Is the Holy Quran for the humans only or for the Jinns too?
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Peace jkhan,
You claimed in your comment that is created from fire. Therefore, the burden of proof is on your shoulder. I just asked a reference and Brother hawk99 quoted chapter 15 verse 27 in which God is using completely different word . So I don't know why you are asking me brother to proof anything.
In your reply, you quoted two verses from Chapter 55, verse 14 (for Insan and Jaan, which is actually 14 and 15) and verse 33 for Jinni. Again, in those verses God is using different words, in verse 33 and in verse 15.
No where in Quran God ever mentioned that he created from fire. If he did then we need a reference.
What has been proof so far is that the creature which was created from fire according to Quran is .
Salam
When i re-read your above thread, i understood that you didn't get what chapter 55 is dealing with words Jaanna and Jinn and Insaan and Insi at all... as per your claim there are THREE in this chapter that is 1. Jaanna 2. Jinn 3 Insaan.... That's clear rejections of the pure verses... or your inability to use wits and compare...
Anyhow thank you for your comments..
God guide you.. -
Peace jkhan,
It is not the first time that someone made a claim and failed to produce evidences, get frustrated and started making personal attack.
Let see how well you understand the words used in the book and your inability to understand it.- Is INS and INSAN only used for human beings? The answer will be categorically YES.
- Is any other words also used for human beings or category of human beings? The answer will be YES. Adam and JIN are also used for human beings.
- Is JAAN only used for creature made of fire? The answer will be YES.
- Is JAAN also used for any other creature beside invisible beings in the book? The answer will be YES, for snake.
- Is snake made of fire? Answer is NO. How do we know verse is talking about invisible beings or Snake? Its context.
- Is JIN used for invisible beings made of fire in the book? ?NO?
- What is word JIN used for in the book? It is used for angels, astrologers, foreigners, nature of forces etc.
Salam
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NK,
It is very worth considering what you have explained.
As I have been saying for some time, my understanding of jinn is that it is not a kind of being but that it poinst to a trait which can be "exhibited" (in this case it sounds like a pun) by different kinds of beings. It points to a trait which makes them unseen or unnoticed to everybody or to anybody in particular or in circumstances or in some ways. This I think matches, at least to some extent, your own appreciation of what it means. In that sense it would match actually anything, including your own understanding of jaann in the circumstance that it would "exhibit" that trait.
As to what the jaan are and whether it is any particular kind of being, I am not sure, I would have to let it cool a while (no pun intended, you know, the fire).
There is however an aspect as to this question that a feel can be significant. Somebody, when speaking of fire and jinn spoke of arrogance. I think it has a point. There may be two parallel meanings to these terms. On the one hand, the concrete meaning of them, as measurable, known beings, and on the other hand the symbolical meaning of them.
The boasting of jinn about being made of fire, may well be meaning that those who show that trait are indeed imposing, competitive, exclusivist beings, no matter what their species or kind, so indeed, Ibliis would be made of fire, and as the self-worshipper he is, desdains the beings made of dust, humans (even though the jinn may be himself human), who creep (in his view). And that kind of beings we know them too well, they are around us, and sometimes or many times, they rule us.
I think that it has meanings at both levels. So there is a humble side to jinniness, which is may be when he makes himself "invisible", and there is a proud side to it when he scorches everything around him.
Salaam
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Let see how well you understand the words used in the book and your inability to understand it.
- Is INS and INSAN only used for human beings? The answer will be categorically YES.
- Is any other words also used for human beings or category of human beings? The answer will be YES. Adam and JIN are also used for human beings.
- Is JAAN only used for creature made of fire? The answer will be YES.
- Is JAAN also used for any other creature beside invisible beings in the book? The answer will be YES, for snake.
- Is snake made of fire? Answer is NO. How do we know verse is talking about invisible beings or Snake? Its context.
- Is JIN used for invisible beings made of fire in the book? ?NO?
- What is word JIN used for in the book? It is used for angels, astrologers, foreigners, nature of forces etc.
peace NK,
indeed very interesting points i havnt find time to continue my study after having off-topic debates/humor with my beloved memebrs. but i just find something interesting also while researching the subject of those jin,aljin,jan,aljaan all of them four..
i will share it in a bit after gathering the information..
God bless you
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Dear NK... pls don't spoil the topic by saying personal attacks.... God witness that I have no personal attacks.. But I will definitely attack arguments till the truth comes out and manifest..thats my professional job as well being a lawyer.. If u took it personal then I can't help...
