Jonah---Never swallowed by a whale
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Peacee Fusion/zayd.
I am merely asking questions.
I expect people to go with their understanding of course.
I am not going to enforce anything on anyone.
However , Qoran deals with beliefs that require both faith and reason/Science/logic.
Sometimes ,yes stories have happened literaly and to serve as lessons...etc.
For example when Moses was sent to Pharoah,what happened?was it literal?
And We have sent Moses with Our Ayah?s (miracles or signs) to Pharaoh and his elders proclaiming ?I am a messenger from the Lord of the universe?. When he brought them our Ayah?s they laughed at him. Every Ayah We showed them was greater than the one that preceded it.? 4346-48
Someone will explain the "plagues" similar to what they explain other "Aayats" i.e signs/miracles... Does this mean they did not happen?
Just to ponder and search deep ,that s all.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Buddy, I did not say you wanna enforce anything upon others, certainly you cant enforce faith upon others unless you make them really believe from bottom of their hearts OR you show these people some Magic and you have a different agenda, which has happened ironically. Unfortunately I spent time with the people who believe in curse, nazar, magic, cast bad spells etc in order to justify their sufferings or to cause others ills, and those were all Muslims by faith.
Is it not the most ironic thing that most of the non-arabs muslims do not know more than a few verses of quran for the sake of prayers?
Because the do not know Arabic or perhaps because the priests in their culture make them not to read Quran with translation as this will make the people ask questions and those so called priest will lose their power upon them.I am but student and I started Quran understanding with a couple of years ago. The more I read, the more doubtful I become, until came a point where things started to make sense and I hope my journey will continue in the same manner.
There are some good people here who helped me as well. The verse 48 to me means that God punishments successively appeared in different forms with each new one more severe, for the purpose to make the rebellious leave their evil path.
I wanna share something here.
https//www.youtube.com/watch?v=LChGfJMur5o
The woman is talking about not believing in Angel Gabrael and the authenticity, saying that since there is no proof of such a person as Gabrael (even though there are proofs of all these men whom we called messengers from history for being reformers and helper of poor folks and with books) ever exited, hence the concept of wahi can not be true, and which implies no divine message was revealed.
So yes I agree with your statement that Quran expects believers to believe in FAITH. Simply put it. you must believe in Angels. Now its not similar that you can equate angels with god, saying that since you don't see or prove god, so its the same. No, there are many many signs around us that compel us to believe in the creator and his creations. But no such signs for what is called an Angel. except the fact that this concept is repeated from old scriptures/prophets with continuity and down to prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him.
So how can some one prove existence of Angels with logic and wisdom ??? I wish if folks can give me an answer as this would be a great help to my understanding.
What are the roles of Angels in this universe? is all of this documented in Quran? For example if we see disasters happening around us like earthquakes , tsunamis .. are these carried out by angles upon God instructions? Similar to the verses where two strangers came to Ibrahim as guests but were actually angels sent to destroy people of Lot. By this definition, there are disasters more than that of people of Lot (different kinds of viruses killing humanity in recent time) hence are we being cursed and punished by God, the only difference is that there is no prophet among us today to actually explain this phenomenon to us.
The point is that same chain of events are happening now, as they happened thousands years ago , cause and effect, peace and war, are we to believe the same context???
Cheers
Peacee Fusion/zayd.
I am merely asking questions.
I expect people to go with their understanding of course.
I am not going to enforce anything on anyone.
However , Qoran deals with beliefs that require both faith and reason/Science/logic.
Sometimes ,yes stories have happened literaly and to serve as lessons...etc.
For example when Moses was sent to Pharoah,what happened?was it literal?
And We have sent Moses with Our Ayah?s (miracles or signs) to Pharaoh and his elders proclaiming ?I am a messenger from the Lord of the universe?. When he brought them our Ayah?s they laughed at him. Every Ayah We showed them was greater than the one that preceded it.? 4346-48
Someone will explain the "plagues" similar to what they explain other "Aayats" i.e signs/miracles... Does this mean they did not happen?
