On Marijuana
-
Meet endocannabinoids (compression of "endegenous cannabinoids"
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocannabinoid_systemThese are cannabinoids (compounds found in cannabis/marijuana) that are produced naturally by the body, especially during times of physical or mental stress.
If God prohibited cannabis for us, why did he put cannabinoids in our brain? After all, the brain states caused by smoking marijuana can be also reached naturally, on occasion. Even ingesting high levels of THC causes, by making the blood vessels dilate and lowering blood pressure, a type of sleep, accompanied by vivid dreams.
The ayah prohibiting Khamr could NOT have been referring to ALL intoxicants, because it would then, by extension, also prohibit morphine, a drug that is naturally produced in the brain during pain, exercise, orgasm, etc ("endorphin" is short for "endogenous morphine".
The body may be a temple, but these drugs are already a part of it.
Khamr could be referring to alcohol. Not wine, but brewed alcoholic beverages, which makes sense, because unlike cannabinoids or morphine, the body doesn't produce alcoholic compounds, and is poisoned by them. Combining social, economic, individual, and health factors, alcohol is the worst drug. It doesn't belong in our system.
http//www.bbc.com/news/uk-11660210Peace.
-
Khamr could be referring to alcohol.
It is quite illogical to claim that khamr is alcohol and therefore is a sin to consume.
If a country makes alcohol completely illegal,is there any point in telling people not to drink and drive? You don't. You just tell them that consuming alcohol is forbidden and punishable by prison. So what would be the point of The GOD telling people to not drink and pray if drinking is a sin?
"O you who believe, do not go near prayer when you are intoxicated till you know what you say,(443)You ask a Muslim this question and they'll quote from their hadith books that drinking is haram and that this verse above is abrogated by the hadith that bans drinking. Kufr and hypocrisy at its finest. They're indirectly implying that the laws Bukhari wrote overrides the word of The GOD(Quran). Funny right? The Quran even talks of people in paradise who pass around a glass of wine. "Indeed, the righteous will drink from a cup of wine whose mixture is of Kafur,"
Bukhari is the lawmaker of Muslims. He decides what is haram and what is halal. He is their god.
Hence, there is no evidence to support the claim that alcohol is prohibited. This is just one of many illogical inconsistencies pushed by political and religious sectarians who like to make prohibitions. There is no such thing as a prohibited drink, meal, limb or air particle.
Marijuana actually has a lot health benefits.
http//www.trueactivist.com/still-believe-nature-got-it-wrong-top-10-health-benefits-of-marijuana/ -
You are all so biased.
I wonder what covers your hearts? Is it a creation of stone or something harder still?
Beware of your own biases when approaching a topic in the Quran.Invalid, are these the only two aayyahs that mention intoxicants in the Quran?
You have only picked two that conform with your biases instead of truly searching for complete understanding.
I don't know if you are doing it on purpose but this common amongst many members indeed.
It is saddening.
You are all becoming no different than the sectarians you look down upon. Your unanimous biases fed by the new age consensus in this forum.Wake up brothers
Look at the following verses please
2219
They ask you about intoxicants and gambling. Say ?In them is great harm, and a benefit for the people; but their harm is greater than their benefit.? And they ask you how much they are to give, say ?The excess.? It is thus that God clarifies for you the revelations that you may think.590
O you who believe, intoxicants, and gambling, and altars, and arrows of chance are tainted by the work of the devil. You shall avoid him so that you may be successful.
591
The devil only wants to cause strife between you through intoxi- cants and gambling, and to repel you away from remembering God and from the contact prayer. Will you be deterred?Intoxicants is not only limited to alcohol but it is anything that intoxicates your body and covers your judgement hence Khmer it covers or conceals your concern for discretion and refrain.
It clouds your judgement let's say.This includes any drug! Alcohol, marijuan, nicotine, cocaine, crack, ecstasy you name it any type of intoxicant.
Now! Pay attention to your Lord's words. He has not forbidden it at all.
But! Big BUT He has commanded you to avoid it that you may be successful.
It is obviously clear according these verses that there are some benefits BUT, BIG BUT again the harm outweighs the benefits.Will you refrain from partaking in that which your Lord has told you to avoid?
The choice is always yours people.
Do what you will God is watching.But don't ever try to to mock the righteous by shouting nonsense with no support.
The Quran is a Book to be taken in its entirety especially when trying to focus in on a specific topic.
