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  4. The Inaneness of Holy Books

The Inaneness of Holy Books

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  • I Offline
    I Offline
    Invalid777
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    Allah tells you he is the most merciful. Allah also claims that he is the most just and loving. You would have thought that this this super advanced, all-knowing and all-powerful being would contact his creation in the most ADVANCED, FAIR and LOVING way. The best method of communication Allah could come up with was to only communicate through just one human he chose and make him write books which Allah himself allowed to be corrupted later on. This God who claims to love you uses only ancient human messengers to communicate with you at such distance in time and space, and with the barriers of language and imperfect translations.

    Let?s stop there for a moment. Allah claims to want to ?guide? his creation and save them from eternal hell fire. In addition, Allah takes no responsibility whatsoever for your ?wrongdoings? despite the fact that everything you do is predetermined by Allah himself and anything you want to do only happens because he allowed it to happen. Everything you do is your fault and he will punish you for it. Allah sent the Torah to some of his creation who inhabited the Middle East. Mind you, instead of revealing it to everyone, he only reveals this supposed message to humanity to only one part of his creation and in just one language. Frankly, not even a part of his creation, but only one person in that specific part of his creation. Allah later on allows the Torah to be corrupted.

    It would be like me sending an email to only one person and program the file to corrupt itself later on while in fact I had the capability and resources at hand to send it to everyone. The people who did not receive this vital message later on will now be misguided but no! It is still their fault for being misguided. I will not take any responsibility because I am all-powerful. If I really wanted to get a vital message out in the most efficient manner and had all the worlds? resources available due to me being all-knowing, I would send the message out to everyone!

    I will keep in mind that not all of my creation live in just one geographic area. I will also keep in mind that they don?t all speak the same language thus I will send it in different formats they can all understand directly and not have to rely on translations which are subject to human bias and corruption. I will keep this message eternal. Why? Because I do not make mistakes. I do not need to repeat myself or release revisions (version 2.0 or 3.0) because anything I do is perfect. I am all-powerful so will not allow the message to be corrupted because it would be unfair to future generations.

    In this way, all of my creation have received my message in the most efficient and fair way as possible. This of course was not the case with Abrahamic religions. Islam claims to be superior to Christianity and Judaism. Islam claims that the Torah was a message from Allah that was later on corrupted because Allah allowed it to be corrupted. Allah then releases the Gospel which was also corrupted because Allah allowed to be corrupted. In the 7th century, Allah decided to release version 3.0 of his supposed message to humanity, this time he wasn?t going to allow it to be corrupted (According Islam).

    Islam claims that the Koran is now the last and ultimate message to humanity and have discarded their rivals? holy books (Torah and Bible) as being corrupt and outdated. The Koran now replaces their books. Version 3.0 is now the final message. Allah will no longer reveal anything more. This is Islam?s logic in claiming religious superiority over rival religions by using this silly and unfair excuse. Islam claims that their religion is the only and true religion. This supposed message to humanity was also written in one language. A language only a few people from a specific geographic location spoke and understood. In other words, a local book.

    Allah, the most advanced and powerful being was not able to make the Koran readily available to the whole of humanity. Red Indians in North America did not receive this supposed message to humanity. Even if they managed to move to the Middle East, they would still face the language barrier. They would have to rely on someone?s translation of the text. Is this really fair? Is this what a merciful God would do? To disregard others needs and only focus on some of his creation? To discriminate on who should receive this vital message while leaving others in the dark although claiming that it was a message for the whole of humanity?

