the Secret of gospel ?

[noshirk]

Salaam All

i turn back here to share with you new amazing hypothesis.

i already told that, for me and some friends, Jesus in not Issa.
The true Isaa is Yesha Bin NUN, the nephew of Moses and the great prophet who installed "bani israel" in "the promised land" wich i think is located in yemen.

in another side, we think that Issa is known in persia as Zoroaster.

So what to think about Gospel ?
The fist idea who come is to say that they are falsehood.

But deepest study shows another amazing hypothesis
Evangelists where "zoroasters" who plotted to reintroduce teachning of the true Messiah in judaism.

In fact, before exposing the thesis, we have to notice that rabbis "erased" the teaching of Issa from old testament. The are two reasons for this
1- Issa rejected their teachings (as in gospel)
2- Isaa preached to "other" people than the "official elected" people. In fact, Persians where the goyims of Issa.

The plot organized by Paul and evangelists was, 20 and 50 years after the believed death of jesus was
1- make "jews" believe that Jesus was the expected Messiah.
2- Definitively kill the "expected king of Jews" fabricated by rabbis.
3- Resuscitate The Messiah in his teachings.

So Gospel is entirely written in a "parabolic way".

Let see examples.
Jesus is said to be born in betlhem. In arabic, it would be bayl laham wich is house of flesh.
On the other side, Nazareth is, in arabic, Al Nassira, wich is excately the same root as nassara in quran.
So Jesus, "the son of man" was "created" in a "house of flesh" and elevated by "his followers"

Matthieu-27-17Therefore when they were gathered together, Pilate said unto them, Whom will ye that I release unto you? Barabbas, or Jesus which is called Christ?

Barabbas, in hebrew, means "son of the father". And, very funningly, he was also called Jesus.

Gospel aimed form the beginning to "kill" Jesus, the expected king of Jews, the fabrication of rabbis, to resuscitate Jesus Bar abbas, the "spiritual son of God".
All the Gospel is written in this "parabolic style".

for example.

Luke 1831 to 34
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished. 32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on 33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death and the third day he shall rise again. 34 And they understood none of these things and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

it is clearly said the "the fabricated" Jesus has to accomplish all what "scribes" have invented. then it will be killed, in order to be resuscitated in his true teachings (what he said in gospel and what Saint Paul teached)

Luke 23-38
And a superscription also was written over him in letters of Greek, and Latin, and Hebrew, THIS IS THE KING OF THE JEWS.

In fact, Issa had nothing to do with "jews" and was never a king of "Israel". All these are bullshits ot Rabbis. And it was the "Rabbinical" fabrication who was killed by "the Evangelist fabrication".

This thesis is too long to expose. However, it is logical to see that Juda, in the allegorical casting by evangelists, who took the roleplay of the traitor and that the "rabbis" were pointed as "the main guilty" of the "killing of the Messiah".

Christians are just Jews (in the sense they still have the torah in their hands) but who follows the true teaching of the Messiah

Zoroastrian Gathas are the true Injeel.

4157 And their saying ?We have killed the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, messenger of God!? And they had not killed him, nor crucified him, but it appeared to them as if they had. And those who dispute are in doubt regarding him, they have no knowledge except to follow conjecture; they did not kill him for a certainty.

and Issa had the injeel between his hands

5110 God said ?O Jesus, son of Mary, recall My blessings upon you and your mother, that I supported you with the Holy Spirit; you spoke to the people in the cradle and middle-age; and I taught you the Book and the wisdom, and the Torah, and the Gospel; and you would create from clay the shape of a bird, then blow into it and it becomes a bird with My permission; and you would heal the blind and the leaper with My permission; and you would bring out the dead with My permission. And I have restrained the Children of Israel from you, that you came to them with proofs; but those who rejected among them said ?This is clearly magic!??

Continuing the "research", if we consider that "jews" (allathina hadoo) were probably no more guided by god since they rejected the Messiah, it is logical to suppose that David and Salomon were King of a kingdom who supported the Messiah.

3835 He (Salomon) said ?My Lord, forgive me, and grant me a kingship that will never be attained by anyone after me. You are the Grantor.?

