Palavers about Qur'aan.
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The event begins by disclosure in 171
You cannot understand a simple question? Let me give you my question once again.
Which Arabic word in 531-18 has the meaning of travel i.e. Isra wal miraj?
You are linking 171 with surah najam but what is your proof from Quraan other than the scholars have told so in their tafseer and traditions?
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You cannot understand a simple question? Let me give you my question once again.
You are linking 171 with surah najam but what is your proof from Quraan other than the scholars have told so in their tafseer and traditions?
The purpose of journey is mentioned in both narratives.
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For journey the core collocates are the words and prepositions signifying place of departure and destination; and also direction. Every prudent man knows it. From where the journey began?
That is called hearsay. Quran is a mubeen book. You are quoting tasreef ul ayat so lets see what Quran says about the prophet ascending into skies
635
I will quote your translation of 635 from your web site
Reverting to your sensitivity of grief; if their deliberate refraining is heavy upon you that you can't resist feeling grieved
Thereby, if you self acquired the capability enabling that you might find a two-mouth run-through tunnel within the Earth;
Or a ladder that leads to be within the Sky;
Thereby, come back to them along with some unprecedented demonstrative sign.
And if Allah the Exalted had so resolved, He would have indeed consolidated them upon the Al-Huda the Guide (Qur'aan).
Having known this, you should not henceforth emotionally be disturbed for them.
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That is called hearsay. Quran is a mubeen book. You are quoting tasreef ul ayat so lets see what Quran says about the prophet ascending into skies
635
I will quote your translation of 635 from your web site
Reverting to your sensitivity of grief; if their deliberate refraining is heavy upon you that you can't resist feeling grieved
Thereby, if you self acquired the capability enabling that you might find a two-mouth run-through tunnel within the Earth;
Or a ladder that leads to be within the Sky;
Thereby, come back to them along with some unprecedented demonstrative sign.
And if Allah the Exalted had so resolved, He would have indeed consolidated them upon the Al-Huda the Guide (Qur'aan).
Having known this, you should not henceforth emotionally be disturbed for them.
Has it any relevance to a Real-Life Event?
Episodes are mentioned in Frames. You will see an episode explained at other places by repeating key words to give more information about same events.
Now you come up with what you think is mentioned in 171 and Chapter 53. Leave aside what I have said.
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Has it any relevance to a Real-Life Event?
Yes it is telling us a real life event. People were not accepting the message. The prophet was getting restless that why people are not accepting the truth. He was advised by Allah to bring some ayah for them from the sky if he could.
Now you come up with what you think is mentioned in 171 and Chapter 53. Leave aside what I have said.
Did I claim I have a web site or have done translation of Quraan? I am a student trying to understand Quraan and that is why I have been looking into different translations of "Prudent people" like yourself.
I can only give my reasons why a certain translation is not acceptable to me in the light of Quranic evidence. So I have tried to point out issues I have with your translation. Nothing against you but it is my search for the truth.
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Yes it is telling us a real life event. People were not accepting the message. The prophet was getting restless that why people are not accepting the truth. He was advised by Allah to bring some ayah for them from the sky if he could.
Did I claim I have a web site or have done translation of Quraan? I am a student trying to understand Quraan and that is why I have been looking into different translations of "Prudent people" like yourself.
I can only give my reasons why a certain translation is not acceptable to me in the light of Quranic evidence. So I have tried to point out issues I have with your translation. Nothing against you but it is my search for the truth.
It is good to see things critically. However, evidence should be relevant to an issue. Declarative statements are not compared with episodic text.
I have tried to explain that Qur'aan is composed in encyclopedic style. Conceptualization becomes easier by frames,
May be you find it helpful for critical study and evaluation of works
http//haqeeqat.pk/FacilitativeByEncyclopaedicFormat.htm
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It is good to see things critically. However, evidence should be relevant to an issue. Declarative statements are not compared with episodic text.
I have tried to explain that Qur'aan is composed in encyclopedic style. Conceptualization becomes easier by frames,
May be you find it helpful for critical study and evaluation of works
http//haqeeqat.pk/FacilitativeByEncyclopaedicFormat.htm
Sorry brother I dont buy that. This complex terminology and word games have confused people so much that muslim have become a target for hatred and ridicule. Quran is a book of guidance and I do not imagine things or use stories circulating in the market, to get guidance from the Quran. I try my best to stay with the original text. If I cannot comprehend something I admit it that at present I dont understand it. I keep my search on to get the truth.