Just to ponder and search deep ,that s all.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
All this questions about belief in God or angels depend on the first place on the idea one has of God and angels or whatever else. Many people who say they do not believe in God I could say that I don't believe either in the God they are thinking of, which continues, even considering him abstract or incorporeal, being a man, rather bypolar and not very logical. Weknow though, root of being itself is beyond us, beyondm our comprehension.
With angels I have the same "problem" I can't get a clear idea of them. I wuould dare to imagine that they are the agency through which God may manifest things for us. I would not think they are the movers of nature, I would think that is in nature laws themselves, but may be they are our movers in circumstances or all the time.
Salaam
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Peace Fusion.
That s it. Keep asking questions and learning and studying Qoran.
Of course we can have different views/opinions... But it does not mean we cannot grasp the truth.
The most important message from Qoran is to work on oneself and become a good soul. This requires time and effort and patience and help from GOD as we are being tried while going through this process.
We can start from any position of belief. Then we begin by getting to know about GOD,Angels ,scripture ,messengers, the straight path...And so on.
It does not really matter what Angels look like or what happened in the past, I mean it is pointless arguing about it.
I believe Qoran has all the answers we need for our salvation. We cannot know everything.
If we believe in Qoran, then we are asked to study/ponder and be patient until we attain certainty.
I have not asked ,in my posts,anyone to follow me ,neither have I said I am right or wrong in my understanding. I always ask people to check and find out for themselves.
However I point out that Qoran always advices us to be loyal to GOD Alone, trust only GOD, rely only on GOD. i.e Not to rely/trust /take as authority any of GOD s creations.
We should read//study/look at other views/advice/opinion and take what is best and what agrees with Qoran.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
What you said is cool and all fits perfectly if one has absolute belief in the Quran being word of God, every part of it with no changes whatsoever. If that belief is attained then definitely the path of journey becomes rather easier to travel.
So the question would be if one has already attained the above belief then he/she would read Quran and take it slow and try to understand bit by bit and if things look non logical or magical or miraculous on the surface, am sure with God's guidance, he/she will certainly hope to get an answer in his/her life before he/she passes away.
My question is what makes one have absolute belief in the first point, is it because he was born as muslim or because he was converted or because he read and understood... hence my question to you.. what makes you believe in Quran with absolute 100% comfort level, that it is indeed the word of God. am not questioning in the wrong way but I welcome every one to share what events or study etc make em believe in its truthfulness??? and how they crossed the line to be on the other side---believers.(angels/books/prophets)
Cheers
Peace Fusion.
That s it. Keep asking questions and learning and studying Qoran.
Of course we can have different views/opinions... But it does not mean we cannot grasp the truth.
The most important message from Qoran is to work on oneself and become a good soul. This requires time and effort and patience and help from GOD as we are being tried while going through this process.
We can start from any position of belief. Then we begin by getting to know about GOD,Angels ,scripture ,messengers, the straight path...And so on.
It does not really matter what Angels look like or what happened in the past, I mean it is pointless arguing about it.
I believe Qoran has all the answers we need for our salvation. We cannot know everything.
If we believe in Qoran, then we are asked to study/ponder and be patient until we attain certainty.
I have not asked ,in my posts,anyone to follow me ,neither have I said I am right or wrong in my understanding. I always ask people to check and find out for themselves.
However I point out that Qoran always advices us to be loyal to GOD Alone, trust only GOD, rely only on GOD. i.e Not to rely/trust /take as authority any of GOD s creations.
We should read//study/look at other views/advice/opinion and take what is best and what agrees with Qoran.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Believing angels is like believing in the natural order, natural forces and their effects on humans and their deeds. This belief is there in all religions including Buddhism. Not all can be equal, some are benefited with wealth, some with knowledge and some with good health etc... the natural forces plays an important role in balancing on who gets what, even modern science cant define on who gets what and the belief of this is primary for the belief in God.
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Peace Fusion.
This is a good question
.. hence my question to you.. what makes you believe in Quran with absolute 100% comfort level, that it is indeed the word of God. am not questioning in the wrong way but I welcome every one to share what events or study etc make em believe in its truthfulness???