You choose to very biasly analyze two. Disappointing really....You can do better brothers!
Some of us would have us turn to pot smoking promiscuous liberitarians if it were up to them nope
-
You are all so biased.
I wonder what covers your hearts? Is it a creation of stone or something harder still?
Beware of your own biases when approaching a topic in the Quran.Invalid, are these the only two aayyahs that mention intoxicants in the Quran?
You have only picked two that conform with your biases instead of truly searching for complete understanding.
I don't know if you are doing it on purpose but this common amongst many members indeed.
It is saddening.
You are all becoming no different than the sectarians you look down upon. Your unanimous biases fed by the new age consensus in this forum.Wake up brothers
Look at the following verses please
2219
They ask you about intoxicants and gambling. Say ?In them is great harm, and a benefit for the people; but their harm is greater than their benefit.? And they ask you how much they are to give, say ?The excess.? It is thus that God clarifies for you the revelations that you may think.590
O you who believe, intoxicants, and gambling, and altars, and arrows of chance are tainted by the work of the devil. You shall avoid him so that you may be successful.
591
The devil only wants to cause strife between you through intoxi- cants and gambling, and to repel you away from remembering God and from the contact prayer. Will you be deterred?Intoxicants is not only limited to alcohol but it is anything that intoxicates your body and covers your judgement hence Khmer it covers or conceals your concern for discretion and refrain.
It clouds your judgement let's say.This includes any drug! Alcohol, marijuan, nicotine, cocaine, crack, ecstasy you name it any type of intoxicant.
Now! Pay attention to your Lord's words. He has not forbidden it at all.
But! Big BUT He has commanded you to avoid it that you may be successful.
It is obviously clear according these verses that there are some benefits BUT, BIG BUT again the harm outweighs the benefits.Will you refrain from partaking in that which your Lord has told you to avoid?
The choice is always yours people.
Do what you will God is watching.But don't ever try to to mock the righteous by shouting nonsense with no support.
The Quran is a Book to be taken in its entirety especially when trying to focus in on a specific topic.
You choose to very biasly analyze two. Disappointing really....You can do better brothers!
Some of us would have us turn to pot smoking promiscuous liberitarians if it were up to them nope
My point was not to promote the consumption of intoxicants but rather expose the illogical reasons sectarians use to create a list of prohibitions. Brother, drinking 5 liters of coke is no different to getting drunk. Your sugar levels will go through the roof, your internal organs will shut down and you will die. Is there any point in banning coke? Of course not. It is your choice. What happens when you eat too much fast-food? obesity, heart disease and death. Should fast-food then be banned? Of course not.
It is your choice to either destroy yourself or become a better human being, physically, psychologically and spiritually. This exact same advice is given to us in Quran. Quran does not prohibit you from eating or drinking anything. Quran is sound advice to sound individuals. Only sound/self-aware individuals can make use of this piece of knowledge(Quran).
Today, government has adopted a lot from religion. Blind faith labelled as patriotism, holy war labelled as "defensive" war and apostasy labelled as treason. Government now dictates what you can eat, drink and think. You are told what to think and what not to think and in some parts of the world, they tell you how many children to have. They have put up a list of prohibitions and punish you for consuming it just like religion does.
We were all created with free will. The choices we make has a direct impact on not just ourselves but also life around us. The future depends on the inputs we make now. You form your future.
At the end of the day, it all boils down to choice. Quran gives advice on how to make some of these choices. The religion of Islam doesn't see it that way. A totalitarian tyranical system that makes prohibitions. There are no choices in Islam. It does not appreciate free will. Go into sheep mode or get executed for breaking the rules. No critical thinking hence no choices. The blind leading the blind.
-
Peace, I agree with HP_TECH, because I live in the US, the verses are quite easy to understand,
I know about intoxicants first hand, being sober is a no brainer if you want to be successful
as per Quran, on the other hand, things used for medicinal purposes are a great help
hence not banned as per Quran.peace
-
You are all so biased.
I wonder what covers your hearts? Is it a creation of stone or something harder still?
Beware of your own biases when approaching a topic in the Quran.Invalid, are these the only two aayyahs that mention intoxicants in the Quran?
You have only picked two that conform with your biases instead of truly searching for complete understanding.
I don't know if you are doing it on purpose but this common amongst many members indeed.
It is saddening.
