Alif-Lam-Miim
-
What is this? It is not a translation?
What is the aim of the thread?
Alef Lam Meem is supposed to be understood 'alam' according to how I see it and part of the discourse. It is (as grammatical function) + from the root in my opinion which root means assemble/gather/collect (etc) according to Lane's Lexicon. So the phrase begins and the initial letter is saying a' lam. The "mysterious" initials are part of some riddle, although they are quite not so mysterious actually if one treats them as ordinary words (even when there is only one letter).
So "Be assembled this decree beyond doubt to be a gift to the conscious-minded", although less literal and more fluent English translation would "This decree is beyond doubt assembled be a gift to the conscious-minded".
It seems even a bit poetically written.
Salaam
-
Verbatim? Okay. That was surely a controversial one.
Salaam
-
7430 On it is nineteen.
7431 The ingrates will say, "What did God mean by this example?"
-
I was merely gesturing that it was a whole load of words not there in the original script in yours. At least I explained my translation, from 21. Where did you get yours?
Salaam
-
Salaam reel,
It is a false inference that no one knows their meaning. It is a misrepresentation. Alternative translations even say "AND those well-founded in knowledge."
One just have to think a little and they come clear. I argue I already know the meaning of some of them.
Salaam
-
Salam,
Would you care to elaborate how did you get this translation? I can't see any relation between the original text and your translation.
Since Quran has reached us through recitation, maybe it should not be written like this e.g. ( م.
Regards,
-
It is not written as only . Please look up a printed Quran it is written as . If one notices there is a Medda on Alif and a Shadda on Miim. Let us remove these signs and see when these linguistic rules are not applied, what it should look like.
It should look like this . So what could be its root, . What is its scale/measure/weight with all five letters? , apply Shadda at the end and two Lam are written together , the ninth form of Verb. Please see root Alif Lam Miim. When it is convereted into this measure of ninth form of verb, since root Alif Lam Miim has ?Alif? at ?Fa? kalima, this alif would be combined with Alif/Humza of measure and could be written as one Alif/Hamza with Medda over it, as cited above in written Quranic script.Arabic verbs are sentences and have built in pronouns.
-
Thanks for making me look at 21 more carefully. I checked more than one version. It is written with a madda on both lam and meem, but not on alef. It is part of the riddle, because you can then see that alef is modifying lam while lam and meem are marked as carrying their own distinct meaning. It is not for pronunciation purposes.
So the alef in is to give be + from the root , is my take on it.
I gave my translation earlier except that I do not think Raib means doubt. I think it is lent from as to mean it is a substantiated foundation through the added .
Salaam
-
Thanks for making me look at 21 more carefully. I checked more than one version.
So the alef in is to give be + from the root , is my take on it.
Salaam
I would accept this, hadn't I looked this root up. However, I could not find a rule so far, stating that Medda, can be used to indicate duplication of other consonants, instead of just Alif/Humza. Have you found this rule of language? If you have, please share the reference. I would greatly appreciate it.
Regards,
-
Hello,
Thank you for the elaboration, it is very clear now, but the version with me has a different punctuation, it is "" with medda on lam & meem, it is clear that you have another version. Do you know why is it pronounced " " or "" instead of ""? and how i get the meaning of "" for
for example?Back to the interpretation of "", how did you apply the rule of substitution of letters to get that translation?
Regards,
-
Hello,
Thank you for the elaboration, it is very clear now, but the version with me has a different punctuation, it is "" with medda on lam & meem, it is clear that you have another version. Do you know why is it pronounced " " or "" instead of ""? and how i get the meaning of "" for
for example?Regards,
I do not know there is a different version that I am looking at. There are two Meddas and also a Shadda over Miim. The first Medda is likely slightly displaced from over Alif to over more on Lam. Why it is pronounced as Alif Lam Miim? Under same misplaced belief that nobody can understand these so called letters.
https//www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?ch=2
I have not found an explanation for the second Medda yet. Is it just extra, for calligraphy? I do not know.
Please understand there is no way to confirm how it was read originally except believing the tradition or Hadith about mystrey of these so called letters. Although, there is no proof that, how it was written originally also; but then, we also don't have any preserved archives of written language from the time of its original writing. All language archives are from times much later than its supposed origin. These archives match with the text, how it is written now and not to the older Qurans. Hence, the only way to understand Quran, is to apply rules from archives of language to current text. Finally, apply Rabb given rationale, the function of mind, to decide if these meanings make sense.
Back to the interpretation of "", how did you apply the rule of substitution of letters to get that translation?
Word Salat is from root, Siin Lam Waw, and not from, Sad Lam Waw.
Regards,
-
Madda is an ancient diacritical marker to notify the reader/listener that the letter is supposed to be carrying its own meaning. In pronunciation it is a stress on intonation that marks the letter. It is among the only diacritics I consider native with the original (Quranic) Arabic.
It is not normally written so much on a short word like this, but in this case this is a kind of riddle. It is a hint to the interpretation.
Otherwise the madda is usually on modifying (grammar) letters such as and , but there are exceptions. It is anyway for the reader to emphasize on the marked letters, for a reason.
For example, with madda says thereof BE (what is) that the letter carries independent meaning as part of a word. In the alef without madda negates to form a word that means 'not'. Meem alone does not occur normally but it needs an attribute and a lonely alef without marker (madda) is just closing it as a negative (not).
In alef lam meem as in 21 the alef modifies lam (since it has not madda and alef without it exclusively works as a grammar letter in Arabic) so the word should be + . And as I said, I now consider that comes from the trilateral root .
Same goes for the famous (to me infamous) amen/amin word . It is actually with an alef as grammar function before it (prefix). So its meaning is BE thereof/of + argument. If you say amen b'Allah it means you should have its traits. is rather from the root which is the same as . It is an "attribute reference giver". The amen word is more like verb to imply that the person should gain the attribute(s) in question compared to only which is passive.
These are the truths about Arabic and you will not find it with ignorant scholars. The Quranic Arabic was likely forgotten over a period and people could not really decipher it later.
Salaam
-
Salaam,
The reference I can give is Lane's Lexicon plus the language itself. It has become obvious to me that words such as a'men, a'mer or a'lam are actually not own roots but the alef has been a bit deceptive due to lack of knowledge and the roots are actually and and .
Salaam
-
Salaam,
The reference I can give is Lane's Lexicon plus the language itself. It has become obvious to me that words such as a'men, a'mer or a'lam are actually not own roots but the alef has been a bit deceptive due to lack of knowledge and the roots are actually and and .
Salaam
First of all it is not Alif, when it is part of a root, it is should be Hamza. Alif is not part of any root.
But are you saying that there are no roots with Hamza and Lane supports that?
Regards,
-
Salaam,
Hamza is an invented letter.
It is named alif and it can have a (madda) marker on it to mark that the letter should be treated independently instead of as a modifier/affix.
Salaam