If the " kingship that will never be attained by anyone after me" is not found by archeologists, it is probably because we see in the history of "false nassarah". It can be supposed that jealous "rabbis" imported and adapted these stories in their fabricated mythologies. I don't know yet who is salomon and who is dawoud and who is talut, but i will not be surprised if they were king of the " Achaemenid empire".

it is important not to confuse between yahood and bani Israel.
Israel, i think, is an allegorical figure who represent "people who travel in the darkness with prophets". that is priest. And bani israel are then the people who "eats" the "teachings" of Israel. In Arabic, ibn mean who are feeded while walad point the genetic genealogy.
the "jewish" bani Israel is only the visible part of the iceberg. The "islamic bani Israel" (Daesh and others) and others and the true "Israel".

If we see in the old testament how "Israel" became the name of a prophet, we can observe that it is full of deception. Esau, alleged brother of Jacob in old testament, represent an "invention" of rabbis to humiliate Issa.
Whenever the name Israel appears, there is a lie behind

These are the main ideas of a french article from the dukhani group here
http//nawaat.org/portail/2015/05/19/ibadat-el-chouyoukhs-11-le-messie-levangile-et-israel/

i just tried to summarize here the complex ideas of the article.
Please just consider this post as a summary for "free-minds" members and just a start point for who want to go deepest.

The article says also that Saint paul was a true nabi. The Nabi who founded christianism. the only nabi of christianism.

Israel (priests) is considered as the "spiritual son" of chaytan who has the "job" to distray from way of god. And then, Israel is a kind of antechrist.

"the hypothesis" that David and Salomon were Persians is not exposed in the article. however it is in study and things are not yet very clear. Help is needed and the hypothesis that quite all "hebrew prophets" after Issa and Moses were in fact false prophets is not dismissed. However studying lies can be interesting when we know that they are lies.
It is important to note that it is very likely that Quran make huge use of nicknames. Use of proper names can even be considered as a "contradiction" with the bismillah (with the names of God). So, deep precautions have to be taken with names appearing in Quran.
For example, in the article, the hypothesis that Jonas (Younes) is a nickname for Issa is made.

Peace and sorry for my english. Hope main ideas are clear.

[huruf]

There are great ideas in your text.

As far as I am concerned, christianity as true religion, can only be considered devoid of historical content. It is a spiritual language that speaks about spiritual phenomena. As soon as it is applied to derive prophecies which ar mondaine, it is useless and even more than that, harmful. As such spiritual language it should speak to each person spiritually and intimately and to the truest feeling of humans.

In that sense, your writing is good in the sense that it rescues the true spirit of godly goodness.

However, all that is historical content should be subject to study and verification or be always considered as conjecture without any religious content. Otherwise we land again on the rediculous contentions that make spiritual life dependent on the chosenness of this or that, or second comings, and goings, and fantastic literature that panders to human feelings of inadequacy filling people with delusions of grandeur even if it is second hand grandeur. Probably Jesus was not a particular person but an archetype of avery person's spiritual journey, although the gospel narration may have taken as a starting point some real person or event as a detonant of the whole story rather than as a real person of any historical import.

Salaam

[noshirk]

There are great ideas in your text.

As far as I am concerned, christianity as true religion, can only be considered devoid of historical content. It is a spiritual language that speaks about spiritual phenomena. As soon as it is applied to derive prophecies which ar mondaine, it is useless and even more than that, harmful. As such spiritual language it should speak to each person spiritually and intimately and to the truest feeling of humans.

In that sense, your writing is good in the sense that it rescues the true spirit of godly goodness.

However, all that is historical content should be subject to study and verification or be always considered as conjecture without any religious content. Otherwise we land again on the rediculous contentions that make spiritual life dependent on the chosenness of this or that, or second comings, and goings, and fantastic literature that panders to human feelings of inadequacy filling people with delusions of grandeur even if it is second hand grandeur. Probably Jesus was not a particular person but an archetype of avery person's spiritual journey, although the gospel narration may have taken as a starting point some real person or event as a detonant of the whole story rather than as a real person of any historical import.

Salaam

Salaam bro

i advice you read the gathas.
i advice you also serach in google comparison between zoroastrianism and christianism

Please note that

• Constantin decided to make christianism state religion at nicee. At that time, a corrupted zorostrianism, called mithraism, was having great success in the roman empire. Constantin mixed mithraism, judaism, gospel and other texts to make bible the "only book" of "the only religion" of his empire.
  -St Helen, , mother of constantin, made an archeological expedition in palestine and "discovered" al what she wanted to make gospel a true history.

