest meaning would be intoxicants. Brother wakas also gave another meaning of the root word
Khamr (KMR) Root is defined as (Keeping secret, concealment, to block) as in the witness concealed his testimony as an example.
It depends the context.
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Peace sushi1992,
Arabic seems often to be using literally descriptive words for each condition or word so to call alcohol khamr is probably right. It clouds the mind and judgement. I have noticed the same in Persian (my wife is Iranian).
However using the same logic ought to mean that any drug is khamr.
The biggest problem is when khamr prevents the remembrance of God and when we forget about Him and to remain righteous under its influence because it often clouds our judgement. Many people become violent or "light-footed".
God bless you
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Peace sushi1992,
Arabic seems often to be using literally descriptive words for each condition or word so to call alcohol khamr is probably right. It clouds the mind and judgement. I have noticed the same in Persian (my wife is Iranian).
However using the same logic ought to mean that any drug is khamr.
The biggest problem is when khamr prevents the remembrance of God and when we forget about Him and to remain righteous under its influence because it often clouds our judgement. Many people become violent or "light-footed".
God bless you
Peace,
Why do you believe it should be alcohol and not intoxicant. Because that would include a lot of other not so good things.
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Peace sushi1992,
I think you did not read carefully enough or I expressed myself poorly. I said that alcohol could be associated with khamr in Arabic due to its condition. These middle-eastern languages have a habit of using a word that describe its effects as noun. Khamr could thus be other drugs too and not necessarily only alcohol.
The word or derivative root is used in a verse where it talks about women covering too.
It is obvious that the word indicates the kind of state you turn into while consuming "khamr". Your mind is clouded and you cannot think straight and thus reducing the clarity of your Communion (salat) and you might ramble unwise things to The Lord. Wine was obviously a popular khamr in the past and is mentioned a lot in the Bible and Hafez the Persian poet wrote a lot about it (and strangely enough he wrote about praying and prayer mats too and despite wine being forbidden in "Islam". But it has undesirable effects in some people such as aggression and many become "light-footed" if you understand what I mean.
Khamr comes in Heaven too as per a verse in The Book, but its negative effects seem to have been removed then and only positive narcotic effects. I can wait until Heaven for khamr.
God bless you
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Peace sushi1992,
I think you did not read carefully enough or I expressed myself poorly. I said that alcohol could be associated with khamr in Arabic due to its condition. These middle-eastern languages have a habit of using a word that describe its effects as noun. Khamr could thus be other drugs too and not necessarily only alcohol.
The word or derivative root is used in a verse where it talks about women covering too.
It is obvious that the word indicates the kind of state you turn into while consuming "khamr". Your mind is clouded and you cannot think straight and thus reducing the clarity of your Communion (salat) and you might ramble unwise things to The Lord. Wine was obviously a popular khamr in the past and is mentioned a lot in the Bible and Hafez the Persian poet wrote a lot about it (and strangely enough he wrote about praying and prayer mats too and despite wine being forbidden in "Islam". But it has undesirable effects in some people such as aggression and many become "light-footed" if you understand what I mean.
Khamr comes in Heaven too as per a verse in The Book, but its negative effects seem to have been removed then and only positive narcotic effects. I can wait until Heaven for khamr.
God bless you
Peace,
I understand you more clearly now. I thought you're previous post was saying that it can be called alcohol but that's all.
Thanks for the explanation. Yep I agree that you are discouraged from being intoxicated while performing salat, because you won't really have a clear conscious of what you're saying.
Peace peace