On intuition and false prophets

mmkhan

Have you read 478

Peace bro,

I did ask you to check 478 and 479 and compare them and please let me know your understanding on them. But you never come up with that and again spreading a part of topic as a lie?

That is not fair et all.

May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan

FreedomStands

Peace bro,

I did ask you to check 478 and 479 and compare them and please let me know your understanding on them. But you never come up with that and again spreading a part of topic as a lie?

That is not fair et all.

May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan

I don't know what you're talking about, but if I missed some post of yours, sorry for the delay.

478 http//islamawakened.com/quran/4/78/ (see the literal word for word translation for both 478 and 479) says "All is from God" and to say that. It says that silly people say that only good is from God while bad is from people, and then says to say "All is from God" then it says "the good from God, the evil from yourselves" All is from God, it didn't contradict itself, it is saying the good from God and the evil from yourselves is all from God. In other parts of the Qur'an it says that whatever befalls you of evil, even in yourselves, is from God, it says God misleads whoever God wants to, God makes for hell whoever God wants to, that we can't even will anything except as God wills us to will it. So "All is from God" is pretty clear in that context and it is written out pretty clearly, but people tend to just go nuts about 479 and totally ignoring 478 which says "All is from God" and to say that, which is what I do say, but not because the Qur'an said so. If the Qur'an said "All is not from God" then I would not agree to that, and I'd still say "All is from God". The only reason I like the Qur'an is because I find it agrees with me, if it didn't agree with me, I wouldn't like it very much or follow it. My religion is Islam because Islam corresponds to my religion, not the other way around really. If my beliefs were matching up to Christianity, then I'd be a Christian instead, but they don't match up to Christianity really as much as they do to Islam.

So I was not hiding or avoiding you or something if there was some delay in my response to some question you asked somewhere which was not sufficiently answered to your satisfaction.

I believe that God is the source of all harm and benefit, good and evil ultimately, this is no secret, it is a theme in a great many of my posts as you can see, and 478 has been mentioned in the past as well.

My posts can be read by clicking on my username and checking them out, even from early on I had been talking about two basic themes

God controls everything and God is the source of everything, including all good and all evil ultimately, that there is no other power than God and no one has power to help or harm but God alone.

These views are also affirmed in lots of verses in the Qur'an, but even if they weren't in the Qur'an, I would still state them because they are based on logical necessity and thinking to the end of things. They are also views found in the Bible and Vedas among other things.

To me, they are essential beliefs for full appreciation of our state of surrender.

runninglikezebras

The Qurn was not "revealed" in (what we call) "Classical Arabic" (but in an* Arabian tongue).

CA was formulated by (post-qurnic) Ajamites (e.g., Sb/Sibawayh); !

~ Both the script and vocabulary (of the Qurn) bespeak an Aramean origin

indefinite

@hicham9 What makes you think Hijaz has any place in Qurans revelation except sectarian delusions?

Peace

Man_of_Faith

Hail to you Samira,

While it is true that I use the letters' innate meanings as a help in understanding Quran it is not my only mode of working on my reinterpretation and translation project. I have realized that unless I utilize help to gain better precision it would likely take me 50 years to decipher the whole Quran, so I gave lexicons a try and I realized that the usually most odd definitions hidden in those ancient lexicons are usually correct. Checking what the words often indicated in Aramaic helps too.

The innate letter meanings help to assist making sure which definition is truly correct since you can figure out the approximate meaning of a word fairly fast by merely taking a glance at the word itself while studying the sequence the letters occur in the word. One word with a very simple morphological structure is "amen" from the root with as prefix, which is alef 'be', meem 'thereof' nun 'integrity'. Knowing that it is very easy to know what the word means and it does not mean believe. "Be Thereof/of Integrity" means just what it says, i.e. be like someone or something, e.g. act like Allah or as it really means "act like Being" . For knowing what it means it is just to study what the Rabb has for traits.

Be well

Samira1234

Thanks for your explanation MoF. I am still not sure how exactly you come to a specific innate meaning of a letter. Can you explain that?

Man_of_Faith

Hello again Samira,

One has to make a discourse analysis and study what "safe words" mean, i.e. words that can be regarded as meaning as is perceived and then make out how the order of the letters affects the meaning of the root to learn what each "slot" in a trilateral root does what.

Taking very basic and primitive letters first is recommended, e.g. . Alef means the state of being, lam means "such/that/which", miim means "thereof/of/by" and nun the integrity of something like nabi "integrity with substance" i.e. one with substance or more easily said "insight" OR "integrity within it" is also an interpretation based on newfound grammar rules not in traditional knowledge.

