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  4. The Search for Muhammad has Ended

The Search for Muhammad has Ended

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  • I Offline
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    imrankhawaja
    wrote on last edited by
    #310

    Nafs is not Adam, nafs is btw feminine (of course IF we take "HA" to represent "femininity&quot.

    yes in daily language its feminity... either the rooh/nafs of male or female ... its feminity... same like earth lol

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      Novice
      wrote on last edited by
      #311

      3166 What you suffered on the day the two armies met was by God's leave, and to let those who acknowledge know.

      238 We said, "Descend from it all of you, so when the guidance comes from Me, then whoever follows My guidance, they will have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve."

      same root word used on otheer occassion clearly tell its two

      plural is plural in grammer and its mean more than one..

      Salaam Imran

      May I write something if you allow me. In Arabic plural is not more than one rather there are three different rules for pronouns. If it is two then a dual pronoun is used and for more than three a plural pronoun is used.

      In 3166 has a plural noun "KUM" showing more than two.

      What huruf is saying is what we can find in Quran. Adam seems to represent mankind which developed from a single cell. Initially single cell reproduced asexually and at a later stage of development it started bisexual reproduction. This is how this ayat appears to depict. Otherwise you have to accept hadithi interpretation that a single man was created and his mate was created from his rib and then human race expanded through incest.

      (

      May God help us understanding His book.

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        Bender
        wrote on last edited by
        #312

        Adam seems to represent mankind which developed from a single cell.

        If you meant with cell "nafs" then I totally agree with you.

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          imrankhawaja
          wrote on last edited by
          #313

          In 3166 has a plural noun "KUM" showing more than two.

          you are targetting a wrong word my brother...

          Initially single cell reproduced asexually and at a later stage of development it started bisexual reproduction.

          please clairfy it..

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            Novice
            wrote on last edited by
            #314

            If you meant with cell "nafs" then I totally agree with you.

            Thanks brother handshake

            Cells are live and in my humble understanding they can be called "nafs"

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              Novice
              wrote on last edited by
              #315

              you are targetting a wrong word my brother...

              please clairfy it..

              My target was not wrong word but I was trying to say that in Arabic pronouns are either single or dual (only two) or plural (more than two).

              Our present scientific knowledge says that life originated from single cell organisms in marshy areas from inorganic matter. Brother consider following verses and see what is said here.

              (&#65279 (&#65279 (

              It is translated traditionally as

              So, let man consider of which stuff he is created. (5) He is created of spouting water (6) That comes out from between the loins and the chest-bones. 2

              Does this translation make any sense?

              God bless you.

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                HP_TECH
                wrote on last edited by
                #316

                Peace

                I want to give my two cents to imran, huruf and Novice

                We were all created from before and we were made to bear witness that Allah is our Lord,
                that is why Allah says man will be sufficient as a witness against himself on the day of account.

                Since the Quran and the topics concerning Adam and the expulsion are not all in sequential order, it means it takes a patient and reasoning mind to put the pieces together.

                Think about the following events
                Not in any particular order, just my mind way of assembling.

                ? -Allah announced to the Malaika He was going to create man

                ? -Angels questioned Allah's decision

                ? -Allah told them that He Knows what they do not know

                ? -Allah tells Malaika that when He is finished creating man and blows of His Spirit then they should fall prostrate

                ? -Adam was created

                ? -Adam's mate was created from the same soul

                ? -Allah taught Adam All-Names

                ? -Allah presented something to the Malaika

                ? -Allah challenged the Malaika to name these things if they were truthful (meaning if they were right in questioning God's decision for creating man whom some or maybe one of them saw as unfit to place on Earth as a vicegerent)

                ? -Malaika acknowledged that Allah Knows All-Things and more and that they only know what Allah shows them

                ? -Allah told Adam to inform them of their names! So he did

                ? -Allah told the Malaika to make obeisance to Adam

                ? -All the Malaika made obeisance to Adam together except Iblis

                ? -Allah questioned Iblis on his insubordination

                ? -Iblis revealed his arrogance, bigotry and jealousy for Adam who was placed above the Malaika