It is important to note that many facts of "gospel" are mentionned in quran
For example, dinner of Issa and his apostles. Birth of Yahia who had a name never used before, zacharie was forced do be "mute" (see beginning of luke). Theses similarities, if we consider quran true, show that luke had knowledge of true facts about Issa.
This is possible only if story of true Issa and his teachning remained in a restricted area of his supporters.

many sites try to proove that Jesus inherited from old mythologies. The reverse become true when Issa is at the era of moses. mythologies inherited from Issa's History. Quite all links i have are in french. But there is many sites in english.
see here for example http//egyptianchristianity.com/augustine_cx_before_christ_egypt_origin.htm
and here http//www.ethiopianreview.com/index/12622
there is many similarities between gospal parables and Veda parables

there is a funny remark about gospel
last sentence of Jesus (mathhieu 27-46) is conisdered as persian by persian. I can't say if it was persian or araaic but it seems that aramaic was the administrative languageof persian empire for centuries. Ss persians would have no problems to understand.

look here John, ch19
19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS. 20 This title then read many of the Jews for the place where Jesus was crucified was nigh to the city and it was written in Hebrew, and Greek, and Latin

the question is why Jesus preached in aramaic between hebrews and why aramic is not between the 3 language of the inscription ?

---

For Issa as Yeshua bin nun, please note that lineage of Issa is very clear in quran
19-28 Marie sister of aaron
7-142 Aaron brother of moses
20-94 Aaron son of mother of Moses
66-12 Marie daughter of Imran
3-35 and 3-36 Merie from the womb of the wife of Imran

Torah is clear. Imran had three childs Moses, Aaron and Marie.
Quran let no way for allegorical meaning to "daughter and, sister". Moses is the uncle of Issa.

Yeshua Bin Nun totally linked to the Messiah. Yeshua is j?sus. Bin is feminine of Ben. and Nun means Nun (devoted woman of mother).
Yeshua is presented as disciple of Moses and his successor. He have done all task waited from a Messaih by bani israel.
Yeshua appears in quran in 18-60 to 18-65 as the young with Moses.

look here http//www.near-death.com/experiences/jesus04.html
and here http//www.hebrew4christians.com/Grammar/Unit_One/Aleph-Bet/Nun/nun.html

Peace

[noshirk]

salam

please see this http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takht-e_Soleym%C4%81n

it is not a proof. but it is funny

now, more serious.
Talut is associated to Dawood in Quran and Dawood Killed Jalut (2-249 to 2-251)
Harut and Marut (note phonetic similaratity with talut and jalut) and soleiman are associated to babel (2-102).

we consider this as a quranic indication to see near babel if we want to search for soleiman.
however, archemeed empire was so big that egypt and yemen could have been visited by salomon even if he was persian.

now we have many persians kings (from archemenes to Artaxerx?s Ier ) and three "quranic kings" talut if not a nicknameof dawood, Dawood and Soleiman.
we dont know how to match.
see http//fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arbre_g%C3%A9n%C3%A9alogique_des_Ach%C3%A9m%C3%A9nides

but it seems that Cyrus the great (a kind of messiah in the hebraic bible) is one of ther searched ones. Pehaps Darius also.
we consider this verse

3834 And We tested Solomon and placed a corpse upon his throne, but he then repented.

as possible indication that salomon was not the direct successor of dawood on the throne. This complicate the search
of course, we consider dawood and soleiman as nicknames.
but we don't understand persian etymology of kings.

peace

[runninglikezebras]

If "the promised land" was in Yemen as you claim why would queen Sheba bring gifts like frankincense to Solomon? If Solomon lived in Yemen he would have access to frankincense himself.

Peace

[GODsubmitter]

So Gospel is entirely written in a "parabolic way".

I agree with that...

The post is an interesting hypothesis though...

Thanx

[noshirk]

Salaam

I would like to add a little parable.

genesis, chapter 21
9 And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham, mocking.
10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac.
11 And the thing was very grievous in Abraham's sight because of his son.
12 And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called.
13 And also of the son of the bondwoman will I make a nation, because he is thy seed.
14 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba.

let's now make correspondancies.

