Call for Discussion: Users who promote their own religious beliefs.
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Peace csmith.
It is not a case of what we want! It is a case of "Free-Minds" discussing with each other Qoran and other related topics.
Because Qoran asked for using our own intellect to find out what it says, we cannot impose our own rules on others.
If one believes he has the "truth" ,then what is the problem?
After all Qoran says the truth will always defeat falsehood.The rules are already set and those who moderate are trusted with the job
We on the other hand as members should stick to our job ( discussing/refuting/giving information/helping others/.) and let those who monitor the forum do theirs
Just like everyone is entitled to post here as a member,every member is also entitled to voice their concerns if they have any. That in itself should be enough and fair.
My opinion of course.
GOD bless you.
Peace -
That is the price, I think, for rejecting organized religion. There's always going to be crazy ideas. I embrace them, laugh at them, and move on.
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Maybe it is because members are trying to be open minded?
That is one possible reason.
@Wakas to satisfy both sides why not create an area for Quranist
to debate minus the noise of those who do not make salat, fast,
make hajj, etc.,.Please elaborate how that would work in practice.
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Ok, it's a lost cause. Thank you everyone for taking the time to reply.
The community evidently want a forum where anything goes, where there is effectively no scope. That's fine, if that's what you guys want.
No brother, it is not a lost cause. We have two options 1. What GL said (stick to the job) or 2. Stay away from such discussions. Both are approved by God.
Sanctions are upheld by those who can't defend their religions. Just think about sunniforum. It seems "reasonable" over there to ban the one who defeats their sectarian teachings.
I would be happy to debate non-Muslims and to defend Quranism, don't get me wrong. I believe in free speech, but there also needs to be a place where Quranists can discuss our religion without constant interruptions from people trying to promote their religion and mock us.
I suppose you are talking about sticking to the topic? In that case, I agree with you. But I also think one reason why people go out of track is because in Quranism, there hasn't been any establishment of a proper way to approach the book. The end results are everything is a metaphor, bizarre claims, confusion, and blind faith in the entire traditional interpretation of the book.
It's a shame. I'm sure there are many other people who just don't bother with this forum because it has been taken over by people who are only interested in promoting themselves and their original theories, who derail any attempt to discuss the finer points of Quranism.
I think most people left because we tend to discuss the same topics over and over again. It sometimes gets a little boring. About people promoting themselves and their original theories, you will find many new faces coming to do that. It never gets old. But at the end of the day, it is a forum.
Maybe a VIP section can solve a bit of the frustration. I know most forums make it available only for those who pay a fee. But I suppose it can also be made as invite only.
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I have a project on GitHub where people can discuss Islam based on the Quran alone. I've opened a thread for people to introduce themselves. If anyone here is interested in being a part of that group, please drop by and say hello.
Introduce yourself here https//github.com/carlsmith/quran/issues/1
I am not trying to move everyone over from this forum, but hope we can get enough interest to form a decent sized group there. People can come here for what this forum does well, and go there for friendly discussions where everyone at least agrees on the basics.
Open a new issue there if you have something you'd like to discuss. The actual project is focussed on developing a Quran translation based on the Free Minds version, but you can open an issue about anything relevant to Quranism.
Thanks.
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Peace!
Hello csmith,
It is unfortunate that you have chosen to leave, I find the contributions of members equally valuable, so it is always sad to see someone go.
You mentioned two important points in your first post of this thread the upholding of forum rules, and the discussion of unorthodox theological ideas.
I agree that forum breaches should not be tolerated, and that the offending member should be sanctioned according to the breach. Thing is, the admin of this forum are all volunteers with lives outside free-minds, so as you can imagine we don't spend all our time on this forum, as such, some (or probably most) of the breaches escape our notice. But you are more than welcome to report any breaches as Wakas has pointed out.
However, regarding the content of discussion, I strongly believe that no subject is off-limits (provided that the discussion is conducted respectfully). I agree that the quality of posts are extremely diverse, some members speak from well-founded knowledge and we can learn a great deal from them, whereas others speak from whim and they serve only to create chaos and confusion. Such is the paradox of a minimally-regulated open-source platform.
