Salat as per the mainstream muslim tradition!
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The standard prayer is fine, is a meditative exercise for one's own benefit.
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Enjoin prayer on thy people, and be constant therein. We ask thee not to provide sustenance We provide it for thee. But the (fruit of) the Hereafter is for righteousness.629
O ye who believe! When the call is heard for the prayer of the day of congregation, hasten unto remembrance of Allah and leave your trading. That is better for you if ye did but know.2110
And be constant in prayer, and render the purifying dues; for, whatever good deed you send ahead for your own selves, you shall find it with God behold, God sees all that you do. -
I have read all these ayahs before and I believe wholeheartedly in them. What I will take from your reply is this
"The standard prayer is fine, is a meditative exercise for one's own benefit."
And that is what I want to discuss with the people on this forum. I personally think the standard prayer is fine ... it is about my submission to God five times a day which gives me a lot of satisfaction.
Quran 1328
"Those who believe, and whose hearts find satisfaction in the remembrance of Allah for without doubt in the remembrance of Allah do hearts find satisfaction." -
Agreed. Therapeutic at the least.
Peace
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I have read all these ayahs before and I believe wholeheartedly in them. What I will take from your reply is this
"The standard prayer is fine, is a meditative exercise for one's own benefit."
And that is what I want to discuss with the people on this forum. I personally think the standard prayer is fine ... it is about my submission to God five times a day which gives me a lot of satisfaction.
Quran 1328
"Those who believe, and whose hearts find satisfaction in the remembrance of Allah for without doubt in the remembrance of Allah do hearts find satisfaction."Yep, me too.
The standard prayer covers all the things mentioned in the mainstream translations of the Qur'an, and exceeds the other religions which also have practices similar which are not often followed (Buddhists, Hindus, Sikhs, Jews, Christians all have formal worship practices that include ablution, standing, bowing, and prostration while reciting praises and prayers in the Muslim style but most people don't do them).
The practices are very ancient, many people say they are "pagan" which is true, since the ancient "pagans" often were given the same messages as well, the Ancient Egyptians worshiped in this fashion, and the Sumerians, and the Chinese, and even the Northern Europeans and others have records of this same practice, Native Americans, Aztecs, the whole world worshiped like this, except sometimes they would later do it to idols which were representations of concepts usually like "Justice" "Love" "Fertility" or whatever.
The majority of the people on this website who are active users seem to not pray, and if they pray they do less or some sporadic or minimized version, and they don't fast, or they do some greatly minimized version, and they don't believe in angels or jinns or have strange ideas, some of them even believe the Earth is Flat while not believing in other things like Jinn.
So here you can witness what might be a tremendous miracle and curse from Allah, where the Qur'an can be used to misguide people as well as guide people, and widespread hypocrisy even in the face of revelations, and people who are totally convinced and bold in what they are doing.
They reject often that Allah should be feared, they reject that Allah is in control of everything, they reject science sometimes, they say "peace" and then insult each other.
Enjoy the forum though! It can be fun to vent and get your ideas out, but you won't find many people to be very cooperative or nice really, you'll find they will make some rude remarks while wishing you peace.
It can help maybe if you imagine them all to be furry monkeys. Actually no maybe that doesn't help, that just made me really angry. Now I laughed.
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Yep, me too.
The standard prayer covers all the things mentioned in the mainstream translations of the Qur'an, and exceeds the other religions which also have practices similar which are not often followed (Buddhists, Hindus, Sikhs, Jews, Christians all have formal worship practices that include ablution, standing, bowing, and prostration while reciting praises and prayers in the Muslim style but most people don't do them).
The practices are very ancient, many people say they are "pagan" which is true, since the ancient "pagans" often were given the same messages as well, the Ancient Egyptians worshiped in this fashion, and the Sumerians, and the Chinese, and even the Northern Europeans and others have records of this same practice, Native Americans, Aztecs, the whole world worshiped like this, except sometimes they would later do it to idols which were representations of concepts usually like "Justice" "Love" "Fertility" or whatever.
The majority of the people on this website who are active users seem to not pray, and if they pray they do less or some sporadic or minimized version, and they don't fast, or they do some greatly minimized version, and they don't believe in angels or jinns or have strange ideas, some of them even believe the Earth is Flat while not believing in other things like Jinn.