Israel=Isra + eel= Secret/trip in darkness + people of.
Ismael=Ismaa + Eel=Listen (or make listen) + people of

ibrahim=the curer + him (??)
Isaac=two meaning in arabic (to make far or the eradicate-the laugher in hebrew

hajar=to be far from home

now, the parabolic reading

The great patriarche, the curer, expulsed the people who listen to make the laugher (or the eradicator) inherits and give power to his son (Israel) and his childs.

quite the reverse of what happened when god expulsed chaytan. Funny no ?

Peace

[noshirk]

salaam

some remarks

Awal , is a shark divinity. ( http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muharraq#History)
Shark is Qirsh in arabic.
Quraich same rot as qirch.
Old bahrein (arabic side of arabic gulf) whorshipped awal
hajar capital of old bahrein and more about awal (http//bahrain-history.net/1469.html)

old bahrein too easily accepted islam (http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munzir_ibn_Sawa_Al_Tamimi)

as Jesus,whose symbol is fish , easily accepted by goyims
as yeshua the son of "a fish",
ae zoroaster, easily accepted by people of king visthaspa
as Jonas, who stayed three days in a fish, easily accepted by ninivites

Muhamad, the son of quraich (he little shark), was accepted easily near persia.
near old maka, wich is actual oman (http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maka_%28satrapy%29), a satrapy of archemnid empire.

and of course, Allah who compare his words to a sea (18-109), not very far from 18-63, where Moses and "the young guy" lost a fish in the sea.

funny no ?

Peace

[Man_of_Faith]

Salaam noshirk,

I see you have finally begun to see what I am seeing.

Good. I could use your expertise in my research. I have lots of new data/intel since I last wrote on this forum about Persia/Fars.

It is important to note the reason why "modern" places in Iran/Persia are spelled and pronounced with 'f' is because (Pe - exclusive Persian-Arabic letter) is missing in the Arabic tongue. In the Arabicization of Persia during the rebellion of Persian clerics against their own motherland for dominion, the locations Pars changed to Fars and Espahan/Espadan/Spadan changed to Esfahan, probably with the initial alef as part of Arabic grammar. In fact the Islam that took form was just a variation of Judaism, which has a Pagan offspring called (modern) Zoroastrianism, tailored by the Persian clergy and called islam due to a misconception of what their limited understanding of Quran presented to them (as there is no religion called islam), the same that got Jesus/Isa persecuted and executed.

I am researching on old location names of places in Iran and Iraq to find some mentioned in the Biblical Gospels. So far Nain is interesting since it is a Persian ancient city north of Yazd in Iran and mentioned in the Gospels. In today's Iraq/Syria are places called Tel witnessing they used a similar language. Be(t)h Lehem may originate from a word used in Persian/Farsi called 'Beh' which means village. There are multiple locales which start with Be(t) h, e.g. Bethsaida. I am attempting to pinpoint them in Iran or Iraq if possible. Yazd was not always called Yazd but Isatis (Greek definition!) among others in the past. It shows Iran was ruled by a Greek master for a while due to forced entry of certain Greek influences. Alexander the Great put a footprint here.

The Pharisee sect in the Biblical Gospels is called 'Parsu' in Hebrew/Aramaic accounts of the Gospels (see 'the Gospel according to the Hebrews&#039. Personally I am utterly convinced Pars/Fars (Fars is an Arabic compromise since the phonological sound is not in Arabic) was the clerical seat which persecuted Jesus.

Herodes was a title for a certain king's family just as Pahlavi was the last Shah family in Iran in the 20th century. If one studies Persian rulers around the time of the alleged traditional Jesus there is bunch of kings called Orodes. It is worth noticing in variations Herodes or Orodes have little differences between the two. It is also worth noticing that the event of Jesus occurred quite early on after the defeat of the Achemedian empire by Alexander the Great which brought Greek and soon Greco-Roman dominance in the region. Persia/Judah became a satrap to the Roman empire. They were left alone on condition that they obeyed and assigned the ruler/satrap the Roman empire approved of (Herodes).

You see every piece of the puzzle is falling into its place more and more.

So you see "Christianity" got into the Romam empire this way. Jesus caused a major stir in the clergy albeit he did obviously not dissolve it as their thirst for spiritual importance returned with Quran in the tampering with "Islam" by Persian clerics. The Roman, what are their ranks called I forgot, but the representatives, for example Pontius Pilate, and the protection of the (then) stable and civilized Roman Empire from the religious nutjobs Parsu (Persians). No wonder Christianity spread out because most of the ignorant clergy rejected Jesus still but cold have gotten some response throughout the Roman Empire. Those who spread it was probably at first disciples of Jesus who had to make a run for it. They were probably not finding friends anywhere for neither side of Romans or Persians sought to use the message other than for control. Note that Jesus teachings probably took quite a while to be accepted. You may know that the Roman Empire did not become Christianized before much later.

