hello_world !

Ezio

Peace brothers and sisters ,

I have been reading this forum for quite a moment now and, I must admit, it was really helpful.

I am a Tunisian dude mostly talking Arabic (mostly the Tunisian dialect) and French. I am not very confident about my English as I do not practise it very much, so please be comprehensive and do not hesitate to correct me if needs be.

I was - quite like what traditionalists would say - "born muslim" (because of my "muslim" family... I mean... brickwall ) and, up until the age of 16, I never really thought that much about islam, nor was I practising any of the so called "rites" of the Sunni sectarian religion - except for fasting during the "month of Ramadan". A funny (?) anecdote is that, as a little kid, I was taught three little chapters of the Qur'an - namely, the first and the last two chapters - that I was supposed to recite in bed before sleeping, because as they said (my grandma mainly), it was meant to protect me (from being cursed, from the Jinns, and so on... you know the drill...). But then again, it was not an obligation per say, It was not imposed to me, yet I was young, I could not say "no thanks, I don't want to learn them", even though I didn't quite understand the why and, more tragically, I did not understand at all what I was reciting.

Anyway, at 16 years old, I somehow felt drawn and compelled to understand God, to understand Islam. I already knew - or more exactly - I have been taught, that the Qur'an is the word of God, His last testament to mankind. So I read the Qur'an, or what I thought to be the Qur'an, which is the translation of the arabic text, to see for myself, to be convinced for myself, through my own efforts, that this book is the word of God. As a result, I was left dubious, sceptical, to say the least.

That was the fault of the translation, but that, I did not know at that time.

Nevertheless, I did not give up.

I used the internet to know more about islam (what a shame in the first place, to have to use anything but the word of God to understand God, right ?). But as I was surfing the web, trying to understand in a nutshell the core obligations of a muslim, I stumble upon the ahadith corpus and so, I dove in it. So to speak. Indeed and without even mentioning the nonsense I could read, at the precise moment I saw the incredible number of the so-called sayings of Muhammad (peace be upon him), I knew there was a problem, a big problem how was I supposed to practise islam to the full extent, knowing that I will never be able to grasp and keep all those "necessary" ahadith in my head ?

The funny thing here is that I was so proud to be born in a "muslim" family, because I felt guided, since my childhood, to the right path that would lead me to God. But how wrong was I when, thanks to God, I understood that this "islam" we are talking about is but a front for a man-made religion (aren't they all?) created a couple of centuries after the last revelation. I understood I was on the wrong path, and I humbly stood corrected. My own parents don't even know what Sunni is, even though they follow it my father refers to himself as a Sunni but only in opposition to the Shiite people. He doesn't even give a damn about the ahadith and like my mother, they follow islam based on what their parents taught them. For example, they do not practise the ritual prayers nor do my mother wear a headscarf or my father, a "religious beard"; all they practise is a "traditionalist" fast. My mother, when I told her about the fallacy of the ahadith, told me that she knows it is nothing but hearsay; yet when I tell her that, for instance, there is no headscarf for women in the Qur'an, nor is there any ritual prayers, she just tell me not to say such nonsense and to stop talking about God's words without any knowledge, to what I respond by saying that I have proof form the Qur'an itself. She then answers by telling me that the Qur'an is not just the book I have in my bedroom, but that there is other books that form, altogether, the Qur'an. Obviously, to much contradictions lie in her head. But hey, it's my mom. May God guide her and my family to the right path.

Confucius once said "When words lose their meaning, people lose their freedom."

I knew the Qur'an, the original version so to speak, was the only way to know about real islam. So I began to learn to read Arabic and to understand "Quranic Arabic" (as I already speak the Tunisian Arabic) and I looked for possible translations from "Qur'an only people"; at the same time, I used online applications to listen to the Reading. Then I learned the way to understand anything one would want to understand from the Qur'an root definitions, cross-referencing, and so on. I meditated upon the world, I learned about some of the others religions, like Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, hell even Hinduism. Then I was convinced the Qur'an is the word of God, even though, I found myself choking on doubtful moments from time to time. In those periods, I kept asking for God's help, and He did always answered my prayers, relieving me of those doubts.