You have brought many points listed and yourself keep claiming Yes and No...
Just come to the point You claim that Jaann and jinn are not made of fire and we have no reference in Quran but only for Jaan .. So I brought the chapter 55 for you to give a thought to perceive Jaan and jinn.. Does God refer one or two .. I hope you know what is the meaning of "" ... RABBIKUMA... " does it refer to one or two or three or four... Pls kindly answer with logic or root... And then let me know throughout the chapter to whome God refer as RABBIKUMA...? If you claim that there are more than two creatures God mentioned since your claim is only Jaan created by fire and not jinn so.. You have to accept that there is huge grammar mistake in the usage of RABBIKUMA.... Pls be stick to the context of my question... Then later see what is serpant bla bla.. Coz you have uttered misconception and big difference.. Let's work it out..
Much welcome answers from others to my above question... I am ready to surrender to the truth and I am not adamant.. Pls bring the proof from Quran by denying my understanding... My understanding is chapter 55 jinn and Jaan both same and insi and insan both same and to that TWO GOD calls RABBIKUMA.. Based on that I deduce only creature which is created by fire is Jinn in another way Jaan... But insi or insan is created by clay... But we all shouldn't forget every living creature base is water even jinn... Prove I am wrong... -
Peace NK.
Where in Qoran do you get this answer?, Quote
6. Is JIN used for invisible beings made of fire in the book? ?NO?Remember if one cannot find a yes it does not mean it is a no unless you bring verse/s that state it is "NO".
I have already stated my understanding that Jaan is a singular form of Jin.
For me Jin can also be used for other things/ beings "That cover something". As well as for the beings Jin.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Peace jkhan,
You said in your reply 47
<<You have brought many points listed and yourself keep claiming Yes and No.>>
If you think my 7 points are against the book then refute them with references. You did not address a single point in your reply. I am not here to entertain you. You seem to avoid the comment and start a new discussion. I am not going to reply until you refute my 7 points my friend.
You failed again and again to produce a verse which approve your claim that Jin is made from fire then avoided my 7 points. Do your homework and then come back. Take your time. I am not in hurry but i am not here to do your homework.
I will comment on your "Rabukuma" once you refute my 7 points.
Salam
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NK Dear....
It's okay... If you can't... Then at least someone who is knowledgeable would answer my question and if not anyone then I will remain on what I was guided till Allah keeps me on the same understanding...
BTW... NK... You started this topic and you put a caption... In it you only asked quran is meant for humans or Jinn as well... But you didnt even bothered to say a word of Jaan who is created of fire... Why you left out the major one who is created of fire and was referring the jinn which you have no reference with what it is made of who they are other than your own conjectures ... My senses working sharp as always... Thanks God. .that is the same Jaan God says He created by fire and side by side He says created human by clay In chapter 55.. That creature you left out in your caption and asking everyone for an alien creature in your mind jinn for which you claim as meanings of Angels, astrologers, nature of forces bla bla.. .. So you are asking by your caption from us... Is the Quran for humans only or Angels, astroleger, nature of forces.. .... Quran for angels.... Ha ha ... Thanks God you didn't ask us quran for buffalos as well..
Go dude.. Read chapter 55 with care and with much meticulous effort.. You have answer in it if you are good enough...*God claimed Iblees as Jinn
*God claimed Iblees as malak
Iblees claimed he is made of fire.
God confirmed only creature made of fire is Jaan..
Can we accept iblees's saying as he called he was created by fire... Yes.. I won't just say Yes like you.. I will explain... First of all we have confirmed statement from God that He created Jaan by fire.... When iblees was asked why you not sujud to Adam, iblees replied as you all know...he said I am created by fire.. Then what was the reply of God... "..It is not for you to be arrogant here..." Why did God say to iblees arrogant coz he was boasting himself with what he was created (fire) compared to Adam(clay)...Ibless deduced a creature made of clay is lowly and he was high... Note everyone carefully. didn't iblees further say that Adam was created by clay???.. Was it a wrong claim by iblees? In fact Adam was created by clay... Well said iblees. .can we trust him in this case... If iblees knew with what Adam was created then doesn't he know with what he himself was created? Common sense.... God's word usage of arrogance and practically iblees's arrogance coz of being a creature of fire proves that iblees was in fact a creature of fire and God didn't deny it but acknowledged it by saying arrogance....arrogance based on what? Non other but Being a fire creature... Now if iblees was created by fire and if iblees is jinn and the glaring confirmation of chapter 55 in support of jinn and Jaan and grammar In it and dual usages. What else you want to prove that God refers Jinn and Jaan to His same creature ...Just don't read Quran with roots... Read Quran compare quran and explore QURAN and verify... I don't say this Author of Quran said it in few verses..