My simple answer to you is this
http//www.total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/is-qoran-the-word-of-god/GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Believing angels is like believing in the natural order, natural forces and their effects on humans and their deeds. This belief is there in all religions including Buddhism. Not all can be equal, some are benefited with wealth, some with knowledge and some with good health etc... the natural forces plays an important role in balancing on who gets what, even modern science cant define on who gets what and the belief of this is primary for the belief in God.
Excellent! @ amin
Thanks good logic for the link handshake
Peace Fusion, great insights on your part,
What you said is cool and all fits perfectly if one has absolute belief in the Quran being word of God, every part of it with no changes whatsoever. If that belief is attained then definitely the path of journey becomes rather easier to travel.
So the question would be if one has already attained the above belief then he/she would read Quran and take it slow and try to understand bit by bit and if things look non logical or magical or miraculous on the surface, am sure with God's guidance, he/she will certainly hope to get an answer in his/her life before he/she passes away.
My question is what makes one have absolute belief in the first point, is it because he was born as muslim or because he was converted or because he read and understood... hence my question to you.. what makes you believe in Quran with absolute 100% comfort level, that it is indeed the word of God. am not questioning in the wrong way but I welcome every one to share what events or study etc make em believe in its truthfulness??? and how they crossed the line to be on the other side---believers.(angels/books/prophets)
I believe totally in Quran Kareem because of several reasons. One of
which is my personal will and the will of God intersected at some point.
Another reason is that the Quran unlike other scriptures is bold and emphatic muscle
and leaves no doubt by saying "this Quran is from the lord of the worlds".
Pay close attention to that statement because no other scripture makes
such a claim. The Bible does not say this book is from God,
neither does any other scripture and the reason for this is worth noting.?This is the Scripture whereof there is no doubt, a guidance unto those
who ward off (evil).? (Q. 2 2)?A book which We have revealed unto thee (Muhammad) that thereby thou
mayst bring forth mankind from darkness unto light, by the permission of
their Lord, unto the path of the Exalted in power, Worthy of all praise.? (Q. 141)It describes itself as discernment (Furqan) between truth and error
?Truth has come and error has vanished; verily error is ephemeral.? (Q. 27 73)
?And say the Truth is from your Lord. Let him the who cares to believe, believe ;
and let him who will not care to believe, believe not.??Here is a Book whose verses are perfect in their form and content and are set
forth clearly by one who is All-wise and All-informed.? (Q.21)Even though the Quran discusses a multitude of subjects and all facets of life
and sometimes in great detail, it makes a bold claim that no contradiction or
inconsistency can ever be found in it. It says?Had it (the Quran) been from any source other than God, you would have
found many contradictions in it.?The Quran describes itself as a Light, a clear guidance and a blessed Book.
?It is a blessed Book which We have revealed, so follow it,? This Quran
verily guideth to the path, which is perfectly straight and announces to
believers who do what is right, for them there is a great reward.? (Q. 17 9)
?These are the verses of the Quran ? the lucid Book offering guidance
and good tidings to the Believers.??The Quran is an Admonition and a reminder.? (Q. 271)
?And say (O Muhammad); The Quran hath been revealed to me that I
should warn you by it and also those whom it may reach.? (Q. 61? It hath come down from the Lord of all domains of existence, will you
deny the gift that is with one?? (Q. 36. 80-82)The Quran cautions that if you will believe you will attain success and
sublimity but if you will follow Satan, his associates and progeny. you
will end in Hell. The Quran is a blessing, a healing and a mercy We
sent down through the Quran a healing and a mercy to the believers
which causes distress to the wicked.? (Q 17 82)The Quran says that no power on earth can produce a Book like itself
?Say ?Should men join together and attempt to produce the like of
this Quran, they cannot produce a like of it, however much the one
group may help the other. ? (Q. 17 8As for the question, "was Jonah swallowed by a whale" for me the
creature is irrelevant, but the wisdom extracted from the revelation is
what mattersGod bless
peace
-
Salaam,
We forget that the same God who caused the sea to part for Bani Israel and prophet Musa (pbuh), is also able to sustain a human being's life against all odds that would normally end it!
Normally if you are swallowed, I agree with amin, the natural forces created by God, do what they are created to do, but God is capable of stopping or altering these at Will. And God is certainly capable of all things.