    Let?s sum these facts up and see how preposterous the claim made by Abrahamic religions make in claiming superiority over one another.
    ? Since this is a vital message to humanity, you would expect God to reveal it to everyone in a format they can ALL UNDERSTAND in order for it to be a UNIVERSAL message to humanity. Nonetheless, God did not conclude to reveal it to every single human but rather just one person he chose while keeping others in the dark. You would have thought that such an advanced being would have the most efficient way to reveal his message to his creation but that was the best he could come up with.
    ?God allocates these so called holy books into one geographic area while keeping the rest of humanity who did not live in or around the Middle East in darkness.
    ?God only makes this vital message available in one format that not all of his creation can understand.
    ?God expects the rest of his creation to rely on translations subject to bias and human error.
    ?God deliberately allowed his supposed message to humanity (version 1.0) to be corrupted hence causing millions of people to be lead astray.
    ?God releases version 2.0 of his supposed message to humanity but also causes it to be corrupted consequently causing even more people to be lead astray.
    ?God claims to be loving and most merciful. Instead he says stuff like this; ?He guides whomever he wants? and ?he leads astray whomever he wants? (sura 6125). If that?s not discriminatory, I don?t know what is.

    ?God releases version 3.0(Quran), another postulated universal message to humanity. This time he promises in that same book that he won?t allow it to be corrupted.
    ?God now claims that version 3.0(Quran) of his supposed message to humanity being the last ever revelation. God will no longer reveal anything more than what is written in the Quran.
    ?Despite this being the last and ultimate message to humanity, God still failed to make it available to the whole humanity. The same inaccuracies and flaws in Version 1.0(Torah) and 2.0(Gospel) had been repeated in version 3.0 (Quran).
    ?God has made it clear in the Quran that if you do not believe in his last book (the Quran) you will be going to hell for eternal torture. How merciful!
    ?God expects you to blindly believe in a book whose authenticity cannot even be proven. You are required to blindly believe that the Quran you have in your hands today has not been altered. The only way to substantiate this claim is to have the original Quran written by Muhammad himself and compare it with the one you have today.

    ?Despite Allah being all-powerful, he failed numerous times to protect his supposed message to humanity. His excuse is that he ?allowed it to be corrupted? which is ludicrous! He wants to guide humanity because he apparently is the most merciful but keep on allowing it to be corrupted, not to mention his failure in making a universal message and not just limit it to one geographic location, one language and one point in time. For such an all-powerful deity, he only allows his message to humanity be of use only for a short time span because he later on decreed that it would get corrupted thus rendering the message useless for future generations.
    ?Despite all this, Islam still requires you to blindly believe that the Quran is the universal message to humanity, has remained unaltered and is 100% perfectly moral despite being a local book with countless inconsistencies, presenting a hypocritical, immoral, violent and insecure God. If you disagree with the Quran, you are a kafir who is to be tortured for eternity in hell. How merciful!

    With predetermination, Allah has already decided whether or not to guide you BEFORE you were even born. Allah will ?seal their hearts so they do not understand?. Allah admits that he wilfully misguided people by disabling them from being guided by ?sealing their hearts and covering their senses?. (27) Allah has set a seal upon their hearts and upon their hearing, and over their vision is a veil. And for them is a great punishment."

    After Allah has sealed their hearts and disabled their senses, he describes them as being ?dumb, deaf and blind? and even goes as far as to even compare them to cattle.

    (2171) And the example of those who disbelieve, is as that of him who shouts to the (flock of sheep) that hears nothing but calls and cries. (They are) deaf, dumb and blind. So they do not understand.

    (7179) Already have We urged unto hell many of the jinn and humankind, having hearts wherewith they understand not, and having eyes wherewith they see not, and having ears wherewith they hear not. These are as the cattle - nay, but they are worse! These are the neglectful.

    God favours some of his creation over others. In other words, he discriminates whilst calling himself the most merciful. He has decided to lead you astray before you were even born.
    No loving God would be so reckless, hateful and hypocritical. The God of Abrahamic religions is but an invention. God did not create man but man created God in his image. Intolerant, sexist, discriminatory, violent, hateful and hypocritical.

    We can thus conclude that the Quran is not a message that was intended for the whole of humanity and the nature of the deity known as Allah conveyed in the Quran is but a complete contradiction. One minute Allah is all-powerful, the next he can?t seem to get a simple message to his creation right. He claims to be the most merciful whilst, threatening you with eternal torture. He is so sadistic he vividly describes his cruel torture methods in hell. What moral lessons do you gain by learning how ?boiling water is to be poured down the throats of people in hell?? Or how they are to be ?rounded up and thrown into fire??

