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Freedom

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Issues / Questions
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  • R Offline
    R Offline
    roshan_m
    wrote on last edited by
    #14

    Government as we know it today is forceful, unjust, unsustainable (every country in the world is in debt - it borrows money in the name of unborn children so they can devour as much as they can while in the power) - they don't bring real world values but they invent things so people would think they are necesary under the pretense that they regulate or make things better (2103) and they eat other people's wealth unjustly through stealing (tax) 429

    Peace.

    Peace sister an everyone,
    although in general I agree with your whole post, I do not command going to the extreme of seeing any form of central government as necessarily oppressive thiefs. Only some form of central governance allowed in the past and in present to make substantial investments in infrasturcture, public services and improve people's living standards. Total decentralization of powers and letting everyone be 'lord' of themselves form a vacuum of power and give a way to creating warring factions, warlords, and if not taxation, then pillage of people's resources. Look at Afghanistan and Somalia. These countries didn't have in the past much a tradition of having centralized governments and they will go on for the next decades in chaos, warring, warlordism and insecurity. Even though the central govt was somehow established in AF, it is very weak and I don't see it getting any better without international assistance.

    As for the taxation, I also disagree with seeing it ENTIRELY as a stealing. It is indeed stealing if such taxes go primarily to the coffers of corrupt leaders. But if you look at the statistics of OECD, the most developed countries have the highest tax to GDP ratio (around 35%) while the developing countries around 19%. In many developed countries, the taxes are used for ensuring provision of public services, such as health care (UK has healthcare entirely funded by insurance tax and its completely FREE for EVERYONE), free education and even higher education (many Scandinavian countries have state funded higher education), pension systems, roads, railways subsidies, water and sanitation, I could go on and on. Same with government regulations; they are here for a reason, to regulate relationships in the society and ensure some form of rule of law.

    Now regarding few problems that you mentioned

    1. Corruption. Often central leadership in many countries is corrupt and will use the state budget to the advantage of their own. But again, this is not inherently due to the existence of government but due to the leaders who are behind it!
    2. Debt and unsustainabilty of the governments nowadays originates from unequal power relations between the governments and the banking and the corporate system that was deregulated around 1960s in accordance with the neoliberal agenda. This gave less power to the government to control finance system and in fact nowadays the governments (and us) are the slaves of the banks. Also, along this line, tax burden on the society is unequal with poor people paying large part of their incomes in he taxes (income tax and VAT going mainly on consumption) and ridiculously low taxes on wealthy people and corporations (again its inherent in the neoliberal agenda and convincing the governments to cut corporation taxes, give unsustainable exemptions for the companies and in general the fact that rich have more money to hire lawyers and accountants for tax evasion and tax avoidance purposes etc etd). As a result you see those corporations like Google, Apple or Sturbucks involved in tax evasion schemes and paying as ridiculous taxes as 2.5%. Many studies were done claiming that the money saved by the corporations in tax evasion schemes would be more than enough to balance the debt and cover current govt expenditure without any need for future debt!!

    As you see, lots of issues we face nowadays derives from this unequal power that corporations and banks have over the governmnets and they can lobby politicians for their own agenda and interest. This is a really complicated net of dependencies. Do not just target the weak 'enemy' but search and see what is the real and serious threat. Do not look at the the effect but also at the causes of this all mysery in the world.

    The problem is not government per se but corrupt government. The problem is not taxation per se but unjust taxation and unsustainable, unjust spending propelled by influences of the powerful few.

    Stay blessed
    M.

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    • M Offline
      M Offline
      mmmm
      wrote on last edited by
      #15

      There is nothing free provided by the government (somebody had to pay for it for you even if he doesn't want it, not to mention the quality of the services) and there is no possability of having justified theft it is imposible - if you steal you cannot justify it even if you give 90% of your stolen goods to the poor - you stole it it wasn't yours to give in the first place.

      Peace.

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      • J Offline
        J Offline
        JavaLatte
        wrote on last edited by
        #16

        https//scontent-nrt1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/11825101_1016793241676770_3340804880342243676_n.jpg?oh=23e0b29bdbb035980e2fd06d421c6a7c&oe=563BD854

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        • J Offline
          J Offline
          JavaLatte
          wrote on last edited by
          #17

          https//scontent-nrt1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/t31.0-8/s720x720/11834876_1635366516730993_1511597754427142136_o.jpg

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          • H Offline
            H Offline
            huruf
            wrote on last edited by
            #18

            No government or lack of it, no system or lack of it is going to be better that the people who are involved in it. Systems by themselves are not the matter bu thre morality of the people who are involved.

            Salaam

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            • F Offline
              F Offline
              FreedomStands
              wrote on last edited by
              #19

              Make this thread about me if you know what is good for you!

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              • J Offline
                J Offline
                JavaLatte
                wrote on last edited by
                #20

                https//scontent-sin1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/11813464_10204748573856573_5902414332769906781_n.jpg?oh=c03997f907ad8242be7f661c153af00a&oe=567B1984

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                • F Offline
                  F Offline
                  FreedomStands
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #21

                  https//scontent-sin1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/11813464_10204748573856573_5902414332769906781_n.jpg?oh=c03997f907ad8242be7f661c153af00a&oe=567B1984

                  Haha! That is really a great one for me!

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                  • F Offline
                    F Offline
                    Farabi
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #22

                    https//scontent-sin1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/11813464_10204748573856573_5902414332769906781_n.jpg?oh=c03997f907ad8242be7f661c153af00a&oe=567B1984

                    You knew it that since the beginning of time, based on evolution perspective, we trust all of our senses. Cant help it.

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                    • J Offline
                      J Offline
                      JavaLatte
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #23

                      You knew it that since the beginning of time, based on evolution perspective, we trust all of our senses. Cant help it.

                      I don't like most of TV shows! (sorry if my response is unrelated)

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