Alcohol/intoxicants.
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thank you...
I am very convinced the moderate consumption of alcohol is not haram...
and that the excessive consumption of alcohol can lead someone to abomination and haram, and therefore is not advisable...
there is no commandment asking not to consume alcohol in the Quran...
the commandment is not to follow Satan's lures and machinations...
this is what I will answer someone who asks me for advice about this matter... which is the same advice I give myself...
as an exhibit, there is a commandment not to pray while being drunk, with alcohol or any other mind altering drugs, as sukara means inebriated, and you can also get inebriated with opium, heroin, marijuana, etc.
by the way I also agree with the use of marijuana for medicinal purposes, now go ahead and criticise me, LOL!
there is no commandment asking not to consume alcohol in the Quran...
And this is the disagreement.
Verse 590 does forbid Alcohol.
the commandment is not to follow Satan's lures and machinations
Yes. And those "lures and machinations" are . . . gambling, intoxicant, arrows, etc. Hence - Alcohol is forbidden.
"O you who have believed, indeed, intoxicants, gambling, stone alters , and divining arrows are but defilement from the work of Satan, so avoid it that you may be successful."
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Do not approach prayer while intoxicated says the Quran. If alcohol is prohibited, like pigs meat, the Quran would not say this quote. As a prohibition that's a sin to consume at all, are only four things as explicitly stated in the Quran.
Peace.
Peace
this is why one cannot read a verse on its own... the Quran is a whole, and we have to take account of all verses and guidelines...
it is not a matter of opinion, or preference...
beside what is clearly forbidden, if each of us were to give our opinions, likes, dislikes, fears, pleasures, emotions, it can never end as we are different...
but the base guideline is to avoid excess... we even cannot avoid Satan's whispers, but can protect from it...
why did Allah say that to every prophet, there will be devils coming their way trying to deflect them from the righteous path...
it is more important and logical to stick to the guideline of avoiding excess...
besides, the chimp is asking the wrong question, and it is not that alcohol is made haram by Allah... it is clearly not...
Now would I advise someone, anyone to drink alcohol? would I preach that everybody should drink alcohol? would I stop anybody from drinking alcohol?
these are questions worth asking me, or anyone who drinks alcohol... -
Greetings and Peace, all group
Although many translations may state "fermented substance," a more literal definition is "that which conceals/covers" with the root word pertaining to cover/conceal. This is demonstrated in 2431 by use of the word bikhumurihinna.
2431 And tell the believing females to lower their gaze and keep covered their private parts, and that they should not reveal their beauty except what is apparent, and let them put forth their shawls over their cleavage. And let them not reveal their beauty except to their husbands, or their fathers, or fathers of their husbands, or their sons, or the sons of their husbands, or their brothers, or the sons of their brothers, or the sons of their sisters, or their women, or those maintained by their oaths, or the male servants who are without need, or the child who has not yet understood the composition of women. And let them not strike with their feet in a manner that reveals what they are keeping hidden of their beauty. And repent to GOD, all of you believers, that you may succeed.
To be sure, intoxicant will include more substances than only brewed substances that contain alcohol. To me, it makes sense that Satan can use intoxicants as a tool--not only brewed substances containing alcohol. Don't you think that heroin is probably worse for a believer than alcohol?
Given free choice, I'm all for any and all drugs being legal. It sure doesn't mean that I'd choose to take them, though!
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
salam,
thanks for this ijtihad, I accept the definition of "that which conceals/covers", it makes better sense...
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Just my two cents.
I believe that khamr would be translated as "alcoholic beverages". I reject translating it as "intoxicants" for the following reason
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It makes sense to avoid alcohol because it is the most harmful of all drugs, all factors taken into consideration.
http//www.cbc.ca/news/technology/alcohol-ranked-most-harmful-drug-1.919186 -
However, it would not be appropriate to translate it as "intoxicants", because that would mean that all intoxicating substances are haram. However, after orgasm, the brain produces endorphins; chemicals extremely similar to morphine. During sleep, it also produces DMT, a powerful hallucinogen. So I must ask, what difference does it make where it comes from? It's still intoxication, and it is (that is, sex and sleep) in no way, haram.
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If we are warned against Alcohol - then why should it be legal or accessible? Why would you make beverages that you cannot consume?