    Using ?holy? books to communicate with your creation is the most inefficient and unfair way as proven by history and even the Quran itself which is also a ?holy? book. The inventors of the Quran have managed to take advantage of this pitfall and built a false paradigm of ?this time everything is going to be okay? idea. Allah will now do his best to not let the Quran get corrupted whilst throwing the towel and withdraw himself from revealing anything more. Allah has now seized to communicate with his creation. A feeble-minded excuse for simple-minded individuals. Islam pushes a neophobic attitude thanks to a ?We know it all? mentality. Anything new is considered the work Satan. Believe in the incest story of Adam, his wife and their children, while ignoring tons evidence for evolution.
    I believe this is the reason why Islam has refused to evolve and reform itself. With such a mentality, Islam will never evolve but rather decay and its treatment towards apostates, infidels, women and children deteriorate over time.

    My faculty of reason will not accept this pathetic excuse of holy books and its Gods.

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    • M Offline
      M Offline
      Man_of_Faith
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      Hello,

      "God" did make Quran ready for spiritual teachers of mankind. It is an instruction for a model of spirituality. But what Quran teaches has been quite readily available even millennia ago and is nothing new. Quran is however a Manifestation (actually the meaning of the word 'Quran&#039 and it is "God's" own words in a compilation.

      The readily available interpretations and translations are causing it to convey an incorrect account and it was because the interpreters made it as according to themselves and which doing does not help anyone who clings unto it pass along; its adherents are delving into the wrong focus points.

      Just like with the world Quran has been a huge contradiction.

      Wellness to you
      Amenuel

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      • I Offline
        I Offline
        Invalid777
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        Hello

        The whole idea of a ?holy book? began in the Middle East. You say what the Quran teaches has been available for millennia. If that?s the case, why is there no global pattern for ?holy? books like what you see in the Middle East? The farther you get from that geographic area, the less you hear about holy books, judgment day and the other nonsensical type of stories found in these three Abrahamic religions.
        Even for isolated communities, there is not a single trace of a holy book. The aborigines, Native Americans etc. They are more in line with Eastern religion such as Taoism and Buddhism. The Abrahamic dogma and postulated ?holy? books are only to be found in and around the Middle East. The Quran is a local book hence cannot be a message to humanity. It is in no way special and should not be given any special status.

        I like your idea of self-control and fighting the beast you live within but I just don?t buy into holy books, messengers and a God. To be honest, I no longer believe in a God. It is something I have contemplated for a while. Even if a God did exist, I don?t believe he would send books.
        Holy book aside, the prophets mentioned in these three books are just way too illogical to be taken seriously. Moses for example heard voices when he saw a burning bush. How silly does that sound? Would you believe me if I told you that God spoke to me through a burning tree? Why would such an advanced being contact his creation through burning bushes or so called holy books? The claim that Moses escaped Egypt with his staff and rescued millions of Jews has also been proven to be a historical fallacy. There are no records of the ancient Egyptians losing millions of Jewish slaves. If that was true their economy would have collapsed overnight and the news reach everywhere. Not even the Romans had any records of a bunch slaves escaping Egypt. I have lost all faith and respect for Abrahamic religions and their preposterous so called holy books.

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        • J Offline
          J Offline
          Jafar
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          From thousands or perhaps millions of human civilizations on earth throughout time, only these followings civilizations claimed to have or received a "holy book written by Gods or God".

          1. Ancient Egyptians (Book of the dead)
          2. Israelites (Tanakh & Gospels which later bundled together to become a bible)
          3. Israelites / Arabs (Quran)

          See the connection?

          It's insane... the idea of book written / authored by God is indeed an insanity.. started by Ancient Egyptians..

          I'm now more interested on digging the reason behind such claims, the motives, the objectives and the nuances which drove human to introduce such concept.