And the Greco-Roman Empire never held any lasting control over Persia. They soon made a new empire, the Parthian Empire.

And I nowadays know for sure the diacritics of Quran as NOT native with early transcripts. Research on archeological discoveries in Iran where I am located has shown that very old Quran quotes and Qurans simply lack any but the Arabic without any extra markers above and below the letters. Only the 'madda' is an original "diacritic" to distinguish if there is an emphasis on the letter so that it is to be interpreted independently. In a verbal communication it is simply by holding on to the hollow sound a little longer.

Salaam

[noshirk]

Salaam

well, i would like two remarks concerning David and Salomon.

we have two verses with historical indications

2180 And We taught him the making of armor (labous) for you to protect you from your enemy. Are you then thankful?

3410 And We granted David blessings from Us ?O mountains, echo with him, and the birds.? And We softened the iron for him.

this link David to two technlogical revolutions. First one is the chain mail armor, the second is related to an innovation "softeninge iron.

i am not a specialist in such "archeology" and what we call "iron age".
however, i found in internet this
here http//www.ukessays.com/essays/history/the-history-of-chain-mail-history-essay.php
we can read

Many archeologists have come to believe that chainmail was invented by the Celts because rusty masses were found in some Celtic graves, dating as far back as 400 BC, and they were identified as being remains of old chain mails. However, the earliest known record of chain mail armor is of a Persian solider who was wearing a chain mail shirt in battle around 359 BC.

There is also other informations here for example http//www.iranicaonline.org/articles/armor-ii

Now, we have also Iron is history of dhul qurnein who seems to have also a technological advance in iron treatment.
And cyrus the great is a good candidate as Dhul Qarnein.

Please note that Dhul Qarnein is clearly a great prophet since he was "speaking with Allah" in 18-86.

I know that it is hard to believe that David and Salomon could be persians. But we haven't a big choice in very big kingdom in the region (see 38-35).

Please note also that scirbes of bible seems to have done a big mistake;
Daniel Chapter 5
"30 In that night was Belshazzar the king of the Chaldeans slain.
31 And Darius the Mede took the kingdom, being about threescore and two years old."

It was Cyrus and not Darius who conquered Babylon.

It seems that "rabbis" rewrote history to invent an "Israeli" bigger empire than that of persians.

Now let's look at this

Daniel 5-3 Then they brought the golden vessels that were taken out of the temple of the house of God which was at Jerusalem; and the king and his princes, his wives, and his concubines drank from them.

and this

2247 And their prophet said to them ?God has sent Saul to you as a king.? They said ?How can he have the kingship when we are more deserving than him, and he has not been given an abundance of wealth?? He said ?God has chosen him over you and increased him in knowledge and physical stature.? God grants His sovereignty to whom He chooses; and God is Encompassing, Knowledgeable.
2248 And their prophet said to them ?The sign of his kingship shall be that he brings to you the ark in which there is tranquility from your Lord and the legacy of what was left behind by the descendants of Moses and the descendants of Aaron being carried by the angels. In this is a sign for you if you are believers.?

So it seems that Belshazzar had in his possession "vessels from the temple".
Quran indicates that signs that "Talut" should be considered as king is that he will bring to bani Israel what was in the ark.
And it was Cyrus who liberated "jews" from babylon and gave back to jews what was in the temple. And Bible declare him as messie and recognize him as a nabi since Allah was clearly seaking to him. After that, Cyrus was king od "Israel". A not "hebrew King" but Accepted by bani Israel. It is rare no.

This would leads to this conclusion that talut is a nickname of david and Cyrus.
Bani Israel would have rejected "Talut" first because was a persian, not one of them.