Dude, do you not remember the Prohibition? It lead a rise to gangs, Al Capone, the Iron Law of Prohibition, and people dying from drinking tainted alcohol.
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There is no prohibition on alcohol in the Quran. Good advises is to stay away from intoxicants for obvious reasons. However it is not prohibited. Considering getting drunk is obviously the problem I think it is best to avoid it or limit oneself. I avoided alcohol for a year and I recently enjoyed a nice alcoholic ginger beer or two (on separate occasions). You can get low alcohol drinks or alcoholic 'soft drinks' (less then .5% here) I don't think there is any problem with them they are a nice refreshing drop. Are low alcohol beverages or alcoholic soft drinks 'intoxicants'? Not really... You would probably make yourself sick before intoxicated with most of them. I think common sense prevails in complying to the Quran. I don't see it as a sin drinking alcoholic beverages or prohibited however I do think intoxication is not a good thing and God sternly advises against it.
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If a country makes alcohol completely illegal,is there any point in telling people not to drink and drive? You don't. You just tell them that consuming alcohol is forbidden and punishable by prison. So what would be the point of The GOD telling people to not drink and pray if drinking is a sin?
"O you who believe, do not go near prayer when you are intoxicated till you know what you say,(443)You ask a Muslim this question and they'll quote from their hadith books that drinking is haram and that this verse above is abrogated by the hadith that bans drinking. Kufr and hypocrisy at its finest. They're indirectly implying that the laws Bukhari wrote overrides the word of The GOD(Quran). Funny right? The Quran even talks of people in paradise who pass around a glass of wine. "Indeed, the righteous will drink from a cup of wine whose mixture is of Kafur,"
Bukhari is the lawmaker of Muslims. He decides what is haram and what is halal. He is their god.
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Khamr has a meaning of khumaar or drunkenness, i.e. enebriation, aside from its meaning of wine and grapes. It most literally means grape wine as well as grapes. It has been taken as a simile for all alcoholic drink by Muslims. Sakar however, more appropriately means all alcoholic drink. In my opinion it is better not to drink alcohol because it is too easy to get enebriated, but I do not believe it is haram. It is the enebriation that is haram. The verse that tells us not to come to prayer drunk, the one that says that we take alcoholic drink (sakar) from fruits and the verses that say we will be given in paradise what we were given to eat here on earth and that we will be given wine in paradise, but it will not cause enebriation are all clear indicators that alcoholic drinks are not forbidden. However 'enebriation' IS the culprit and is the preferred meaning for 'khamr.' To find this meaning look up 'khamira' and then look at its masdar 'khamr.' it will say 'huwa khamira khamran' which is like 'huwa fa3ala fa3lan or fi3lan'. Fa3l or fi3l is the masdar of fa3ala, like khamr is the masdar of khamira.
Peace,
Anwar -
I woder why there is always so uch discussion about sirits being haram or not. Do we ctually need a little word "haram" like a red button in orde to undersand the dangr of something that is very plain to everybody even without the Qur'an uttering a word? Are we idiots or what?
The havock created by alcoholic drinks in society is formidable enough. We know that alcohol is the hardest drug that exists. Is it "haram", is the agic word there or is it not there? As far as I am concerned I do not need that word to avoid alcohol, if not for my sake, although you never know, for the many people, families, societies, that are harmed, destroyed, demeaned by it.
What do we care whether laws allow it or not? We know what it dos, so do we need that some law force us to avoid it? Would such law be effective? Who cares. For those who believe in God's words we do ot need that a law enforces anything onn us, we should kow that as members of asociety we need to take care of all its members, the weak, by character or any other cause, particularly. Avoiding alcohol is good for us and good for our fellow humans. Allthe Qur'an does, as happenns with othr things, is REMIND US. It is not discovering alcohol for us or telling us something we do not know, it is reminding us, and as it seems, reminders on thsi account nevr seem out of place seeing how in spite of it all, alcohol is alive and kicking.
Salaam
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Peace.