          The idea of "God's last revelation to human" which is 1400 years ago in middle east is definitely proven to be not true.
          The amount of new revelation and new knowledge known to human in the past 100 years alone has far exceeded the amount of revelation / knowledge collected by human throughout their estimated 200,000 years of existence.
          And instead of slowing or stopping the trend shows that it is actually accelerating....

          And I thank God for it...

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          • A Offline
            A Offline
            almarh0m
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            Peace

            From thousands or perhaps millions of human civilizations on earth throughout time, only these followings civilizations claimed to have or received a "holy book written by Gods or God".

            1. Ancient Egyptians (Book of the dead)
            2. Israelites (Tanakh & Gospels which later bundled together to become a bible)
            3. Israelites / Arabs (Quran)

            See the connection?

            It's insane... the idea of book written / authored by God is indeed an insanity.. started by Ancient Egyptians..

            I'm now more interested on digging the reason behind such claims, the motives, the objectives and the nuances which drove human to introduce such concept.

            The idea of "God's last revelation to human" which is 1400 years ago in middle east is definitely proven to be not true.
            The amount of new revelation and new knowledge known to human in the past 100 years alone has far exceeded the amount of revelation / knowledge collected by human throughout their estimated 200,000 years of existence.
            And instead of slowing or stopping the trend shows that it is actually accelerating....

            And I thank God for it...

            Interesting as always @Jafar, are The Avesta for the Zoroastrians and The Vedas for The Hindus, not "HoLy Books"? To me, sacred texts are the same as a holy books. If they are not holy books to these religions followers, what are they to them? Unless, you are telling us that Hindustan is in The Middle East.

            Peace
            almarh0m

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            • J Offline
              J Offline
              Jafar
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              Interesting as always @Jafar, are The Avesta for the Zoroastrians and The Vedas for The Hindus, not "HoLy Books"? To me, sacred texts are the same as a holy books. If they are not holy books to these religions followers, what are they to them?

              The Avesta, The Vedas, Mahabharata, The Buddha Writings, Tao The Ching, Confucius writings etc...
              None of them CLAIMED to be authored by God or Gods..
              And they didn't have too..

              The entire conception or idea of God authored a book can only be found within the Semites.. (Egypt, Israelites, Arabs)

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              • I Offline
                I Offline
                Invalid777
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                From thousands or perhaps millions of human civilizations on earth throughout time, only these followings civilizations claimed to have or received a "holy book written by Gods or God".

                1. Ancient Egyptians (Book of the dead)
                2. Israelites (Tanakh & Gospels which later bundled together to become a bible)
                3. Israelites / Arabs (Quran)

                See the connection?

                Agree. Another thing I'd like to point out is jannah. As with the usual plagiarism Islam engages in, their idea of jannah can also be found in Viking tradition. The Vikings believed that if you died fighting in their wars AKA Mujahideen, you'd end up in Valhalla. A place where you would sit on comfortable chairs and drink an unlimited amount of alcohol. Quran also describes Jannah as a place where you would sit on comfortable couches and have rivers of wine. You would be given glasses of wine to drink and receive full breasted companions with large eyes. A typical sign that it was written by humans since every description in it is what can be found here on earth. Even with the so called punishments of hell. Waterboarding using boiling water, being tortured with fire to being rounded up like cattle and being violently thrown into fire. Thiefs are to have their limbs amputated, a woman's testimony being worth half of a man's and the woman being restricted to inherit a fair amount compared to her male siblings and the fact that adulterers are to be publicly whipped is all the kind of usual stuff a male dictator would do.

                It's insane... the idea of book written / authored by God is indeed an insanity.. started by Ancient Egyptians..

                And Islam has carried on that insanity through to the 21st century. A bit like Olympic relay but passing on insanity instead. Abrahamic relay I would call it, kick started by the Ancient Egyptians of course. Unlike its local rival religions(Christianity and Judaism), it really hasn't evolved much. You don't see Christians in Europe accusing women of witchcraft and burning them in the streets or killing people for denouncing their religion. Pop in next door to the Middle East and you have Iran, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Islamic state and Sudan killing apostates for denouncing Islam. There was even a thread that was made here not so long ago regarding a 15 year old and a bunch of other people from his town in Sudan who still had some sanity left in them. He and his friends were ordered to be sentenced to death for not denouncing Islam but for just being skeptical about the hadith collection.