                ? -Iblis was among the jinn (I speculate a type of Malaika before expulsion)

                ? -Iblis asked Allah for respite to prove that he was right about man being unfit to hold the Trust and vowed to mislead all of Adam's offspring except for the righteous servants of Allah (as vicegerent on earth)

                ? -Allah granted him respite and declared that He would fill Hell with him and all those who followed him

                ? -Allah told Adam and his wife to dwell in the garden for a time and to beware of the Satan because he is to them a clear enemy perhaps alluding to both the desire and the entity known as Iblis

                ? -Allah told Adam and his mate to dwelled in the garden and eat of every fruit except for the tree

                ? -Adam was approached by Iblis and he deceived him and his wife into disobeying Allah

                ? -Adam repented and sought forgiveness from His Lord

                ? -Allah the All-Forgiver forgave for him

                ? -Allah took Adam and his wife's descendants from their backs and made them bear witnesser themselves "Am I not your Lord?" Seriously read 7172-174

                ? We all answered( me, hurt, imran all of us) " Yes we have testified" Quran 7172-174 THIS IS KEY TO UNDERSTANDING why ALLAH says GET DOWN ALL OF YOU!

                ? -Allah told Adam and WHOMEVER else (his mate, his offspring, possibly Iblis and his children) to ALL get down 20123, 724, 236, 238, 261

                ? -Adam received words from His Lord and established the Covenant of upholding and supporting Messages and Messengers

                ? -Here we are...

                What happened in the time between Adam and the rest being expelled and the first recorded human civilizations is knowledge we do not have. Is it important? What difference does it make?

                Although, if you desire clarification read further in the Quran Noah told the people from before that Allah caused us to GROW from the earth as PLANTS/GROWTHS 7117-18

                It is then plausible that men and women were "seeded" in the Mother of the towns, (2859, 2143) the secure city "baladan aminan" (953, 901-2, 2791,1435, 2126 ), the secure town/city "qryatan aminata"(16112), the safe haven established for mankind and grew and spread over the four corners from there. Or another possibility is that we were seeded in all different regions of the earth. Something tells me the first assumption is nearer to reason.

                Don't argue over these things without evidence brothers. Brother Imran I agree with both you and huruf. Come together brother and sister. I will explain, as Novice indicated if the subject is two or dual the language in the Quran uses dual form, here in this context of expelling Adam from paradise in all the verses above Allah purposely uses plural not dual plural. In fact, just to clear any doubt you Lord in 20123 uses jamian ALL!!
                But I also side with you Imran because Allah addresses Adam as single when He is speaking to Him and commanding him to give names and commanding malaika to prostrate to him
                Huruf you are wrong in that aspect Allah clearly addresses Adam in the singular masculine pronoun.
                Read these verses 20117, 3872? find all the other relevant ones on your own easily go on corpus.quran.com and look at the occurrence of the word adamu.
                The malaika are addressed in plural while adamu is addressed as singular.

                Now I do not deny the possibility that Adamu might be addressing ONE specific nation of insan while the malaika being possible MULTIPLE tribes/nations jinnati being a distinct than other malaika after all Allah made the malaika messengers having wings two, three or four.

                There is no denying, however that Adamu can be both understood as one individual and representative of a nation.
                So why are you both right?
                Because Adam as one individual and he had one mate and they dwelled together in the garden until they were made to slip. Once they disobeyed our Lord then we all were summoned as a nation for the following reasons

                We were all brought out of our parents? backs to be witnesses over ourselves and to testify that Allah is our Lord and to testify as to the Covenant of God?s Guidance in form of Scripture and Messengers.
                This includes Iblis and the jinn.
                Then we were all told to get down from there some of us to others as enemies.

                Novice I disagree with the alternatives you present. The possible alternatives are not confined by neither hadith or the cell theory you present.
                The above explanation proves that.

                1)Nafsin does not even remotely mean cell. Wrong

                2)I am a biologist and your rendition of cell biology is horrendous no offense.