So no harm or otherwise can come about to anyone except with the permission of God. I think that's the case too here.
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You are giving new definitions to Malaika which are mentioned many many times in Quran. I was under the impression that angles are creations of God from source light and with no free will and they act upon God's instructions. Creation in the sense that they have physical body etc.
What you said makes sense but then how your definition can be put to test with the word angles and its context used in the quran? Please clarify because I have certainly read angels in so many places in Quran as if they are creatures.Cheers
Believing angels is like believing in the natural order, natural forces and their effects on humans and their deeds. This belief is there in all religions including Buddhism. Not all can be equal, some are benefited with wealth, some with knowledge and some with good health etc... the natural forces plays an important role in balancing on who gets what, even modern science cant define on who gets what and the belief of this is primary for the belief in God.
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I am in no way saying that God is not capable, it is just a discussion to understand the meaning of verses with the common understanding that people have had for centuries (3 days or 40 days inside stomach and what Quran says).
What I mean is when God wants to break his laws it is clearly mentioned as in the case of people of caves (Ashab Al Kahaf) or when God made the person die for 100 years along with his donkey and made them alive to show his power to them for he can create anything.I have no issue with believing any of the definitions, its just that am trying to understand where and at which point I should use my faith to understand Quran or where would I use the logic and wisdom.
For example the following verse
Take this, my shirt, and cast it over the face of my father; he will be able to see. And bring me your family, all together. (Surah 12, Yusuf verse 93). Should I take it part of faith because otherwise rubbing of cloths would not return once lost eyes.OR should I use the following interpretation... which makes sense to my logic and appears wise.
"Go back to your home
and present my shirt to my father, (I know
that he possesses so much insight that) he
will recognise this shirt. And come back to
me with all your family members."So you see my confusion? And I believe this same phenomenon has created ignorance and rise to myths and miracles etc to so many people in the Islamic world in past and now that we see many silly things and ideas floating and give rise to some sort of a magical islam and the same thoughts and beliefs actually makes the people void of (innovations, creations, free thinking etc) if it is blown out of proportion which ironically has been the case. Like when I shares some of these ideas and thoughts with my mom, she told me to repeat Kalima as if am going out of islam.. It is like embedded into the generations.
Cheers
Cheers
Salaam,
We forget that the same God who caused the sea to part for Bani Israel and prophet Musa (pbuh), is also able to sustain a human being's life against all odds that would normally end it!
Normally if you are swallowed, I agree with amin, the natural forces created by God, do what they are created to do, but God is capable of stopping or altering these at Will. And God is certainly capable of all things.
So no harm or otherwise can come about to anyone except with the permission of God. I think that's the case too here.
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So basically you took the verses of Quran and try to make your point that after reading these verses, you are absolute sure that this indeed is the Book from your lord revealed to Muhammad via Gabrael. Is that correct?
If yes then I am glad for you.
May I ask other folks how did they come to the same conclusion about Quran, what made them reach to the height of utter belief In Quran?cheers
Excellent! @ amin
Thanks good logic for the link handshake
Peace Fusion, great insights on your part,
I believe totally in Quran Kareem because of several reasons. One of
which is my personal will and the will of God intersected at some point.
Another reason is that the Quran unlike other scriptures is bold and emphatic muscle
and leaves no doubt by saying "this Quran is from the lord of the worlds".
Pay close attention to that statement because no other scripture makes
such a claim. The Bible does not say this book is from God,
neither does any other scripture and the reason for this is worth noting.?This is the Scripture whereof there is no doubt, a guidance unto those
who ward off (evil).? (Q. 2 2)?A book which We have revealed unto thee (Muhammad) that thereby thou
mayst bring forth mankind from darkness unto light, by the permission of
their Lord, unto the path of the Exalted in power, Worthy of all praise.? (Q. 141)It describes itself as discernment (Furqan) between truth and error
?Truth has come and error has vanished; verily error is ephemeral.? (Q. 27 73)
?And say the Truth is from your Lord. Let him the who cares to believe, believe ;
and let him who will not care to believe, believe not.??Here is a Book whose verses are perfect in their form and content and are set
forth clearly by one who is All-wise and All-informed.? (Q.21)Even though the Quran discusses a multitude of subjects and all facets of life
and sometimes in great detail, it makes a bold claim that no contradiction or
inconsistency can ever be found in it. It says?Had it (the Quran) been from any source other than God, you would have
found many contradictions in it.?The Quran describes itself as a Light, a clear guidance and a blessed Book.