If you are seeking a more intimate environment, then I know of one other forum in which potential members must apply to register and are only accepted at the discretion of the administration. Said forum will probably have more of an intimate feel to it and will probably only allow orthodox ideas to be discussed. Although I can't be certain, as I haven't been granted access. You can try though http//www.quransmessage.com/forum/forum.htm
Finally, I would like to say that I reckon it is critical to subject one's ideas to people from different ideological positions in order that the truth may be subject to the harshest criticism, and if, after all that scrutiny, the truth still stands, then you can only be assured of the validity of your position. Whereas, if one only preaches to one's own crowd, then you only receive a chorus of consent.
My two cents.
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how do we post without promoting our beliefs... they seem deeply ingrained in or post?
become a muslim Abrahamic monotheism it's the best of religions hurry one hurry all hurry the prayer and hurry to prosperity hurry there's one god and praise worthy is his messenger.
like how does one answers a question or speak but from his own experience? most of the people on this site have be dedicated to their reliogns and gods for quite a few years other know nothing but faith.
as a muslim how can I not promote my beliefs, most religions propagate as a practice.
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Hello fye,
They mean promote something which is not Islam by the doctrine or at least follows the fundamental understanding of Rabb. This is according to them blurring the forum and potentially discouraging new people from checking the forum for doctrinal answers. It is perhaps most efficient to spread the doctrine but it makes it rather cornered towards so-called "tunnel-vision".
The administration has the choice of setting the level of tolerance and of course what is considered to be "baseless facts". Personally I find that researchers in general have too much faith in existing knowledge and often ignore simple logical fallacies when it comes to Arabic grammar that are easily observable.
When browsing very old Classical Arabic lexicons it is possible to find definitions for example of that the Arabic word "jann" means bodily or the outer layer of something. Despite its very apparent recurrence it is usually ignored in favor of the nonsensical "invisible beings". And the word (Jannah, or rather jannateh as the Semitic letter is pronounced 'teh' is obviously derived from the same root and is claimed to mean paradise. It does not add up logically. Instead of sensibly countering the argument people tend to go towards the sense of "ad hominem" and claim a "lack of skill". Even one with a normal level of logic can see it does not add up. However, if both jann and jannateh means "flesh" or an "indulgence" (paradise) then obviously you can make it add up.
But if you decide in a doctrine that Jinn means invisible being and is made of fire then obviously it is holy to these people, even if nothing can be made of fire in the first place, and not even light for that sake. The only it theoretically can be made of is what causes light and fire, energy or energetic discharge. When something causes friction between matter, heat is built up and the discharge causes an illumination. This imbalance that can be in substances ought to be what is "naar" or "noor". I would say it is metaphorically called "force" by the Arabic, but also it means the "building material" of the world.
But what the people like is to have a sectarian consensus and deem different thinking as baseless as it is incompatible despite well contemplated. When a person writes there is always the choice of ignoring the poster. And the poster will likely not write and write to a person uninterested. I write because there is an interest in some cases to hear more and because I think different views are appreciated even if not by all. Many are here because they find something special about Quran but they might not be particularly interested in the doctrine of Islam and they are dissatisfied with many things yet looking for a divine answer. Quran has a mysterious touch over it even for many skeptics who are skeptical just due to the illogical sound of the mainstream interpretation.
Yet I have turned down on my replies in doctrinal threads such as salat, zakat and so on. I try to avoid debating in such threads. I have in some cases said something about the weirdness of a holy house in the middle of nowhere.
Nevertheless I suppose it is good to have alternative input.
Be safe
Amenuel -
oh you mean like heresay something you heard but never examined?
but most religions are crowded with that. the quran speaks about prophet abraham but the sunnis say muhammed is our jesus-like model of the perfect muslim.
this post is kinda saying you need a certian level of intelligence to even read post. there's probably a whole bunch of people who read and yet are too afraid to post.think some old and yet simple post should be brought back up to familiarize new users on free-minds?
we have the introduce yourself board but most post-ers stop there.