                3)There are cells that reproduce asexually and cells that reproduce sexually not Bisexually lol

                1. Cells don?t have a gender Novice! A cell that is sexually reproducing simply means that it goes through mitosis and meiosis (while an asexually reproducing cell only goes through mitosis)

                2. I think you imagine one asexual cell ?> becoming sexually reproducing?> then having two sexes that?s a big no no

                3. Meiosis for sexually reproducing cells only means that the cell divides so to give rise to offspring that are genetically different than the parent cell, essentially giving new genetic combination

                4. Mitotsis which is akin to all organisms but unique to asexually reproducing organisms means the offspring cells are going to be identical to their parents

                Therefore sexually reproducing cells belong to only animals, plants and fungi

                1. Do you understand the implication of this?

                2. It means that today we don?t know of any type of single cell organisms that can reproduce sexually. We only know of gametes from animals and plants!

                3. This means to me that it is farfetched to believe that a prokaryotic cell(asexually reproducing) could have evolved into a human gamete or eukaryotic cell able to undergo meiosis. This theory is so far-fetched that scientists themselves are starting to see the light and have come with a theory that states these two had different origins!

                4. Away with the theory that all cells came from one cell!

                5. We humans have eukaryotic cells, while bacteria and archaea are prokaryotes

                6. This means then that in scientific terms your notion of man being one asexually reproducing cell and then becoming sexually reproducing is absurd

                7. Let us not even mention that the conventional theory for the origin of the eukaryotic cell states that a prokaryotic cell swallowed another prokaryotic cell and instead of digesting it decided to keep it inside itself for its own benefit! If you swallow these lies as scientific facts you are just being deceived by shaytan my friends. I am the utmost sincere advisor to you.
                  I study these subjects and cringe in horror at the bs they invent?

                8. I am not sure if you yourself understand what you are proposing brother. Why would Allah create a prokaryote (asexually reproducing organism who has been indicated by some scientists to not share the same common ancestor as eukaryotes) then make it into a eukaryote (again for which there is weak scientific evidence of eukaryotes originating from prokaryotes) and then per your interpretation give rise to bisexually reproducing cells(no such thing)?

                9. Science is not in favor of your argument Novice. People unfortunately assume science is reason while they are not well acquainted with it. Science as we think of it is not indisputable truth or facts! When you only know conjecture or assumptions about anything and you use that as your basis for believing something this is problematic, with Scripture, science and everything in life. Beware.

                By nafsin or soul Allah is describing something of the unseen, metaphysical.

                I challenge you Novice to try to replace cell with soul in Quran and if it makes sense post it! Never will you do it!

                As a young aspiring scientist I want everyone to know that most of what we consider scientific fact is pure conjecture! Most of it is pseudoscience, but I do not want you to just take my word for it, study it yourselves like I am and you will find me Allah willing truthful!

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                  Timotheus
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #317

                  Peace be upon you all,

                  Alhamdullilah.

                  HP_TECH may The All Mercifull reward you for your striving. it does help to put all the parts together in one place, as due to the nature of the quran, i can be sometimes a jigsaw puzzle, all the pieces fit together perfectly, though only with an open heart to Gods guidance can we see how they fit together.

                  I agree with your reference to science , with much being conjecture. In my understanding, science, and what it entails is just a theory, one which if i recall correctly should be falsifiable, or able to be proven wrong. However just because we have not falsified something, or proven it wrong does not mean it is true. in fact all we can say about 'scientific facts' is 'they have not yet been disproven' this does not mean that they are true, it does not mean they are false, it is a assumption, or conjecture based on evidence.

                  the only true evidence is that which is from God, that which is without doubt the absolute truth. there is a large margin of error though, due to the interpretation, or limited understanding, the nature of human beings, however we should all strive to base ourselves soley on the proven truth, God's 'clear evident signs'

                  rather than the scientific method of claiming as 'fact' something which has supporting evidence, and has not been falsified, but is falsifiable, i am much in favour of the 'cartesian doubt' method of methodical skeptisism, check it out on wikipedia, but here is the jist of it....