Since then, I only use reason and critical thinking in order to understand to my best abilities the word of God (by the way, wouldn't it be more accurate to say that it is the Angels that are talking to us in the Reading, relying the message of God ? But I digress here...).

Today I am 26 and I can proudly say I do not believe in God, rather, I acknowledge His existence, for I am not anymore a blind witness to His signs and guidance. I hope and pray the Almighty to always guide me as well as everybody else, and I will do my best to earn that guidance.

May we all be blessed by Him to whom we shall all return.

Peace

PS I apologize for the long post, I didn't intend to do such a long presentation in the first place ^^

Man_of_Faith

Hello,

Welcome to the forum.

Be safe
Amenuel

good_logic

Peace Ezio.

As they say in north Africa" Ya khouya"( hoping I got the gender right? My Arabic is worse than yours!), I have a question for you. Or rather multiple questions?

http//www.total-loyalty-to-god-alone.co.uk/

Welcome to the test. The journey is long. Keep persevering.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

clashncruz

Assalamu Alaykum wa Rahmatullah brother,

I am glad you have found this forum, and insha'Allah you will find its members courteous, respectful, and knowledgeable.

I am confused on one point though you do or do not believe in God?

At first it sounded like you did believe, but then you said, "I can proudly say I do not believe in God".

I don't mind either way by the way, basically the whole of my family and friends are Atheists.

Salaam,

Clash.

Ezio

Peace everyone and thank you for your welcome !

@good logic
You got it right ^^
I visited the website (only the homepage since I do not have much time). Those are good questions one should ask himself to know where he stands vis-?-vis God's system and God Himself, or even just with respect to his own beliefs.
I did ask myself those questions as I "woke up" from my ignorance...
Thank you for the link, I'll check it out when I'll have the time !

@clashncruz
Sorry I got you confused !
What I meant is that I am certain of God's existence, which is the reason why I said I do not believe anymore as I oppose those two notions belief and certainty. But not everyone make that distinction, it is my personal view of things, so I understand your confusion ^^
I hope it is clearer now ^^

Peace )

Comrox

Peace Ezio,

I loved reading your story. It's very interesting. I'm glad you've found this forum. ) I too spent a lot of time reading here (and still do) before I joined.

Ezio

Peace Comrox,

Thank you for your welcome

Man_of_Faith

It is good that you say you acknowledge Rabb rather than believe. Believing is not optimal.

Ezio

Peace Man of Faith,

Indeed, that is exactly the way I see things.

Bender

Salaam Ezio welcome to the forum handshake

I enjoyed reading your intro.

Salaam,
Bender

mmkhan

I can proudly say I do not believe in God, rather, I acknowledge His existence, for I am not anymore a blind witness to His signs and guidance. I hope and pray the Almighty to always guide me as well as everybody else, and I will do my best to earn that guidance.

Peace bro,

Welcome to the forum welcome

The red highlighted part caught my eyes, interesting

May the Rabb guide us all to His path pr
mmKhan

HP_TECH

The above in red is the perfect example of people trying to divide themselves into sects.
By redefining words that already make perfect sense.

And proves lack of understanding of words.
If you acknowledge the existence of God you by default believe.

People need to really define their terms clearly before making statements like these, because there are different mesnings the word believe can convey.
It can convey certainty in something without absolute proof and even an assumption or supposing.
For all purposes when we Muslims are speaking about believing in God we are of course conveying certainty without absolute proof.

So why try to exclude yourself from the lot by trying to use fancy vocabulary.

Ridiculous

Now. If you'll excuse me

Bender

The above in red is the perfect example of people trying to divide themselves into sects.
By redefining words that already make perfect sense.

And proves lack of understanding of words.
If you acknowledge the existence of God you by default believe.

People need to really define their terms clearly before making statements like these, because there are different mesnings the word believe can convey.
It can convey certainty in something without absolute proof and even an assumption or supposing.
For all purposes when we Muslims are speaking about believing in God we are of course conveying certainty without absolute proof.

So why try to exclude yourself from the lot by trying to use fancy vocabulary.