?It is a blessed Book which We have revealed, so follow it,? This Quran
verily guideth to the path, which is perfectly straight and announces to
believers who do what is right, for them there is a great reward.? (Q. 17 9)
?These are the verses of the Quran ? the lucid Book offering guidance
and good tidings to the Believers.??The Quran is an Admonition and a reminder.? (Q. 271)
?And say (O Muhammad); The Quran hath been revealed to me that I
should warn you by it and also those whom it may reach.? (Q. 61? It hath come down from the Lord of all domains of existence, will you
deny the gift that is with one?? (Q. 36. 80-82)The Quran cautions that if you will believe you will attain success and
sublimity but if you will follow Satan, his associates and progeny. you
will end in Hell. The Quran is a blessing, a healing and a mercy We
sent down through the Quran a healing and a mercy to the believers
which causes distress to the wicked.? (Q 17 82)The Quran says that no power on earth can produce a Book like itself
?Say ?Should men join together and attempt to produce the like of
this Quran, they cannot produce a like of it, however much the one
group may help the other. ? (Q. 17 8As for the question, "was Jonah swallowed by a whale" for me the
creature is irrelevant, but the wisdom extracted from the revelation is
what mattersGod bless
peace
-
Salaam,
I am not giving any definitions to the malaika. Even if they are frequently mentioned, they are not clearly defined. We do know that they serve various functions, possibly one of these are the observable natural laws.
The Quran, is simply a warning and a reminder. The focus as itself advises, should not be on verses that are ambiguous, but the direct ones that give laws or commandments ( i.e. believe in God and do this and dont do that etc). Focusing and trying to derive interpretations from ambiguous verses is identified as having a kind of disease.
As for coming to the conclusions that the Quran is from God, there are many reasons and no reason at the same time.
One of the reasons among many reasons, is that of the coming end which the Quran frequently refers to and the recreation of life, a central theme.
Think of the typical life cycles of solar systems. The star is born and consequently all the planets are born, some of them having the right conditions for life, breed and host life. We know only of earth for sure, there maybe others that we are unaware of. The star burns through its fuel, towards the end of its term it expands either to engulf and destroy all of its planets and become silent as a white glowing mass or explode as a supernova, also, destroying planets, in both cases leaving star dust. From this star dust, new stars and planets are born and thus life can come about, again!
I think the detail was not that necessary, but that is the biggest example of life and death that we have and also that of resurrection - something that the Quran emphasized heavily over a 1000 years ago when the prophet Muhammad (pbuh)'s audience astonishingly would question him in ridicule.."shall we be brought back after we are mere dust and bones?"
What about the "no reason" for my conclusion?
"I agree, and believe it, all of it is from God."
I recognize and turn to the One who initiated the universe, seen and unseen in monothiestic belief, God, the Almighty, the Eternal, the Absolute.
The Quran confirms and identifies God as such and this stance.
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Hello,
Angels are what we are struggling to become. They do have free will since they are an independent consciousness in the Grand Consciousness, although they are simultaneously in symbiosis with God and that power source through the link. They lack a physical Body because they have been released from that attachment although they can gain possession over a Body if necessary. We are actually also as them, potential ones, but we are also being tested to see if we choose to succumb to the World or choose our divine nature. The World was made to be corrupting and deceptive and an obvious "testing ground". When a person has "separated the Spirit from the Flesh" then they can begin to see such things.
For those blessed having seen the man-made science-fiction Star Trek can find a parable with 'the Borg' in there being connected to a huge computer network where there is a mainframe and infrastructure which can be considered to be 'Rabb' and Holy Spirit. Its allegorical use is very good actually. Just see the metaphor in it. That is basically how things work when joining the Realm/Kingdom of God.
For those opposing the above can disregard the message at whole.