                  "Cartesian doubt is methodological. Its purpose is to use doubt as a route to certain knowledge by finding those things which could not be doubted. The fallibility of sense data in particular is a subject of Cartesian doubt."

                  The only thing that cannot be doubted in the Clear and Evident Signs of God.
                  what can be doubted is our knowledge, understanding or interpretation of them, and pretty much everything else.

                  Peace be with you all.

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                    Timotheus
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #318

                    Peace, by the way, i am not advocating doubt in God, or His signs, theese are the absolute truth, proven again and again, and clearly evident even in our own souls we know the truth, but many deny..

                    I am advocating that we do not accept any knowledge that cannot be proven without doubt.. In terms of our understanding of the quran, it is helpfull to not rely on your own understanding, i.e to doubt your own understanding, but rather to rely soley on God, because he proves his proven word to us, If He has so willed, and if we are open to seeing it.

                    proverbs 33-6

                    Mercy and truth will not forsake you; tie them on your neck; write them on the tablet of your heart; and you shall find favor and good understanding in the sight of God and man. Trust in YHWH with all your heart, and lean not to your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct your paths.

                    Peace.

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                      Novice
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #319

                      Thanks HP-TECH for all technical information but you forgot to give your understanding of 865-7

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                        huruf
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #320

                        HP TECH he masculine is used for males and words that are of masculine gener but there is a form of address and reference which form is the same as masculine bu which is used whenn gender is not itended to be shown and which is used for that purpose wither when the sex of the perso or animal is not intended to be shown or because it is kunknown. Of Course quer'an raders of certai type soon as there is not a cler cut markof feminine and it iterests them make everythig masculine but that is not so. Also adam's mateis nor named in the feminine. So o sex is give to ay particuar individual of the adam. Adam is the human vaariety that is give revelatio at that time thus making them insaan not just bashar. The ue of gramatical gender sinn te Qur'an is the same as in Spanish nd grammarias traditionnally mostly men make evrythign masculine that is to their advantaag, but the fact is that there is anothr ggender, which is like masculine, but is used for unknown or unrevealed subjects and also for mixed occurrences of both sexes or genders.

                        Of course I will not even attempt to convince anybodyof that. I know the reactions. But please do show some femenine form of address for the purported "wife" of adam.

                        As to that nafs we all come from is to a person it would be a species any time in volutionn who showed the traits of mammals. Mammals do whoe in their bodies the traces of having had the sexual traits of both sexes.

                        Salaam

                        Salaam

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                          imrankhawaja
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #321

                          3)There are cells that reproduce asexually and cells that reproduce sexually not Bisexually lol

                          thats make me laugh lol..

                          anyway peace hp_tech hope u doing good,, nice to see u after long time hope u was doing good...

                          actually i want to add the theory of darwin regarding cell is still a theory 90 % of modern scientist reject his theory not all but some significant parts.. there are some parts that also match with understanding of quran and modern science but again the process of natural selection failed badly ...

                          human beings, plants, animals have a dna structure based on interlocking of cells that run through proper coding if a code miss structure will fail...

                          a goat was goat millions years ago,, monkey was monkey million years ago...
                          there is no missing link , actually that link dnt exist at all and not part of programming of creation.. its a intelligent design.. and designer is our lord..

                          so its not a proven fact at all ... its still a theory..

                          God bless you

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                            Adam_The_Warner
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #322

                            Dear Pazuzu,

                            You know very well that none here care what the Jews say/write...We are followers of the Quran as our source of law.

                            You speak against Jewish history (which I may or may not agree with you), but then you turn around and start inventing your own history which may be just as bad - Abraham came from Yemen!