Personally I think there's a lot of time wasting when it comes to discussions on religious duties and inclusion of halal and haram into every act. These people are those who wants to be God so terribly that they judge everyone in accordance to their own self made scale. It is so easy to haram things like alcohol and swine (they add on to include prohibition of touching dogs and pigs as haram) but it is so difficult for them to haram dirty eateries, corruption, oppression, killing, suicide bombing (some even say 'halal' base on the intention of the bomber ie killing infidels). One country made it statutory law for a certain race to be muslim and when it comes to apostacy in that race it becomes a major issue in the country. All these are creation of people who are so idiotic to turn everything into a religious issue. The only thing religious in the Quran is chapter 112. The rest are guidance for success in this world and the next world. Adoption of those guidance into human laws are welcome but not to the point it is made into a religious issue and cause global hardship to everyone (the Creator does not oppress, the religious idiots do). If the Creator allows freedom of choice, who are these people to take them away? These people are nothing but God wannabees! All smart people must reject all these fanatics. The Quran is about living and thriving in this world and the next - human kind successful existence rest on self development to prove whatever the angels or iblis say of adam/humans is wrong - and here we are majority of which proving them right. Its a sad state, it is also a reflection of people's reading of the Quran and how much we have progress since then. Luckily in this age women are standing for their rights and be heard and being women they argue with determination and stamina - good or bad? I think interpretations are getting better. I need a Guinness, cheers!
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Peace everyone,
I'd like to share a quote with you.
In my opinion, one of the most detrimental things you can do in your journey to find the truth, is to start comprimising yourself or your morals/values for the people around you. If you have to start compromising yourself or your morals/values for your friends, then it's probably time to change your friends. It seems that too many people compromise themselves and their morals/values just to fit in. For example, one of my closest friends knows a muslim girl who drinks alcohol with her friends. She does not want to drink alcohol, but she does it anyway. It seems that she drinks alcohol to fit in and to please her friends. In my opinion, doing this is a mistake. Even though drinking alcohol is not forbidden by the quran, it seems that the quran advises people to stop drinking.
Also, I recommend the post below.
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9607636.msg372776#msg372776
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Personally, I consider my body a temple. Therefore, I treat my body with respect. Some people seem to have no respect for their bodies. They put all types of harmful drugs into their bodies, and then they wonder why they aren't healthy. They treat their bodies like trashcans, and then they wonder why they are apathetic/indifferent and can't find the motivation to do anything worthile. Instead of treating their bodies like temples, they treat their bodies like trashcans. Instead of nourishing their bodies, they harm their bodies. It seems that some people will never learn until it's too late. As a saying goes, "Too soon old, too late smart." I'm not referring to alcohol in this paragraph, by the way. I'm referring to really harmful drugs like Heroin, Crack Cocain, LSD, Chrystal Meth and other types of trash.
When it comes to alcohol, I don't drink alcohol at all. And I'm not planning to drink alcohol in the future. I know that the Quran doesn't forbid alcohol. But even though the Quran doesn't forbid alcohol, I don't want to drink it. Because the Quran seems to command us to not drink alcohol. It seems that some muslims (who follow "islam based on the Quran" drink alcohol to get tipsy/drunk. They seem to have liberal views on alcohol. But their views are incompatible with the teachings of the Quran, in my opinion. That being said, if some muslims who follow Quran-based islam drink alcohol in order to get tipsy/drunk, I will not judge them. And I will accept and respect their choice. I consider all muslims who follow Quran-based islam as my brothers or sisters, regardless of whether they drink alcohol or not. I think it's important to be tolerant and inclusive. I think it's a good decision to lay a side our differences and instead focus on our similarities. Because that will help us to remain united, in my opinion.
Even though I am no longer a sunni muslim, I don't reject/discard an idea just because it's classical/traditional. There is a quote Bruce Lee which goes like this
"Do not deny the classical approach, simply as a reaction, or you will have created another pattern and trapped yourself."
I have nothing against traditional muslims. And I have nothing against liberal/modernist muslims. I consider all muslims to be my brothers and sisters, regardless of whether they are traditional muslims or modernist/liberal muslims. But I'm not a traditional muslim. And I'm not a liberal/modernist muslim neither. I consider myself to be a monotheist. And I believe that we should only use the Quran as a source of law and guidance in islam.
As mentioned earlier, I don't reject/discard an idea just because it's classical/traditional. And I don't reject/discard an idea just because it's liberal. But I reject/discard an idea if it's incompatible with the teachings of the Quran. And in my view, drinking alcohol to get tipsy/drunk is incompatible with the teachings of the Quran. And therefore I have decided to never drink alcohol to get tipsy/drunk. To me, this decision is set in stone. But each to their own, I guess.