The four mentioned letters are among the most frequently used letters in Quran and Arabic. Nun is common because it gives the integrity of the subject(s).

I also learned that many letters do almost never take place as the first letter in a root such as . The letter is even virtually never part of the root of a word. The famous root does hence not stem from a root with those letters but from (ya-dal-ya).

In Aramaic scholarly grammar these letters are called weak letters, i.e. when localizing roots it is better not to search for those letters.

If is contained in a word it is usually best to change that for a when you search for the word's root and due to that is usually the base form used in the root.

Words beginning with seldom have their root with that but begin with the subsequent letter.

One example is "nabi"s root which rather could be said is ba-ya-nun because the initial nun on the word is a grammatical prefix to help say the integrity of the person is manifest, full of insight.

Be well

hicham9

I've always been right, at least based on the mainstream interpretations of the Qur'an, that God is plainly the source of all the harm(evil) in existence (according to the Qur'an translations, and Bible even, and Vedas), and coming to terms with the truth of nature being harsh and not cuddly is part of the Surrender.

Did you even read Sreh 479 30, &c.]!?

Have you read 478

Yes, I did read 478 followed by 479 (ie. in context), I also read 4230 (which you failed to address in your reply), &c.
Matter of fact is, I read the whole Quran, multiple times, in its original language. & I still do, and shall, G-D willing, read it again and again and again, until I return back to my One Master/Owner.

The Quran taught me that G-D is Omnibenevolent.
The root of all evil is NOT G-D but Iblys.
Hence, to my discernment, your malevolent "god" is none other than hybris.

"Wherever you may be, death will overtake you - even though you be in towers raised high. "Yet, when a good thing happens to them, some say, "This is from God," whereas when evil befalls them, they say, "This is from thee ! Say "All is from God." What, then, is amiss with these people that they are in no wise near to grasping the truth of what they are told?"

That is the verse right before the one you're quoting, it clearly states that "All is from God" and tells us to say so, then it repeats what the foolish people who "are in no wise near to grasping the truth" say which is "Good is from God, evil is from humans".

Here is another for you

5722
No evil befalls on the earth nor in your own self, but it is in a book before We bring it into existence; surely that is easy to Allah

1049
Say "It is not within my power to avert harm from, or bring benefit to, myself, except as God may please. For all people a term has been set when the end of their term approaches, they can neither delay it by a single moment, nor hasten it."

So are you claiming that Allah is not the sole power that controls all harm and benefit to anyone and all that is in creation? Are you claiming there are other powers at work? Then at the very least you're claiming Allah is passively allowing evil to persist, merely "allowing" the children to be raped and whatever, which is still evil.

I am stating "All is from God", and that "whatever evil/misfortune/calamity befalls anyone is from God, brought into existence by God" that God is to be feared and can do anything terrible freely and is completely unfettered, and that God controls everything.

If the Qur'an says otherwise, the Qur'an means nothing to me, but luckily the Qur'an confirms the truth that I'm stating anyway based on observing reality.

For example, if the Qur'an said there is no suffering in the world, then it is lying, but it doesn't say that.

I like the Qur'an so much because it says the right things, it doesn't seem to lie at all, it is very straightforward, and it says that God alone is the sole power, in control of everything from setting up your adversaries to making people evildoers made for hell like fish are made for water, and that Allah is responsible for absolutely everything, down to guiding and misguiding people, and that you're not special but can easily be replaced.

You're foisting your irrational megrims on the Quran,
and your translations are inauthentic !

Plz, don't waste my time.

hicham9

The Qurn was not "revealed" in (what we call) "Classical Arabic" (but in an* Arabian tongue).

CA was formulated by (post-qurnic) Ajamites (e.g., Sb/Sibawayh); !

~ Both the script and vocabulary (of the Qurn) bespeak an Aramean origin

indefinite

@hicham9 What makes you think Hijaz has any place in Qurans revelation except sectarian delusions?

Whatever happened to the false "Mecca" & "al-Madnah" al-MuZawwarah!

FreedomStands

Have you read 478

Yes, I did read 478 followed by 479 (ie. in context), I also read 4230 (which you failed to address in your reply), &c.
Matter of fact is, I read the whole Quran, multiple times, in its original language. & I still do, and shall, G-D willing, read it again and again and again, until I return back to my One Master/Owner.

The Quran taught me that G-D is Omnibenevolent.
The root of all evil is NOT G-D but Iblys.
Hence, to my discernment, your malevolent "god" is none other than hybris.