                            Here is what my authentic history (Quran) tells me

                            • Abraham left his people and emigrated to the land whuch God had blessed;
                            • Lot was from Abraham's progeny and emigrated with him;
                            • Abraham and Ismail raised the foundations of the Temple;
                            • Abraham called people to pilgrimage to the Temple;
                            • Abraham's progeny resided in a valley not far from the location of the Temple;
                            • Lot's people were destroyed by Angels and the town was left as a sign for people;
                            • Jacob had 12 sons and one of those sons became a minister in Egypt and moved all the sons of Jacob there;
                            • Moses was sent to resucue the children of Jacob from Egypt;
                            • Moses was supposed to settle in the blessed land - but due to the disobediance of the tribe, they were blocked from it for 40 years;
                            • David and Solomon formed the kingdom of Israe;
                            • The location of this kingdom was not in the holy land, as Solomon used to send the winds there, but was near Sheba;
                            • Jesus (and others before him) were sent to follow in the footsteps of Abraham;
                            • Mohammed came to follow in the same footsteps;
                            • God names the holy land "Baca" and says that the station of Abraham is inside the Temple;
                            • Mohammed liberated the holy land before his death;
                            • The Children of Israel , during their 2nd rise, will occupy the holy land as prophecsized in suran 17.

                            Now, which place was it that Jesus, Moses, and Mohammed all highlighted as being "holy", and which place do all the faiths in one form or another agree that pilgrimage was towards?

                            The answer is a place that is "known" and "revered" by all the faiths - else the whole point of calling mankind to the pilgrimage is missed!

                            I can tell you - that place is not Yemen.

                            Torah - Genesis 11 31 And Terah took Abram his son, and Lot the son of Haran his son's son, and Sarai his daughter in law, his son Abram's wife; and they went forth with them from Ur of the Chaldees, to go into the land of Canaan; and they came unto Haran, and dwelt there.

                            Quran 544 We have sent down the Torah, in it is a guidance and a light; the prophets whohave submitted judged with it for those who are Jewish, and the Devotees, and the Priests, for what they were entrusted of the Book of God, and they were witness over. So do not be concerned with the people but be concerned with Me; and do not purchase with My revelations a cheap price. And whoever does not judge with what God has sent down, then these are the rejecters.

                            Quran 566 And if they had upheld the Torah and the Gospel, and what was sent down to them from their Lord, they would have been rewarded from above them and from beneath their feet. From among them is a pious nation, but most of them only do evil.

                            Quran 568 Say "O people of the Book, you are not upon anything until you uphold the Torah and the Gospel and what was sent down to you from your Lord." And for many of them, what was sent down to you from your Lord will only increase them in transgression and rejection. So do not feel sorry for the rejecting people.

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                              HP_TECH
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #323

                              Thanks HP-TECH for all technical information but you forgot to give your understanding of 865-7

                              What don't you understand brother?

                              According to my current understanding these verses are referring to sperm or components of semen.
                              These are secreted form the seminal vesicle. Seminal vesicle is located adjacent to the sacrum, which is the base of the backbone/spine l-sul'bi. It supports the whole upper body and intersects with pelvis.

                              http//anatomytubuh.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/male-anatomy-abdomen.jpg
                              https//medlineplus.gov/ency/images/ency/fullsize/19464.jpg

                              If you think about the male anatomy in 3D then seminal vesicle is between lower most ribs l-taraibi and apex of sacrum which is anchor and support of the spine/backbone l-sul'bi see below

                              https//i.imgsafe.org/db224d1a49.jpg

                              This is my understanding Novice.

                              But of course Allah Knows Best!!

                              May Allah guide those of us who seek His Guidance closer to the Straight Path and to the correct interpretation and understanding.
                              And may my Lord forgive for me lest I err and unknowingly deceive the believers

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                                HP_TECH
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #324

                                HP TECH he masculine is used for males and words that are of masculine gener but there is a form of address and reference which form is the same as masculine bu which is used whenn gender is not itended to be shown and which is used for that purpose wither when the sex of the perso or animal is not intended to be shown or because it is kunknown. Of Course quer'an raders of certai type soon as there is not a cler cut markof feminine and it iterests them make everythig masculine but that is not so. Also adam's mateis nor named in the feminine. So o sex is give to ay particuar individual of the adam. Adam is the human vaariety that is give revelatio at that time thus making them insaan not just bashar. The ue of gramatical gender sinn te Qur'an is the same as in Spanish nd grammarias traditionnally mostly men make evrythign masculine that is to their advantaag, but the fact is that there is anothr ggender, which is like masculine, but is used for unknown or unrevealed subjects and also for mixed occurrences of both sexes or genders.