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It is good to see things critically. However, evidence should be relevant to an issue. Declarative statements are not compared with episodic text.
I have tried to explain that Qur'aan is composed in encyclopedic style. Conceptualization becomes easier by frames,
May be you find it helpful for critical study and evaluation of works
http//haqeeqat.pk/FacilitativeByEncyclopaedicFormat.htm
To me the whole story of isra wal miraj make no sense. So many issues if you look at it critically
Allah is somewhere and prophet had to go there at the speed of light to get revelation whereas he was getting revelation for 23 years as well while staying on this globe.
50 salah per day so one salah about every half an hour.
Hagling with Allah to reduce the salah from 50 to 5.
After reducing it to 5 the prophet felt shy to go back to get further reduction.
The hagling prompted my prophet Moosa who supposedly knew more than the giver and taker of 50 salah gift.
The journey started from the house of his widowed cousin, Umm Hani or
The journey started from kaaba
It happened before hijra or it happened after hijra.
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isra' means travel that is undertaken at night. That is the meaning of Isra'ill, the people of the pact of the travel starting in the darkness towards the light. Isra'il means that. bani isra?'l are those who maintain that pact or the descendants fo those who had that pact although may not continue abiding by it.
All of humanity, ll of existence is meant to travel from darkess to light. That is what eminently did prophet Muhammd and all prophets and believers each one at his own pace and in his stage.
Amongs the germanic people, Swiss, austrin germ, there is a ritual in november wth candels where people go out and sing some thing like it is night I am going home, with my light. It is very moving and to me an indication precisely of God's light having been sent to all peoples. The rituals or appearance may differ, but the thrust and the message is the same.
Salaam
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To me the whole story of isra wal miraj make no sense. So many issues if you look at it critically
Allah is somewhere and prophet had to go there at the speed of light to get revelation whereas he was getting revelation for 23 years as well while staying on this globe.
Read again but firstly remove what is stuck in mind for making study critical. What was the purpose of journey; read as is told by Allah and not what inspirations come to mind because of some aversions to stories.
Look the purpose told by Allah the Exalted
http//haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/017.%20Al%20Israa/17.1PPT.gif
The purpose of ascending him (Muhammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam) was that We show him visually the greatest Existent in the Miscellany of Our Existents-Physical realm.
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Allah is somewhere and prophet had to go there at the speed of light to get revelation whereas he was getting revelation for 23 years as well while staying on this globe.
50 salah per day so one salah about every half an hour.
Hagling with Allah to reduce the salah from 50 to 5.
After reducing it to 5 the prophet felt shy to go back to get further reduction.
The hagling prompted my prophet Moosa who supposedly knew more than the giver and taker of 50 salah gift.
The journey started from the house of his widowed cousin, Umm Hani or
The journey started from kaaba
It is bad manner of discussion. Where did I say all this rubbish. We are talking with reference to statement in Qur'aan.
If you have aversion to the ascension of the Messenger beyond the extremities of the universe you should restrict to what actually is stated in Qur'aan because I am not going out of it. Ok, no use of discussion since passion does not let learn anything. Thanks.
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Read again but firstly remove what is stuck in mind for making study critical. What was the purpose of journey; read as is told by Allah and not what inspirations come to mind because of some aversions to stories.
Look the purpose told by Allah the Exalted
http//haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/017.%20Al%20Israa/17.1PPT.gif
The purpose of ascending him (Muhammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam) was that We show him visually the greatest Existent in the Miscellany of Our Existents-Physical realm.
171
171 has no word for the greatest. It says which means our signs. I guess you are trying to add/impose these meanings to prove the link between 171 and 5318.
Have you given a consideration that is referring to ?
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It is bad manner of discussion. Where did I say all this rubbish. We are talking with reference to statement in Qur'aan.
If you have aversion to the ascension of the Messenger beyond the extremities of the universe you should restrict to what actually is stated in Qur'aan because I am not going out of it. Ok, no use of discussion since passion does not let learn anything. Thanks.
Brother why you imagine what I did not write. When did I write that you said it. I started my post with the red part i.e. TO ME THE WHOLE STORY OF ISRA WAL MIRAJ..........