You're foisting your irrational megrims on the Quran,
and your translations are inauthentic !

Plz, don't waste my time.

4231
and you cannot elude Him on earth, and you will have none to protect you from God, and none to bring you succour.

God controls even what evil befalls a person from their own hands, it said so clearly "All is from God" and then even "whatever evil befalls you in your own selves, written in a decree before We bring it into existence " and then to top it off it says "and you can not will it, except as Allah wills it" meaning that you can't even will things unless Allah wills them, and even more the Qur'an clearly has stated repeatedly that Allah misleads, and step by step leads people astray and harms them too. Iblis can't do anything, he is an enemy and an ambitious one but there are many enemies and Shaitans and villains.

Are you denying "All is from God"? Even what your hands earn and send forth to your destruction? I mean what are you arguing? The Qur'an even says "we will punish them by your hands" and the control there. Iblis can not do anything on his own, he even says so

3882
(Iblis) said "Then, by Thy power, I will put them all in the wrong,-

848
And when Satan made their deeds seem fair to them and said No-one of mankind can conquer you this day, for I am your protector. But when the armies came in sight of one another, he took flight, saying Lo! I am guiltless of you. Lo! I see that which ye see not. Lo! I fear Allah. And Allah is severe in punishment.

5916
Like the Shaitan when he says to man Disbelieve, but when he disbelieves, he says I am surely clear of you; surely I fear Allah, the Lord of the worlds.

3175
It is only the Shaitan that causes you to fear from his friends, but do not fear them, and fear Me if you are believers.

6842
On the day when it befalleth in earnest, and they are ordered to prostrate themselves but are not able,

With eyes downcast, abasement stupefying them. And they had been summoned to prostrate themselves while they were yet unhurt.

Are you sure I'm wasting your time? Is it that your time is such that it shouldn't be spent discussing these things with me?

You deny the existence of jinn, you deny the Earth is round, you do not perform salat, you suggest I am a follower of Iblis, you don't fast and you mock the fasting people (with that funny Ramadan Mubarak joke for example).

You've for whatever reason adopted the habits of the Jews in saying "G-D" rather than God or GOD or GoD or any variant.

You suggest that people are in the wrong for doing those things

9112
Those that turn (to Allah) in repentance; that serve Him, and praise Him; that wander in devotion to the cause of Allah, that bow down and prostrate themselves in prayer; that enjoin good and forbid evil; and observe the limit set by Allah;- (These do rejoice). So proclaim the glad tidings to the Believers.

971
And the believers, men and women, are protecting friends one of another; they enjoin the right and forbid the wrong, and they establish worship and they pay the poor-due, and they obey Allah and His messenger. As for these, Allah will have mercy on them. Lo! Allah is Mighty, Wise.

2114
Hence, who could be more wicked than those who bar the mention of God's name from His houses of worship and strive for their ruin, they have no right to enter them save in fear ? For them, in this world, there is ignominy in store; and for them, in the life to come, awesome suffering.

G-d?

591
The Shaitan only desires to cause enmity and hatred to spring in your midst by means of intoxicants and games of chance, and to keep you off from the remembrance of Allah and from prayer. Will you then desist?

I am the follower of Iblis for stating that "All is from God" as the Qur'an says to say? I'm the follower of Iblis for saying that God controls everything, good and evil?

1049
Say I do not control for myself any harm, or any benefit except what Allah wills; every nation has a term; when their term comes, they shall not then remain behind for an hour, nor can they go before (their time).

7188
Say I do not control any benefit or harm for my own soul except as Allah wills; and had I known the unseen I would have had much of good and no evil would have touched me; I am nothing but a warner and the giver of good news to a people who believe.

5343
and that it is He alone who causes to laugh and to weep;

10106
And do not call besides Allah on that which can neither benefit you nor harm you, for if you do then surely you will in that case be of the unjust.

5722
No evil befalls on the earth nor in your own souls, but it is in a book before We bring it into existence; surely that is easy to Allah

951
Say Nothing will afflict us save what Allah has ordained for us; He is our Patron; and on Allah let the believers rely.

5810
Lo! Conspiracy is only of the devil, that he may vex those who believe; but he can harm them not at all unless by Allah's leave. In Allah let believers put their trust.

3936
Will not Allah defend His slave? Yet they would frighten thee with those beside Him (that Iblis is the power of evil). He whom Allah sendeth astray, for him there is no guide.

3937
And whom Allah guides, there is none that can lead him astray; is not Allah Mighty, the Lord of retribution?

Not clear enough? Wasting your time?