Be safe
Emanuel/Aminujil -
Cool explanation buddy. Is this your own theses or you inspired from some sources? I would love to know because the mainframe example is really great.
Since you did not cite references, hence point to your own understanding of them. I have a hypothetical question. Is it possible that these angels can be seduced to go and act against God?
Hello,
Angels are what we are struggling to become. They do have free will since they are an independent consciousness in the Grand Consciousness, although they are simultaneously in symbiosis with God and that power source through the link. They lack a physical Body because they have been released from that attachment although they can gain possession over a Body if necessary. We are actually also as them, potential ones, but we are also being tested to see if we choose to succumb to the World or choose our divine nature. The World was made to be corrupting and deceptive and an obvious "testing ground". When a person has "separated the Spirit from the Flesh" then they can begin to see such things.
For those blessed having seen the man-made science-fiction Star Trek can find a parable with 'the Borg' in there being connected to a huge computer network where there is a mainframe and infrastructure which can be considered to be 'Rabb' and Holy Spirit. Its allegorical use is very good actually. Just see the metaphor in it. That is basically how things work when joining the Realm/Kingdom of God.
For those opposing the above can disregard the message at whole.
Be safe
Emanuel/Aminujil -
Hello Fusion,
Cool explanation buddy. Is this your own theses or you inspired from some sources? I would love to know because the mainframe example is really great.
The "mainframe allegory" was my parable in relationship to something some of us can relate to contemporaneously.
It is based on my reinterpretation of Quran using unbiased and original ways of reading the ancient Arabic with a rendition into English I am working on right now. The real message of Quran conveys a very different perspective of faith much in line of what Jesus teaches in the Biblical Gospels. It simply confirms him really well. However, he is not some kind of unique "son of God" (which is used metaphorically there), nor does that son relationship have anything to do with any biological tie. The comparison is made when a person acts just as God would in any case scenario or at least very well close to it. Although no one can be above their Master they can yet be on equal level.
Since you did not cite references, hence point to your own understanding of them. I have a hypothetical question. Is it possible that these angels can be seduced to go and act against God?
When they abide separated from the Body and can be stern at this then it is not very likely, but it would be possible if someone was really that foolish and gave in to temptations. The biggest trap for an angel or someone close to being one is being arrogant due to your superiority and let it express itself in your decisions and judgements. That is not as according to the Rabb. When you are attached to a Body then the biggest concern is not allowing the Body to control you with its primitive instinctive drive and that you enjoy being it because gradually you succumb to its desires and it clouds your link to God.
Be safe
Emanuel/Aminujil -
Interesting indeed, would you please share your work with me at this stage or you wanna keep it until it is fully translated?
Cheers
Hello Fusion,
The "mainframe allegory" was my parable in relationship to something some of us can relate to contemporaneously.
It is based on my reinterpretation of Quran using unbiased and original ways of reading the ancient Arabic with a rendition into English I am working on right now. The real message of Quran conveys a very different perspective of faith much in line of what Jesus teaches in the Biblical Gospels. It simply confirms him really well. However, he is not some kind of unique "son of God" (which is used metaphorically there), nor does that son relationship have anything to do with any biological tie. The comparison is made when a person acts just as God would in any case scenario or at least very well close to it. Although no one can be above their Master they can yet be on equal level.
When they abide separated from the Body and can be stern at this then it is not very likely, but it would be possible if someone was really that foolish and gave in to temptations. The biggest trap for an angel or someone close to being one is being arrogant due to your superiority and let it express itself in your decisions and judgements. That is not as according to the Rabb. When you are attached to a Body then the biggest concern is not allowing the Body to control you with its primitive instinctive drive and that you enjoy being it because gradually you succumb to its desires and it clouds your link to God.
Be safe
Emanuel/Aminujil -
Hi Fusion,
I could, but it is nothing public right now because I cannot safely guarantee there are not interpretation errors which could be avoided merely by rereading the same passage several times and reflecting. I have had little to no revision of what has been rendered so far.