You are all becoming no different than the sectarians you look down upon. Your unanimous biases fed by the new age consensus in this forum.Wake up brothers
Look at the following verses please
2219
They ask you about intoxicants and gambling. Say ?In them is great harm, and a benefit for the people; but their harm is greater than their benefit.? And they ask you how much they are to give, say ?The excess.? It is thus that God clarifies for you the revelations that you may think.590
O you who believe, intoxicants, and gambling, and altars, and arrows of chance are tainted by the work of the devil. You shall avoid him so that you may be successful.
591
The devil only wants to cause strife between you through intoxi- cants and gambling, and to repel you away from remembering God and from the contact prayer. Will you be deterred?Intoxicants is not only limited to alcohol but it is anything that intoxicates your body and covers your judgement hence Khmer it covers or conceals your concern for discretion and refrain.
It clouds your judgement let's say.This includes any drug! Alcohol, marijuan, nicotine, cocaine, crack, ecstasy you name it any type of intoxicant.
Now! Pay attention to your Lord's words. He has not forbidden it at all.
But! Big BUT He has commanded you to avoid it that you may be successful.
It is obviously clear according these verses that there are some benefits BUT, BIG BUT again the harm outweighs the benefits.Will you refrain from partaking in that which your Lord has told you to avoid?
The choice is always yours people.
Do what you will God is watching.But don't ever try to to mock the righteous by shouting nonsense with no support.
The Quran is a Book to be taken in its entirety especially when trying to focus in on a specific topic.
You choose to very biasly analyze two. Disappointing really....You can do better brothers!
Some of us would have us turn to pot smoking promiscuous liberitarians if it were up to them nope
question alcohol is toxic it kills plants.
is thc toxic? and does an intoxicant have to be toxic, not just by content but by amount as well?(poisonings such as water poisoning , your lifeblood containing too much water and thus being coming diluted beyond use)there's always that whole no one has died from smoking too much pot, and i haven't heard of THC being used to perserve other foods which i assumes is not damaging them but it does stick to fats so your body is storing thc for some reason if it's in you for a month.
alcohol is used in hormonal regulation fats are sterol (steriods), and hormones are in this catergory biologically alcohol in your diet increase your "libido" (run by alcohol consuming lipids in your body), this alcohol is in micro amounts like in artifical flavorings, breads, and cakes (things with extracts in them , extracts being 35% alcohol by fda regulation if it's less than this it can't be called an alcohol just a flavoring)
As an abrahamic monotheist i follow what's in the quran alcohol is an abomination of satan's handywork, yet it's everywhere in colognes soaps, shampoos, and deodorants, and one the breathe and bodies of the people all around us, and don't forget pumping out of their pores. but in-toxic-ants things toxic inside you is implied, caffine changes the way you think, eating more or less healthy chages the way you think but soming like advil or the pain killers derived from vemons (in some cases) are not thought of.to simplify this i spend a lot of time smoking pot but my interpretation of intoxicant are simply poisonous things, is marijuana even a good pesticide that we might think of it as "toxic"?
-
Fye
Pot has a lot of negative long term effects on your cognitive skills.
Also because it is an illegal drug, much research on its effects has not been conducted.
There are implications however that it may be more severe than previously thought.
I would not advise anyone to any kind of drugs.We all have our shortcomings and I am not judging you for what you do. Health wise speaking smoking anything will have lasting impact on your lungs and heart despise the myths that are propagated around the weed culture.
It is also quite addictive despite the myth. Not as addictive as other drugs, but you will still have a hard time quitting like with cigarettes.
It is ridiculous for you abstain from alcohol and then smoke pot. They're both intoxicants fye
I find it a contradiction to indulge in set activities because
If you spend a lot of time smoking pot, how do you perform your salat?
Do you approach it while your high?
Do you try to read while you're high?
Are you high right now?
I can kind of see the effects of it in your scrambled reasoning and logic
Try hard to quit brother muscle
-
My view on the subject is that intoxicants are not recommended in Quran because they are something which covers peoples understanding.
The verse 443 points it out.443 O you who believe, do not come near the contact prayer while you are intoxicated, until you know what you are saying. ...
Alcohol makes people stupid.
Psychedelics as pot and others enhance the understanding (in moderate doses - too much pot or too often dont have this effect). -
Fye
Pot has a lot of negative long term effects on your cognitive skills.
Also because it is an illegal drug, much research on its effects has not been conducted.
There are implications however that it may be more severe than previously thought.
