Reducing land from its outlying borders ? If Flat Earth real than ?
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Ok, but I truly believe that in the near future (if we live long enough), we (=ordinary people) can afford a space flight.
So I was wondering if you will still believe in the quran when you can see with your own eyes that the earth spherical.@ hp_ tech
u did not answers any my questions?
what i present is my understanding whether water comes from asteeriods or rain ,,, it dosent matter but accoridng to quran and accoridng to science water was not there in the start of planetary system of young earth..
i just wonder just tell me when u see earth with your own eyes and what possible answers you have for that time, instead of thinking about shape you should be optimistic about the reasoning what you will provide after watching earth with your own eyes...
at that time you have not much options ...
option number 1 .. eyes get trick and from so far distance flat shape looks like round
option number 2.. i dnt beleive in my eyes i beleive quran is saying earth is like a carpet spread so literally its mean plain...
option number 3 ... 2+2=4 but i still not beleive becoz quran is saying 2+2=5 ....i think option first is bit logical to carry on the next episode of flat earth if you can be able to see with your own eyes
God bless you and i pray from God to make arrangements for you to have a space flight,
but i know sometimmes evenn miracles dnt work , when people try to disbeleive they will continue in it like example of pharaoh , did moses not tell him the clear signs.. but they still refuse to disbeleive,, did jesus not show live miracles with the grace of God but people still disbeleive...
i m not much astonish when people claim earth is flat but @ bender i think even if hp_tech see the planet shape with his own eyes he still continue to disbeleive in it.. and probabaly go for option one..
peace
May Allah castigate the defiantly disobedient, those who pretend to be with the believers while they speak the lie and entertain doubt and refute the truth thereby with the falsehood!
The earth is planar
The scenarios you both depict are implausible.
Scientific empirical evidence proves a plane, stationary earth. Records show no one has gone to the moon nor reached higher than 400 miles.
Bismillah AlRahman AlRaheem
(51481)
wal-ara
And the earth, CONJ ? prefixed conjunction wa (and)
N ? accusative feminine noun Earth(51482)
farashnh
We have spread it; V ? 1st person plural perfect verb
PRON ? subject pronoun
PRON ? 3rd person feminine singular object pronoun
?? ??
(51483)
fani'ma
how excellent REM ? prefixed resumption particle
V ? 3rd person masculine singular perfect verb(51484)
l-mhidna
(are) the Spreaders! N ? nominative masculine plural active participle -
The heliocentric model invented by jesuits/NASA and everyone else is about bringing down the human race to insignificance compared to the universe. And ultimately fail the human race as promised by those who rebelled against the Lord.
The importance of humans brought about the rebellion in the first place.
If we follow mainstream science, what is stated in the old scripture and Quran becomes illogical ie why should the Creator destroy the universe just to judge the human race? Isn?t it just enough to destroy the earth alone?
According to science, the sun is relatively a young star and its destruction will not be anytime soon.
But if it was the flat earth and the earth is the focus ? the story about end of days becomes logical, And it can come at anytime.
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Scientific empirical evidence proves a plane, stationary earth.
o
really , can i have any statement from any qualified scientist throughout the world who claim this thing...
provide reference if you are truthful...
height of stubborness...
important questions you always ignore , you did not tell us if one day you see the shape of earth with your ownn eyes,, what will you think about all this.. &
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Okay. How about discussing anything productive? This is just blaming from right to left like a kindergarten about something irrelevant.
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But if it was the flat earth and the earth is the focus ? the story about end of days becomes logical, And it can come at anytime.
is this what science predict or quran?
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did God will wait for the sun to finish its energy for bringing judgement day...
did you not see everyday the millions things get destroyed and millions things get birth . when purpose fullfilled the law change the shape ,
leaves fell from tree get yellow and get disolve in ground , then water give a new life again to land... birth of stars and death of stars supernova... eveaporation of water from land... consumption of wood etc etc... this universe actually lost nothing things changed the shape according to law...
all this stuff is a principal law for running this universe designned by God...
so do we assume the same law for hereafter or all this must have to reprogrammed with some next level technologies what we have no knowledge of yet...
brother use reason dnt fell in the trap of flat earthers , these lost people are just a new episode to consprisy theories ... and it will come till the end of days ...
the reason you provide does not hold water ? if God is saying all will get destroyed God know best the reason of destruction...
might be the laws of destruction is on other way the law of reformation ... depends on how you look into all this...