The English rendition is also following Arabic sentence structure (albeit correct English word order but the clauses follow Arabic style) to retain faithfulness to the original script so can be a bit dull to read to not say the least. By the official release I plan on also publishing a paraphrased version that sounds okay in English. One issue is Arabic omits many pronouns, for example, in a relative clause and it is not always possible to remain totally faithful to the Arabic by not inserting any words however limited to mainly pronouns.
Regardless, at whole it gives a different image of the faith system which not surprisingly (to me) looks somehow Gnostic to the style.
The "deen" is easy; the Body is a test for you and its instinctive drive is Satan, so the only way is to fight it, fight yourself and find your Spirit which has the potential to be like God for you were created to be in His image. The World is a distraction and made to be corrupting by mode of deception to indulge in it. You probably see that the Body calls for you to enjoy its chemical processes. Once in the second chapter God (appropriately) calls it "ape", primate (misquoted/misinterpreted by sectarians to mean that people were to become despicable apes).
No rituals, no weird stuff and in fact image-making of God is detrimental and against the advised decree of God due to the Body has a tendency to make physical beacons for itself (see Kabah in Mecca) or attribute force to lifeless items. God is within you; it is a symbiotic phenomenon and God spoke to Moses "I am who am I" and Jesus said "I am in the Father and the Father in me". That is the only way to Oneness and absorption/merging into the Oneness since there is only one existence, coexistence in God, and the Realm is at hand.
And the communication (connection) with God should be constant, nothing timed to occur according to some fixed schedule and calling unto God can occur spontaneously whenever required to receive guidance that you cannot channel directly intuitively without imploring. Otherwise just have faith YOU CAN and it will be so. Revere God by your perfect resemblance, worship is empty words for something that has no needs or can be charmed or bribed. Prostration should be done with the heart.
Sorry for flooding those who do not wish to hear with words. Please disregard my message.
Be safe
Emanuel -
What you said about the Deen, can this be easily understood by commoners? What I mean is that the masses then, with no proper education and understanding, was deen come down to target intellectuals only?
I am asking this because when you take for example a common person then or even now, the follow to deen is understood as following rituals. Any comment on how your understanding can be easily understood by every one with ease and was this the purpose of God rather than millions of people on earth in all times, understood God through rituals... does this means all of those people wasted their life... what would become of them in the next life.
cheers
Hi Fusion,
I could, but it is nothing public right now because I cannot safely guarantee there are not interpretation errors which could be avoided merely by rereading the same passage several times and reflecting. I have had little to no revision of what has been rendered so far.
The English rendition is also following Arabic sentence structure (albeit correct English word order but the clauses follow Arabic style) to retain faithfulness to the original script so can be a bit dull to read to not say the least. By the official release I plan on also publishing a paraphrased version that sounds okay in English. One issue is Arabic omits many pronouns, for example, in a relative clause and it is not always possible to remain totally faithful to the Arabic by not inserting any words however limited to mainly pronouns.
Regardless, at whole it gives a different image of the faith system which not surprisingly (to me) looks somehow Gnostic to the style.
The "deen" is easy; the Body is a test for you and its instinctive drive is Satan, so the only way is to fight it, fight yourself and find your Spirit which has the potential to be like God for you were created to be in His image. The World is a distraction and made to be corrupting by mode of deception to indulge in it. You probably see that the Body calls for you to enjoy its chemical processes. Once in the second chapter God (appropriately) calls it "ape", primate (misquoted/misinterpreted by sectarians to mean that people were to become despicable apes).
No rituals, no weird stuff and in fact image-making of God is detrimental and against the advised decree of God due to the Body has a tendency to make physical beacons for itself (see Kabah in Mecca) or attribute force to lifeless items. God is within you; it is a symbiotic phenomenon and God spoke to Moses "I am who am I" and Jesus said "I am in the Father and the Father in me". That is the only way to Oneness and absorption/merging into the Oneness since there is only one existence, coexistence in God, and the Realm is at hand.
And the communication (connection) with God should be constant, nothing timed to occur according to some fixed schedule and calling unto God can occur spontaneously whenever required to receive guidance that you cannot channel directly intuitively without imploring. Otherwise just have faith YOU CAN and it will be so. Revere God by your perfect resemblance, worship is empty words for something that has no needs or can be charmed or bribed. Prostration should be done with the heart.