Please, i remind that exegesis we made is that bani Israel means who learn religion from priests. So there was no nabi from bani israel at All. never.
)
Now, Cyrus, in Persian, was Kurush. this is very near from qirsh and Quraich (nowadays, Kurush is still a trukish money equivalent to Qirsh money in arabic country.
Try guess from where is Cyrus ?
at beginnig he was king of Ashan, just in front people of old bahrein, where there was a qirsh divinity
http//www.kurdistanica.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=152&g2_serialNumber=3

there is some strange thing also.
it seams that neither David nor Salomon are considered as prophets in bible. Just kings.
But Quran is clear, they were prophets.
so the question is, why rabbis rejected the prophethood of David and Salomon.

finally
etymology says david (and dawuud) means beloved. In arabic, Wadda, wich is perhaps the root of dawuud means something like that.
so dawud can be a nick name.
Same thing with Salomon. Roots in hebrew is said to shalom. Arabic clearly states that root is same as islam.

hope someone will give some help

Peace

[huruf]

Sulayman looks like a diminutive doubled of the expansive mold finished like rahmaan.

Salaam

[Man_of_Faith]

Thanks for the information, noshirk. I will reflect on what you wrote.

I made more work on specifically the Pars/Fars side-project lately (I have been busy on the reinterpretation of Quran and The Great Project).

There is mention of Bataeans which may refer to ancient Ecbatana where Og of Bashan (Basan/Bashan is an alternative spelling of Bataan) went out to meet the Children of Israel (bani israel) in battle. Basan is supposed to be North-East in Judah. What did bani Israel do there anyway?

Maybe a coincident, but in northern Arabia and today's Iraq there was an ancient community called Nabetaens. They developed the Arabic script used today as late as the 5th century AD and they used the Aramaic script before it. Such culture capable of inventing scripting languages witness of an advanced civilization. Rome referred to then as Nabetaens. Their historical account goes back a few centuries BC. They were a rich trading community. I vote that the real prophet of Quran was from here and it is written in northern Arabia/Iraq originally. The center of the awkward Shia/Sunni conflict also always had its center here and is rather a Persian vs. Arabs who forgot Persians rallied them. Jews and Judaism (sectarianism) always had a finger in it all. In think Quran was written in the 5th century and by a Nabetaen and the Quran was the first writing in this script. Quran is as good as perfect literally. The conflict was due to Persian clerical meddling in it all and that sectarian forces got their dirty hands on it. Persian clerics (elected imams in the "new" faith) rallied Arabs for war against their own country Persia, but retained the Persian language. It was just a battle for dominance and religion abused to rally people "in the name of GOD". Islam is just a modified clerical doctrine that was already in place. The clergy abused the Quranic context to invent an interpretation and then enter it on the innocent text. It became a religious propaganda machine.

The amazing thing is that Quran seems to have retained its integrity. Very little is manipulated in terms of text. It was probably good that Quran was kept on both sides of the conflict, i.e. Persians and Arabs. The blasphemous Yemeni Quran factory which was discovered shows it was important that copies were spread all over Earth. Personally I am interested in the Kufic script and desire a Quran copy in that script as I am sure the original Arabic did not have any particular diacritical marks.

Aram is likely today's Armenia.

J-ord-an seems to refer to a stream of water (river) in Persian, perhaps multiple in the case of this form. The largest river in the region is in Mesopotamia with many branches.

I made a mistake in my previous post where I wrote about Beh because Deh is village in Persian.

I intend to read up a bit more on what you wrote and other sources.

Have you considered that the Old Testament is written in such a way it presents Zoroastrianism to the reader? The fire altars are very characteristically Persian Zoroastrianism and so is burning incense. Many Persians today are still superstitious about the burning of incense in religious belief.

In the Biblical Gospels "magi" can be seen coming from the east to witness the newborn Messiah. Magi was the priestly class of Zoroastrianism and the likely guests who arrived. Astrology was also a Persian superstition (although I am a bit curious about astrology actually) as the tale about a star in the sky sure could have come from a Zoroastrian mind.

You see the faith is so tainted by Persian influence. It is also remarkable as I said that Pharisees (Parsu in Hebrew) bear such a heavy resemblance to Parsian. Pars was likely a religious center. Persepolis is proven through archeological investigations to have hosted foreigners who came from all over to wander there.

From 330BC until 250AD Persia does not seem to have been independent until the Sassanid empire. There are many Greek remnants there and places with Greek spelling still present in their (old) names, e.g. Isatis/Yazd.

A year ago or something I saw a very old map with a ruined building further up in the mountains that was simply referred to David/Dawood.

Salaam

[noshirk]

Sulayman looks like a diminutive doubled of the expansive mold finished like rahmaan.