So here you can witness what might be a tremendous miracle and curse from Allah, where the Qur'an can be used to misguide people as well as guide people, and widespread hypocrisy even in the face of revelations, and people who are totally convinced and bold in what they are doing.
They reject often that Allah should be feared, they reject that Allah is in control of everything, they reject science sometimes, they say "peace" and then insult each other.
Enjoy the forum though! It can be fun to vent and get your ideas out, but you won't find many people to be very cooperative or nice really, you'll find they will make some rude remarks while wishing you peace.
It can help maybe if you imagine them all to be furry monkeys. Actually no maybe that doesn't help, that just made me really angry. Now I laughed.
"The majority of the people on this website who are active users seem to not pray, and if they pray they do less or some sporadic or minimized version, and they don't fast, or they do some greatly minimized version, and they don't believe in angels or jinns or have strange ideas, some of them even believe the Earth is Flat while not believing in other things like Jinn."
Ok well I was not aware of that ... the impression I got is that the people here believe in the Qur'an as the message of God and therefore believed in it wholeheartedly. We believe in Jinns because we believe in the word of Allah (Swt). Not to be rude to anyone, but I would like to know why they do not pray, believe in Jinns etc?
"So here you can witness what might be a tremendous miracle and curse from Allah, where the Qur'an can be used to misguide people as well as guide people, and widespread hypocrisy even in the face of revelations, and people who are totally convinced and bold in what they are doing."
Do these people believe in the oneness of God? Do they Believe in the angels, the judgment day and message of God (i.e Quran)? If yes then it is between Allah (swt) and their souls on the day of judgement if they are wrong. You or me are no ones to pass judgement on them.
"They reject often that Allah should be feared, they reject that Allah is in control of everything"
I believe that Allah (swt) does not aim to be feared. He is the most just the most merciful. He is the creator of all that there is. But since he asks us to follow his commands and when we don't, we are told about the consequences about disobeying our creator. But I don't know how the others on this forum may be talking about Allah (swt). What I state is simply my Belief.
"they reject science sometimes"
To their own determent I say.
"Enjoy the forum though! It can be fun to vent and get your ideas out, but you won't find many people to be very cooperative or nice really, you'll find they will make some rude remarks while wishing you peace."
To be honest I have found much worse while trying to converse with people on other supposedly "muslim" forums. I find the conversation here to be much more decent and constructive, even if the parties don't agree amongst themselves.
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"The majority of the people on this website who are active users seem to not pray, and if they pray they do less or some sporadic or minimized version, and they don't fast, or they do some greatly minimized version, and they don't believe in angels or jinns or have strange ideas, some of them even believe the Earth is Flat while not believing in other things like Jinn."
Ok well I was not aware of that ... the impression I got is that the people here believe in the Qur'an as the message of God and therefore believed in it wholeheartedly. We believe in Jinns because we believe in the word of Allah (Swt). Not to be rude to anyone, but I would like to know why they do not pray, believe in Jinns etc?
"So here you can witness what might be a tremendous miracle and curse from Allah, where the Qur'an can be used to misguide people as well as guide people, and widespread hypocrisy even in the face of revelations, and people who are totally convinced and bold in what they are doing."
Do these people believe in the oneness of God? Do they Believe in the angels, the judgment day and message of God (i.e Quran)? If yes then it is between Allah (swt) and their souls on the day of judgement if they are wrong. You or me are no ones to pass judgement on them.
"They reject often that Allah should be feared, they reject that Allah is in control of everything"
I believe that Allah (swt) does not aim to be feared. He is the most just the most merciful. He is the creator of all that there is. But since he asks us to follow his commands and when we don't, we are told about the consequences about disobeying our creator. But I don't know how the others on this forum may be talking about Allah (swt). What I state is simply my Belief.
"they reject science sometimes"
To their own determent I say.
"Enjoy the forum though! It can be fun to vent and get your ideas out, but you won't find many people to be very cooperative or nice really, you'll find they will make some rude remarks while wishing you peace."