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May Allah castigate the defiantly disobedient, those who pretend to be with the believers while they speak the lie and entertain doubt and refute the truth thereby with the falsehood!
rotfl
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May Allah castigate the defiantly disobedient, those who pretend to be with the believers while they speak the lie and entertain doubt and refute the truth thereby with the falsehood!
Salam HP_Tech. I agree with you. Unfortunately there are more of them than those who truly strive to uphold the Quran. So we can expect more lies than truth BUT for those who hold fast to the Lord, clarity and the truth is here in the Quran and all falsehood shall perish.
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i really like when the discussion of science suddenly take u turn to the discussion of faith... rotfl rotfl rotfl
and intrestingly i also have some emotional attachments linked up with this theory .. becoz i remeber my first post was on about shape of earth , otherwise i was not about to start the discussion on forum , but again i also learn lot of things from the members... thanx to all of them.. and special thansk to flat earthers who force me to say somethings...
and all the time i come up with baseless claims and interestingly they always avoid questions? some of these questions are here
what bring seasons changing to earth?
why we cannot experience the sudden dark and sudden light in sun set and sunrise, cant b possible in flat earth?
what shape is the sun and other planets of solar system?
does light travel in a straight line?
what is "vanishing point" do you mean the sun moves away from an observer VERTICALLY or HORIZONTALLY or something else? In other words, what motion does the sun have in your view? ponder about this question..
how do you explain regions such as iceland and many other where you can experience months of permanently visible sun, and months of permanently non-visible sun?
all these questions and many more things i ask from experts of flat earthers but one by one everybody run away i dnt know why...? &
some of them become my enemies and even they make fake ids specially to take piss with me rotfl i still dnt understand i think its something like a war or what...
any way mr hsalan if you are ready to give the answers of some of these questions i will be greatful as i see you beleive in flat earth too ?
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i really like when the discussion of science suddenly take u turn to the discussion of faith... rotfl rotfl rotfl
and intrestingly i also have some emotional attachments linked up with this theory .. becoz i remeber my first post was on about shape of earth , otherwise i was not about to start the discussion on forum , but again i also learn lot of things from the members... thanx to all of them.. and special thansk to flat earthers who force me to say somethings...
and all the time i come up with baseless claims and interestingly they always avoid questions? some of these questions are here
what bring seasons changing to earth?
why we cannot experience the sudden dark and sudden light in sun set and sunrise, cant b possible in flat earth?
what shape is the sun and other planets of solar system?
does light travel in a straight line?
what is "vanishing point" do you mean the sun moves away from an observer VERTICALLY or HORIZONTALLY or something else? In other words, what motion does the sun have in your view? ponder about this question..
how do you explain regions such as iceland and many other where you can experience months of permanently visible sun, and months of permanently non-visible sun?
all these questions and many more things i ask from experts of flat earthers but one by one everybody run away i dnt know why...? &
some of them become my enemies and even they make fake ids specially to take piss with me rotfl i still dnt understand i think its something like a war or what...
any way mr hsalan if you are ready to give the answers of some of these questions i will be greatful as i see you beleive in flat earth too ?
Imran, all the answer you asked can be found in the net, so look it up. You can find both main stream science and FE answers to your questions. I cannot answer them better. Whether you believe them or not is up to you.
My perspective is based on what I understand from the Quran. If you can imagine the end of days like what the Quran says, which is more plausible? flat earth or main stream science? To me flat earth appears more plausible.
But no one here has absolute proof given none of us have reached space. All we have are images which can be easily manipulated and created. Even the image we see with our own eyes will appear curvy because the construction of the eye is curvy.
But it all relates to belief - the main reason majority will fail is their lack of belief in the hereafter which translates to lack of action.