Ridiculous

Now. If you'll excuse me

Hi,

Sorry but that is what you make of it.
The only ridiculous thing is your accusation towards him.
He can believe and/or acknowledge whatever he likes, just like you do, it has absolutely nothing to do with sects or whatever you accuse him of.

Besides this in his OP he said "I am not very confident about my English as I do not practise it very much, so please be comprehensive and do not hesitate to correct me if needs be."
So please stop with these kind of things.

HP_TECH

Hi,

Sorry but that is what you make of it.
The only ridiculous thing is your accusation towards him.
He can believe and/or acknowledge whatever he likes, just like you do, it has absolutely nothing to do with sects or whatever you accuse him of.

Besides this in his OP he said "I am not very confident about my English as I do not practise it very much, so please be comprehensive and do not hesitate to correct me if needs be."
So please stop with these kind of things.

There is an overall trend of people on this forum trying to reinvent the wheel at every turn and I won't stand for it if I can help it.
He asked for correction and I have given it.
My correction is stern but is not wrong, I am not as passive as others in my delivery but I am just as concerned and caring

Man_of_Faith

Believe in English has multiple connotations and for certain of them believe can be used, but if it means "to think something to be true" then this does not fit the word "Alif-Miim-Nun". Amen does mean "to realize", "make real" and when you realize something this is something you acknowledge then. Za-Nun is the Arabic word for believing/thinking/assuming. Amen is a stronger sense of realization than that.

Wellness to you
Amenuel

Bender

There is an overall trend of people on this forum trying to reinvent the wheel at every turn and I won't stand for it if I can help it.
He asked for correction and I have given it.
My correction is stern but is not wrong, I am not as passive as others in my delivery but I am just as concerned and caring

Hi,

I might be wrong but to me it looked more like an accusation the a correction.

Anyway I think I understood what he meant with "I can proudly say I do not believe in God, rather, I acknowledge His existence,"
He reached a level that is more then believing. I think a lot of people here have reached that level.
He is not separating himself from the rest, it is just a feeling he has, it has nothing to do with getting fancy or trying to look more special then the rest.
Of course this is also just a speculation from me.

HP_TECH

Then if I misjudged I offer to him my deepest my apology.
I just don't want to see people discard away definitions which are still valid. Others might have a hard time grasping the difference between acknowledgement and belief. They still mean the same when they say I believe firmly, or with certainty or with no doubt.
I was concerned that these little nuances might cause a divide, but perhaps I was too rash in concluding such.

mmkhan

Then if I misjudged I offer to him my deepest my apology.
I just don't want to see people discard away definitions which are still valid. Others might have a hard time grasping the difference between acknowledgement and belief. They still mean the same when they say I believe firmly, or with certainty or with no doubt.
I was concerned that these little nuances might cause a divide, but perhaps I was too rash in concluding such.

Peace,

2260 may help you understand the difference, inshaAllah.

And when Abraham said, "My Lord, show me how You give life to the dead." said, "Have you not believed?" He said, "Yes, but only that my heart may be satisfied." said, "Take four birds and commit them to yourself. Then put on each hill a portion of them; then call them - they will come to you in haste. And know that Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise."

HP_TECH

Peace,

2260 may help you understand the difference, inshaAllah.

And when Abraham said, "My Lord, show me how You give life to the dead." said, "Have you not believed?" He said, "Yes, but only that my heart may be satisfied." said, "Take four birds and commit them to yourself. Then put on each hill a portion of them; then call them - they will come to you in haste. And know that Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise."

I am confused about two things.

I think I understand the difference..... unless you think I am showing lack of understanding.
I do not see how this ayaat demonstrates a difference? Are we talking between Iman and zanna?

If 1 happens to be the case could you more clearly explain if you don't mind, how 2260 clarifies that difference in 2?

mmkhan

I am confused about two things.

I think I understand the difference..... unless you think I am showing lack of understanding.
I do not see how this ayaat demonstrates a difference? Are we talking between Iman and zanna?

If 1 happens to be the case could you more clearly explain if you don't mind, how 2260 clarifies that difference in 2?

Peace,

There is no mention of "zanna" in this aayat. But the difference is between "Eimaan" and "Yaqeen".