Honestly I have nothing more to say in this Jaan and jinn... It's all up to readers...
God bless us... -
Peace jkhan,
Again you fail to provide the proof of your claim. No reference from the book that Jin is created from fire. Again, you did not refute my 7 points. Did not address single point. Claiming a thing then not giving a reference from the book bear no weight in the discussion.
You made a claim. I asked a reference. You failed number of times to provide it. You made another claim that i made up 7 points. I asked to refute it but you could not address on a single point.
You failed my brother. Failed on number of occasions.
Salam
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hey guys before i post my findings i m still working on it. i want anybody know whats the arabic Word for ?ghost? ?
by ghost i mean anything that make human being afraid becoz invisible beings cant afraid human as they are invisible so i m looking for a WORD use for scaring people it could b anything modernly vampire, warewolf, demon, blackwitch, whitewitch, giants, mermaid, fairy anything. what cause a human being to get aftaid.
any specific creature or word?
if somebody snt know about it thats fine i have something in my mind anyway let me complete my findings today then i will share it.@brother NK u need to do more work on point 3,4&5 i forget to tell yesterday.
for snake alone Quran used 3 different words when u ll
start looking it u ll get close to your findings too. anyway wait for my post in couple of hours i will post it. with all possible information -
Peace NK.
Please respond here, surah 55 is saying this
5514
He created the human from aged clay, like the potter's clay.5515
And created the jinns from blazing fire.Qoran has used a singular for each different beings here. So Jaan is singular for What?
Like Insaan is singular for Naas -Humans-
So Jaan is singular for Jin-The other beings_ I am saying and confirm here
5539
On that day, no human, nor a jaan, will be asked about his sins.5541
(This is because) the guilty will be recognized by their looks; they will be taken by the forelocks and the feet.And
5574
No human ever touched them, nor a jaan.It is clear Qoran is talking about Naas and Jinns two different beings created for the test,
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
I am not here to prove the adamant people who have no evidence for claims...
But I consider as my duty to spread the truth with logic... So erudite people will ponder..
Okay here concern and clarification needed is "" quran for Men only or Jinn as well..""
Yes.. And to prove it I will bring few more verses.. As I always say with Quranic proof Jinn has no difference to human 7139 ..but they are created by fire and more powerful compared to man...
6130... God is posing a question to these two communities (Jinn and Human) didn't MESSENGERS come to you among yourself and reciting my verses and warn you.... No where in Quran talks of a particular messenger after quran to any community be it Man or Jinn. Quran is the only messenger as a book and it's message being spread as willed by God to Men and Jinn.. No wonder I repeat Jinn listened to quran and went as heralds to their community...
1788 a thought provoking verse.. What's the logic here.. God asks Men and Jinn to get together to produce the like of Quran..
Why Jinn should involve in this to produce a like of Quran. Why not only men? Or Men and Jaan or Men and snake or men and animals... It was revealed to Mohamed and Mohamed was a man who spoke Arabic... Strong evidence that Jinn also meant for guidance by quran... They can't produce like of Quran.. How can they produce the like of Quran unless they do Know about it in the first place what is Quran.. Why they should produce a like of something which is irrelevant to them...?? But God gave priority to first to whome it was revealed which the society of Mohamed and to whomever God willing to guide of Men of any period and to His other creature Jinn....
God says 5156 "" I didn't create jinn and Men except to serve (Ibada) Me... Did God miss out the Jaan after creating it by fire to let them serve Him...? Oops God missed out Iblees who is made of fire to serve him... No way... God knows what He speaks... Jinn and Jann same... Is iblees exempted from serving God or his descendants... Then why iblees should be destined in Quran for hell if he was not meant for serving God? If not for serving then violations are irrelevant..
That's undeniable with the wording of Quran...
As per topic... I have responded that quran is for Men and Jinn collectively and in addition to that I clarified that Jinn and Jaan same creature in Quran... Till one prove with evidence it's much better to be silent...
If anyone interested let him open a different topic so we explain the three way of explanation of Mosa's staff in Quran...
God bless us