3222
And who could be more wicked than he to whom his Sustainer?s messages are conveyed and who thereupon turns away from them? Verily, We shall inflict Our retribution on those who are lost in sin!

Yet you're the good friend of "G-D" apparently, that you have some private lessons from such which tell you that I'm a follower of Iblis?

I worship the Lord of Devils, the Ruler of Evil, the Greatest and Mightiest Satan (Adversary) that can be, the one that can not be defeated, it isn't Iblis.

Correct me in my religion if there is a problem and you have any compassion.

FreedomStands

In addition, how can you claim "omni-benevolence" when clearly evil exists in the world and is not abolished?

Would you be considered "benevolent" if you watched a child be raped and mutilated and did nothing when you easily could?

What excuses can you make?

What partner powers are there? Is something restraining God? Is God incapable of acting against evil? Is God disabled by some power? Can things be created and exist without God? So that Iblis creates things that God didn't?

What blasphemy will you choose to justify your statements or the reality of things (which perhaps you are barely aware of, since the Earth is flat after all).

Is it that there are many creators besides God? Or just one creator besides God that creates evil while God only does good yet is so apparently good that evil is allowed to flourish and children are allowed to be raped and mutilated up the wazoo (its their own fault of course?).

I'm the senseless one? I'm the one presenting things which don't correspond with sense or reality?

What about this

Isaiah 457
I form the light, and create darkness I make peace, and create evil I the LORD do all these things.

Isaiah 520
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter. (Are you claiming evil is Good? Do you know what "omni" means? How does evil exist at all if "Omni" benevolence exists?)

Deuteronomy 3239
"See now that I myself am he! There is no god besides me. I put to death and I bring to life, I wound and I heal, and no one can deliver out of my hand.

So where is this omni-benevolent one you speak of? Certainly evil would not and could not exist or be permitted if omni-benevolence existed, that is why it is logically and realistically a lie to claim omni-benevolence exists, omni would overcome everything else.

Luke 125
But I will show you whom you should fear Fear him who, after your body has been killed, has authority to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him.

Matthew 1028
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

Hebrews 1031
It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Exodus 101
Then the LORD said to Moses, "Go to Pharaoh, for I have hardened his heart and the hearts of his officials so that I may perform these signs of mine among them

FreedomStands

If the Qur'an and the Bible isn't to your taste, how about http//www.shaivam.org/hipgodco.htm

FreedomStands

18.66 Abandon all varieties of systems and just surrender unto Me. I shall deliver you from all sinful reactions. Do not fear.

"Tell me who are You in such a fierce form? My salutations to You, O best of gods, be merciful! I wish to understand You, the primal Being, because I do not know Your mission.

The Supreme Lord said I am death, the mighty destroyer of the world, out to destroy. Even without your participation all the warriors standing arrayed in the opposing armies shall cease to exist.

Therefore, get up and attain glory. Conquer your enemies and enjoy a prosperous kingdom. All these (warriors) have already been destroyed by Me. You are only an instrument, O Arjuna.

Bhagavad Gita, chapter 11, verses 31-33"

mmkhan

3882
(Iblis) said "Then, by Thy power, I will put them all in the wrong,-

Peace brother,

If you understand alQuraan/alKitaab in translations/interpretations you will end up with such understandings as quoted above.
Where is the power mentioned in that aayat? Does izzat means power? Please check Arabic and multiple translations before saying any lie on Allah.

May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan

Man_of_Faith

Hello FreedomStands,

You deny the existence of jinn, you deny the Earth is round, you do not perform salat, you suggest I am a follower of Iblis, you don't fast and you mock the fasting people (with that funny Ramadan Mubarak joke for example).

I deny the existence of the supernatural jinn, I do not do salat, I do not fast too. Am I a kafar?

I am the follower of Iblis for stating that "All is from God" as the Qur'an says to say? I'm the follower of Iblis for saying that God controls everything, good and evil?

All is from the Rabb or sustained/upheld by the Rabb, but we are responsible for our own thoughts and thinking. But it was the Rabb that created these human bodies so if we do things instinctive and are clouded by our bodies then in a way it was because of the Rabb, but it is our fault giving in to that trap.

You cannot however not follow something that does not exist. Neither Ebless nor Shaytaan are any animate beings. Ebless is just used as an ordinary word in the text. Shaytaan refers to one's instinctive drive.

Be well

FreedomStands

Peace brother,

If you understand alQuraan/alKitaab in translations/interpretations you will end up with such understandings as quoted above.
Where is the power mentioned in that aayat? Does izzat means power? Please check Arabic and multiple translations before saying any lie on Allah.