Sorry for flooding those who do not wish to hear with words. Please disregard my message.
Be safe
Emanuel -
Hi Fusion,
What you said about the Deen, can this be easily understood by commoners? What I mean is that the masses then, with no proper education and understanding, was deen come down to target intellectuals only?
It should not be so hard to understand in my opinion, but it is always possible to complicate things. However, I would argue that it actually is a test of intelligence, but it does not really include the massive need for education to grasp this but only an open mind and some careful reflection. What I said ought not to require much education to understand but it is mostly about common sense and what seems plausible. We live in a world of lies and religion has often been an instrument for political motives.
I am asking this because when you take for example a common person then or even now, the follow to deen is understood as following rituals. Any comment on how your understanding can be easily understood by every one with ease and was this the purpose of God rather than millions of people on earth in all times, understood God through rituals... does this means all of those people wasted their life... what would become of them in the next life.
The blunt answer is yes, they have wasted much of their focus on something in vain. The ritualism is a slow-to-die remnant from the age of Paganism when people had physical gods and things were hedonistic and they still are. It is pathetic that a religion 2015 still uses a beacon/idol for their god such as the big idol in Mecca. Even then people such as in Christianity also materialize their god such as that it becomes a distinctly separate object. But God does not work that way by those dynamics.
People do not need to know everything about the nature of God to pass the test, but it may be important to know their obstacles in life such as what to focus on. Most people fail to understand that their biggest stumbling block in life is their own Body which contains Satan (instinctive drive).
...was this the purpose of God rather than millions of people on earth in all times, understood God through rituals...
The purpose was like this God created Spirit copies of Himself albeit blank/undeveloped, one reason we are often called "Children of the Father by some prophets", and God also created a contradiction which was the World as we know it which was made to corrupt and deceive us, i.e. it is correct to say this is a test of intelligence because we have been deceived by our God on purpose. It is the Body that clouds our Spirit origin perception which Spirit is our real selves and every time we give in to its biological amusements and desires it strengthens its fog effect on the Spirit. The best way to countermeasure it all is to begin to fight the primitive nature of it by suppressing it and which ignorant people call extremist of who have not understood the contradiction in the World.
There are also people who take it too far by depriving it of necessary nutrition and even causes it malnutrition but it should be treated like a dog or cat by feeding it for as much as it needs but keep separated from it and not become it. It sounds somehow cruel to speak of our own Body like his but if one can distance themselves from it the better. We are however not supposed to become lifeless, inanimate and passive beings just because we keep our Body restrained but be alive in God being a mirror of Him sharing His qualities by the symbiosis between.
God will harvest the best souls which are then released from the "Flesh" to become angels and the failures will wither and die and their seed will grow again; they will experience 'Jahannom' which is a cycle of receiving "new skins" over and over again until they either break down their Spirit further or become completed/perfected up to God's standards. It is worth reflecting upon in what manner God refers to when it comes to "perfection". One key is to have immense empathy, empathy can take a person very far, just observe the teachings of the Messiah Jesus. But the essential parameter is actually to distance yourself from the Body's impulses, its crude nature.
According to me it is far more simple and explanatory than the sectarian version of the faith, but that is up to you.
The more indulgence is committed by the individual the more it succumbs to the Flesh and dependent it becomes. Its attachment, dependence and bonding to the "Flesh" can increase and thus the delusion also goes rampant. It is harder for a heavily deluded person to understand. People turn unable to see how primitive they have become and how driven by instincts they are.
Obviously all that I wrote about above can be studied in Quran if the poor book is interpreted as it is worthy of. People have made a joke of it even if little has been changed from since it was compiled. It is not like I have been sitting down and conjectured a lot but is the true account. This is how it goes when people take for granted that an interpretation is correct just because a long chain of interpreters have said it is so and then not ever challenge it might be faulty to begin with. To find the errors and then unwrap all falsehood is not that hard; it was not obvious and not hidden. The people who sat down those years ago did not know much at all what the text said but what was important to them was that they made a doctrine similar to tradition. They did not even know the nature of the word "allah".
I know people call me arrogant because of this, but I urge people to reflect on their own.
Be safe
Emanuel