Salaam

i agree.
the problem i have is, for david and salomon, why Quran take nicknames similar to bible given names if they weren't named like this ?
If i consider the bismillah (with the names given by Allah), that probably means that Dawud and Suleiman should be the at least the traduction of r.eal nicknames of dawud and soleiman.

I heard for example an historian saying that cyrus the great had always been mentionned in good terms everywhere. He is really a beloved one.
if David is Persian, cyrus is my best candidate.
Problems are with soleiman. I found no occurence of name soleiman before soleiman. however, Soleiman seems to fit with Darius. But Darius is not the son of Cyrus. Quran says oly Wahabna Soleiman li dawud. Is that means son ?
Wahabna is used for example to say wahabna Aaron nabiyyan li moussa.

peace

[noshirk]

Salaam man of faith

i saw somewhere in this interesting series https//www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TW0ojfa8Jo
that pharisees are originated near babylon

Peace

[Man_of_Faith]

Salaam noshirk,

They likely had their base of operations (propaganda) there during a part of their existence and consisted of a clerical group called Parsu. Despite rises and falls of their empires the word Persian was always used and seems to have had a religious connotation but also fixation on bloodline for clerical inheritance of rank. Kings always had in one way or another a religious connection officially. Cyrus even followed inspiration of GOD.

The Persian Empires usually controlled a major part of today's Iraq but unless suppressed they also controlled Syria, Palestine (Phillistines) and also Egypt/Mesr. The Nabetaens history is on territorial collision course with the Persians and that is why they drew my attention. They also developed the modern Arabic script in the 5th century as they were an advanced community, for their time, with many resources. In my opinion the Arabic script is a perfection of the Semitic origin scripts and easy to read and use.

Salaam

[Man_of_Faith]

Hail Noshirk,

There are Persians and also Arabs who believed that Solomon/Suleiman had his seat in present-day Iran. Read this link

http//en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takht-e_Soleym%C4%81n

No other empire was as big as the Achemenid Empire at its peak and the Biblical accounts say "no other empire was ever this big" about his empire yet there is no huge empire in historical records attributed to David and Solomon.

Be well

[noshirk]

Hail Noshirk,

There are Persians and also Arabs who believed that Solomon/Suleiman had his seat in present-day Iran. Read this link

http//en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takht-e_Soleym%C4%81n

No other empire was as big as the Achemenid Empire at its peak and the Biblical accounts say "no other empire was ever this big" about his empire yet there is no huge empire in historical records attributed to David and Solomon.

Be well

Salaam Man of Faith

it is very interisting to see how much Cyrus and Darius were monotheist in their declarations.

http//www.livius.org/be-bm/behistun/behistun03.html

http//www.livius.org/aa-ac/achaemenians/inscriptions.html

and also,
3413 They made for him what he desired of enclosures, and images and pools of deep reservoirs, and heavy pots. ?O family of David, work to give thanks.? Only a few of My servants are thankful.

in fact, Persian empire had many palaces
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achaemenid_architecture

and it seems that even word paradise has persian origin
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradise#Etymology

Peace

[Man_of_Faith]

Just made a linguistic and phonological observation. Beh or Bis is similar to the Beth which introduces many Biblical locations. Bes-Tun/Beth-Tun, I hope you see the parable. The famous Bethlehem is actually Beth-Lehem or Beh-Lehem.

It is important for my studies to find locations which can strengthen my point and bind a location to the Bible. If I just bind a few locations then it would surely create a chain reaction.

The word Beh seems to mean "village" in the language it originates from. Although not correct in my comment before, Deh is used to say "village" today in the Persian language. During linguistic studies I noticed that such consonant sounds may be one and the same word despite different phonology. For example, there is a village in the mountains here called Deh-Bala (the uphill village) which sounds a bit alike the Beh-Saida/Behs-Aida.

And then we also have Nain, mentioned in the Biblical Gospels... there exists a very old city in the middle of Iran called Nain.

By the way, in the inscription 'Israel' or 'Judah' are not even mentioned by name, which they would have if they are historically as famous as it is claimed. I also noticed that on very old maps Israel or Judah are not marked. Also it is worth looking at alternative historical references such as omitting the initial alef on Esrajiil to Sar(a)jiil and in old pronunciation is not supposed to lose its consonant sound completely but be a weak jee sound while is a distinct 'dj'. Read background of Classical Arabic for reference. These languages have no vowel marks but they are produced by reading the consonants as they are pronounced. Not even alef is ever a vowel, but an old 'diacritical mark'. Alef as prefixes in Arabic are to give a "be" (e.g. Be + salam l'Rabb) meaning grammatically while alif-lam is "Be As" (i.e. be alike attribute in word). This is controversial to sectarian scholars of Classical Arabic, but I tell you to not reject it outright. I think people in the so-called "Islamic age" were not native to the text and used words in ignorance.