                I'm now more interested on digging the reason behind such claims, the motives, the objectives and the nuances which drove human to introduce such concept.

                Temporal lobe epilepsy. Religious individuals and people with temporal lobe epilepsy share the same behavior such as neophobia, schizophrenia like Sky-daddy watching you all day long and angels sitting on your shoulders to Satan flying around and whispering into your head.

                Here is a link http//www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18171635 or a video instead https//youtu.be/mJM5mipwebw?t=11m54s

                " Besides the standard symptoms of seizures and the alterations of visual perception, temporal lobe epilepsy (TLE) is distinguished among the different forms of epilepsy by its association with some of the most profound experiences in human history. Many important historical figures in our past suffered from neurological disorders that went undiagnosed or misdiagnosed because their disorders were not even named, much less understood, at the time. Since the symptoms of temporal lobe epilepsy were defined many historians and neuroscientists have theorized about various historical figures and what role TLE may have played in shaping their lives and our culture. Much of the speculation about how this disorder affected these important figures in human history is based on how the symptoms of epilepsy affected their behavior.

                Many individuals with temporal epilepsy report experiences directly preceding their epelaptic fits, known as "auras." These auras vary from "crude warnings," which tell the individual that they are about to have a seizure, to "elaborate mental states," which include more complex symptoms and can change the perceptions of that individual. Auras vary widely from individual to individual, but they often contain common elements including (Taylor, 1987)

                hypergraphia (excessive, compulsive writing or drawing)
                deja/jamais vu (the sensations of seeing something new and feeling like you have seen it before, or seeing something familiar and feeling like it is the first time respectively)
                deja/jamais entendu (same as the above, but hearing rather than seeing)
                fear, euphoria, or other intense emotions
                a sensation of sudden insight or revelation
                While all these symptoms are part of life, and exist in the normal population to varying degrees (Persinger, 1987), their combined presence in temporal lobe epilepsy could help us better understand the lives of several influential figures in history, as well as our selves and our society.

                Religion

                One of the branches of neuroscience that has a lot of controversy associated with is neurotheology, or the neuroscience of religion and religious experiences. Many people feel that explaining such phenomena reduces their value or that it is disrespectful, but research into the field is not attempting to demean religion. Rather, the aim is to help us better understand the brain processes that makes up these remarkable experiences and is common to all of us. Temporal lobe epilepsy is strongly associated with radical spiritual events including visions of figures, vivid memories, auditory hallucinations, intense feelings of religious conviction, and in many cases conversion or return to specific faiths. In fact, many scientists and historians have speculated that St. Paul of Christianity might have suffered from temporal lobe epilepsy.

                St. Paul

                In the book of the Acts in the bible, there are two separate descriptions of Paul's conversion one is a third person narrativem, and one is a speech he gave when he was arrested in Jerusalem. Both are brief, they do not present a lot of evidence with which to diagnose him. However, the elements they do contain do support a TLE interpretation.

                Both passages describe Paul falling to the ground and experiencing a blinding light. Then he hears a voice claiming to be "Jesus of Nazareth, whom you are persecuting" (Acts of the Apostles 226-21 ). Afterwards he was unable to see, and he did not eat or drink for three days on his way to Damascus. Following this experience Paul became a devout follower and missionary of Christianity, exhibiting religious fervor and driving purpose.
                Auditory hallucinations of divine voices, visions of divine figures, and physical collapse are all common elements of TLE, and they are especially common in documented cases of sudden religious conversion in people with temporal lobe epilepsy. In 2 Corinthians 12, Paul described another experience, in which he was "caught up to paradise and heard sacred secrets which no human lips can repeat." He also claimed that he was "given a thorn in the flesh, an angel of Satan to rack me" to prevent him from becoming too prideful about his "wealth of visions." This story gives two important indications that Paul might have suffered from TLE there is confirmation that he had recurring, if not frequent visions, and he had an awareness or perception of some illness in himself. "

                The idea of "God's last revelation to human" which is 1400 years ago in middle east is definitely proven to be not true.
                The amount of new revelation and new knowledge known to human in the past 100 years alone has far exceeded the amount of revelation / knowledge collected by human throughout their estimated 200,000 years of existence.
                And instead of slowing or stopping the trend shows that it is actually accelerating....