Who really believes in the hereafter? judgment day? heaven? and hell? Not many, because all of us cannot see them, the unseen a part of faith and logic. If its not logical why believe it?
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Even the image we see with our own eyes will appear curvy because the construction of the eye is curvy.
o
if i see a curve does it mean flat becoz the image of eyes is curvy,,, if we see flat earth with curvy eyes .. it becomes curvy... other side round we see spherical earth with curvy eyes.. will it appear flat ? curve + curve = ? brickwall
by default if earth is spherical its mean its flat due to curvy eyes... but if earth is really flat ... then its mean our eyes should see it as curvy?
do we need to change all the shapes according to the view of curvy eyes... ?
stars in the night sky what shape they have is it like sun or five ways lighting image ?
coin in the water appear moving on the floor of pool? is coin is round or moving? or its water waves that are responsible?
what if i see with glasses on my eyes... still curvy or glasses/mirror also have some hidden properties... ?
do we also need to invent something which lens is not curvy and bring us actual image?
questions after questions but no answers y ?
anyway... best of luck...
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Peace Imran,
really , can i have any statement from any qualified scientist throughout the world who claim this thing...
provide reference if you are truthful...
height of stubborness...
important questions you always ignore , you did not tell us if one day you see the shape of earth with your ownn eyes,, what will you think about all this.. &
bravo bravo bravo
Peace
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Peace everyone,
-How evil is their neglect to thoroughly investigate and research a matter, before denying it?
I have little respect for those who argue without properly investigating.
It appears the poster himself has not thoroughly investigated and researched the matter and thus his own words would apply to himself. It appears the poster assumes a conclusion from quranic signs to be true, when actually according to quranic signs that conclusion might not necessarily be true, which is called deductive fallacy. Let us see whether he is trying to conceal/cover (kafara) the truth or not.
You look at the sky and see the sun, moon and stars rising and setting hence moving about you, yet you claim it is the earth rotating around itself and the sun! Blasphemy!(675-7
Not only are you not using the faculty of reason and sight He has given you as Mercy but you are by so doing withholding within yourself the apparent/clear Signs of His Creation being the sun moon and stars are doing exactly what you see them do moving about you.
The apparent visual phenomenon for someone on surface of earth of "the sun, moon and stars rising and setting hence moving about you" can be possible both in flat earth model and spherical earth model. This premise doesn't conclusively indicate that the earth is flat. This apparent visual phenomenon is also possible in both the heliocentric model and the geocentric model and does not conclusively indicate that the geocentric model is true.
Therefore this premise cannot be used to conclude only flat earth or geocentric model as being true, otherwise it will be example of deductive fallacy.
Allah BRINGS the sun from the east! (Sun is the one moving from east not the earth rotating west!! Blasphemy!)
QURAN 2258The apparent visual phenomenon for someone on surface of earth of "the sun being brought from the east" can be possible both on flat earth and on spherical earth. This premise doesn't conclusively indicate that the earth is flat. This apparent visual phenomenon is also possible in both the heliocentric model and the geocentric model and does not conclusively indicate that the geocentric model is true.
Therefore this premise cannot be used to conclude only flat earth or geocentric model as being true, otherwise it will be example of deductive fallacy.
The heavens are RAISED without pillars that you see! (How can you raise empty infinite space? YOU CAN'T!) The sky is a structure! A roof!
QURAN 132There is some indirect evidence of existence of dark matter everywhere and no area of space therefore being empty.
Additionally, scientists in California using a scientific technique of extension neurosensing technology, have determined the existence of "seven heavens" which they call "seven levels of manifestation" (LOMs) or "seven superdomains" with discrete boundaries between the levels, with our universe being at the center. So the edge of the universe and the edge of each LOM or superdomain has a discrete boundary, and that discrete boundary is raised without "pillars".
http//www.lpg-c.org/essays (see the essay "Introduction to Idiomaterial Life Physics" and click on open).
This raising without pillars is thus possible both for a flat earth or a spherical earth, and is also possible both in heliocentric model and geocentric model.
Therefore this premise of heaven raised without pillars cannot be used to conclude only flat earth or geocentric model as being true, otherwise it will be example of deductive fallacy.