I would not advise anyone to any kind of drugs.We all have our shortcomings and I am not judging you for what you do. Health wise speaking smoking anything will have lasting impact on your lungs and heart despise the myths that are propagated around the weed culture.
It is also quite addictive despite the myth. Not as addictive as other drugs, but you will still have a hard time quitting like with cigarettes.
It is ridiculous for you abstain from alcohol and then smoke pot. They're both intoxicants fye
I find it a contradiction to indulge in set activities because
If you spend a lot of time smoking pot, how do you perform your salat?
Do you approach it while your high?
Do you try to read while you're high?
Are you high right now?
I can kind of see the effects of it in your scrambled reasoning and logic
Try hard to quit brother muscle
whoa not bumpin drugs or anything I'm just saying one kills plants and the other simply is a plant
an my belief is drugs are in everything well alcohol is in everything from candy to natural and artificial flavourings even bread has alcohol in it. whether I smoke weed or not it it's the same thing my logic and reasoning is "everythings round" things can be complete even while we don't know them and so is my approach to life.
why is smoking weed bad? caffine is considered good in the mornings but it's addictive.
and right intoxicants make people make mistakes but it's alcohol. after avoiding alcohol in most foods I do feel more like all mistakes are made on purpose but it's the alcohol acting on peoples minds in small amounts. alcohol like pot or whatever people call it, has a psychoactive effect on your mind until it's out of your system.
avoid everything, life's livable as it is you shouldn't need a joint or a cup of coffee.once again sorry for promoting things of such nature I just wanted to be pro weed in my reply
has any one studied psychoactive compounds and how they work on peoples minds? like how caffine wakes people up in the morning and how a cup of milk and help you sleep, I really just think people are what they eat and drink.
-
whoa not bumpin drugs or anything I'm just saying one kills plants and the other simply is a plant
an my belief is drugs are in everything well alcohol is in everything from candy to natural and artificial flavourings even bread has alcohol in it. whether I smoke weed or not it it's the same thing my logic and reasoning is "everythings round" things can be complete even while we don't know them and so is my approach to life.
why is smoking weed bad? caffine is considered good in the mornings but it's addictive.
and right intoxicants make people make mistakes but it's alcohol. after avoiding alcohol in most foods I do feel more like all mistakes are made on purpose but it's the alcohol acting on peoples minds in small amounts. alcohol like pot or whatever people call it, has a psychoactive effect on your mind until it's out of your system.
avoid everything, life's livable as it is you shouldn't need a joint or a cup of coffee.once again sorry for promoting things of such nature I just wanted to be pro weed in my reply
has any one studied psychoactive compounds and how they work on peoples minds? like how caffine wakes people up in the morning and how a cup of milk and help you sleep, I really just think people are what they eat and drink.
Your whole argument is completely flawed because you assume that the word intoxicant is describing strictly in the archaic sense a Toxic poisonous substance. Hence why you claim it kills plants.
Not all poisons and toxic chemicals kill some just affect your physiological state. Think about pain killers, from Tylenol, to morphin, they are all "poisons" or "toxic" in a sense.Then you go on a long rant about alcohol in candy. That has nothing to do with khamri
FYI fye, there is a world of difference between what is considered alcohols in a scientific sense (chemistry)and alcohol as an intoxicating beverage. There are alcohols used for all sorts of things, take rubbing alcohol that is isopropyl alcohol. In organic chemistry chains of carbons(-C-C-C) that have hydroxyl groups(-OH) attached to them, hence carboxyls(-C-C-OH) are considered "alcohols".
These carboxyls groups are even in DNA bases and are essential for replication reactions.
THESE ARE NOT INTOXICANTS!! They do not cause intoxication! This is basic knowledge bruh.
Your trying to defend pot is making you sound silly.
That's why your whole argument about candy and etcetera having alcohol is completely ridiculous.When it comes to the word Khamri and intoxicant
I strongly advise you to use a dictionary.
I strongly advise you to check what the word al khamri means
I strongly advise to check further the meaning of the root kha mim ra
Use the PRL website or Lane or any other Classic Arabic LexiconLook at PRL for example
Kha-Miim-Ra = cover/conceal/veil, becoming changed/altered from a former state/condition, mixed/mingled/incorporated/blended, intoxication/wine/grapes, make-up, any intoxicating thing that clouds/obscures the intellect, come upon secretly/unexpectedly, crowding of people, odour of perfume, women's head cover, man's turban, a covering, something fermented/matured.
khamr n.fem. 2219, 590, 591, 1236, 1241, 4715
khumur n. masc. pl. 2431
...and let them draw/set/cast (walyadribna) with their veils/covers (bikhumurihinna) over (AAala) their breasts/bosom (juyoobihinna)...