To me the whole story of isra wal miraj make no sense. So many issues if you look at it critically
Allah is somewhere and prophet had to go there at the speed of light to get revelation whereas he was getting revelation for 23 years as well while staying on this globe.
50 salah per day so one salah about every half an hour.
Hagling with Allah to reduce the salah from 50 to 5.
After reducing it to 5 the prophet felt shy to go back to get further reduction.
The hagling prompted my prophet Moosa who supposedly knew more than the giver and taker of 50 salah gift.
The journey started from the house of his widowed cousin, Umm Hani or
The journey started from kaaba
It happened before hijra or it happened after hijra.
Discussion must be to find out the truth and not to win or lose.
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171
171 has no word for the greatest. It says which means our signs. I guess you are trying to add/impose these meanings to prove the link between 171 and 5318.
Have you given a consideration that is referring to ?
It is a prepositional phrase coupled with two possessive phrases; and the pronoun is referent to the referred Abd. is the object of verb perfect single transitive and the subject is Abd. This object is elided in the 171 as second object of verb there.
This is explained at length in the link.
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Brother you did not explain the following
Look the purpose told by Allah the Exalted
http//haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/017.%20Al%20Israa/17.1PPT.gif
The purpose of ascending him (Muhammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam) was that We show him visually the greatest Existent in the Miscellany of Our Existents-Physical realm.
171
171 has no word for the greatest. It says which means our signs. I guess you are trying to add/impose these meanings to prove the link between 171 and 5318.
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Brother you did not explain the following
171 has no word for the greatest. It says which means our signs. I guess you are trying to add/impose these meanings to prove the link between 171 and 5318.
This is because you do not even study individual words.
171
This verb needs two objects. The one to whom something is to be shown and another what is to be shown to his eyes. it relates to elided second object. A prepositional phrase always relates to another entity and that entity must be determined, preferably by reference to Qur'aan itself.
Firstly it is mentioned what was to be shown and in the next it is told what was seen by him.
and have the same meanings with difference of first person structure and third person structure.
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This is because you do not even study individual words.
171
This verb needs two objects. The one to whom something is to be shown and another what is to be shown to his eyes. it relates to elided second object. A prepositional phrase always relates to another entity and that entity must be determined, preferably by reference to Qur'aan itself.
Firstly it is mentioned what was to be shown and in the next it is told what was seen by him.
and have the same meanings with difference of first person structure and third person structure.
Brother are you trying to avoid the question. Its ok if you do not want to admit that you added "The Greatest" in your translation of 171. Here is your translation from your web site
171 ........ ........
The purpose of ascending him (Muhammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam) was that We show him visually the greatest Existent in the Miscellany of Our Existents-Physical realm.Which Arabic word in 171 you translated as "The Greatest"?
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Brother are you trying to avoid the question. Its ok if you do not want to admit that you added "The Greatest" in your translation of 171. Here is your translation from your web site
171 ........ ........
The purpose of ascending him (Muhammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam) was that We show him visually the greatest Existent in the Miscellany of Our Existents-Physical realm.Which Arabic word in 171 you translated as "The Greatest"?
Now it seems you are just playing. What hampers you read the words. tells you not something FROM our Ayat. That something is later mentioned as the greatest Ayah.
You listened not doubly transitive verb needs two objects; and objects can be elided if mentioned somewhere else about the same concept.
You accept not any academic rules.
Goodbye.
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Now it seems you are just playing. What hampers you read the words. tells you not something FROM our Ayat. That something is later mentioned as the greatest Ayah.
You listened not doubly transitive verb needs two objects; and objects can be elided if mentioned somewhere else about the same concept.
You accept not any academic rules.
Goodbye.
I cannot dare to play with the words of Allah brother.
171
...... ...........to show him from our signs....
First object is "HIM"
Second object is "OUR SIGNS"Why to ignore two objects in 171 and jump to 5318 to impose second object?
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I cannot dare to play with the words of Allah brother.
171
...... ...........to show him from our signs....
First object is "HIM"
Second object is "OUR SIGNS"Why to ignore two objects in 171 and jump to 5318 to impose second object?
You are playing with words unnecessarily while from within you are clear. At this stage I can't believe that you are not aware of Preposition and that is the object of preposition and NOT of verb.
The object of a verb is always ACCUSATIVE. A genitive noun is never the object of verb,
If you wish not to believe the ascension of the elevated Messenger beyond the extremities of universe, it is ok. But you should not play with words.