                                Of course I will not even attempt to convince anybodyof that. I know the reactions. But please do show some femenine form of address for the purported "wife" of adam.

                                As to that nafs we all come from is to a person it would be a species any time in volutionn who showed the traits of mammals. Mammals do whoe in their bodies the traces of having had the sexual traits of both sexes.

                                Salaam

                                Salaam

                                Gender equality is absolutely important. I tend to now agree with you, I now am in the understanding that Adamu refers to both male and female.
                                If anyone were to take a look at the two narrations in the Quran when the Shaitan approaches and whispers to Adamu you might see what I now see.
                                In one narration the shaitan is said to approach both of them and whisper to both of them and make both of them slip, while in the other narration the shaitan approaches Adamu and as a consequence they BOTH slip.
                                It is certainly makes more sense that when Allah fashioned man he finished both genders.
                                Then taught Adamu, both male and female all the names
                                This makes much more sense because in the event after Iblis vows vengeance against Adamu, Allah tells Adamu to dwell with its mate in the garden. It is an address to both of them. It does not seem as if it were just Adam informing about the names and standing before the malaika.

                                I admit I have been a bit ignorant and sexist about this matter before. I finally see why Adamu is not necessarily a proper name.
                                I could be wrong in saying that it is definitely not a proper name, so I am not claiming so.
                                It is possible that it was a proper name, but I am more convinced now after a night-long research that Adamu includes our mother and father.

                                Although no one can deny that our Lord created a male and a female as distinct genders.

                                http//corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=7&verse=189#(71899)
                                7189 He (is) the One Who created you from a single soul and made from it its mate that he might live with her. And when he covers her, she carries a burden light and continues with it. But when she grows heavy, they both invoke Allah, their Lord, "If You give us a righteous (child), surely we will be among the thankful."

                                Again this is not saying that either gender was extracted from an initial gender. NO

                                I think Allah is saying that He created both male and female from one essence.
                                That is why we want to be with each other. That is why there is natural chemistry, affection and love between men and women.
                                We long that counterpart that makes our soul "complete"
                                He created pairs from one

                                That is why He made everything in pairs it is a detailing of His Signs, the way that everything seeks a partner and companionship.
                                Everything that lives wants to copulate and become whole.

                                We seek to be whole like The One Who Has no Equal, He is Whole without partnership and Absolute! Glory to Him!

                                5149 And of every thing We have created pairs, so that you may remember.

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                                  imrankhawaja
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #325

                                  3636 Glory to Him Who has created pairs of everything that the earth grows, and of themselves, and of things they have no knowledge yet

                                  one soul(genderless) then a pair male and female... or adam and mate.. thats what i was on about before as welll...creation did not finish on adam ,instead creation completed when a pair of male and female come in to existence after that incidents like expelling from garden and teaching names and stuff happen.. process of all this only God knows

                                  peace

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                                    huruf
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #326

                                    HP, I think tat when peole see adam as male and then the female they are infuenced,by one of the two biblical accounts. There is one, very brief, which matches the Qur'an and there is a longer one, whichreads like some science fiction drama where there is a snake and all that.

                                    I find the Qur'anic acount harmonius and measured, bi mizaan a we tend to hik of the universed when we read sura Ar-rahmaan.

                                    Salaam

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                                      Novice
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #327

                                      What don't you understand brother?

                                      According to my current understanding these verses are referring to sperm or components of semen.
                                      These are secreted form the seminal vesicle. Seminal vesicle is located adjacent to the sacrum, which is the base of the backbone/spine l-sul'bi. It supports the whole upper body and intersects with pelvis.

                                      Thanks brother for your reply. I am not challenging you but trying to understand these verses.

                                      If these verses are referring to sperm then sperm cells are produced in the seminiferous tubules of the testicles (which make up the bulk of each testicle) and then stored in a structure on the testes called the epididymus. From there they travel up the vas deferens...