Lane gives some examples ?the dwelling was hidden by the trees?, ?he concealed his testimony?, "She (a woman) applied KhaMaRat as a linament, to beautify her complexion.".
"KhiMaR a woman's head-covering."
LL, V2, p 443, 444, 445, 446 ## http//ejtaal.net/aa/#q=xmr
NOTICE how it says nothing of poison, chemical or toxic substance. Intoxicants is a totally different word fye.
What most people who can pick up a dictionary/lexicon will understand from Khmari or intoxicant is a substance that which clouds or obscures the intellect, or a substance that causes intoxication
Look what the definition of intoxicant is
intoxicant (ntksknt)
noun
anything that causes intoxication
adj
causing intoxicationNext fye use a dictionary to see what intoxication is in "scientific" terms
intoxication in Medicine Expand
intoxication in?tox?i?ca?tion (n-tk's-k'shn)
n.The pathological/ physiological state produced by a drug, serum, alcohol, or any toxic substance; poisoning.
Finally please re-read the Ayaas related for your own good
(22193) l-khamri intoxicants
(5905) l-khamru the intoxicants
(59110) l-khamri intoxicants -
The issue is craving for earthly matters.
-
The issue is craving for earthly matters.
Salam, yes, the issue is the craving of earthly matter and its deterrence from the worship of God, which should be priority #1.
Smoking pot, drinking alcohol, overeating junk food, whatever it is. You have to ask yourself what void you have inside you that you are trying to fill. And then ask yourself why you refuse to use Allah to fill that void.
-
Khumer could refer to lying or concealing the truth as well as wine/strongly fermented drinks (date/grape wine in those times). Indeed, when people are drunk they often conceal or exaggerate the truth (not just intoxicated drunk, but drunk with power or fame as well).
This verse of course does not say "intoxicants", this is a modern promoted translation; all older translations will say wine/fermented drinks. It clearly says Khumer (date/grape wine; and/or concealing the truth), it is a nuanced word with double meaning, like modern puns in English, the Qur'an is full of this type of language.
Of course if there were to be verses outlawing marijuana or opium it would have been easy, as their use was widespread during the time of the revelation of Qur'an. However, they are specifically not prohibited because of their medical qualities. Indeed, al-kohol, or alcohol, was invented by Muslim and Jewish physicians/alchemists who were discovering how to distill these same herbal medicines that had been in use for thousands of years. Alcohol was meant as a sterilizing and extracting agent for herbal medicines and surgical procedures. It was never meant to be drank!
Anyway, I would just remind people on this forum that millions upon millions of people daily receive medical treatments, procedures, and prescribed doses that involve specifically these two natural plants, Cannabis and Opium.
I will also remind you of God's own words
1057 O mankind, there has to come to you instruction from your Lord and healing for what is in the breasts and guidance and mercy for the believers.
1058 Say, "In the bounty of Allah and in His mercy - in that let them rejoice; it is better than what they accumulate."
1059 Say, "Have you seen what Allah has sent down to you of provision of which you have made lawful and unlawful?" Say, "Has Allah permitted you , or do you invent about Allah ?"
1060 And what will be the supposition of those who invent falsehood about Allah on the Day of Resurrection? Indeed, Allah is full of bounty to the people, but most of them are not grateful."Salaam,
Clash.
-
Khumer could refer to lying or concealing the truth as well as wine/strongly fermented drinks (date/grape wine in those times). Indeed, when people are drunk they often conceal or exaggerate the truth (not just intoxicated drunk, but drunk with power or fame as well).
This verse of course does not say "intoxicants", this is a modern promoted translation; all older translations will say wine/fermented drinks. It clearly says Khumer (date/grape wine; and/or concealing the truth), it is a nuanced word with double meaning, like modern puns in English, the Qur'an is full of this type of language.
Of course if there were to be verses outlawing marijuana or opium it would have been easy, as their use was widespread during the time of the revelation of Qur'an. However, they are specifically not prohibited because of their medical qualities. Indeed, al-kohol, or alcohol, was invented by Muslim and Jewish physicians/alchemists who were discovering how to distill these same herbal medicines that had been in use for thousands of years. Alcohol was meant as a sterilizing and extracting agent for herbal medicines and surgical procedures. It was never meant to be drank!