May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan

So its a lie that we operate by Allah's power and that "All is from God"?

FreedomStands

Hello FreedomStands,

I deny the existence of the supernatural jinn, I do not do salat, I do not fast too. Am I a kafar?

All is from the Rabb or sustained/upheld by the Rabb, but we are responsible for our own thoughts and thinking. But it was the Rabb that created these human bodies so if we do things instinctive and are clouded by our bodies then in a way it was because of the Rabb, but it is our fault giving in to that trap.

You cannot however not follow something that does not exist. Neither Ebless nor Shaytaan are any animate beings. Ebless is just used as an ordinary word in the text. Shaytaan refers to one's instinctive drive.

Be well

By the mainstream Muslim standards you are not meeting the qualifications of a Muslim which are generally those 5 pillars they usually talk about at the very least, according to them.

Besides the Hadith, generally the mainstream Muslims believe the following

The Qur'an is the word of God, sent in Arabic, inspired in Muhammed through Gabriel.
That there are angels, generally believed to be winged beings who can take human forms and are the servants of God.
That there are the jinn, who are some kind of creature that are not angels or humans.
That there is paradise and hellfire, that the paradise is a place of Earthy pleasures and the hellfire is a place of physical torment through fire and other tortures.
That the prophets were good people who said and did good things and were sincere and kindly.
That there were many prophets sent to a variety of civilizations throughout time and that Islam was the only religion promoted by them (and generally imagined to be something similar to the Islam practiced today by the mainstream Muslims which included worship and monotheism).
That there is only one God, who is not a human.
Standard worship 5 times a day.
Fasting every day for a whole month (Ramadan).
Going to Hajj and performing many of the usual rituals.
That Iblis was a Jinn who is now called Shaitan but that there are other evil adversaries among the humans and the jinn.

and stuff like that. People who don't believe in or follow most of those practices are not considered Muslims by the mainstream or maybe by others who consider themselves Muslims.

I'm mainly only disqualified by extremist kinds of Muslims and maybe some others by thinking many parts of the Hadith are blasphemous but generally I get around too much trouble by stating what the Hadiths are historically.

I don't follow many of the Hadith rulings like keeping a beard or whatever, but for centuries this was not common in the Muslim world anyway since Turks for example traditionally kept mustaches without beards sometimes and a variety of fashions.

I do qualify as a mainstream Muslim though pretty much by most standards besides those who think Islam requires a beard or whatever.

I think you're on a spiritual journey of discovery as you continue to learn and translate the Qur'an with your method and things like that.

The physical exercises or expression (practiced by the Jesuit Order even) is one of the main things that "feels" if anything like it might be a missing component that differentiates a philosophy from a religious practice maybe.

Did you see those videos I showed somewhere that had the Buddhist, Sikh, and Mormon talk about the way they pray?

Man_of_Faith

I rather disqualify as a muslim than live a life in lies. Peer pressure is one's downfall.

Be well

FreedomStands

I rather disqualify as a muslim than live a life in lies. Peer pressure is one's downfall.

Be well

True no matter what, since if one is good merely because others around them are good it doesn't mean they are actually a good person (placed in different conditions they might freely do evil if there are others around them who are supporters), and if its peer pressure to do bad that wins out, then that is obviously bad too.

I disqualify in the eyes of many people as many things, and maybe qualify as many things too, but the eyes of people are crossed worse than a Siamese cat or Barbara Streisand, so it doesn't matter much anyway.

At the end of the day, I want to be safe, secure, healthy, happy, powerful, protected, free, untroubled, humorous, beautiful, serene, and satisfied.

I try to achieve that in the immediate, and in all experiences, and so my mind thinks of how that isn't being achieved perhaps and how to achieve it; what I call "Strategies".

What are the causes of suffering, how can they be alleviated without the elimination of experience.

What makes me happy truly and lastingly, how shall I go about achieving that sensation.

What really satisfies me, how to achieve longer lasting satisfaction.

If a person's mind starts operating and problem solving about these greater issues in life, perhaps they will accomplish something for their own pleasure and benefit while they have time.

hicham9

Salute @M0F.

... Ebless is just used as an ordinary word in the text. Shaytaan refers to one's instinctive drive.

The above is your personal understanding (not mine).

That said, I've got a question for you.

Who's to blame for the degrading "fruit" between your legs?

Is it

G-D?
Adem & his mate?
Something else? (identify)

SLM

Man_of_Faith

It is my understanding yes.

What is the point with your question? Rhetoric?

Be well