To be honest I have found much worse while trying to converse with people on other supposedly "muslim" forums. I find the conversation here to be much more decent and constructive, even if the parties don't agree amongst themselves.
I ask them the same questions, why? It often seems to stem from the belief that the mainstream translations of the Qur'an are incorrect and that the words have different meanings or intentions, so since they don't believe in jinn they consider it absurd and look for other definitions or concepts for jinn (often that jinn is a reference to humans), but at the same time some of the people who do that also consider the Earth flat and stuff, so its pretty weird what goes on here sometimes.
Very many of them seem to take the Qur'an as an important text which they always refer to.
My views are generally in accordance with mainstream Islam except I'm not very fond of the bad things written in the Hadiths but I take the Hadiths as what they are, stories written some time after anyone supposedly mentioned in them was long dead.
As for the fear thing, not to correct you or anything, but I was basing that statement on things like
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O ye who believe! Fear Allah as He should be feared, and die not except in a state of Islam.http//www.google.ca/cse?cx=partner-pub-96715146088074583428093302&ie=UTF-8&q=fear+Allah&sa=Search&ref=www.islamawakened.com/quran/&gws_rd=cr&ei=jNSRVc_iDZH2oAShqoeoDg#gsc.tab=0&gsc.q=fear Allah&gsc.page=1
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@FS,
stop sniping, not good for you,
all this energy you are expanding being cynical about some here could be put to better use,
such as learning Arabic, then you could decide for yourself what the fuss is really about.
as Allah says, listen to what is being said and follow the better course thereof...
Peace.
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Good thread! I have decided, God willing, to start taking Arabic classes this fall and learn Arabic well enough so that I can translate the Quran and hadith (both Sunni and Shia collections, since I do notice many Quranist - a term I do not consider pejorative - have a residual Sunni bias in their approach to the Quran while I tend to believe the Mutazilites (and therefore the Shia, also) are less likely to get things wrong perhaps because those sects don't believe in abrogation of Quranic what's, at least consciously, except for the Agha Khanites. It also seems that both the Sunni and Shias have added extra lines to the Adthan (in the Shia case, because Muhawiya the Caliph after the murder of Ali Ibn Talib, the 4th Caliph, had the family of Ali cursed from the Friday Pulpit). These are my conclusions based on reading Sunni and Shia hadith and histories, so if you disagree with my conclusions, it's fine.
I notice too that some Quran Alone don't pray Salat prayer, and in my opinion it saddens me because the Quran commands it, so they are losing out. At least make Salat as best as one's understanding leads according to Quran teaching.
My Kindle Fire makes spelling corrections and suggestions and every time I spell Ali Ibn Talib, it gets auto-corrected to Taliban, which is irritating! The Taliban would hate Ali, according to my reading of history.
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@FS,
stop sniping, not good for you,
all this energy you are expanding being cynical about some here could be put to better use,
such as learning Arabic, then you could decide for yourself what the fuss is really about.
as Allah says, listen to what is being said and follow the better course thereof...
Peace.
The Qur'an seems rather full of this "sniping" activity in its commentary about things, perhaps someone will see it and not want to be like those things.
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Ok well I was not aware of that ... the impression I got is that the people here believe in the Qur'an as the message of God and therefore believed in it wholeheartedly. We believe in Jinns because we believe in the word of Allah (Swt). Not to be rude to anyone, but I would like to know why they do not pray, believe in Jinns etc?
We are still at debate about praying. That's why! Some people find benefit in it. Others don't. Then there are also those who have come across other meanings of the word salaat. What connection does jinn have with prayer? You can see jinn if you try hard. Its a creature. Just because I see chimps does not mean I have to believe in all of evolution theories. Belief is very personal though and in Islam each of us manages our own fate. You sum it up here
Do these people believe in the oneness of God? Do they Believe in the angels, the judgment day and message of God (i.e Quran)? If yes then it is between Allah (swt) and their souls on the day of judgement if they are wrong. You or me are no ones to pass judgement on them
they reject science sometimes
rotfl I suppose its because some artificial conspiracy theories are presented too convincingly. I fell for a few too once and my sibling who swears by science once fell for the reptilian politician conspiracy theory of David Icke.