                Agree and to add to that, I find it really annoying that Islam's unique selling point is based on a complete fabrication, that it's "the last message from God to humanity" which is complete hogwash.

                And I thank God for it...

                What is your definition of God? I have entertained the idea of a God and have come to the conclusion that there is no such thing as an all-powerful, all-knowing and merciful God or sky-daddy. If there is a God, he is definitely not all-powerful and all-knowing. I liked Amenuel's idea of describing us as shares of God and we developing/evolving ourselves but I sort of sense he is of afraid telling that here explicitly due to the Islamic dogma of God being some cosmic, all-powerful North Korean like tyrant being pushed at him at times which I have even witnessed happen. If a God does exist, I believe he is not perfect but is using us to expand himself. I also believe this God has no morals and is not the most merciful and we are not his first batch of puppets. Mind you, that's if I believed God exist.

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                • WakasW Offline
                  WakasW Offline
                  Wakas
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  My faculty of reason will not accept...

                  What if your reasoning skills are poor?

                  All information is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should always seek knowledge and verify for themselves when possible: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11.

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                  • A Offline
                    A Offline
                    almarh0m
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #9

                    The Avesta, The Vedas, Mahabharata, The Buddha Writings, Tao The Ching, Confucius writings etc...
                    None of them CLAIMED to be authored by God or Gods..
                    And they didn't have too..

                    The entire conception or idea of God authored a book can only be found within the Semites.. (Egypt, Israelites, Arabs)

                    Of course The Authors of those "Holy Books" were not God, just claimed to be Incarnation of god or personification of god,. Wasn't Kreshna a incarnation of god? Mahabharata is epic poem that contained The Bhagavad Gita, but the author was Vyasa and Kreshna ( whom later morphed into Jesus Christ) therefore, The Hindu holy books were authored by gods.

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                    • J Offline
                      J Offline
                      Jafar
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #10

                      Of course The Authors of those "Holy Books" were not God, just claimed to be Incarnation of god or personification of god,. Wasn't Kreshna a incarnation of god? Mahabharata is epic poem that contained The Bhagavad Gita, but the author was Vyasa and Kreshna ( whom later morphed into Jesus Christ) therefore, The Hindu holy books were authored by gods.

                      The author of Mahabrata (which include Gita and Bharatayudha) was supposedly a dude named Vyasa..
                      Krishna was a character inside the story, which was told to be a "Deva" (read Shining being)
                      I repeat; a character inside a story authored by Vyasa..

                      The Mahabrata was not authored by Brahman (the equivalent to Allah/YHVH in Hinduism)

                      While Quran was supposedly or claimed to be authored by Allah..
                      And not Muhammad or the Caliph Uthman or any other human or sentient being.. (Which most definitely the actual author)

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                      • R Offline
                        R Offline
                        reel
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #11

                        Dear Invalid bro,
                        A little error there. You are thinking of Allah as a human like character who gives false promises and then plays us like puppets. I used to think like that also. But it has changed. Quran has many secrets which can be unlocked to get this

                        Allah also claims that he is the most just and loving. You would have thought that this this super advanced, all-knowing and all-powerful being would contact his creation in the most ADVANCED, FAIR and LOVING way.

                        Take a break from Islam and all other religions. Lead the worldly life thinking there is no God, no holybook, no prophets, etc! Let us know how things go. I do know that you have threats all around you. But once you are alone you are free to do whatever you like. Be your own king. Good luck!