                                      How do you reconcile emitting of sperms from testicles with the verse?

                                      Thanks in advance for giving your understanding.

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                                        Hizbullah
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #328

                                        You know very well that none here care what the Jews say/write...We are followers of the Quran as our source of law.

                                        There are still some truth in the Tawrah, probably about 10%?

                                        You speak against Jewish history (which I may or may not agree with you), but then you turn around and start inventing your own history which may be just as bad - Abraham came from Yemen!

                                        i believe to a certain extent, Pazuzu was right...please see http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9608396.0

                                        Here is what my authentic history (Quran) tells me

                                        • Abraham left his people and emigrated to the land whuch God had blessed;
                                        • Lot was from Abraham's progeny and emigrated with him;
                                        • Abraham and Ismail raised the foundations of the Temple;
                                        • Abraham called people to pilgrimage to the Temple;
                                        • Abraham's progeny resided in a valley not far from the location of the Temple;
                                        • Lot's people were destroyed by Angels and the town was left as a sign for people;
                                        • Jacob had 12 sons and one of those sons became a minister in Egypt and moved all the sons of Jacob there;
                                        • Moses was sent to resucue the children of Jacob from Egypt;
                                        • Moses was supposed to settle in the blessed land - but due to the disobediance of the tribe, they were blocked from it for 40 years;
                                        • David and Solomon formed the kingdom of Israel;
                                        • The location of this kingdom was not in the holy land, as Solomon used to send the winds there, but was near Sheba;
                                        • Jesus (and others before him) were sent to follow in the footsteps of Abraham;
                                        • Mohammed came to follow in the same footsteps;
                                        • God names the holy land "Baca" and says that the station of Abraham is inside the Temple;
                                        • Mohammed liberated the holy land before his death;
                                        • The Children of Israel , during their 2nd rise, will occupy the holy land as prophecsized in suran 17.

                                        I would like to address the above highlighted ones

                                        Lot was not from Abraham's progney, he was from Nuh

                                        Nowhere in the Quran or Tawrah mentioned that Jacob had 12 sons. It was Ishmael that had 12 sons.

                                        Nowhere in the Quran that says Moses was sent to rescue children of Jacob. . Furthermore, Moses was a Messenger-Prophet, that means he was sent the worlds just like the Last Prophet of ALLAH! After he rescued the children of Israel, he led the rest of the 11 tribal nations - the Ishmaelites, to the bless land.

                                        The location of the Kingdom was within the Holy Land....http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9608396.0

                                        The children of Israel already rise for the second time and they had assimilated with the Ishmaelites, plausibly during the ministry of the Last Prophet!

                                        Now, which place was it that Jesus, Moses, and Mohammed all highlighted as being "holy", and which place do all the faiths in one form or another agree that pilgrimage was towards?

                                        The answer is a place that is "known" and "revered" by all the faiths - else the whole point of calling mankind to the pilgrimage is missed!

                                        I can tell you - that place is not Yemen.

                                        it is norther part of Yemen.......http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9608396.0

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                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #329

                                          Thanks brother for your reply. I am not challenging you but trying to understand these verses.

                                          If these verses are referring to sperm then sperm cells are produced in the seminiferous tubules of the testicles (which make up the bulk of each testicle) and then stored in a structure on the testes called the epididymus. From there they travel up the vas deferens...

                                          How do you reconcile emitting of sperms from testicles with the verse?

                                          Thanks in advance for giving your understanding.

                                          It's okay we are supposed to question everything! And it is my duty to after presenting a view to provide evidence or thought process behind such understanding.

                                          Well I should clarify that I understand this as semen not exactly sperm. Semen is the end product while sperm is only a component of what's being ejaculated. Semen is therefore a mix of fluids. These other fluids used along with sperm cells stored in epididymis are obtained from the seminal vesicle and prostrate gland. What gives semen its fluidity are these seminal components from seminal vesicle and prostrate gland which nourish and protect sperm cells(which in respect are much more dense and viscous than the fluid).