Anyway, I would just remind people on this forum that millions upon millions of people daily receive medical treatments, procedures, and prescribed doses that involve specifically these two natural plants, Cannabis and Opium.
I will also remind you of God's own words
1057 O mankind, there has to come to you instruction from your Lord and healing for what is in the breasts and guidance and mercy for the believers.
1058 Say, "In the bounty of Allah and in His mercy - in that let them rejoice; it is better than what they accumulate."
1059 Say, "Have you seen what Allah has sent down to you of provision of which you have made lawful and unlawful?" Say, "Has Allah permitted you , or do you invent about Allah ?"
1060 And what will be the supposition of those who invent falsehood about Allah on the Day of Resurrection? Indeed, Allah is full of bounty to the people, but most of them are not grateful."Salaam,
Clash.
Allah has said
O you who believe! Verily the intoxicants and games of chance and (sacrifices at) altars and divining arrows (are an) abomination from (the) work (of) the Shaitaan, so avoid it so that you may (be) successful.He gives specific instructions concerning intoxicants. Yes intoxicants not wine.
Those are two different words clash alkhamri or khamru is structurally, contextually different than khamran.Noun
(22193) l-khamri intoxicants
(5905) l-khamru the intoxicants
(59110) l-khamri intoxicants
(123610) khamran wine
(12417) khamran wine
(471520) khamrin wine -
Perhaps no one knows the true meaning then HP, as many translators seem to have differing translations.
Just take the first instance of "al khamri" 2219
Sahih International They ask you about wine and gambling. Say, "In them is great sin and benefit for people. But their sin is greater than their benefit." And they ask you what they should spend. Say, "The excess ." Thus Allah makes clear to you the verses that you might give thought.
Pickthall They question thee about strong drink and games of chance. Say In both is great sin, and (some) utility for men; but the sin of them is greater than their usefulness. And they ask thee what they ought to spend. Say that which is superfluous. Thus Allah maketh plain to you (His) revelations, that haply ye may reflect.
Yusuf Ali They ask thee concerning wine and gambling. Say "In them is great sin, and some profit, for men; but the sin is greater than the profit." They ask thee how much they are to spend; Say "What is beyond your needs." Thus doth Allah Make clear to you His Signs In order that ye may consider-
Shakir They ask you about intoxicants and games of chance. Say In both of them there is a great sin and means of profit for men, and their sin is greater than their profit. And they ask you as to what they should spend. Say What you can spare. Thus does Allah make clear to you the communications, that you may ponder
Muhammad Sarwar (Muhammad), they ask you about wine and gambling. Tell them that there is great sin in them. Although they have benefits for men, the sin therein is far greater than the benefit. They ask you about what they should give for the cause of God. Tell them, "Let it be what you can spare." This is how God explains for you His guidance so that perhaps you will think
Mohsin Khan They ask you (O Muhammad SAW) concerning alcoholic drink and gambling. Say "In them is a great sin, and (some) benefit for men, but the sin of them is greater than their benefit." And they ask you what they ought to spend. Say "That which is beyond your needs." Thus Allah makes clear to you His Laws in order that you may give thought."
Arberry They will question thee concerning wine, and arrow-shuffling. Say 'In both is heinous sin; and uses for men, but the sin in them is more heinous than the usefulness.' They will question thee concerning what they should expend. Say 'The abundance.' So God makes clear His signs to you; haply you will reflect;
1 out of 7 is translated as "intoxicants"
4 out of 7 as "wine
1 out of 7 as "strong drink"
1 out of 7 as "alcoholic drink"
So how do you come to your conclusion that it means all intoxicants HP? I am not being condescending, I really do want to know your methods.
What is the best way to resolve this issue between alkhamri and khamran?
I agree with you that those are the listed instances of it in the Qur'an as well (6 times), and once as a context for head covers
"(243116) bikhumurihinna their head covers "Salaam,
Clash.
-
Hi Clash,
You portray a very deceiving account of how al khamri is translated. Corpus Quran does not have all the translations available.
According to a good source islamawakaned.com 23/48 translators chose intoxicants for al khamri
http//www.islamawakened.com/quran/2/219/default.htm
That's 47.91% nearly half of translators have chosen intoxicants over wine and alcohol.