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                        • U Offline
                          U Offline
                          unknownuser
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #12

                          He's not the first and he wont be the last. The arguments he has brought up are not new, they have existed even amongst the Quran's audience. Conversely there have existed the complete opposite of thought, i.e. predetermination.

                          Both sides don't understand at all, funny how both of them read the text and the text brings out each one's inner inclinations.

                          I second the question put by Waqas.

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                          • I Offline
                            I Offline
                            Invalid777
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #13

                            What if your reasoning skills are poor?

                            My reasoning skills are poor because I concluded that the Quran is not a last message to humanity from God and therefore not worthy of any special status?
                            What would you call poor reasoning skills? To believe a local book like the Quran to be the last and ultimate message to humanity? To believe in a God that expects the rest of his creation to rely on translations subject to bias and human error? Was this not the reason why this forum was opened? But of course, to have perfect reasoning skills you have just ignore all this and pretend that everything is okay.

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                            • M Offline
                              M Offline
                              Man_of_Faith
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #14

                              Invalid777,

                              I understand, but Quran is a Rabb manifestation compiled by Rabb itself. That idiots have another book derived from the same writing is another case.

                              What Quran teaches you find in Buddhism and Hinduism and is nothing unique in itself, but it is consoling to read something which sounds like what is Rabb itself. In it you see that Rabb created this world as a contradiction and it was intended to be corrupting by default. It does teach things from the viewpoint of Rabb.

                              The word "holy" means whole and something which makes sense is holy by definition. Holy does not mean it is the only material that can be used to achieve something and like a wrote; the information conveyed has in great parts been told before and in other parts of the world.

                              Both A' ram -ic and E' rab -ic are developed by Rabb and there is a quite mysterious background to them both. They do not follow the natural evolution of languages and are supposed to be spoken just as if 5000 years ago, i.e. by the sounds of the letters and if a word has a meaning it always has that literal meaning, it cannot be changed, it is in itself incorruptible.

                              Quran is a mysterious writing and it does not have a normal background. That is more evident if you can actually decipher it as intended by its author and get a feel of what it presents and its model of spirituality. If it was not made written by Rabb then a maniac wrote it considered the formulation of the sentences, but it is too intelligible for that.

                              Wellness to you
                              Amenuel

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                              • M Offline
                                M Offline
                                Man_of_Faith
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #15

                                Although by the way, Invalid777, Rabb is 'Who Is' so even I can be. Sufficiently insightful person can write a Rabbic writing too. "GOD" is a symbiotic phenomenon as I have told a lot of times on this forum. "I am who am I" is the foundation of this.

                                Wellness to you
                                Amenuel

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                                  good_logic
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #16

                                  Peace Invalid.

                                  I agree with reel, free yourself from what is "burning" inside you. You do not have to believe or follow what seems unreasonable and illogical to you.

                                  Also free yourself from what others do. Like you, they are free to choose whatever seems logical or ... to them.

                                  Find yourself another "god" that satisfies your logical thinking, for every human follows/finds a "god"whether they admit it or not. Their "god" can be anything from ego, philosophy, nothing,others,material,...etc.

                                  Only make sure you let us know the "truth" when you find it.

                                  GOD( The only One/the unique)) bless you.
                                  Peace.

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                                    huruf
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #17

                                    Yes, reel and good logic have said sensible things.

                                    We live too much on the deeds of other people and over do our sense of responsibility thinking that what others do somewhow we should be able to straighten.

                                    The sad fact is that we are powerless for almost everything, and that about the only domain we can manage a little is ourselves and even there we ar not very powerful.

                                    I would add free yourself of that sense of having to account for the rest of the world. Th rest of the world you may dislike to death but it is not you nor are you responsible for it. Make peace with yourself. Sign a peace treaty with yourslef and abide by it. And really take ONLY responsibility for what you have power over, not for anything else, and love yourself for what you are. Love yourself. Have mercy on yourself, do not be too hard on yourself. As you see, for all tose horrible things you feel angry, you are punishing yourself in some way. Love yourself.