                                          865 Falyanthuri al-insanu mimma khuliqa
                                          866 Khuliqa min ma-in dafiqin
                                          867 Yakhruju min bayni alssulbi waalttara-ibi

                                          865 So let see man from what he is created.
                                          866 He is created from a water, ejected,
                                          867 Coming forth from between the backbone and the ribs.

                                          The Quran is a kitab Book with its parts oft-repeated. What does this mean? That if you are looking for confirmation of a certain concept then it should appear more than once.

                                          327 Allathee ahsana kulla shay-in khalaqahu wabadaa khalqa al-insani min teenin
                                          328 Thumma jaAAala naslahu min sulalatin min ma-in maheenin
                                          329 Thumma sawwahu wanafakha feehi min roohihi wajaAAala lakumu alssamAAa waal-absara waal-af-idata qaleelan ma tashkuroona

                                          327 The One Who made good every thing He created, and He began (the) creation (of) man from clay.
                                          328 Then He made his progeny from an extract of water despised.
                                          329 Then He fashioned him and breathed into him from His spirit and made for you the hearing and the sight and feelings; little thanks you give.

                                          2312 Walaqad khalaqna al-insana min sulalatin min teenin
                                          2313 Thumma jaAAalnahu nutfatan fee qararin makeenin
                                          2314 Thumma khalaqna alnnutfata AAalaqatan fakhalaqna alAAalaqata mudghatan fakhalaqna almudghata AAithaman fakasawna alAAithama lahman thumma ansha/nahu khalqan akhara fatabaraka Allahu ahsanu alkhaliqeena

                                          2312 And indeed, We created the humankind from an essence of clay.
                                          2313 Then We placed him (as) a semen-drop in a resting place firm.
                                          2314 Then We the semen-drop (into) a clinging substance, then We created the clinging substance (into) an embryonic lump, then We created the embryonic lump, (into) bones, then We clothed the bones (with) flesh; then We produce it (as) a creation another. So blessed is Allah (the) Best (of) the Creators.

                                          225 Ya ayyuha alnnasu in kuntum fee raybin mina albaAAthi fa-inna khalaqnakum min turabin thumma min nutfatin thumma min AAalaqatin thumma min mudghatin mukhallaqatin waghayri mukhallaqatin linubayyina lakum wanuqirru fee al-arhami ma nashao ila ajalin musamman thumma nukhrijukum tiflan thumma litablughoo ashuddakum waminkum man yutawaffa waminkum man yuraddu ila arthali alAAumuri likayla yaAAlama min baAAdi AAilmin shay-an watara al-arda hamidatan fa-itha anzalna AAalayha almaa ihtazzat warabat waanbatat min kulli zawjin baheejin

                                          225 O mankind! If you are in doubt about the Resurrection, then indeed, We We created you from dust, then from a semen-drop then from a clinging substance then from an embryonic lump, formed and unformed, that We may make clear to you. And We cause to remain in the wombs what We will for a term appointed, then We bring you out (as) a child, that you may reach maturity. And among you (is he) who dies, and among you (is he) who is returned to the most abject age, so that not he knows, after having known, anything. And you see the earth barren then when We send down on it water, it gets stirred and it swells and grows of every kind beautiful.

                                          Noun
                                          (1644) nu'fatin a minute quantity of semen
                                          (183713) nu'fatin a minute quantity of semen
                                          (22515) nu'fatin a semen-drop
                                          (23133) nu'fatan (as) a semen-drop
                                          (23143) l-nu'fata the semen-drop
                                          (35117) nu'fatin a semen-drop
                                          (36777) nu'fatin a semen-drop
                                          (4067 nu'fatin a semen-drop
                                          (53462) nu'fatin a semen-drop
                                          (75373) nu'fatan a semen-drop
                                          (7625) nu'fatin a semen-drop
                                          (80192) nu'fatin a semen-drop

                                          You should inspect all these Signs yourself,
                                          but as you can see this concept is well established in Quran

                                          PS I need to clarify we do know of single cell eukaryotes

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