A couple of the 23 have picked both and one has chosen to keep al khamri transliterated.We can see that a huge portion of translators are choosing intoxicants. This is telling information.
Although it is statistically implicating, it doesn't truly concern us.
We don't rely on traditional translators, rather word for word translations that avoid incorporating bias from a translator selecting words that resonate specifically with his linguistic style and interpretation.
You get me? That is why we use corpusquran.com for the word for word section not the quick translations. So we can analyze the morphology of the words and concurrences in the Quran and so forth.There is no issue for us to "resolve" between intoxicants and wine. Allah has explained already.
It is your heart perhaps that is refusing to comprehend, stubbornly.
Check all those 6 instances and if you will re read the chapters. That's always good.You will see the first three are admonitions from Khamri and gambling for the believers.
While the other three are about pressing grapes which produces wine and giving wine to drink.I have pressed grapes before and fermented the grape juice into wine. It increase in alcohol level as you ferment it over a long period of time.
What's worse is distilling the alcohol from dried skins of the grapes. This method of distillation is what generates liquors and so forth.Mind you regardless of what we are discussing.
A glass of wine with dinner is not the issue, opium used for medicinal purposes is not the issue.
The issue is those using the above as a pretense to excuse those who use them for the sole purpose of getting high or drunk. Who can calculate accurately what the exact dosage of wine they can intake or what the exact amount of pot they can smoke before they get drunk or high? That's a very difficult thing to do if not impossible.The point is you don't need to drink wine nor smoke marijuana it is a thing of leisure, that's why it is better to avoid it unless it is absolutely necessary. You mess up and get too drunk or high now you cannot uphold salat.
-
Nice source HP, thank you for providing it to the forum, I will try to use this in future research; tabarak'Allah.
First, I agree with you HP about people abusing medicine, and the prohibitions on drinking and approaching prayers inebriated.
However according to your source, indeed as I figured, the majority of scholars translate the word as wine/strong drink/alcohol, 33 of the translations listed there. While only 21 instances of "intoxicant", and even those instances are mostly in the "Controversial, deprecated, or status undetermined works" category of translations.
Are you suggesting we should take the less agreed upon translation and usage here?
That being said, we must also ask the critical sociopolitical questions of our day Why would someone try to change this traditionally-held meaning (alcoholic beverages) now in the modern age? What political or economic agenda is afoot?
I would really suggest critically thinking about why our current laws, specifically against Cannabis, were introduced in the first place (hint look up the oil industry, cotton vs. hemp, chemical industry, paper industry, pharmaceutical industry, alcohol industry etc.) There is more to it than meets the eye.
I am not advocating for people to go and "mess" themselves up HP, nor to not perform salaat, not at all, please; I am simply stating that Allah has very clearly prohibited a few things, and has clearly encouraged or commanded much more, with much leeway in between. One thing Allah has prohibited though is other people prohibiting things that Allah has not clearly prohibited. So I take the issue of declaring things "haram" to be a very heavy decision; similar to trying to declare someone an unbeliever or enemy of Islam.
"Ask them to call their witnesses who will testify that God has made certain things unlawful. Even if they do testify, do not testify with them. Do not follow the desires of those who have rejected Our revelations and the people who do not believe in the Day of Judgment; and who hold others as equal (in worship) with their Lord." 6150
I only ask you to take this into consideration, we should not be so quick to condemn others. We have no idea how Allah will judge.
Salaam,
Clash.
-
Dude literally nowhere have I said anything is forbidden or prohibited. That word has come from you alone buddy.
I am only presenting you God's command to avoid it in the Quran.
We know something has to be avoided, I have not stated it is prohibited, yet it seems you are not agreeing on what this thing to be avoided is.
You are stressing too much on translators. You have your own ability to assess meaning of words by checking word for word translations which are more accurate. I use islamawakaned.com to check the literal word by word translation not the other translations. So bringing up the translators is not relevant. I brought it up to show you that you improperly portrayed the proportion of translators choosing intoxicants. Bro 21/54 is still ~39% and that's if you are being accurate.
Check 590-91 it'll be ~48%.
Regardless these are still considerable amount of people and I don't give merit to most of those translators who then translate 434 as strike them, but that's a whole other argument.No matter how you feel the root for khamri conveys an intoxicating substance that clouds the mind or intellect. Both alcohol and drugs fit the bill, I don't know what motive YOU have for trying to exclude drugs from intoxicants.....