One has to observe ancient pronunciation of words to be aware of where to find them on maps or literature. Like I wrote above, all letters had sounds in the past as they all carried meaning. Silent letters is because people became lazy and spoke the language faster and without equal emphasis.

I am so eager in this work because it annoys me every day that the world has been deceived by misrepresentations of official history. Also mainstream "Islam" annoys me every day because I know Quran actually says something often entirely different on account of the Author compared to what they claim. It makes me draw a sigh if someone mentions salat for example.

I work hard to diminish the nonexistent violent nature of Quran, and it is not because I twist it because I dislike it, but I knew my 'Rabb' would never made written such unrighteous nonsense. The prophet of the true account tells people to "help the kafar (deluded) to see the true light" and it says "Is it not tragic that those who are good such as them that it is those who corrupt and such who relate what is to be acknowledged? " 211-12 (from my translation project, not perfect yet but slightly literal)

The Quran then teaches to show empathy and have patience with kafaroon which is a word for deluded. The mainstream version tells you to hate them as GOD "hates" them. It is the corruptors that GOD dislikes. GOD does seldom refer to belief but realization in a system of symbiotic assimilation in the image Allah while 'Rabb' is the Unit word for GOD. All righteous personnel address GOD as 'Rabb' in Quran and means 'Sustaining Foundation' and I metaphorize it "Platform" as in a network system where each human spirit is a node to interconnect with the Rabb (mainframe), but not without losing the blindness of the animalistic nature and bias of the body first.

People think I am idolatrous and discredit the Rabb, but my perception actually does not. Like others I affirm the Rabb as the Supreme, but I do not belittle myself but I also affirm I can be like the Platform (Rabb) if I stop being an animal and find the true spirit, Ruh Quds, which is not unattainable for the common human and not only prophets (nabi). And the Platform is not separate from yourself but a Unity, Allahu ahad, a oneness existence and you exist in that Unity.. or not at all but is spiritually dead without perceiving it.

"And thus it all poured out through "the door" that enclosed it and went away and dumbfounded they notice it was their designation in joining them of vigilance against unconscious cessation..." 219 without perfect rendition. It is an intelligent and teaching parable and not according to the hateful and only humiliating mainstream interpretation.

"...and Being As It (Allah) are encouraged to show restraint towards the deluded ones in the folly of their insensible perception..." part of 219-20.

Sorry if I wrote something you did not want to hear.

Be well

[FreedomStands]

Hi, just a quick question! If any of you actually care, why do you actually care? Serious question!

[noshirk]

Salaam All Again
Ok, ok, ok.
i understand that hypothesis that David and Salomon were in fact persians and that jealous "jews" adapted this fantastic story to a "jewish" context.

but there is is another argument for this amazing theory The queen of saba.

it seems that historic queen of saba lived in era of cyrus the great and darius and not before.
there is an anachronism problem between biblical queen of saba and kingdom of saba

according to this link (french)
http//philippelopes.free.fr/RoyaumeDeSaba.htm

http//philippelopes.free.fr/RuinesMaribYemen.jpg
this is what arabs calls haram balkis near maarib in yemen.
it is a temple where sun and moon were whorshipped like quran said about queen of saba. It is dated in 6th centuru before christ by hamadani. that's era of darius and co.

here also http//bible.archeologie.free.fr/reinedesaba.html (french)
we have also the indication that archeology seems to place "saba kingdom" more later than the biblical jewish salomon, 2500 yeas ago, in era of rising of the great persain empire

i want to add this map
https//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a5/Map_of_the_Periplus_of_the_Erythraean_Sea.jpg/1280px-Map_of_the_Periplus_of_the_Erythraean_Sea.jpg

it is a reconstitition according a book of trade written in first century. https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Periplus_of_the_Erythraean_Sea
interesting to note
1- whare saba is placed
2-how red sea was a commercial route.
3-no camels, no mecca, no yathrib in trade.

Peace