The sun and moon each RUNNING for a term appointed!
QURAN 132The sun and moon could be running for a term appointed in both flat earth and spherical earth models, and in both geocentric and heliocentric models. For example moon running around spherical earth, and sun running around the galactic center.
Therefore this premise of sun and moon running for an appointed term in 132 (or swimming in orbits - 2133, 3640) cannot be used to conclude only flat earth or geocentric model as being true, otherwise it will be example of deductive fallacy.
How does Allah describe the earth?
Ask yourself when visualizing this if I employ you to spread a substance out for me, let's say it is silly putty/ play dough,
Will you roll it up into a ball or flatten it out??!None of the referenced quranic words only mean "flattened", but have other meanings of spread, expanded, stretched, extended, even, smooth, expanse etc. also. These meanings can be applicable to both a flat surface and a spherical surface. For example the peel of an orange is spread out over its surface, or the universe is being expanded after the big bang, or a balloon is being expanded by blowing in it. This does not indicate that an orange or a balloon is flat.
133 The Earth is madadnaha/spread out!!
(1333) madda spread
(15192) madadnh We have spread it
(5072) madadnh We have spread it out
(8433) muddat is spreadSpread out does not necessarily imply flat, but spread out can also be used for spherical objects.
Spread out means "distributed over an area" or "extended in one or more directions", which could describe both flat and spherical objects and does not indicate only a flat object.
Additionally, the main meaning of "madda" is "extended" or "stretched", which could apply to both flat and spherical objects, and does not indicate only a flat object, otherwise it will be example of deductive fallacy.
http//www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume7/00000223.pdf
Other quranic words such as "dahaha" and "sutihat" also mean "spread out" or "expanded" which can be applicable to both flat and spherical objects (7930, 8820), and do not indicate only a flat object, otherwise it will be example of deductive fallacy.
http//www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume3/00000023.pdf
http//www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume4/00000081.pdfWithout the mountains and valleys and crookednesses and curvatures the earth is a level plain!!!!
(18476) brizatan (as) a leveled plain
(201063) afafan plainNot one but two sister ayaats to confirm this!
Note how the poster tries to deceive, mislead, misguide others by quoting the description of the appearance of earth on the last day and making it look like it is describing the current appearance of the earth. This is proof of intellectual dishonesty.
Both these verses are about the last day as is clear from the context
1847 And the Day We move the mountains, and you see the earth level, and We gather them; so We will not leave out anyone of them.
20102 The Day the horn is blown, and We gather the criminals on that Day white eyed.
20103 They whisper among themselves "You have only been away for a period of ten."
20104 We are fully aware of what they say, for the best among them will say "No, you have only been away for a day."
20105 And they ask you about the mountains, so say "My Lord will annihilate them completely."
20106 "Then He will leave it as a smooth plain."
20107 "You will not see in it any crookedness or curves."ALL I SEE IS CROOKEDNESS IN POSTERS ARGUMENTS.
The earth is made as a bed for us!
(20535) mahdan (as) a bed
(43105) mahdan a bedThe main meaning of "mahdan" is "even or smooth" in addition to other meanings, which can be applicable to both flat and spherical objects. It also means "expanse" which fits in the above signs. Expanse means an area of something presenting a continuous surface which can be applicable to both flat and spherical objects. The poster clearly ignores other meanings of "mahdan" to propagate his own views. Even the meaning of bed would be applicable if the relative size of the object standing on top of a spherical object is tiny compared to an extremely large spherical object. The tiny object can easily sleep on such an extremely large spherical object (approx. 5-7 feet compared to approx. 25,000 mile circumference). Ask an ant how even and smooth it would be to sleep on surface of an extremely large balloon.
This term "mahdan"/"expanse" can thus be applied both to a flat and a spherical object and does not indicate only a flat object, otherwise it will be example of deductive fallacy.
http//www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume7/00000267.pdf
All this evidence indicates that the quranic words do not rule out a spherical and heliocentric earth.
Readers can verify all this information for themselves and reach their own conclusions. No more comments from me in this matter.
Peace