                                    Salaam

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                                      Wakas
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #18

                                      My reasoning skills are poor because I concluded that the Quran is not a last message to humanity from God and therefore not worthy of any special status?

                                      No, I was referring to ensuring one's reasoning does not contain assumptions, faulty info and logical fallacies etc.

                                      I recommend checking your statements for such.

                                      All information is correct to the best of my knowledge only and thus should not be taken as a fact. One should always seek knowledge and verify for themselves when possible: 17:36, 20:114, 35:28, 49:6, 58:11.

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                                        hicham9
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #19

                                        My reasoning skills are poor because I concluded that the Quran is not a last message to humanity from God ...

                                        The Qurn doesn't proclaim itself to be G-D's "last message" !

                                        That's a misconception from your part.

                                        ... through the lens of Sunnis !

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                                          Bender
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #20

                                          Let?s sum these facts up and see how preposterous the claim made by Abrahamic religions make in claiming superiority over one another.
                                          ? Since this is a vital message to humanity, you would expect God to reveal it to everyone in a format they can ALL UNDERSTAND in order for it to be a UNIVERSAL message to humanity. Nonetheless, God did not conclude to reveal it to every single human but rather just one person he chose while keeping others in the dark. You would have thought that such an advanced being would have the most efficient way to reveal his message to his creation but that was the best he could come up with.
                                          ?God allocates these so called holy books into one geographic area while keeping the rest of humanity who did not live in or around the Middle East in darkness.
                                          ?God only makes this vital message available in one format that not all of his creation can understand.
                                          ?God expects the rest of his creation to rely on translations subject to bias and human error.
                                          ?God deliberately allowed his supposed message to humanity (version 1.0) to be corrupted hence causing millions of people to be lead astray.
                                          ?God releases version 2.0 of his supposed message to humanity but also causes it to be corrupted consequently causing even more people to be lead astray.
                                          ?God claims to be loving and most merciful. Instead he says stuff like this; ?He guides whomever he wants? and ?he leads astray whomever he wants? (sura 6125). If that?s not discriminatory, I don?t know what is.

                                          ?God releases version 3.0(Quran), another postulated universal message to humanity. This time he promises in that same book that he won?t allow it to be corrupted.
                                          ?God now claims that version 3.0(Quran) of his supposed message to humanity being the last ever revelation. God will no longer reveal anything more than what is written in the Quran.
                                          ?Despite this being the last and ultimate message to humanity, God still failed to make it available to the whole humanity. The same inaccuracies and flaws in Version 1.0(Torah) and 2.0(Gospel) had been repeated in version 3.0 (Quran).
                                          ?God has made it clear in the Quran that if you do not believe in his last book (the Quran) you will be going to hell for eternal torture. How merciful!
                                          ?God expects you to blindly believe in a book whose authenticity cannot even be proven. You are required to blindly believe that the Quran you have in your hands today has not been altered. The only way to substantiate this claim is to have the original Quran written by Muhammad himself and compare it with the one you have today.

                                          ?Despite Allah being all-powerful, he failed numerous times to protect his supposed message to humanity. His excuse is that he ?allowed it to be corrupted? which is ludicrous! He wants to guide humanity because he apparently is the most merciful but keep on allowing it to be corrupted, not to mention his failure in making a universal message and not just limit it to one geographic location, one language and one point in time. For such an all-powerful deity, he only allows his message to humanity be of use only for a short time span because he later on decreed that it would get corrupted thus rendering the message useless for future generations.
                                          ?Despite all this, Islam still requires you to blindly believe that the Quran is the universal message to humanity, has remained unaltered and is 100% perfectly moral despite being a local book with countless inconsistencies, presenting a hypocritical, immoral, violent and insecure God. If you disagree with the Quran, you are a kafir who is to be tortured for eternity in hell. How merciful!

                                          Hi,

                                          All your facts are false as simple as that. You need better facts.

                                          Salaam,
                                          Bender

                                          ps. was your post sarcastic? If not then you are spreading lies about Allah.

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